toastyToast
Member
The writing is boring as shit. No room to express yourself with the dialog system. If I wanted to shoot stuff I'd play a shooter instead
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How does Fallout 4 compare to 3 and new Vegas? Spoilers allowed
- Thread starter JohnnyFootball
- Start date
The same thing happened to me, I think Nick read the script ahead of time.
Haha yeah, same thing here, made me go "what the fuck?" out loud. Even better, when I went outside right after he said that, the fucking dog was waiting for me there.
I'll just share my match-up from the other thread lol
Codsworth x ED-E
Piper x Cass
Danse x Boone
Strong x Lily
Preston x Arcade
Dogmeat x Rex
Hancock x Raul
Cait x Veronica
[FO4 has Nick Valentine, X688, Deacon and Curie as outliers]
That was mostly due to JES being a gun nut. Folks at Bethesda clearly don't care as much.
I feel the game is better then Fallout 3 for sure, but the Narrative is no where near as good as New Vegas. Not only is the story a bit shallow, but its sort of drops the ball on the end. The game also felt low on quests IMO. There were effectively only two endings, and none of the endings elaborate on the impact of your actions, its sort of "Yep, this is it, you did it"
New dialog system sucks also.
New dialog system sucks also.
I'd say so far it's the best for me of the 3 comparing up to the point in the game I am at so far, like 70 hours in. Lots of little improvements that make a big difference like FINALLY fixing the quest markers, making looting less button presses, lots of new unarmed and melee perks that really spice it up etc. etc.
Expanding the comic books, making exploring more part of progression was brilliant and the comics themselves have absolutely gorgeous art. The base building is brilliant as well, people are gonna do some crazy stuff with that (I already have to a lesser extent lol) and it's gonna have crazy longevity as long as they keep adding more stuff with patches/DLC/mods.
Also there is always something interesting to run into just wandering around. Just playing a few minutes ago I wandered into a ship stuck on a building crewed by robots with groups of scavengers outside scheming to take their loot. The whole thing was pretty crazy and was just a lot of fun and I ended up with a freaking cannon gun.
Then after that I end up in the middle of some crazy emergent gameplay thing where 5 or 6 Children of Atom people are shooting off Gamma guns all over the freaking place, fighting about 20 super mutants with 4 or 5 of those nuke bomber guys going off like crazy. Then along comes a group of captain gunners and they are all going crazy fighting each other. I just sat back and watched laughing at the spectacle while Nick made some comments about it. lol
Expanding the comic books, making exploring more part of progression was brilliant and the comics themselves have absolutely gorgeous art. The base building is brilliant as well, people are gonna do some crazy stuff with that (I already have to a lesser extent lol) and it's gonna have crazy longevity as long as they keep adding more stuff with patches/DLC/mods.
Also there is always something interesting to run into just wandering around. Just playing a few minutes ago I wandered into a ship stuck on a building crewed by robots with groups of scavengers outside scheming to take their loot. The whole thing was pretty crazy and was just a lot of fun and I ended up with a freaking cannon gun.
Then after that I end up in the middle of some crazy emergent gameplay thing where 5 or 6 Children of Atom people are shooting off Gamma guns all over the freaking place, fighting about 20 super mutants with 4 or 5 of those nuke bomber guys going off like crazy. Then along comes a group of captain gunners and they are all going crazy fighting each other. I just sat back and watched laughing at the spectacle while Nick made some comments about it. lol
Also the fact THAT YOU FUCKIN SAY THE NAME OF A CHARACTER WHEN YOU FIRST TALK TO THEM! Holy shit it irks me every fucking time. How the fuck would my character know this character's name and to make it worse she always says it all casual like "Hey Pam." Like you don't know this person and you're already know their name and speaking to them like you've known them for a while.
D
Deleted member 30609
Unconfirmed Member
I suspect it was one of those cases where it was assumed that late-development polish would elevate the material, and then when it became clear that wouldn't be the case, it was impossible to replace . Like, I don't think anyone at Bethesda has actually defended the dialogue system, right?
The best/worst examples of this are the dialogues where the character you're talking to immediately introduces himself/herself after. "Hey Pam". "Hi, I'm Pam, I sell stuff". It sounds super awkward.
100% this. I feel like fallout 4 isn't even pretending to be an RPG anymore - they took out skills, character stats barely even matter and the dialogue gives you no opportunity to role-play. Therefore comparing it to New Vegas just feels really silly, as they are basically in a completely different genre at this point.
Instead, it makes more sense to compare it to games like Far Cry 3, Just Cause 2 or Borderlands. And in that comparison, Fallout 4 stacks up quite well, primarily because the world is actually filled with some interesting things and because the progression is not solely based on repeating the same missions over and over again, as has been the case in most recent open world games.
It's also easily better than Fallout 3, if only because the story is not insultingly dumb and because it has drastically better game play. It's not like Bethesda games have had good RPG mechanics in a while now, so I really don't feel like cutting them out was much of a loss.
D
Deleted member 30609
Unconfirmed Member
Also, I've talked to multiple characters and got exact repeats of previous conversations, including mission ending dialogue. It feels super weird.
If they were going to do voiced dialogue, then they should have actually written a character. In Walking Dead or Mass Effect or The Witcher, your character speaks without prompt. She has a personality. In Fallout, pressing a different face-button and getting a completely different Jennifer Hale performance omitted out into a world that barely reacts is so fucking weird. Your character makes no sense, and that's fine when you can fill in the gaps yourself. Not so much here.
If they were going to do voiced dialogue, then they should have actually written a character. In Walking Dead or Mass Effect or The Witcher, your character speaks without prompt. She has a personality. In Fallout, pressing a different face-button and getting a completely different Jennifer Hale performance omitted out into a world that barely reacts is so fucking weird. Your character makes no sense, and that's fine when you can fill in the gaps yourself. Not so much here.
firehawk12
Subete no aware
The fact that F4 has no low int dialog options kind of says it all really.
What I really don't like are the settlements. So useless and unnecessary in a Fallout game. I get it, Bethesda wanted more checkbox features but they should've introduce this into their next TES game where it fits much better imo. They get constantly attacked, always needs more protection with expensive turrets and give absolutely no benefits beside that you have to help them when needed. It almost ruined my Fallout experience but now I don't give a crap anymore about them. Let them be attacked, let them whine about no protection. Wtf I'am? The governator of fucking Commonwealth? Please, give me break. I play Fallout because I want that feeling of a lone wolf who is marching throught the desert (something that I miss aswell, the freaking desert). In that regard, Fallout 4 is a bad Fallout for me ;(
D
Deleted member 30609
Unconfirmed Member
Do you actually have to defend the bases? I never do and I never hear anything about it.
buy teh haloz
Banned
JohnnyFootball
GerAlt-Right. Ciriously.
I would have enjoyed the settlements if they actually actually accomplished something meaningful in the game. Like gave you access to the best weapons, armor, etc.
Going to youtube and seeing some of the settlements other gamers made, its clear that some enjoyed it.
It has by far the most interesting world in a modern day Fallout game (3, NV, 4). Haven't played Fallout 1 or 2.
Bethesda gets better and better at crafting amazing, dense worlds that I can't help but want to explore. Dialogue is the games biggest problem, but overall I think the narrative is enticing enough to keep me moving forward. I've enjoyed most of the sidequests I've played so far, and enjoy most of my companions.
The gameplay is the best that Bethesda has ever crafted. That's usually where these games lose me - I'm lost in the world but the gameplay becomes overly repetitive and unfun. Fallout 4 has fun shooting mechanics and it makes the world a lot more fun to be in.
Love settlement building, love that junk is actually worth collecting now.
I can understand the complaints about Fallout 4, especially related to dialogue and/or choice. It's weak in those areas, but it is so much stronger everywhere else. The world of New Vegas was absolutely boring compared to Fallout 4.
Bethesda gets better and better at crafting amazing, dense worlds that I can't help but want to explore. Dialogue is the games biggest problem, but overall I think the narrative is enticing enough to keep me moving forward. I've enjoyed most of the sidequests I've played so far, and enjoy most of my companions.
The gameplay is the best that Bethesda has ever crafted. That's usually where these games lose me - I'm lost in the world but the gameplay becomes overly repetitive and unfun. Fallout 4 has fun shooting mechanics and it makes the world a lot more fun to be in.
Love settlement building, love that junk is actually worth collecting now.
I can understand the complaints about Fallout 4, especially related to dialogue and/or choice. It's weak in those areas, but it is so much stronger everywhere else. The world of New Vegas was absolutely boring compared to Fallout 4.
JohnnyFootball
GerAlt-Right. Ciriously.
Just curious what did anyone feel was the most useful and least useful perk?
The least useful perks:
Lead Belly - Take less radiation from eating or drinking. Stimpacks are everywhere. Radiation amounts from food was negligible.
Rad Resistant - only adds 10 to resistance at each level. If it added like say 50 then it would tough to resist.
Basher - I cant see a reason to invest in this if you were going to put that many points in strength you likely already had a melee build.
The most disappointing perks (for me):
Intimidation - didn't work enough for it to be really beneficial IMO, but I only got one level out of it.
Mysterious Stranger - I got this one for comedy reasons, but he pretty much never appeared.
Bloody Mess - I didn't notice any difference in gore. The 15% damage was nice I suppose
Ricochet - again never happened enough to be really worthwhile.
Most useful perks
Lockpicking and Terminal - always in fallout games.
Aquaboy - taking no radiation from water is HUGE. Get this one.
All of the gun perks - My shotgun could almost one shot everything when maxed
Armor and gun modding perks were fun
Most OP perks:
I never used them, but I've heard that Better Criticals combined with Critical Banker made you virtually unstoppable.
The least useful perks:
Lead Belly - Take less radiation from eating or drinking. Stimpacks are everywhere. Radiation amounts from food was negligible.
Rad Resistant - only adds 10 to resistance at each level. If it added like say 50 then it would tough to resist.
Basher - I cant see a reason to invest in this if you were going to put that many points in strength you likely already had a melee build.
The most disappointing perks (for me):
Intimidation - didn't work enough for it to be really beneficial IMO, but I only got one level out of it.
Mysterious Stranger - I got this one for comedy reasons, but he pretty much never appeared.
Bloody Mess - I didn't notice any difference in gore. The 15% damage was nice I suppose
Ricochet - again never happened enough to be really worthwhile.
Most useful perks
Lockpicking and Terminal - always in fallout games.
Aquaboy - taking no radiation from water is HUGE. Get this one.
All of the gun perks - My shotgun could almost one shot everything when maxed
Armor and gun modding perks were fun
Most OP perks:
I never used them, but I've heard that Better Criticals combined with Critical Banker made you virtually unstoppable.
Very fun to very fun to very fun.
If you aren't interested in the Fallout lore they "butchered" or a story then they are all basically the same with Fallout 4 having the best improvements to stability and gun play. If you started with Fallout 3 you won't ever notice the inconsistent lore and most likely wouldn't care anyway. I'm different than most here, I actually rank NV last out of the 3.
If you aren't interested in the Fallout lore they "butchered" or a story then they are all basically the same with Fallout 4 having the best improvements to stability and gun play. If you started with Fallout 3 you won't ever notice the inconsistent lore and most likely wouldn't care anyway. I'm different than most here, I actually rank NV last out of the 3.
The least useful perk has to be the one that gives you health as you gain rads. It sounds super awesome, until you realize that rads and health run along the same bar in this game so in the end you still end up with less health since you can't gain health where there's radiation.
JohnnyFootball
GerAlt-Right. Ciriously.
Yeah, I did try that one and reloaded my save. Didn't like it.
Still I do feel lead belly is pointless.
Count of Monte Sawed-Off
un33dab@dpu$$y
Actually this is really close for me. 4 doesn't have anyone as cool as Boone and Cass, but it also doesn't have anyone as shitty as Veronica. Bethesda really stepped up their game with companions. I really liked Piper, Nick, and Cait, and I'd put them over most of NV's cast. Didn't spend much time with anyone else except Dogmeat who remains awesome, but doesn't give any perks. I've heard good things about Curie, and Hancock could be cool.
MiguelItUp
Member
Personally I still think that 3 has the best story, it's nothing too intricate, but it got the job done. Not to mention when the main quest was done, I felt somewhat accomplished. I didn't feel that way with New Vegas and 4. More so with 4. 4 was pretty predictable and when you get to the "huge twist" I was already set on just completing it. I was hoping for a lot more in terms of story and awe. Though I do think 4 has the best gameplay of the bunch. However I have to admit that the faction stuff felt more solid in New Vegas, the faction based stuff in 4 just felt incredibly lackluster IMO.
JohnnyFootball
GerAlt-Right. Ciriously.
The only problem I had with the Fallout 3 quest is that it made next to no sense if you were a Bad Karma character.
Fine Ham Abounds
Member
I said this elsewhere but my general sense is that this is their first game where I found the combat to be serviceable. It's only as disappointing as The Witcher 3 in that respect. The RPG elements are essentially nonexistent now though, so the real meat of the game is now the metagame of Minecraft for Packrats.
Short version: Their best feeling game yet, and their worst RPG yet.
Gut feeling without anything but the anecdotal evidence that I've gone about 50 hours without a corrupted save or terrible performance drops is that the overall package seems more stable with this horrible engine running on better hardware, so that's a plus as well.
I sound down on the game, but I've enjoyed it vastly more than Fallout 3 or Skyrim, it just doesn't really belong in the same category as New Vegas.
Short version: Their best feeling game yet, and their worst RPG yet.
Gut feeling without anything but the anecdotal evidence that I've gone about 50 hours without a corrupted save or terrible performance drops is that the overall package seems more stable with this horrible engine running on better hardware, so that's a plus as well.
I sound down on the game, but I've enjoyed it vastly more than Fallout 3 or Skyrim, it just doesn't really belong in the same category as New Vegas.
ftfy.
firebricks3
Member
Fallout 4 improves upon just about everything from 3 and NV, except for the dialogue that everyone has already harped upon. The gunplay is actually a viable thing now without VATS, the graphics have been improved in some very crucial ways (especially the lighting), just about everything is voiced competently and there's plenty of random small moments in the game that gives it some life. However, the dialogue system is...not great. It's not as bad as I thought it'd be, but its strangely limiting. I am always second guessing what the dialogue decision I made to try to force the game into the NPC giving me a response that makes the quest finish quicker. It makes the dialogue less natural.
Speaking of the random small moments that give the game life, I absolutely love all of random things that your companions will say in response to where the are and the actions that are happening. Nick asking "Where did that guy go? You saw him right?" whenever the mysterious stranger pops is amazing, a long with all the things he'll randomly saying to you during quests or even when you board the USS constitution, he has a small quip specifically for that. It's such a nice touch and I can't imagine how much audio is in this game that no one will hear.
Speaking of the random small moments that give the game life, I absolutely love all of random things that your companions will say in response to where the are and the actions that are happening. Nick asking "Where did that guy go? You saw him right?" whenever the mysterious stranger pops is amazing, a long with all the things he'll randomly saying to you during quests or even when you board the USS constitution, he has a small quip specifically for that. It's such a nice touch and I can't imagine how much audio is in this game that no one will hear.
I'm so sorry.
What? NV had agency. Fallout is just endless copy paste of raider scum and mutated mud crabs.
What...
His Majesty
Banned
It didn't have any ghoul kids locked up for 200 years in fridges, that's for sure. I'll take boring over that any day.
Vyse The Legend
Member
The nerfed dialogue system automatically makes FO4 the least interesting of the three.
Your avatar has, more or less, zero personality outside of the occasional sarcastic/hostile response. Even then, you typically only get a slight variation in the target NPC's response, amounting to little more than a single extra line of dialogue, before the conversation course corrects and sticks you back on the preset path.
The improved gunplay and crafting options are where FO4 shines.
Your avatar has, more or less, zero personality outside of the occasional sarcastic/hostile response. Even then, you typically only get a slight variation in the target NPC's response, amounting to little more than a single extra line of dialogue, before the conversation course corrects and sticks you back on the preset path.
The improved gunplay and crafting options are where FO4 shines.
FO4 has more than NV but half of them are literally the same quest in a different location. It's kind of lame.
Nah, no reason to be. I'm having an absolute blast with F4.
I really enjoyed F3 & NV as well, but something about them felt so one-note oppressive that I found myself disinclined to play them for long stretches at a time. It was just so dreary and depressing.
Perhaps it's the bright color palette in F4 that makes it feel so much more inviting or something. I don't know.
Doesn't matter. Like I said, it's some of the best gaming I've had all year.
as far as the actual gameplay is concerned, I'm liking it way, way more than 3. I played 3, but got bored of it within 4-5 hours. with 4 I just feel more compelled and interested in playing. the shooting feels better, the crafting is interesting, and overall it just feel more playable to me. storywise I could not give two shits about either though ¯\_(ツ
_/¯
_/¯That's an objectively wrong statement. Is Fallout 4's world populated with raiders, gunners, and super mutants? Yes. Completely. That has nothing to do with world building.
World building takes place in the moment to moment exploration, the eavesdropping on raiders/townspeople/etc, the placement of objects, the setting itself. I agree with you - NV gives the player much more agency than any other Fallout game to shape the outcome of the world
Note: Haven't finished 4 yet, so not sure if 4 surpasses
Bethesda does an amazing job at creating an engrossing, believable world.
Okay, hope you enjoy?
It more than even that. It gives the player more agency, full stop.
No one is scared of nick and no one in diamond city gives a fuck about you bringing hancock along.
Believable.
There are plenty of comments in-game about this very thing. Even when I brought Nick into
Vault 81
Curie after I transferred her to a Synth body
QuantumSquid
Member
THE SHROUD DISAGREES WITH YOUR UNJUST ASSERTION!
The Dark Brotherhood is probably the best questline Bethesda's ever made, though. Getting locked into the casket with that possessed corpse of the old mother of the Dark Brotherhood... yeesh. I haven't played or thought about Skyrim much in 4 years and I still remember that quest vividly.