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In my opinion, lag on the NES Classic makes games unplayable

E

ElectricBlanketFire

Member
EDIT: To clarify, on a television, not a computer monitor.

I received the NES Classic as a birthday/Christmas gift and didn't open it until we were with friends and family over Christmas.

Even with game mode on (and we tested multiple TVs), there is a noticeable lag. Mega Man 2, Ninja Gaiden, Castlevania, Punch-Out...where precision is key, the NES Classic falls way short.

Convenience and nostalgia can't erase 30 years of muscle memory.
 
G

Grimsen

Member
I've been carrying mine to various gatherings during the holidays, and it's been playable on every setup I tried.
 
B

BigK_201

Member
Thought the same until I hooked it up to my computer monitor. No lag on the NES Classic, just your HDTV (like pretty much every HDTV).
 
B

britt0n

Neo Member
Mine has zero lag. Not sure what the issue on yours is. I have an older vizio tv I've used it on and that Sony PlayStation tv. Both work fine.
 
S

Scumcore

Member
tbh I didn't have a problem with lag. I finished Double Dragon II with a friend last week and played through all the Mario games, but haven't had any problems. I'll give Mega Man 2 a go. If there is any lag I'm sure I'll notice it with that game.


However the screen brightness did change every couple of minutes from light to dark. That was frustrating. Still haven't found a solution for that.

And I used a 3m USB and HDMI cable due to the extreme short controller cables :(
 
SonicMegaDrive

SonicMegaDrive

Member
It's not the device itself, it's just the nature of LCD TVs. On mine I've managed to get rid of most of the lag by renaming the input to "PC" on my Samsung TV. It's still not perfect, but I got it down to the point where I was finally able to KO Mike Tyson.
 
J

Jubern

Member
Yeah I'm actually curious as to how it fares on my TV back home. We tried it at my parents place where the only set available was a shitty Hisense (good god my eyes almost exploded when I put FFXV on it) and my fiancee noticed the lag immediately despite not being hardcore and only having her memory to go about.
This week she went back to her own parents place and duck out the OG NES to compare and she told me it's night and day...

Hope it's more of a TV problem than anything, otherwise I guess she won't be playing the Classic that much after all lol
 
E

ElectricBlanketFire

Member
SonicMegaDrive said:
It's not the device itself, it's just the nature of LCD TVs. On mine I've managed to get rid of most of the lag by renaming the input to "PC" on my Samsung TV. It's still not perfect, but I got it down to the point where I was finally able to KO Mike Tyson.
Click to expand...

I didn't realize you could do this. I have a Samsung TV circa 2013.
 
W

Wolfgunblood Garopa

Member
I notice lag on anything that's not the real hardware on a CRT. HDTVs vary wildly in terms of input lag, and almost none of them can provide a good twitch based game experience.

People say there's no lag for them when they play a NES Classic, but I guarantee if they played, say, Zelda II on real hardware on a CRT they would instantly notice something magical about the instant response.
 
T

TheXfactor

Member
SonicMegaDrive said:
It's not the device itself, it's just the nature of LCD TVs. On mine I've managed to get rid of most of the lag by renaming the input to "PC" on my Samsung TV. It's still not perfect, but I got it down to the point where I was finally able to KO Mike Tyson.
Click to expand...
Mike Tyson is in the nes classic punchout??
 
E

ElectricBlanketFire

Member
Wolfgunblood Garopa said:
I notice lag on anything that's not the real hardware on a CRT. HDTVs vary wildly in terms of input lag, and almost none of them can provide a good twitch based game experience.

People say there's no lag for them when they play a NES Classic, but I guarantee if they played, say, Zelda II on real hardware on a CRT they would instantly notice something magical about the instant response.
Click to expand...

Yeah, I don't see how it's possible not to notice it. And I'm certain plenty of people who bought one who haven't played games in 20+ years are wondering why it doesn't feel the same/aren't aware they can make adjustments to make it better but still not perfect.

Lkr said:
No problems here but mine is hooked up to a monitor as opposed to an actual TV
Click to expand...

I'd rather not hook it up to a monitor as the entire point is to play it in your living room with the fam.
 
E

ElectricBlanketFire

Member
Nugg said:
I have zero input lag, and zero trouble finishing most of the games you mentioned.
Click to expand...

What TV are you using? Again, I tried multiple setups and other people noticed it as well.

Not saying I don't believe everyone saying they have zero lag...I just don't see how I bad lucked into testing 4 unusable TVs.
 
Ceallach

Ceallach

Smells like fresh rosebuds
Wolfgunblood Garopa said:
I notice lag on anything that's not the real hardware on a CRT. HDTVs vary wildly in terms of input lag, and almost none of them can provide a good twitch based game experience.

People say there's no lag for them when they play a NES Classic, but I guarantee if they played, say, Zelda II on real hardware on a CRT they would instantly notice something magical about the instant response.
Click to expand...
Exactly this. The nes classic is playable, and even hooking an nes up to an HDTV is playable. But the lag is noticable.
 
B

BriGuy

Member
Turn off all the post-processing shit you can and enable "game mode" if your TV has one. There's always going to be some lag (you're going from a technology that measured input lag in nanoseconds to one that measures it in milliseconds), but it should never be "unplayable."
 
A

AndyMoogle

Member
ElectricBlanketFire said:
What TV are you using? Again, I tried multiple setups and other people noticed it as well.

Not saying I don't believe everyone saying they have zero lag...I just don't see how I bad lucked into testing 4 unusable TVs.
Click to expand...

That's not really bad luck. Most LCDs people buy probably have 60+ ms input lag.
 
J

jimboton

Member
Wolfgunblood Garopa said:
I notice lag on anything that's not the real hardware on a CRT. HDTVs vary wildly in terms of input lag, and almost none of them can provide a good twitch based game experience.

People say there's no lag for them when they play a NES Classic, but I guarantee if they played, say, Zelda II on real hardware on a CRT they would instantly notice something magical about the instant response.
Click to expand...

This is the truth. It's impossible that the NES Classic doesn't add at the very least 1 frame of lag, very likely more (that's before factoring TV input lag) being that it's doing software emulation. I'm sure it's good enough to play most games, but you guys saying there's no lag at all should try if you have the chance the real thing hooked to a CRT tv. It will seem the game is reacting before you press the button. Happened to me.
 
S

Syril

Member
Doesn't it output at 720? Then you also have an issue of some TVs being better than others at handling lower resolutions.
 
S

Skeletos311

Junior Member
How many milliseconds does renaming the input to PC shave off? My Samsung TV is supposed to be 30ms. Am I not getting 30ms with it on game mode?
 
L

Lasthope106

Member
I don't have a real NES to compare, but so far the games I've tried seem to work fine on my tv. Calling it unplayable is a stretch.

I have a Vizio D series.
 
W

World SkiFree

Member
Wolfgunblood Garopa said:
I notice lag on anything that's not the real hardware on a CRT. HDTVs vary wildly in terms of input lag, and almost none of them can provide a good twitch based game experience.

People say there's no lag for them when they play a NES Classic, but I guarantee if they played, say, Zelda II on real hardware on a CRT they would instantly notice something magical about the instant response.
Click to expand...

Ceallach said:
Exactly this. The nes classic is playable, and even hooking an nes up to an HDTV is playable. But the lag is noticable.
Click to expand...
I tried my Classic on both of my TVs. Ultimately worked but still seemed to have minor lag. Big difference is that I play the original NES somewhat regularly on a CRT. I'm guessing most folks are just slightly adjusting their muscle memory.

The controls on the good NES games are just so responsive, it is almost the system's calling card. It is difficult to accept anything less, at least t me. Good to hear that it is not an issue for many in this thread.
 
Dr. Zoidberg

Dr. Zoidberg

Member
ElectricBlanketFire said:
I didn't realize you could do this. I have a Samsung TV circa 2013.
Click to expand...

SonicMegaDrive said:
Yeah, it does a MUCH better job than Game Mode, I think.
Click to expand...

It actually depends on the TV. On some sets PC mode is actually more laggy than game mode because it offers 4:4:4 color support.

For example, on the popular Samsung KS8000:

1080p Game Mode : 20.9 ms
1080p PC Mode (4:4:4) : 37.8 ms

I don't have a NES classic but I've been playing NES games via my AVS in game mode and the lag is unnoticeable.
 
J

Joe Shlabotnik

Banned
Just posted this in the other NES Classic thread, but yeah there is slight lag on my Samsung TV in Game Mode but pretty much non-existent on my PC monitor.

I've fought Tyson / Dream literally hundreds of times in my life so I always use it to test lag. It never QUITE compares to CRT response.
 
E

El Pescado

Member
World SkiFree said:
I tried my Classic on both of my TVs. Ultimately worked but still seemed to have minor lag. Big difference is that I play the original NES somewhat regularly on a CRT. I'm guessing most folks are just slightly adjusting their muscle memory.

The controls on the good NES games are just so responsive, it is almost the system's calling card. It is difficult to accept anything less, at least t me. Good to hear that it is not an issue for many in this thread.
Click to expand...

I played NES on a CRT until about 2 years ago when I had to dump it. I'm not saying there isn't ANY lag, but what is there is imperceptible to my eyes and I play a lot of NES. Calling it unplayable has to be the fault of the TV.
 
J

Joe Shlabotnik

Banned
dreamcastmaster said:
No consideration that your reactions might not be what they were 30 years ago?
Click to expand...

I actually am rusty and shitty with Tyson / Dream now but I can still feel the lag. It's my fault on the PC monitor, but it's still slightly worse on the TV. I also test it with Soda Popinski--I can still absolutely destroy him with a fast enough response rate but if the lag is significant he's a pain in the ass.

Also it's only been like three years since I've old-school gamed on a CRT.

I still have an old CRT stuffed away and an NES. If I'm feeling extra motivated I'll haul it all out and try Punch-Out on it (assuming it all still works).
 
M

modsbox

Member
I have an AVS and just got a Classic yesterday. Just did back-to-back tests. May have an explanation here. My findings so far:

On a Samsung LED HDTV *without* enabling game mode, AVS is playable but feels a little off and Classic is noticeably lagged.

With game mode enabled, AVS feels perfect to me, Classic feels good but slightly lagged.

I tested this speedrunning Ninja Gaiden and Super Mario Bros, which I can do at a pretty good level but not competitive to world records. I also tested Zelda, for which some of the tricks (screen scroll and block clip) require frame precision.

My takeaway (without having any way to measure it, how do people measure ms lag anyway?) is that AVS is lag-free and Classic does introduce some lag. If you compound that by not enabling game mode on some TVs, Classic becomes noticeably unplayable while AVS is still playable. I would imagine that some of the latest TVs have so little lag even without game mode that both Classic and AVS can be playable without 'feeling' the lag, further making this issue a bit hit-or-miss and explaining people's different reactions.

Would love to hear more thoughts from folks that can compare one versus the other.
 
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