For me I can't really get into the whole going through a list of 50 indie games to find some that I might enjoy. I hear more about the 'AAA' games so I know what they are about, some indie games get a lot of coverage so I hear about those too, but not nearly as much. There are just way too many of them for me to really pay attention
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Indie > 'AAA'
- Thread starter Toma
- Start date
gutter_trash
Banned
the older I get, the more I can't stand AAA games anymore.
Indy bringing classic vibe and originality back
Indy bringing classic vibe and originality back
AHA-Lambda
Member
yep, I've became very disillusioned with AAA games for some time now so I agree with this notion.
Mauricio_Magus
Banned
I'm not that much into Indies or AAA games, but I guess I'd take Indie stuff.
I honestly don't give indie games much attention, if at all, because they seem to appeal to the NES/SNES generation only. (8bit or 16bit graphics).
If more indie games went the PSX/N64 graphical way or even 6th+ gen I might give them more attention.
I just don't find the current indie games providing something I enjoy. Which is why I can't enjoy my Vita (and to a lesser extent, Wii U) as much as other people on GAF.
And I don't mean to downplay indie developers, I understand funds are a big part of it aswell. Anyways that's my 2cents on indie games.
I also don't like many of today's current AAA games, but every now and then there's a gem that does come out for both AAA and Indies that I like.
If more indie games went the PSX/N64 graphical way or even 6th+ gen I might give them more attention.
I just don't find the current indie games providing something I enjoy. Which is why I can't enjoy my Vita (and to a lesser extent, Wii U) as much as other people on GAF.
And I don't mean to downplay indie developers, I understand funds are a big part of it aswell. Anyways that's my 2cents on indie games.
I also don't like many of today's current AAA games, but every now and then there's a gem that does come out for both AAA and Indies that I like.
gigantor21
Member
Great games can and have been made with budgets/teams/marketing large and small.
Why get hung up on labels?
Why get hung up on labels?
More_Badass
Member
Here's a list of some indie games you might be interested in:
Distance
Cloudbuilt
Thumper
Apotheon
The Stanley Parable
Routine
SCALE
Deadlock
Tower of Guns
Wings of Saint Nazaire
The Stomping Lands
Stasis
K
kittens
Unconfirmed Member
Indies are better by sheer diversity and creativity alone. Indies mean everything from Braid to Minecraft to Gone Home to Depression Quest to Analogue: A Hate Story.
Meanwhile, AAA games are becoming ever more homogeneous.
Meanwhile, AAA games are becoming ever more homogeneous.
Zeyphersan
Banned
I'd be honestly pretty dissatisfied if the industry ONLY produced AAA games or ONLY produced indie games. It's the mix in my Steam library that makes sure there's always something I want to play. For example, last week I really just wanted short games. I beat Brothers: A Tale of Two Sons, LIMBO, VVVVVV, and a couple others. This week, I wanted a big title, so I booted up Dishonored and beat that. Having only one of those (very broad) categories would have left me dissatisfied depending on my mood.
Gaming is about the combination of all available experiences, not the segregation.
Gaming is about the combination of all available experiences, not the segregation.
OniBarubary
Banned
Fuck AAA games and fuck indy games.
I'm into A and AA games. Gimme your mid-range titles motherfuckeeeeeerrrrrrrrrrr.
I'm into A and AA games. Gimme your mid-range titles motherfuckeeeeeerrrrrrrrrrr.
There are mid range games... they are coming out of PC and Indie Devs.
Anyways yeah AAA just isnt my thing anymore.. I crave games that are deep or niche and AAA just dosnt scratch that itch.
The only AAA game I can see myself buying this year is probably Darksouls 2 and I'm sure that game is nowhere near the budget of many bigger titles.
Imagine if we never knew about GTA/V, then one day it showed up in the indie-scene as an indie-game.. There would be so much hipster-orgasm (no offense, I'm a indie-loving hipster too..) we wouldn't hear the end of it.
I think "riposte" has the best post in this thread so far. Most of the perceptions surrounding indie and AAA are tacked on ahead of time, which makes the discussion almost impossible.
That reminds me; what the hell is an indie game anyway.. the lines are so blurry. Many "indie-games" are multi-million dollar professional businesses but are for some reason still regarded as "indie-games" in this forum (Blow, Notch, That Game Company..)
I think "riposte" has the best post in this thread so far. Most of the perceptions surrounding indie and AAA are tacked on ahead of time, which makes the discussion almost impossible.
That reminds me; what the hell is an indie game anyway.. the lines are so blurry. Many "indie-games" are multi-million dollar professional businesses but are for some reason still regarded as "indie-games" in this forum (Blow, Notch, That Game Company..)
I appreciate indys and like many of them, but I dont think an indy has ever been the game I talk about that people must absolutely play...there are a few standouts, but even those (Journey and Unfinished Swan) arent even rally indies
I like the indy/Sony created games as they are usually games with a unique vision, but a uniue vision that is seen all the way through without cutting as many corners
I like the indy/Sony created games as they are usually games with a unique vision, but a uniue vision that is seen all the way through without cutting as many corners
More_Badass
Member
Wyndstryker
Member
Indies are filling in the niches and voids that AAA gaming has created, hence why the sudden rise in it's popularity. As the console business started shifting towards the AAA any game that wasn't AAA was in most cases DOA. It's not really a matter of Indie > AAA, it's a matter of what gameplay/genre I like and where it's going. If AAA doesn't have it a gamer will eventually find an indie game that can satisfy that taste. Nothing wrong with liking one or the other or both but it helps to understand the hows and whys. Gaming is a lot bigger and varied than people really think and realize.
I don't like the term indy, but independant games basically means to me, developers with a single studio that release games without traditional publishers, game can be funded from different places as long as the developer has all business control
Which one does Dota 2 fall under?
Anyway, I think AAA is good for pushing tech and indies are good for pushing ideas and concepts. Whenever an AAA game tries to push ideas it's always so watered down to appease the most amount of people possible. I've been avoiding AAA games for a while (due to lack of depth) but I do think they should exist so tech can progress faster, but not at the cost of A, AA, and B-tier games which is what's been happening.
Anyway, I think AAA is good for pushing tech and indies are good for pushing ideas and concepts. Whenever an AAA game tries to push ideas it's always so watered down to appease the most amount of people possible. I've been avoiding AAA games for a while (due to lack of depth) but I do think they should exist so tech can progress faster, but not at the cost of A, AA, and B-tier games which is what's been happening.
dota was like cs a mod aka indie and now just like cs became valve so has dota.
Dark Octave
Banned
This image lol
Riposte
Member
Take notice of the effort to make the "AAA" label apply to as few games as possible, while "indie" applies to as many games as reason will allow. Games that have a hard time fitting into "indie" games are treated as neutral and invisible until it is time to use them to beat up "AAA" games some more. The idea of using said mid-tier games to also beat up "indies" is undesirable; the idea that they may relate more to their bigger budget studio brethren unimaginable. Any small amount of meaning these marketing brands hold, and it was always a very small amount, is greatly overshadowed by the politics at play. Who gets to decide what the word creativity means?
What's the difference between an A, AA, and AAA game? Let's see if we can quantify this stuff too.
What's the difference between an A, AA, and AAA game? Let's see if we can quantify this stuff too.
Northeastmonk
Gold Member
I grew into the idea that I was going to do game design when I grew up and that idea died the day I realized I couldn't mix work with pleasure, but indie games were something I always thought of when I saw digital art and game design degrees. I for one think it's great for the business, but when indie debs start bad mouthing triple A titles and gamers start to flock over to these cheap gimmicks is when I get disgusted. I own a few indie titles, but I'm almost never interested in booting them up more than once or twice. My problem is that they're getting this status as an option. We should give credit to the companies spending millions and less to some lousy thrill like we're playing a Chinese rip off of Mario. Lately I see these strange developed titles on the App Store and etc and it just feels like a garbage list. We had our bases covered 6 years ago, why is this artsy fartsy indie crowd always so proudful? I get on Desura and see a bucket list of titles like the cereal isle and I get uninterested almost immediately.
Toma delivering once again 
And GAF being disappointing as often too ....
I don't make any distinction anymore, I had a hard time getting into Indie games based solely on the overall retro look of so many of them, since I've took the plunge I've never looked back.
Sure there are things that are way better than others, but there is also plenty of ways to try these games before buying (And Toma's dedication to the indie thread really helps with this *cheers*, I don't post often, but I follow it closely )
There are two categories of games that I have a really hard time enjoying these days, 3rd person shooters, and platformers, and I still have plenty to pick from and enjoy, the 'it's all platformers and metroid like' really is the most stupid argument against indie games EVER.
I won't argue over the quality of Indies vs AAA games, but there is one thing that really makes Indie games stand-out nowadays, and that is variety, one thing where big budget games become really lacking.
That all comes from some kind of twisted view of risks vs rewards scenarios as far as game budgets go, and Indie studios really have more freedom around that.
I can perfectly understand the 'pixelly look' problem, but sincerely, look at videos rather than screens, .gifs too as they really shine in motion.
Some games reproduce the 8/16-bit look on purpose and look like they could have been made on the corresponding platforms, but most of them really take this 'style' to a whole new level with good work on animation and modern lighting and particle effects.
Sure you won't get photo realistic graphics in most games, but as far as graphical style goes there are some extraordinary things even among the most retro-looking ones.
Basically any 'relatively small' gaming company that is not tied to a certain publisher and all the 'marketing department' bullshit that comes with it.
It's true that the lines are a bit blurred after the major success of some of them, and it's true that most of them are still very small studios that are hardly getting by, but basically they all more or less operate on the fringe/outside of what is established today as the 'regular' video game industry and it's very streamlined channels and process.
Sometimes they might be published by some big names on select platforms because the platform policies require that.
The fact that they released something and made a huge success like Mojang (Notch) doesn't change that as they still continue to make things they like and want to make instead of searching for the next CoD success for profit, because they retain a certain degree of freedom that most of the established big studios don't seem to have anymore.
And GAF being disappointing as often too ....
I don't make any distinction anymore, I had a hard time getting into Indie games based solely on the overall retro look of so many of them, since I've took the plunge I've never looked back.
Sure there are things that are way better than others, but there is also plenty of ways to try these games before buying (And Toma's dedication to the indie thread really helps with this *cheers*, I don't post often, but I follow it closely )
There are two categories of games that I have a really hard time enjoying these days, 3rd person shooters, and platformers, and I still have plenty to pick from and enjoy, the 'it's all platformers and metroid like' really is the most stupid argument against indie games EVER.
I won't argue over the quality of Indies vs AAA games, but there is one thing that really makes Indie games stand-out nowadays, and that is variety, one thing where big budget games become really lacking.
That all comes from some kind of twisted view of risks vs rewards scenarios as far as game budgets go, and Indie studios really have more freedom around that.
I can perfectly understand the 'pixelly look' problem, but sincerely, look at videos rather than screens, .gifs too as they really shine in motion.
Some games reproduce the 8/16-bit look on purpose and look like they could have been made on the corresponding platforms, but most of them really take this 'style' to a whole new level with good work on animation and modern lighting and particle effects.
Sure you won't get photo realistic graphics in most games, but as far as graphical style goes there are some extraordinary things even among the most retro-looking ones.
Basically any 'relatively small' gaming company that is not tied to a certain publisher and all the 'marketing department' bullshit that comes with it.
It's true that the lines are a bit blurred after the major success of some of them, and it's true that most of them are still very small studios that are hardly getting by, but basically they all more or less operate on the fringe/outside of what is established today as the 'regular' video game industry and it's very streamlined channels and process.
Sometimes they might be published by some big names on select platforms because the platform policies require that.
The fact that they released something and made a huge success like Mojang (Notch) doesn't change that as they still continue to make things they like and want to make instead of searching for the next CoD success for profit, because they retain a certain degree of freedom that most of the established big studios don't seem to have anymore.
Funny thing is I feel like most the A and AA these days are coming out of indie devs or smaller dev teams in general.. specially on the PC front.
Stuff like Dayz, Next Car Game, Divinity: Original Sin
Middle ground stuff is here its just a lot of it is coming from places like kickstarter and early access games.
Cool to see this thread come back to life. It's a good conversation to have.
For me, 2013 was the year that the AAA industry jumped the shark. The growing bombast and lack of imagination killed AAA gaming for me almost entirely. The vast majority of my gaming time in 2013 was spent playing small budget and indie games.
For me, 2013 was the year that the AAA industry jumped the shark. The growing bombast and lack of imagination killed AAA gaming for me almost entirely. The vast majority of my gaming time in 2013 was spent playing small budget and indie games.
The sooner we can leave labels like Indie and AAA behind us, the better. Categorizing games only hurts them.
I used to post on IGN and prefacing a game with the word Indie guaranteed that most of the replies would be negative. Sure, that can be attributed to general douchiness, immaturity and because they once heard about this dickish guy in that movie who made that weird puzzle platformer game, but it is what it is.
Same thing is applicable to "AAA" games when mentioned among a different audience.
People love to jump on bandwagons and labels reinforce that behavior. Just call them games and less people are going to dismiss them because they're made by pretentious hipsters or greedy corporate suits.
I used to post on IGN and prefacing a game with the word Indie guaranteed that most of the replies would be negative. Sure, that can be attributed to general douchiness, immaturity and because they once heard about this dickish guy in that movie who made that weird puzzle platformer game, but it is what it is.
Same thing is applicable to "AAA" games when mentioned among a different audience.
People love to jump on bandwagons and labels reinforce that behavior. Just call them games and less people are going to dismiss them because they're made by pretentious hipsters or greedy corporate suits.
It manages to create the feeling of both an expansive universe and overbearing isolation.
It evokes a sense of extreme dread when you take simple actions like moving to a new sector because everything is potentially a danger.
It makes you care about the crew you named yourself and breather life into because once they die, they're gone.
It feels adventurous, and urgent, and terrifying.
And all of this is managed by a 2D simplistic top down rougelike with very basic artwork.
It's extremely replayable. It has intelligent and fun mechanics. It's just a wonderful game and one that I recommend to every gamer I meet.
Magic Mushroom
Member
Depends on what you call AAA. Games like Wonderful 101, Mario 3D World and Metal Gear Rising were full of depth, imagination and great gameplay and they sure as hell aren't indie. Not that I dislike indies, I love them. But as I said before, where does AAA begin and end?
Games like Dark Souls II and The Witcher 3 for example are definitely more AAA than indie.
cheezcake
Member
# of sold copies needed to break even would be a good measure IMO
cartman414
Member
Those games, save for MGR perhaps, are A/AA. B perhaps.
Out of curiosity, would niche non-indie games (i. e. Atlus) still be mid-tier?
RoadHazard
Gold Member
Many indies are awesome, many AAAs are awesome. But I'd probably have to say that more indies than AAAs are absolute trash. Ratio-wise though? Hmm, not sure. I want and need both to exist.
Magic Mushroom
Member
Wasn't W101 Platinum's most expensive game ever? But if that's the case, why are people saying the middle ground is dead? What about games like Bayonetta 2 and Project X? Portal 2?
Also, The Last Guardian will be AAA when it comes out right?
I just think we should judge games on their merit, not their budget.
DXLelouch153
Banned
Valdis Storys pretty great
TheHollowNight
Member
Not that I've become disillusioned by the mainstream, but I've definitely noticed as I've got older, the indie/experimental side of the industry has appealed to me more and more.
I'm wondering if there is a correlation between age & interest in indie games? Since from what I've observed, the majority of younger gamers tend to dismiss that spectrum more easily and stick to the more console orientated big-hitters, or at least, tend to be less open-minded. I could be totally wrong about this, but it's made me curious in the past.
More_Badass
Member
Age and maturity is probably a factor. I'm 21, never played a NES/old retro game in my life, so nostalgia is not a factor here
The problem is that most people dont hear about the games that are most fun or could potentially be most fun. Its not a problem of "just play whatever is fun to you", its a problem of all the things mentioned in the OP that lead to a huge chunk of great games being ignored.
Hi guys I like good games.
Oh sorry, I have to choose a side ?
I mean obviously what would internet be without artificial fights between stuff, right.
Not all AAA games are great, not all indie games are great either.
Not all indie games are underdog stuff no one will never hear about, and not all AAA games manage to be incredibly well known or sell very well.
Not all indie games are innovative, not all AAA games are more of the same.
It's true some AAA games tend to follow the same trends and look alike a lot, but the same can be said of indie games, with other trends.
When a game is really freaking great, it's going to be celebrated, in here and elsewhere, wether it is indie or not.
Trying to take as one and celebrate OR downplay such incredibly huge "categories" of games is just ridiculous.
Even putting all of them in the same bag is ridiculous, be it for indies or AAA.
Sorry if this qualifies as "thread moaning", but I have really no idea why this is a discussion.
Oh sorry, I have to choose a side ?
I mean obviously what would internet be without artificial fights between stuff, right.
Not all AAA games are great, not all indie games are great either.
Not all indie games are underdog stuff no one will never hear about, and not all AAA games manage to be incredibly well known or sell very well.
Not all indie games are innovative, not all AAA games are more of the same.
It's true some AAA games tend to follow the same trends and look alike a lot, but the same can be said of indie games, with other trends.
When a game is really freaking great, it's going to be celebrated, in here and elsewhere, wether it is indie or not.
Trying to take as one and celebrate OR downplay such incredibly huge "categories" of games is just ridiculous.
Even putting all of them in the same bag is ridiculous, be it for indies or AAA.
Sorry if this qualifies as "thread moaning", but I have really no idea why this is a discussion.
Adam_Roman
Member
I like both. I tend to get more enjoyment out of indies though because they can make weird games that aren't 100 hours long with 90% of content being boring side-missions.