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[Zoe]

Lightning single handily fucked up this franchise.

Doesn't she poll well in Japan? I wouldn't be so quick to blame XIII.

All the Japanese people I talked to over the weekend said the series is too hard for them now.

 

[raven777]

Yes, it is in a different place. The place where Persona 5 can double what Persona 4 sold, while FFXV halves what FFXIII sold. A place called... justice.

lmao the two franchise's sales have never been closer.

 

[Spiritwalker]

The game doesn't really deserve to do better than past FFs, should have been delayed another year.

I agree. They shipped a messy and mediocre product.

 

[vareon]

Can we compare it with Mobius or Brave Exvius for comparison's sake? Say, vs revenue or userbase?

 

[funkystudent]

The series really blew up between 5 and 6 over there.

What made that particular jump so impactful?


I would have always guessed going 4 or 7 would have been the big leaps in sales. The massive leap from 5 6p 6 seems real random.

 

[LordKano]

Yes, it is in a different place. The place where Persona 5 can double what Persona 4 sold, while FFXV halves what FFXIII sold. A place called... justice.

I like your way of thinking.

 

[autumnleaf]

Does anyone have the figures for X-2 and XIII-2?

 

[firelogic]

How can we blame "the state of consoles in Japan" when games like persona 5 have had their biggest openings in history? Didn't Atlus just say P5 was their strongest debut, sales wise?

Looks more like FF falling off than consoles in Japan.

That's what I'm thinking. FFXV is an east meets west hybrid that probably didn't appeal to them.

 

[duckroll]

Doesn't she poll well in Japan? I wouldn't be so quick to blame XIII.

It is FFXIII's fault though. By introducing Lightning to the audience, S-E created a feminist icon so powerful and popular no other protagonist could hope to live up to. Noct never had a chance.

 

[hosannainexcelsis]

I would expect FF16 or 17 to land on mobile, tbh.

I think Square still sees Final Fantasy as an important brand to cultivate internationally, so I think it's more likely that they'll double down on that and try to go really hard after what they think Western audiences want with FF 16.

 

[Duxxy3]

I wonder why.

It's the first FF I've seriously given thought to buying since X.

 

[butman]

Not too surprising considering Japan has gone mobile.

This.
If XV were released when XIII did and vice versa. XV would crushed XIII.

 

[Tankard]

Bound to happen with how terrible the situation is in Japan, i was predicting sub 500k. I thought it was a good debut all things considered.

 

[MightyHedgehog]

Maybe they should actually try embracing the franchise's retro roots and make more modest party-based JRPGs instead of these dumb megabudget things they've been doing for the past twenty years? FFVI is still the highpoint.

 

[jett]

All cower before Toriyama, destroyer of worlds.

 

[JayWood2010]

I would expect FF16 or 17 to land on mobile, tbh.

Japan has went to mobiles, but none the less FFXV is still the fastest selling Final Fantasy game world wide with 5 million

http://www.forbes.com/sites/ollieba...me-in-the-history-of-the-series/#6b4237805576

 

[Jawmuncher]

Not surprising. Really didn't expect XV to surpass 13 sales. What with the lower console sales there. Also I still feel 13 hurt the series but more so because of the sequels rather than the main entry itself. Had they made 13 and then went to 14 & 15, not wasting time on sequels. I think things would have been a bit different. Well that and the reception of the title. All that wait for a title that didn't technically bring back the "quality" of the earlier games kinda hurts the look as well.

Could be more than that though. Even RE7 is looking like it'll vastly undersell RE6 numbers.

 

[Breakage]

Not even modelling the game's lead characters on a J-pop band could save XV in Japan. Is FF still relevant over there?

 

[duckroll]

I think Square still sees Final Fantasy as an important brand to cultivate internationally, so I think it's more likely that they'll double down on that and try to go really hard after what they think Western audiences want with FF 16.

So they're finally going to make the real sequel to FFXII?

 

[DNAbro]

I think Square still sees Final Fantasy as an important brand to cultivate internationally, so I think it's more likely that they'll double down on that and try to go really hard after what they think Western audiences want with FF 16.

That was FFXV

 

[Nameless]

Yes, it is in a different place. The place where Persona 5 can double what Persona 4 sold, while FFXV halves what FFXIII sold. A place called... justice.

It ain't over until Tabata patches in dating

 

[HotHamBoy]

I agree. They shipped a messy and mediocre product.

And yet they will blame it on the relevance of the brand and focus solely on spin-offs mining nostalgia for the older classics.

Series canceled.

The series really blew up between 5 and 6 over there.

What made that particular jump so impactful?


I would have always guessed going 4 or 7 would have been the big leaps in sales. The massive leap from 5 6p 6 seems real random.

Six was a landmark game for both Final Fantasy and JRPGs. It was a Big Deal.

 

[khaaan]

Nirolak didn't pollute our screens with gifs of Lightning.

A rose beautifies, not pollutes.

 

[Chindogg]

Just goes to show that console gaming in Japan is contracting pretty hard.

Switch may be console gaming in Japan's last hope of surviving.

I'm expeting Final Fantasy VII Remake (all episodes) to be great successes noticeably beyond FF13/15 but without having a large effect on the overall uptake for the franchise.

In the west maybe, but not in Japan with that combat.

 

[Wollan]

I'm expecting Final Fantasy VII Remake (all episodes) to be great successes noticeably beyond FF13/15 but without having a large effect on the overall uptake for the franchise (unless the quality once again rises to become benchmark worthy across jrpg/wrpg's).

 

[Toth]

FF13 came out at the height of the Ps3 era.

Persona 5 sold 550k but a large portion were PS3 sales.

But hey, let's not let facts get in the way!

 

[Go_Ly_Dow]

Toriyama is still at the company, right?

His presence alone must be a nice heat diversion for Tabata.

 

[cvxfreak]

The only recent console game in Japan to debut around these numbers is RE6 -- it debuted at 675K. That one ended up barely making it to 1 million, but only when accounting for re-releases (PS3 The Best, etc.) and digital.

 

[duckroll]

FF13 came out at the height of the Ps3 era.

Persona 5 sold 550k but a large portion were PS3 sales.

But hey, let's not let facts get in the way!

Versus XIII was originally a PS3 game. S-E could have gotten those sales too! They threw it away! Why defend bad decisions? #GiveUsStellaBack

 

[lonerism]

Yes, it is in a different place. The place where Persona 5 can double what Persona 4 sold, while FFXV halves what FFXIII sold. A place called... justice.

A place where Persona 4 debuts with 100k and FF Xlll with 1.5M

Stop trolling

 

[Nirolak]

Can we compare it with Mobius or Brave Exvius for comparison's sake? Say, vs revenue or userbase?

Given Square Enix's annual mobile revenue of $530,000 million and how Exvius charts, you could probably approximate it into the $100 million a year range.

This game cost 8800 yen, and it's 114 yen to the dollar right now.

This is napkin math, to be clear, but yes, it's certainly possible Exvius makes more in Japan annually.

Exvius has been downloaded 7 million times in Japan, but it's an f2p game, so that's not an especially fair comparison.

 

[Interfectum]

I think Square still sees Final Fantasy as an important brand to cultivate internationally, so I think it's more likely that they'll double down on that and try to go really hard after what they think Western audiences want with FF 16.

I dunno... I could see them trying to get in an open world arms race with western devs for FF16 but they could very well experiment with a mainline on mobile as well. I mean, considering how they tossed FF11 and 14 as MMOs I don't think it's a crazy thought they'd at least try to put a new entry on mobile for debut just to see what happens.

 

[Kanann]

Yes, it is in a different place. The place where Persona 5 can double what Persona 4 sold, while FFXV halves what FFXIII sold. A place called... justice.

<3

 

[Blobbers]

Yikes with a capital Why

It's kinda poetic. Sells half of what a game that's half as good sold. All the proof you needed that the universe is chaotic and cares little for the concept of justice.

 

[KillerMan91]

People will ignore for doomsday posting, but the console market is in a different place.

18% of japanese PS4 owners bought FF XV this week.

35% of japanese PS3 owners bought FF XIII during its first week.

It's more about the brand than about PS4.

 

[Mihael Mello Keehl]

Is it Japan or the game? This like chicken or the egg

Hopefully switch help japan but who knows. I need my Japanese games &#128553;&#128553;&#128553;

 

[HotHamBoy]

FF13 came out at the height of the Ps3 era.

Persona 5 sold 550k but a large portion were PS3 sales.

But hey, let's not let facts get in the way!

We'll see if Square Enix views things as rationally as you do.

Let's not forget that Tomb Raider 2013 was a "failure."

FFXV was pretty much doomed to be a sunk cost, but how much so remains to be seen.

 

[marrec]

Man, FF 13 really did damage to the franchise bankability in Japan huh?

Spoiler

lol

 

[Chindogg]

Versus XIII was originally a PS3 game. S-E could have gotten those sales too! They threw it away! Why defend bad decisions? #GiveUsStellaBack

Just concede that everyone hated 13 and Lightning is worst FF protag.

 

[sublimit]

IMO this is not only because Japan favors mobiles over consoles but i think it's also because FFXV aesthetically looks like something that targets Western gamers more than Japanese.KingsGlaive is also proof of that and the fact that they split the story between the game and the (very Western looking) movie might have rubbed a lot of Japanese fans the wrong way.

 

[JayWood2010]

Yes, it is in a different place. The place where Persona 5 can double what Persona 4 sold, while FFXV halves what FFXIII sold. A place called... justice.

Doubling a much smaller number. It sold 264k on PS4 first week. I like Persona more, but lets be honest about things. FFXV will sell a ton more than Persona 5, especially world wide.

 

[Yu Narukami]

Maybe I'm naive or nostalgic but I really wish the franchise doesn't die.

 

[MechaX]

FFXIV helped

Possibly, but given that ARR has been going pretty steady for 3 years now, I'm not sure how much 1.0 helped at this point.

But yeah... a combination of Japan's console market state and now that the Lightning Trilogy probably did some damage is not good.

 

[Toth]

Versus XIII was originally a PS3 game. S-E could have gotten those sales too! They threw it away! Why defend bad decisions? #GiveUsStellaBack

Haha good point. However when Ps3's user base was at like 7 or 8 million in 2009 and PS4 is at I think 1.1 million in Japan, there is a big difference that has to be addresse. it looks like that almost half the people who had the Ps4 bought the game.

 

[orioto]

That makes me kinda happy to be honest. But with everyone blaming console decline and the game rocking in the west..

I doubt SE learns the lesson here -__-

 

[Vincent Grayson]

Seems to me it'd be far more apt to compare XV's sales to its contemporaries, given how different the console market is (especially in Japan) from when XIII launched.

Like, how does XV's launch compare to other JRPGs or big budget Japanese titles today?

 

[HotHamBoy]

IMO this is not only because Japan favors mobiles over consoles but i think it's also because FFXV aesthetically looks like something that targets Western gamers more than Japanese.KingsGlaive is also proof of that and the fact that they split the story between the game and the (very Western looking) movie might have rubbed a lot of Japanese fans the wrong way.

The main party could not be more pandering to its native market.

 

[Baleoce]

Give it up with the spinoffs. Just get back to releasing the mainline titles in one coherent story (well, as coherent as FF gets). You've weakened your own brand by diluting it.

 

[bigol]

FF13 came out at the height of the Ps3 era.

Persona 5 sold 550k but a large portion were PS3 sales.

But hey, let's not let facts get in the way!

Persona 5 sold 265.000 copies in its first week on Ps4 and the rest (about 70.000) were Ps3 copies. FF XV first week is about 700.000.

 

[hosannainexcelsis]

So they're finally going to make the real sequel to FFXII?

Maybe if Square can get Matsuno off his couch.