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[Aquamarine]

Tell us if you know anything or don't tease at all.

On topic: I will again go with 720 late 2013 and PS4 Q1 2014.

Pretty much all sources, leaked documents, rumors and trends are pointing to a Holiday 2013 release. Outside of Gears and a couple of XBL games, Microsoft really has nothing planned for 2013.

Some form of new Xbox is practically guaranteed next year.


Q1 2014 for PS4 on the other hand...that's definitely more suspect.

 

[sphinx]

Not hyped for either system until I see software.

and we have yet to see if their controllers will be standard only.

if MS makes kinect built-in and mandatory in all games, there will be blood in the internet and copious amounts of bans in this forum.

 

[cyberheater]

If rumoured specs are true. Good luck trying to port those games to WiiU.

 

[snoopeasystreet]

This is the part more sad. I prefer ps3 hardware to 360 because it's really particular, I don't like the idea to have a next playstation without an innovative cpu. I suspect this time microsoft will have the lead of the 'exotic' cpu.

That makes no sense to me. Surely you'd want a piece of technology that's easy to develop for rather than something that's complex for sake of it, no?

 

[DevilWillcry]

Call me crazy, but despite the continues rumours, I suspect more the next ps4 will coming out early to the next xbox.

Your assumptions are probably as solid as any of the "rumors" we've gotten so far lol.

 

[Ghost23]

As long as my computer is as powerful as the 720/ps4, I should be good for awhile.

 

[Beerman462]

Well the 670 GPU would not be $400 for Sony/MS, remember they would buy the GPU directly from Nvidia for much less (about a third of that cost). The SSD, well you can get a 64GB one for £34 retail right now. Since Sony and MS seem to be set on AMD they could probably get a very good deal on the CPU/APU/GPU given AMD's current woes.

It's also not like they will be buying a MSI card for $300 all they need are the chips to solder to their boards and some memory. Any attempt to guess what the GPU will cost MS/Sony by looking at full manufactured cards on Newegg is fail. Now what do manufactures of boards like MSI pay NVidia to make a GTX670 .

 

[scitek]

So what would 2nd most powerful mean in PC terms. Something like a gtx 680 as the gpu since 690 is the top?

I'd guess a 670, unless they're talking SLI setups.

 

[mrklaw]

Let's just hope they don't do something astronomically stupid like preventing you from playing used games on the system...

Someone always does something astronomically stupid, that's the fun of launches.

I'm looking forward to the PS4 more (don't like paying for live but also don't like losing access to services by not paying). But I am somewhat nervous that it'll come out soon enough and with enough grunt to have a straight fight.

Plus if MS comes out next autumn, and Sony isn't due until spring 2014, I' m not sure my tech lust will be containable.

 

[i-Lo]

The confidence remark is not, Kotaku points out, necessarily related to hardware at all.

If Kotaku is talking mostly to US or western pubs, it is not difficult to imagine a scenario where Microsoft's plans have been firm while Sony's have been more in the air - even up to today. Microsoft's first market is the US, Sony's is Japan. Sony's plans for US/Euro releases may seem vague while Microsoft's US plans are probably quite solid at this point. I would guess that this is the case, and it would fit in with aegis's comment elsewhere about some devs not being fully clued in about what's going on with PS4 vs 720.

Here are the things we can guess that should inspire confidence amongst devs:

• Lack of exotic hardware means easy porting and overall ease of development being greater.
• Free PSN should be considered a gigantic benefit in the long run because of all rumours about how F2P are going to proliferate the console market. Free PSN = Lack of the biggest barrier to entry
• Similar hardware capability as XB3

On the flip side there are only two reasons why I can think of the third parties may be worried:

• Launch schedule. An uber delayed PS4 may add to the development woes for the first next gen multiplat titles.
• Price. This is important if the third parties expect that all else being equal MS will subsidise the console with a larger margin than Sony. If the base prices are similar for both then Sony stands to lose. Also, MS may be planning subscription models to make a big initial hardware push and Sony may still mulling over any such payment options. It shows a lack of readiness on Sony's part compared to MS.

 

[Barack Lesnar]

Nothing new, mostly vague stuff not specific. I still love reading these types of articles, thanks for posting.

 

[omonimo]

Nothing new, mostly vague stuff not specific. I still love reading these types of articles, thanks for posting.

Gaming journalism.

 

[Dynamite Ringo Matsuri]

Eh, I'll believe it when I see it. Bring on E3 I say

 

[mrklaw]

The confidence remark is not, Kotaku points out, necessarily related to hardware at all.

If Kotaku is talking mostly to US or western pubs, it is not difficult to imagine a scenario where Microsoft's plans have been firm while Sony's have been more in the air - even up to today. Microsoft's first market is the US, Sony's is Japan. Sony's plans for US/Euro releases may seem vague while Microsoft's US plans are probably quite solid at this point. I would guess that this is the case, and it would fit in with aegis's comment elsewhere about some devs not being fully clued in about what's going on with PS4 vs 720.

If this is the case (and it sounds feasible) then this is potentially damaging for Sony as the rumour mills ramp up, as most tech sites are US based. Sony need to make sure they at least engage early with those guys to keep the coverage levels high

 

[schwabdizzle]

I will wait til the PS4 personally.

Actually I should say I will wait til the PS4 before I make my decision what to buy.

 

[Radec]

i can only do PS4.

cant wait for next gen to arrive.

 

[cyberheater]

i can only do PS4.

Why is that?

 

[omonimo]

If this is the case (and it sounds feasible) then this is potentially damaging for Sony as the rumour mills ramp up, as most tech sites are US based. Sony need to make sure they at least engage early with those guys to keep the coverage levels high

Nah, at the end will talk the customer. & EU will save sony again.

 

[DragonSworne]

I have always felt that Sony would have trouble gaining support for PS4. I personally believe third parties western developers would rather just support Microsoft.

Japan is having a hard time to dedicate resources to console gaming as handhelds are so big there and Wii U will have a whole year head start.

Sony is in a really though spot, especially considering they do not have a Trojan horse like DVDs and blurays for PS4

 

[snoopeasystreet]

Why is that?

Cause Radec is a kill zone character.

 

[i-Lo]

2nd most powerful PC at least sounds like comfortably at gtx 670 and above right.

I really don't know why the kotaku article mentioned something so arbitrary unless the sole reason was to stir up crap.

Also, technically the most powerful PC should contain the GTX690, making 680 the second most powerful. In reality, I'd assume the person who gave the info may have had a capabilities in mind that were somewhere between the 660 and 670.

 

[THE:MILKMAN]

There are these graphs from Mercury Research for GPU bill of material's

I assume the interesting figure is under GPU price.


Source: http://www.investorvillage.com/mbth...mValue=216617&dValue=1&tid=10777550&showall=1

 

[Elginer]

Durango...

 

[KageMaru]

Good or bad meltdown?

Either way, GAF will meltdown for anything. No surprises there.

Yup, I can't wait for the reveals next year so I can grab the pop corn and watch the bitter tears.

In all seriousness though, the frustrating part as a person who expects PS4 to be "good" is how they allegedly still can't inspire confidence amongst third parties when the next gen developments are already under way and the launch schedule for next gen console is perhaps just over a year. Sony aren't Nintendo. They aren't competing with Nintendo and definitely can't tell the third parties to effectively piss off and still WiiU in large numbers and make profits because nintendo makes consoles for their own games.

I think Nirolak hit the nail on the head when he pointed out that companies may have more confidence in MS because of the way they communicate with the development community.

How is it that Sony, a hardware company is getting beat to the punch by Microsoft a software company getting hardware to market. I guess it is all money but this shows you how incompetent Sony is.

100-1 that MS's system is straightforward and Sony's has some over-engineered technological brainchild of Kutaragi and Jeff Rigby that is holding this up. This over-engineered component will end up providing no benefit vs what they lose by delaying launch.

lol nice.

However I don't think the Ps4 will be over-engineered at all. If anything, it sounds like 720 will be more customized than what's found in the PS4.

 

[gofreak]

If this is the case (and it sounds feasible) then this is potentially damaging for Sony as the rumour mills ramp up, as most tech sites are US based. Sony need to make sure they at least engage early with those guys to keep the coverage levels high

I'd be less worried about tech sites - afterall, a single conference can overnight turn what was vague into something solid on that end. I think more important for Sony is that they solidify their plans behind the scenes, to publishers, soon enough that they can commit to a schedule for PS4 launch skus, if a release is going to happen next year.

If Sony is telling pubs they 'want to' launch next year (per Kotaku), but Sony's plans are still in flux or their preparedness in terms of tools and all that lags Microsoft (and by all accounts that end of things is lagging by a few months), it's easy to imagine pubs being skeptical while considering MS on track, particularly from a resource allocation point of view. If Microsoft is being very clear, and is very obviously ready, pubs will be assigning resources to make sure their games are ready for that launch. If Sony is still hammering certain things out and/or dithering on commitment to a launch in certain territories in a certain timeframe, it becomes difficult to treat it with the same priority. Particularly with Sony's track record for delays in western territories. If Sony leaves it late to convey a confident release timeframe, they'll will be depending on their hardware affording fast turnaround time for launch SKUs once pubs get a very clear greenlight.

The comments about hardware in the article don't jive with a suggestion that there's a lack of confidence on that side of things, nor do I think it's likely pubs have a general longer term lack of confidence given the kind of business Playstation home systems bring... but with the specific note about confidence in a 720 2013 launch vs a PS4 2013 launch, I think it is maybe about relative preparedness to meet a goal both companies are claiming.

 

[clutch.as.it.gets.]

Always-online is a deal breaker for me. I won`t support a console that requires an always-online connection.

 

[SolidSnakex]

I have always felt that Sony would have trouble gaining support for PS4. I personally believe third parties western developers would rather just support Microsoft.

I don't think they'll have any problems with support as long as the console is powerful enough. Publishers want their games on as many platforms as possible due to how high dev costs are. There's a reason why exclusives have become rare this generation compared to previous generations. Developers really can't afford to just bank on one platform anymore.

 

[i-Lo]

There are these graphs from Mercury Research for GPU bill of material's

I assume the interesting figure is under GPU price.


Source: http://www.investorvillage.com/mbth...mValue=216617&dValue=1&tid=10777550&showall=1

Isn't this outdated? Also, as a chip, the prices classified under GPU and Thermal should be considered (if GDDR5 isn't being used) to calculate the sum total.

 

[-Pyromaniac-]

I'd be less worried about tech sites - afterall, a single conference can overnight turn what was vague into something solid on that end. I think more important for Sony is that they solidify their plans behind the scenes, to publishers, soon enough that they can commit to a schedule for PS4 launch skus, if a release is going to happen next year.

If Sony is telling pubs they 'want to' launch next year (per Kotaku), but Sony's plans are still in flux or their preparedness in terms of tools and all that lags Microsoft, it's easy to imagine pubs being skeptical while considering MS on track, particularly from a resource allocation point of view. If Microsoft is being very clear, and is very obviously ready, pubs will be assigning resources to make sure their games are ready for that launch. If Sony is still hammering certain things out and/or dithering on commitment to a launch in certain territories in a certain timeframe, it becomes difficult to treat it with the same priority. If Sony leaves it late, they'll will be depending on their hardware affording fast turnaround time for launch SKUs once pubs get a very clear greenlight.

how do publishers know if Sony is in flux or not. If Sony tells them they're aiming for Holiday 2013, isn't that all they know?

 

[MakeMeFeelAlive]

I'm just stoked for the new consoles, not any one rumor. I'm especially stoked for the new ps4. Santa Monica and guerilla games are working on a new ip, naughty dogs other studio is working on an unannounced project. You have to figure that if these games haven't been announced this late in the game, they will be launch titles. I'm assuming gt6 will be a launch title (with a gt6 prelude probably for the ps3). Also, gaikai. If they can give me a subscription service (similar to ps plus, except streak ng games) for psone, ps2, and ps3 titles then I don't know if I ever come out of my house again.

There's no way third parties will skip them over. They've made too much money with Sony, even after all the "struggles" people on the interwebs like to mention. Whereas MS, idk. What do they have to offer me? Paid live. New kinect and kinect games? More halo? I know that may be someone's cup of tea, but I personally have lost interest in ms consoles every year.

That being said, screw the rumors. I won't believe anything till they both launch.

 

[Gordon0Freeman]

If I have a Durango exactly one year from now with Destiny, Battlefield 4 and perhaps a couple of exclusives, I will be one happy fucker.

 

[tinfoilhatman]

If Sony isn't backward compatible(Microsoft is almost 100% will be especially for arcade) I won't be buying and if they come in later than MS or with less power their screwed here in the states.

IF MS is really smart they'll make the first gen of 720 games playable on 360(@480p native) should be a way to do this with Directx11 feature\texture scaling.

 

[i-Lo]

I think Nirolak hit the nail on the head when he pointed out that companies may have more confidence in MS because of the way they communicate with the development community.

Whatever happened to SCEA taking the lead on hardware development? I thought these people would be better at communicating than SCEJ. Should it even be an issue after what Sony went through during PS3's early years of game development for third parties? Also should the difference be big enough to generate statements like "loss of confidence" as opposed to "good" for Sony vs "better" for MS?

 

[TheChewyWaffles]

Which is the second most powerful PC on the market today?

Mine.

 

[Barack Lesnar]

i can only do PS4.

cant wait for next gen to arrive.

I'm worried about the PS4. Where there's smoke there is fire so all these rumors we've heard of it missing 2013 are troubling. I wonder what's causing this. Sony is a hardware company so the hardware should be up to snuff, yet Microsoft is the one that seems to have the most optimism heading into next-gen. It's disappointing, I want both to sell gangbusters.

 

[pestul]

Hmm, I'm starting to wonder if 2nd fastest might actually refer to an entire 'tier' downward from the best. Say.. AMDs fastest cpu (2nd to Intel), coupled with a 7850/7870 class GPU or 660TI. At least that would be more reasonable for TDP.

 

[Lunchbox]

8 times powerful
2nd most powerful computer



......nice details there kotoko

 

[Beerman462]

There are these graphs from Mercury Research for GPU bill of material's

I assume the interesting figure is under GPU price.


Source: http://www.investorvillage.com/mbth...mValue=216617&dValue=1&tid=10777550&showall=1

$120 for the 580 gpu, then it drops to $85 and $65 not to bad.

 

[gofreak]

how do publishers know if Sony is in flux or not. If Sony tells them they're aiming for Holiday 2013, isn't that all they know?

Nope. They know about the maturity, or lack thereof, of the dev environment. They know about clarity and concreteness of release plans, or lack thereof. They know how much each has their ducks in a row. They know if one is giving them pricing and marketing plans and one is not. If one system's plans and design seems stable while another is chopping and changing certain things more often, it's a sign of where they are relative to one another on the launch curve.

There's plenty of such things pubs can use to get a feel for the 'real' schedule behind a platform - or that may more or less inspire faith in the intended schedule.

 

[Snowden's Secret]

Super boxes like hinted at here would die on the market as they'd have to be $400-$500. This just confirms the suspicion that next gen will see subscription fees/subsidized boxes.

 

[gofreak]

Whatever happened to SCEA taking the lead on hardware development?

Lead on hardware development != lead on release planning and marketing.

 

[XenodudeX]

Super boxes like hinted at here would die on the market as they'd have to be $400-$500. This just confirms the suspicion that next gen will see subscription fees/subsidized boxes.

I hope this isn't true. That would be awful.

 

[MakeMeFeelAlive]

Also, there may be people who hold off on launch dates. Launch consoles this gen proved to be disastrous. I'm looking at you Microsoft. I'll probably wait almost a year. Fool me once...

 

[iceatcs]

2nd best?

Sound like compare to core i5 with geforce 670-80. Make sense, quite similar to first dev kit and ready for fall 2013.

 

[pestul]

Actually, if we want to go back to the pure (but terrible) teraflop to teraflop comparison.. a 7850-7870 would be more in line with a 8x increase over 360. 7970 would be >10x.

 

[-Pyromaniac-]

Nope. They know about the maturity, or lack thereof, of the dev environment. They know about clarity and concreteness of release plans, or lack thereof. They know how much each has their ducks in a row. They know if one is giving them pricing and marketing plans and one is not. If one system's plans and design seems stable while another is chopping and changing certain things more often, it's a sign of where they are relative to one another on the launch curve.

There's plenty of such things pubs can use to get a feel for the 'real' schedule behind a platform - or that may more or less inspire faith in the intended schedule.

I just assume it's a lot harder for western publishers to know what's going on with a japanese company because of the bubble japanese companies work in. But didn't we have rumours of a dev kit schedule for the PS4. If those were accurate it would seem like everything seems to be on track for the most part. I think this is less about Sony being unprepared/wavering/changing and more about MS being more transparent, which is easier on them (pubs).

 

[systemfehler]

What I wonder is why the guys from Kotaku can't explain this "lack in confidence". Obviously they talked to someone who knows more than them. Why there is mention of inferior hardware, slipped schedules, late devkits, no clear goals, etc.

Sounds really fishy - either you talked to someone that knows what is going on or their leak wasn't as good as they thought and they just heard more about MS because that person only knows about MS.

 

[MakeMeFeelAlive]

What I wonder is why the guys from Kotaku can't explain this "lack in confidence". Obviously they talked to someone who knows more than them. Why there is mention of inferior hardware, slipped schedules, late devkits, no clear goals, etc.

Sounds really fishy - either you talked to someone that knows what is going on or their leak wasn't as good as they thought and they just heard more about MS because that person only knows about MS.

I also would like to know where the sources came from. If it's not from EA, ubi, or activation, then it really doesn't matter..... Imo

 

[airmangataosenai]

Well there you go. Crysis 3 max settings is what I'm asking for for both next gen consoles.

These things don't move in a direct line with the next game necessarily being more advanced than the previous. Crysis 1 had better graphics than 2 after all.

 

[KageMaru]

The confidence remark is not, Kotaku points out, necessarily related to hardware at all.

If Kotaku is talking mostly to US or western pubs, it is not difficult to imagine a scenario where Microsoft's plans have been firm while Sony's have been more in the air - even up to today. Microsoft's first market is the US, Sony's is Japan. Sony's plans for US/Euro releases may seem vague while Microsoft's US plans are probably quite solid at this point. I would guess that this is the case, and it would fit in with aegis's comment elsewhere about some devs not being fully clued in about what's going on with PS4 vs 720.

I don't think that's exactly the case. Both companies should have their designs finalized by now with maybe some wiggle room for change. They have to start sending chips in for testing if they have any hopes to launch in the next year or even early 2014. Any major changes now could delay the whole project for months.

I wonder if the recent rumors about Sony upping the amount of memory is the cause for any delay concerns.

This is the part more sad. I prefer ps3 hardware to 360 because it's really particular, I don't like the idea to have a next playstation without an innovative cpu. I suspect this time microsoft will have the lead of the 'exotic' cpu.

"Exotic" is not always a good thing and more often than not, it produces hurdles on top of the mountain of problems that already exists with game development. It's not like there is some hidden well of power that is inherited from an exotic design.

Honestly, with us not knowing anything about either console, it's pointless to be sad about anything at this point. For all you know, you could prefer the 720 over the PS4. Either way, even if you insist on sticking with the PS4, there's no reason to believe it won't be a great system as well.