I just recently got this and a roku ultra for streaming (I prefer dedicated boxes to the built in apps). I also have a Xbox One S. When I play a UHD Blu-Ray, I get the "hdr video" popup, but I don't get that popup on hdr videos from either the roku or the built in apps. Is that normal?
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KS8000 settings for gaming at 4k/HDR
- Thread starter Haines
- Start date
infinityBCRT
Member
Dynamic contrast has been debated to death already but just look at any hdr video with sunlight or bright clouds and you'll see that detail is removed.I experiment a lot with settings and to my eyes Dynamic Contrast for PS4 games on high looks better than low and medium and is very close to "off". I tested it with the Game mode and it doesn´t seem that I lose detail but with DC set to medium or low the picture gets a bit washed out and colours/brightness are way too "altered".
Yes, I am sharpness weirdo too, I have it at 30 now, 31 introduces visible artificial artifacts, so there is no reason to turn it down right?
On my "returned" KS9000 the sharpness limit was 20.
Also on firmware 1154 and Ratchet HDR in Game mode changes to full brightness now, didn´t do it before on 1142.
I also often test and compare my picture settings in the PS4 XMB with the trophy icon and the game pictures there, so far the one from Alien Isolation is really good at comparing different settings.
I started doing this when I had my first 1080p set and the PS3 about 10 years ago.
Ultimately, if you don't know what to look for you'll think crushed blacks and oversharpness looks better. If you're switching between settings on a non test pattern screen you're doing it wrong and falling into the trap that has resulted into tv's defaulting in torch mode.
Oh yeah, make sure your eco sensor is off guys.
WonkyPanda
Member
What do you guys use to calibrate the white point? I don't recall the WOW disc having much for that. Seems like a tough thing to calibrate properly via eyeball
Should have mentioned that I only find those settings to be good for PS4 games.
For movies, HDR content and HDTV I mostly use the OP settings and I also "calibrated" with test patterns.
But you´re right, I have just watched the HDR channel and switched between the contrast settings and it´s pretty obvious with clouds, but to be honest the rest seems to "pop" more, I guess my eyes are already torched.
For movies, HDR content and HDTV I mostly use the OP settings and I also "calibrated" with test patterns.
But you´re right, I have just watched the HDR channel and switched between the contrast settings and it´s pretty obvious with clouds, but to be honest the rest seems to "pop" more, I guess my eyes are already torched.
Dr. Zoidberg
Member
You are correct, you really need special calibrator tools and software to do it properly. That being said, someone earlier in the thread said you could try to do the the 2-point white balance by eye and explained how. I just used the 2 and 10 point settings from RTINGS along with their custom colorspace settings and it made a huge improvement to my set, though of course there is some variation with every panel so it's likely not perfect but it's a lot better.
Lakerchick4life
Member
I have the 49 inch KS8000 TV..the TV is great but the only issue I have is at night in the dark when I change the channel I guess you can call it clouding but I see some clouding when the channel changes..so I went ahead and adjusted the brightness to 45 and it takes care of it for the most part maybe thats why it would show up to begin with but for my eyes which are VERY sensitive it bothers me Im constantly getting headaches so any advice as to good settings for the TV I would really appreciate
Wait a minute, what am I missing here? I'm on 1155 firmware and my tv is in game mode it does NOT auto change the brightness.
Now we have two posters saying it is doing that on 1154 when it wasn't doing that before?
De Marco, are you sure you are in game mode? I just tested this with FF15 and my backlights did not change automatically on 1155
Now we have two posters saying it is doing that on 1154 when it wasn't doing that before?
De Marco, are you sure you are in game mode? I just tested this with FF15 and my backlights did not change automatically on 1155
As we discussed earlier in the thread, what you seem to be showing here is aliasing, not ringing. Aliasing will look more pronounced at neutral sharpness, because reducing aliasing is one of the reasons people prefer to soften their picture - it's the reason some sharpness scales go below neutral.
For what it's worth, your post made me go back and check again using the PS4 UI. I see ringing disappear at 22; and visible softening below 20. I don't understand why our results differ, and I'm not trying to say I'm right (or that you're wrong) when it comes to finding this TV's objectively correct setting for neutral sharpness. As you pointed out, it could be my eyes versus yours. But there are a good number of people who felt their KS8000 looked oddly soft with sharpness at zero; and that's why I think it's valuable to suggest that people test their picture's sharpness for themselves.
I used the 4K calibration images on the Sbone, the 1080p images from the Apple TV, and the 4K Pro UI. See the video below for clarification on ringing. Skip ahead to 2:30.
https://youtube.com/watch?v=rnAaqy7mRLQ
Best place to see it distinctly is on a simple image with white and black lines (or clearly defined shapes and letters) on a grey background. Crank your sharpness to full, and you'll see it clear as day: white halos around bits of geometry in the picture. Reduce sharpness until there's no sign of these halos, but don't go so low that you notice lines distorting and bleeding into one another.
infinityBCRT
Member
Nope. It's ringing. At under 20. I'm only constricted to a phone for the next week while on vacay so I can't easily show you the post where I pointed it out but it's in my post history. And if you can't see it in that post then you don't know what ringing looks like. There was a halo. That makes the following bit moot but I'll say it too-- introducing sharpening also destroys anti-aliasing too. It's not inherently true that because the image looks more aliased that it's at neutral sharpness.
Edit: you know what. I'm being unfair. Obviously you think you only see sharpness kicking in at 20 but sharpness is more nuanced than "i see obvious ringing at 20 therefore sharpness kicks in at 20". It's kicking in before then, but on the test pattern you are really only seeing the obvious effects at 20.
Yes, it really works with Ratchet in game mode and didn´t before. I will try Deus Ex later today.
The firmware also changed the name of my inputs one day after the update and it was a hassle to get ARC to work with cable TV and without changing anything it suddenly started working. The software really seems to have some quirks.
No worries - I found your image:
infinityBCRT said:
From this post on page 70 of the thread, for anyone who wants to see it in context.
I see what you're talking about, but I'm not convinced that's ringing - I'd rather see a test image on which there's a clear and specific presence or absence of superfluous colour on a neutral background, because that's what I've been using as my guide.
Perhaps it's a philosophical issue. I'm going by the metric described in the sharpening test video I linked above: reduce sharpness until what I perceive as ringing disappears. It seems like you're coming at the issue from the opposite side: increasing sharpness until what you perceive as ringing appears. To me, using test patterns, ringing isn't remotely subtle. It's there, or it isn't. And if I keep going lower after what I perceive as ringing is gone, I watch my image blur.
Assuming there's nothing strange going on with our TVs (and I think that's a safe assumption), it seems to boil down to using different methodology to test sharpness, and possibly different perceptions for what constitutes ringing. Perhaps I don't know what ringing looks like, or that sharpness is more subtle than the artifacts I can see. As I said, I'm just going by the test outlined in the calibration video: the white ringing I can see disrupting the uniformity of the grey background of my test images, and the softening of the lines I see below 20. I'm not advocating everyone set their sharpness to 20. I'm suggesting everyone test it for themselves and come to their own conclusions; especially since people have complained that using the Rtings settings gives them a soft image.
Shai-Tan
Banned
It will pop up saying HDR as well. You've got to ensure UHD color for the HDMI input are correct (and all the other HDR related settings in the OP). To check you can also press the PS button and go check display info while it's running an HDR game and see it's YUV422 (some also said theirs is running YUV420). I don't have FF XV so there might also be an option there that I'm missing.
Ivory Samoan
Gold Member
I've only been testing it on FFXV on 1154 on my KS8000 and it does the "An HDR Video is Playing" popup, I check the backlight and it's on 20, switch HDR off and it reverts back to normal (I normally have mine around 8 for SDR). Switch it back to HDR in FFXV settings, and boom, it's back up to 20 backlight: this is what you're referring to eh? I'm 100% definitely in game mode too, it switches to that automatically for my Pro which I like also.
I'm definitely on 1154 too, just checked my firmware in the settings tab.
Well I'm utterly confused guys.
I have UHD color on and all that. I'm on firmware 1155. I didn't manually update to 1154, 1155 is the OTA I recieved.
Playing FF 15, I get the HDR pop up banner. Backlight does not automatically adjust to 20. I have to manually put it there. When I quit FF and go back to PS4 main menu, the backlight stays at 20 and doesn't go back down to 7. It does this normally when game mode is turned off, but when game mode is turned on, I have to manually adjust the backlight.
I know when 1154 initially came out and people were installing it, everyone in this thread saying it did NOT fix the issue of the backlight auto adjusting in game mode. Did you guys manually update the firmware?
I have UHD color on and all that. I'm on firmware 1155. I didn't manually update to 1154, 1155 is the OTA I recieved.
Playing FF 15, I get the HDR pop up banner. Backlight does not automatically adjust to 20. I have to manually put it there. When I quit FF and go back to PS4 main menu, the backlight stays at 20 and doesn't go back down to 7. It does this normally when game mode is turned off, but when game mode is turned on, I have to manually adjust the backlight.
I know when 1154 initially came out and people were installing it, everyone in this thread saying it did NOT fix the issue of the backlight auto adjusting in game mode. Did you guys manually update the firmware?
Clockwork
Member
Don't be confused. It doesn't automatically switch the backlight in game mode even though you get the banner.
I don't know why people are saying that it does. I have used both 1154 and 1155 on my Xbox One S and PS4 Pro.
Sleeping Lesson
Member
These two statements are completely contradictory. What's the difference, I wonder?
I'd be interested in this, as I'll be doing it this weekend.
Clockwork
Member
Sleeping Lesson
Member
Er, yeah. That's why I'm saying they're contradictory.
Yeah that's what I thought. I was confused by multiple posters saying it's working now.
I mounted mine 2 weeks ago.. you're gonna need:
4 M8 45-50mm screws depending on your wall mount. You may need a few washers if you go the 50mm route.
Ivory Samoan
Gold Member
edit: Found out the backlight stays at 20, but it definitely goes onto game mode 100% on the new input: but that's what it was set to previously so I guess it's just remembering that?
Any chance the Asia-Pacific update is somehow different to other territories? That's about all I can think of: and just to clarify, the brightness does not get adjusted as some stated, but my backlight most certainly goes to 20.
meltingparappa
Member
But when you switch to non-HDR content on your PS4 (like say, a different non-AAA game), does the backlight stay at 20?
That's the bug everyone is dealing with.
You can actually test this out in FFXV by turning HDR on and off in the menu, and seeing if it changes the backlight settings on your tv.
Ivory Samoan
Gold Member
Ahhhh, you're right: it stays on 20 - my bad.
I didn't notice it staying on 20, so that's my fault there: but it 100% changes to game mode when the PS4 starts, that's undeniable (just tested that twice, it's gone from movie mode on my PC HDMI input to Game Mode on the PS4 Pro input).
It just retained the 20 backlight from the previous session, so I thought it had changed up to 20 by itself again, but in actuality, it just never came down.
Does your guys input change automatically to the PS4 input when you turn you console on?
Clockwork
Member
Umm...
Yeah it will change inputs due to HDMI sensing via Anynet.
BUT
It is set to game mode because at some point you configured that input to be that way.
The tv settings can be applied globally or on a per input basis.
I think that the problem is things were getting lost it translation based on what you were saying.
meltingparappa
Member
That's good! That means the firmware is the same for all of us, which adds to the blind hope that they're very aware of the issue and will push out a fix in the next update.
I have a receiver putting all my sources through a single input, so it's an absolute wild west as to what settings my TV will switch to.
Still thinking of whether or not it's a good idea to connect all my inputs into the One Connect box, and sending audio back via the ARC, just to get around that.
Eighthours
Member
Any tips for preventing colour banding, guys?
Clockwork
Member
What kind of color banding?
Is it the source content (tv can't do anything about that) or is it being introduced by the display?
SlimySnake
Flashless at the Golden Globes
ok guys, after seeing the DF video about how Ratchet, FFXV and Uncharted look amazing on HDR, i think i might have some settings wrong because i can barely see the difference in most games. FFXV is brighter and more vibrant but nothing amazing.
Here are my settings:
- Backlight 20
- HDMI Color Input Definitely Enabled for PS4 HDMI (i get popup saying HDR video is playing)
- Color Space Set to Auto (rtings says change this to Native??)
- Smart LED - High
Anything else? I might have accidentally switched out the HDMI cable that came with the Pro with my X1 HDMI cable, but since i get the pop up saying a HDMI video is playing whenever i enable HDR, I figured I have the right HDMI cable hooked up. Though I can probably try the other HDMI cable just to make sure.
Those Exodus and Life of Pi demos look phenomenal. I remember seeing a Hobbit action sequence at Bestbuy on a samsung tv which looked phenomenal. But i cant rent any HDR videos anywhere. They all want me to buy them for $30. fuck that.
Here are my settings:
- Backlight 20
- HDMI Color Input Definitely Enabled for PS4 HDMI (i get popup saying HDR video is playing)
- Color Space Set to Auto (rtings says change this to Native??)
- Smart LED - High
Anything else? I might have accidentally switched out the HDMI cable that came with the Pro with my X1 HDMI cable, but since i get the pop up saying a HDMI video is playing whenever i enable HDR, I figured I have the right HDMI cable hooked up. Though I can probably try the other HDMI cable just to make sure.
Those Exodus and Life of Pi demos look phenomenal. I remember seeing a Hobbit action sequence at Bestbuy on a samsung tv which looked phenomenal. But i cant rent any HDR videos anywhere. They all want me to buy them for $30. fuck that.
Clockwork
Member
I don't think you have anything set wrong. Personally I think HDR is a bit underwhelming and is highly dependent on the content being reviewed. For me it hasn't been that impressive (most movies and games) outside of demos like LG Chess.
VincentMatts
Member
Yeah i dont find it that impressive either. I dont get all the "omg this is amazing" previews. I played forza horizon3, gears 4, uncharted4, i wasnt more wowed (with HDR) than i originally was in regular 4k.
digitalrelic
Banned
Your settings all look fine. To be honest, there's a lot of hyperbole being thrown around about HDR right now. It's a nice feature but it's not always mind blowing. It's usually pretty subtle.
With that said, open up the built-in YouTube app on your KS8000 and subscribe to The HDR Channel. That's a good way to test your HDR capabilities. A lot of the content available there is truly incredible.
Sleeping Lesson
Member
I kind of wish they would let us use auto motion plus in game mode.. Sure it would add input lag but everything outside of game mode has pretty bad input lag
Why? That's like saying you want post-processing in non-post-processing mode.
meltingparappa
Member
I wish the PS4 youtube app was 4k/hdr compatible, because if I could watch the LG Chess demo via my PS4, I could at least confirm to myself that the PS4 is inherently outputting everything correctly.
Until then it's just mindgames and headaches wondering why there isn't a single game on the market that doesn't look as vivid as Amazon's Grand Tour (the Top Gear successor).
Surely the screws that go into the TV will be included with the TV? Or are you referring to the screws for the wall?
Traxtech
Member
Its more because the input lag is terrible even if you have it on or off outside of game mode, doesn't change much.
And I am extremely susceptible to input lag aswell as jutter thanks to having used a 120hz/144hz monitor for years .. So gg to me. Its gotten to the point where I'll take the added input lag in exchange for a smoother experience.
ss_lemonade
Member
Don't you get black frame insertion with motion plus? My old sony TV let's me combine both that and game mode
infinityBCRT
Member
Here's a video I made discussing this stuff. Some of it is repetitive but towards the end I address the sharpness stuff a little. https://youtu.be/RaEUkGaNx50No worries - I found your image:
From this post on page 70 of the thread, for anyone who wants to see it in context.
I see what you're talking about, but I'm not convinced that's ringing - I'd rather see a test image on which there's a clear and specific presence or absence of superfluous colour on a neutral background, because that's what I've been using as my guide.
Perhaps it's a philosophical issue. I'm going by the metric described in the sharpening test video I linked above: reduce sharpness until what I perceive as ringing disappears. It seems like you're coming at the issue from the opposite side: increasing sharpness until what you perceive as ringing appears. To me, using test patterns, ringing isn't remotely subtle. It's there, or it isn't. And if I keep going lower after what I perceive as ringing is gone, I watch my image blur.
Assuming there's nothing strange going on with our TVs (and I think that's a safe assumption), it seems to boil down to using different methodology to test sharpness, and possibly different perceptions for what constitutes ringing. Perhaps I don't know what ringing looks like, or that sharpness is more subtle than the artifacts I can see. As I said, I'm just going by the test outlined in the calibration video: the white ringing I can see disrupting the uniformity of the grey background of my test images, and the softening of the lines I see below 20. I'm not advocating everyone set their sharpness to 20. I'm suggesting everyone test it for themselves and come to their own conclusions; especially since people have complained that using the Rtings settings gives them a soft image.
Carnby
Member
I assure you, the tv only comes with the spacers.
Edit: Googling further, someone on reddit said they used 4 "M8 1.25 50mm with washers".
Link_enfant
Member
Okay, I've just got my KS9000 (KS8000 EU) 49" set, and I've got a few settings questions:
- on my PS4 Pro, is it okay to set all video settings to Automatic? It seems to output 2160p RGB and to use Limited RGB Range (in which case the TV sets HDMI Black Level to Low when choosing Auto)
- I'm a bit confused about the Color Space setting: choosing Native really seems to be the best option, as it makes the colors way more vibrant and feel more accurate. But is it really the case? I can get used to the Auto setting, but I want to make sure that I get the most accurate picture and colors in both SDR and HDR modes.
- My current TV firmware is 1142, but it tells me there's no update available when I search for it. Is that normal? Should I get the last firmware on a flashdrive and install it?
- I can't get YouTube to display any HDR content, whether I'm using the TV app or the PS4 Pro app. How are you supposed to get that to work properly, and which YouTube app should I use?
- If it can help the debate in any way, I feel like leaving the Sharpness setting to the default value is the best choice. PS4 Pro UI and The Last Of Us Remastered just look fine with Sharpness at 50. I tried to set it to 0 but it definitely softens the picture too much and loses details.
- Audio related: I'm only using the TV sound for now, so should I let the audio ouput to PCM on both PS4 Pro and the TV? What about Wii U and PS3?
Should I change anything when using the Sony Gold headset, which I always use when watching movies?
- As I also plan to play PS3 and Wii U on this awesome TV, is there any specific video setting I should modify for those consoles to get the most accurate picture quality and colors?
I don't mind the perfect calibration for the moment since I don't have the stuff to do it, but it already looks amazing and I just need some clarification on the points above to enjoy the set completely.
- on my PS4 Pro, is it okay to set all video settings to Automatic? It seems to output 2160p RGB and to use Limited RGB Range (in which case the TV sets HDMI Black Level to Low when choosing Auto)
- I'm a bit confused about the Color Space setting: choosing Native really seems to be the best option, as it makes the colors way more vibrant and feel more accurate. But is it really the case? I can get used to the Auto setting, but I want to make sure that I get the most accurate picture and colors in both SDR and HDR modes.
- My current TV firmware is 1142, but it tells me there's no update available when I search for it. Is that normal? Should I get the last firmware on a flashdrive and install it?
- I can't get YouTube to display any HDR content, whether I'm using the TV app or the PS4 Pro app. How are you supposed to get that to work properly, and which YouTube app should I use?
- If it can help the debate in any way, I feel like leaving the Sharpness setting to the default value is the best choice. PS4 Pro UI and The Last Of Us Remastered just look fine with Sharpness at 50. I tried to set it to 0 but it definitely softens the picture too much and loses details.
- Audio related: I'm only using the TV sound for now, so should I let the audio ouput to PCM on both PS4 Pro and the TV? What about Wii U and PS3?
Should I change anything when using the Sony Gold headset, which I always use when watching movies?
- As I also plan to play PS3 and Wii U on this awesome TV, is there any specific video setting I should modify for those consoles to get the most accurate picture quality and colors?
I don't mind the perfect calibration for the moment since I don't have the stuff to do it, but it already looks amazing and I just need some clarification on the points above to enjoy the set completely.
VincentMatts
Member
- i believe i read that putting the picture at that 420 option was the best for this TV.
- i also felt like sharpness at 0 was too low. I have it at 20, seems fine.
- mine had an update via wifi to 1154, could be that your model is slightly different
- to set my picture i used my xbox ones calibration options.
the rest i dunno
SlimySnake
Flashless at the Golden Globes
Yeah, i have seen all of their videos. But thats through the TV directly, so i wasnt sure if my PS4 Pro was set up correctly. It's kinda disappointing if reassuring to know my situation isnt unique. I just dont udnerstand why DF keeps going on and on about this massive difference.
Pretty much everyone says set all PS4 settings to Auto.
rtings says Color Space should be native. Gaf and DF says it should be auto. Go with what you think looks best i guess.
Everyone recommends sharpness as low as possible. I have mine at 5 and i cant tell the difference.
Your internet isnt setup correctly. Otherwise it wouldve picked up the latest upgrade. Check it again.
Use the TV's youtube app. Check the HDR Channel channel and play the HDR videos from there. it should say 4k HDR when you are playing it under the youtube name.
I dont think any PS4 apps support 4k HDR yet. I could be wrong on this.
Okay I'm pretty upset right now after being so excited yesterday when I received the TV, I woke up not long ago and turned it on and there is a big red line running down the screen, I'm unsure what to do, I already had to travel 2 hours to get the TV because I am in a tiny remote town, it's not easy for me to take back, does anyone know how to fix it? I read this and thought maybe I could try it but not sure if it would void my warranty https://www.ifixit.com/Answers/View/324784/Thin+red+line+on+TV+screen
meltingparappa
Member
Take these answers with a grain of salt, but -
There's a RGB vs YUV420 Ps4 Pro IQ thread that'll make your head spin, with a very loose definition of consensus. I find that forcing YUV420 looks better than leaving it on automatic, but that could be total visual placebo and I'm probably missing some color depth on SDR content or something.
PS4 Pro Netflix/Youtube can't display 4K/HDR for some dumb reason. You should be able to get HDR videos via the samsung youtube app, but a lot of youtube videos are labeled 4K or HDR when they actually aren't.
The gold standard of testing is an 'LG Chess Demo' that's 60fps, 4K and HDR. It should look insane-o unreal compared to what you'd get on a "normal" tv set. To test if HDR is theoretically running, you can also press the "123" button on the remote, and select the 'i' icon and it will tell you the signal it is currently playing.