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Malaysia Airlines flight en route from Amsterdam shot down over Ukraine; no survivors

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F

Firemind

Member
Rivyn said:
That convoy going from the Airport to Hilversum over the A2 highway, with all the people standing there. Damn.

Tears GAF. Tears.
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Yeah, it's really impressive. Never seen anything like this. I think I'll go there and pay my respects tomorrow or the day after tomorrow.
 
O

Osiris

I permanently banned my 6 year old daughter from using the PS4 for mistakenly sending grief reports as it's too hard to watch or talk to her
sangreal said:
Sounds like the charade is over

http://www.reuters.com/article/2014...nder-exclusive-idUSKBN0FS1V920140723?irpc=932
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I just read that, talk about going "off message", damned interesting piece!

It was always likely to happen, Khodakovsky is no friend of Strelkov, he was going to throw him under the bus sooner or later.

Khodakovsky blamed the Kiev authorities for provoking what may have been the missile strike that destroyed the doomed airliner, saying Kiev had deliberately launched air strikes in the area, knowing the missiles were in place.

"I knew that a BUK came from Luhansk. At the time I was told that a BUK from Luhansk was coming under the flag of the LNR," he said, referring to the Luhansk People’s Republic, the main rebel group operating in Luhansk, one of two rebel provinces along with Donetsk, the province where the crash took place.

"That BUK I know about. I heard about it. I think they sent it back. Because I found out about it at exactly the moment that I found out that this tragedy had taken place. They probably sent it back in order to remove proof of its presence," Khodakovsky told Reuters on Tuesday.

"The question is this: Ukraine received timely evidence that the volunteers have this technology, through the fault of Russia. It not only did nothing to protect security, but provoked the use of this type of weapon against a plane that was flying with peaceful civilians," he said.

"They knew that this BUK existed; that the BUK was heading for Snezhnoye," he said, referring to a village 10 km (six miles) west of the crash site. "They knew that it would be deployed there, and provoked the use of this BUK by starting an air strike on a target they didn’t need, that their planes hadn’t touched for a week."

"And that day, they were intensively flying, and exactly at the moment of the shooting, at the moment the civilian plane flew overhead, they launched air strikes. Even if there was a BUK, and even if the BUK was used, Ukraine did everything to ensure that a civilian aircraft was shot down."
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T

The Dutch Slayer

Member
BtPVO31IUAAIREB.jpg

BtPZVZ6CMAA-PBW.jpg

678497.jpg

678495.jpg


so so so sad right now :(
 
C

CTLance

Member
Sniffle.

Still, in a way it's a good day. No longer are they left on some field or in a stuffy train, being pilfered, rotting away. They are coming home. Now they can be laid to rest with their loved ones. They're still dead and nothing we can do will change that, but at least now people can have closure.

Stay strong, DutchGAF.
 
T

The Dutch Slayer

Member
CTLance said:
Sniffle.

Still, in a way it's a good day. No longer are they left on some field or in a stuffy train, being pilfered, rotting away. They are coming home. Now they can be laid to rest with their loved ones. They're still dead and nothing we can do will change that, but at least now people can have closure.

Stay strong, DutchGAF.
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Thanks 100% agree, stay strong DutchGAF!
 
S

Sadist

Member
I'm not in tears, but at times I'm just left speechless.

I hope everyone involved in Australia, Malaysia etc. are content with the way this is handled by our government.
 
P

Pizza Luigi

Member
I have been watching the TV broadcast for over an hour now and in between the buzzwords 'erg' (terrible), 'vreselijk' (horrifying), etc. I finally heard something sensible and filled with hope from a guy of Turkish descent. He said that these times show how The Netherlands excel in solidarity and how we provide a shoulder for our nationals to cry on.
The queen cries but with every tear, hopefully, goes along the belief that nothing like this will ever happen again. It's our job now to make sure it doesn't.
 
B

BlastProcessing

Member
ymoc said:
I'm sure in a capitalistic world we live in this will be easily done...
Which EU country will willingly stop trade with Russia? Can they even afford something like that in a time like this when countries are already stretched to economic limits?
It might sound as a good idea on paper, but in reality money drives the world and that is why you'll never se Merkel loudly bashing Russia.
Or, MAYBE, we should at least wait until investigators have a chance to finish their INVESTIGATION before we start talking punishment.
Stop listening to Kerry too much.

Soft power is soft power, it is not hard and erect as you might put it. Each have their own merits and faults. It is what it is. Though I fear what's your vision of hard power and what the EU should have done (we had that kind of hard powers in Europe many times already and we all know how that ended).
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Yeah, we will just wait for the investigators to investigate a crime scene where someone chopped up huge parts of the fuselage and carted them off for some strange reason.
 
A

ab.aeterno

Member
sangreal said:
Sounds like the charade is over

http://www.reuters.com/article/2014...nder-exclusive-idUSKBN0FS1V920140723?irpc=932
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So much for this then:

jimi_dini said:
Which means no BUK. If they had any hint about a BUK, they wouldn't (or maybe shouldn't) have allowed any airplane to fly over that area at 30.000 feet. It's as simple as that.
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jimi_dini said:
It was? Last time I checked Ukraine said that all BUKs are in control of Ukraine.
http://odnastroka.ru/politics/5067-yarema-oproverg-zahvat-opolchencami-kompleksov-buk-i-s-300.html

The rebels shot down some airborne vehicles, but not from such a height and they didn't use a BUK-1 for those. It's simply not plausible, especially because you need plenty of well-trained people to operate a BUK-1 (it's actually multiple vehicles, not some rocket-launcher thingie that can be operated somewhat easily).

Exactly. I wrote about this yesterday or so. That's why it doesn't make sense that rebels used it. Unless of course there is a huge conspiracy going on and Russia trained them for months.
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Now that the oft requested proof is here, straight from the horse's mouth, I'll be interested in seeing if it's acknowledged.
 
B

Bam Bam Baklava

Member
ab.aeterno said:
So much for this then:




Now that the oft requested proof is here, straight from the horse's mouth, I'll be interested in seeing if it's acknowledged.
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If jimi or freedomfighter come back to this thread I'd be shocked. Maybe they'll begin the new theory that yes they had the BUK but they didn't use it or that the plane shouldn't have been flying there as he stated in that post.
 
S

speculawyer

Member
Condolences to the Netherlands and thanks for providing a very respectful recognition of the tragedy as the victims return.


I hope the black boxes can provide us all with some useful information.
 
S

Shogun_of_Truth

Member
This doesn't sound good...

https://twitter.com/grasswire/status/492013210304651264
https://twitter.com/grasswire/status/492014759898673152


I hope things don't escalate even further.


I still can't believe that this whole thing started with peaceful protests demanding more European integration. in Kiev on November 21, 2013.

Now, only 8 months later, the Ukrainian president has been overthrown, and a new one voted in, Russian has annexed Crimea, parts of eastern Ukraine have declared Independence with Russian's blessing, a civil war has pretty much broken out, and now an passenger airplane full of innocents has been shot down.

It is truly frightening, if you really think about, how fast things have gone to hell, and continue to get worse.
 
SkylineRKR

SkylineRKR

Member
Parents on TV hoping remains of their young children will be buried accordingly, this is completely terrible. They were being pilfered even, sickening. Humanity is flawed.

This can't go away unpunished. EU is making me sick. As Voltaire said about the Holy Roman Empire, this holds true about the EU as well. Its not there.
 
S

Sibylus

Banned
Shogun_of_Truth said:
This doesn't sound good...

https://twitter.com/grasswire/status/492013210304651264
https://twitter.com/grasswire/status/492014759898673152


I hope things don't escalate even further.


I still can't believe that this whole thing started with peaceful protests demanding more European integration. in Kiev on November 21, 2013.

Now, only 8 months later, the Ukrainian president has been overthrown, and a new one voted in, Russian has annexed Crimea, parts of eastern Ukraine have declared Independence with Russian's blessing, a civil war has pretty much broken out, and now an passenger airplane full of innocents has been shot down.

It is truly frightening, if you really think about, how fast things have gone to hell, and continue to get worse.
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I wouldn't lend Twitter too much credence for updates on what's happening on the ground. Rumor or misdirection is typical.
 
A

antonz

Member
Bo said:
I wouldn't lend Twitter too much credence for updates on what's happening on the ground. Rumor or misdirection is typical.
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Thats really not true at all unless it is a Russian source. The Social media age is working against Russia. They all love their Russian Facebook etc and are so proud of their actions to defend "Holy" Mother Russia they cant help but post pictures etc.

Heres another
BtQMX7dIYAAI43M.jpg
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18 Years old Russian Army. Latest post about being in Donetsk
 
E

Earendil

Member
I have to say, based on the pictures and coverage I have seen from today, the Dutch government really handled this with an incredible amount of dignity and class. I can only imagine what the nation as a whole is going through right now, and I don't think it could have been handled any better.
 
B

BradC00

Member
antonz said:
The Social media age is working against Russia. They all love their Russian Facebook etc and are so proud of their actions to defend "Holy" Mother Russia they cant help but post pictures etc.
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these guys can't even keep a secret. you do this in the US military and you get your pee-pee smacked. i've seen people get disciplined for just talking shit about supervisors vaguely on facebook because of the position they were in. crazy.
 
C

Chariot

Member
BradC00 said:
these guys can't even keep a secret. you do this in the US military and you get your pee-pee smacked. i've seen people get disciplined for just talking shit about supervisors vaguely on facebook because of the position they were in. crazy.
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Well, good for the Ukraie though. The more intelligence it can gather through this the better.
 
O

Osiris

I permanently banned my 6 year old daughter from using the PS4 for mistakenly sending grief reports as it's too hard to watch or talk to her
liveuamap.com has been covering a lot of that social media development, you'd think they would at least wait until they are "on vacation in Ukraine" before posting their holiday plans!

Talking about liveuamap, they just posted that the SBU intercepted another call, Russian MP Vladimir Zhirinovsky promising the VP of DNR "all necessary help".
 
G

Gallbaro

Banned
boi said:
Very emotional what is happening on television right now. My country is deeply saddened. You can feel the atmosphere outside is really bad.

The Dutch government did an exceptional job in reclaiming the bodies from the warzone, even while Putin is putting pressure on the region by shifting his troops around the border.

They say they want to find the ones responsible, but that will be impossible since the Netherlands as a member of the NATO will not be able to conduct any sort of intervention. This also holds true for the EU. Even if they find the ones responsible, it will be up to Putin to allow an intervention to have him captured and that will not happen. If Putin does it himself, the attackers will go to court in Russia and I don't think he will be adequately punished.
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NATO =/= UN. Russia has no hard influence on NATO.
 
L

LNBL

Member
That long drive to the endpoint was something special, lets hope we never have to see something like that again. (After the remaining bodies are brought back Home)

The final shot ofthe live coverage really hit me the most, i don't even know why that scene did it.
tevwxm.jpg
 
A

antonz

Member
FStop7 said:
Clearly, he's working for the Pentagon.
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Funny enough after that he went on lifenews for Russia and denied they ever had any.

Russia has a new narrative though that acknowledges hey maybe they did.

"If they think they shot down a military jet, it was confusion. If it was confusion, it was not an act of terrorism."
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D

DanNLY

Neo Member
I just wanted to bring to your attention a good article about Russian trolls that have infiltrated almost every large forum on the net. I already see this daily on more then a few forums I frequent and it's showing up more and more on Neogaf...

So whenever you see posts refuting any proof or using what about ism or relativism or any denial of absolute truths it's most likely a paid Russian Putin troll...


Paid #Russians = 30,000 Fake Posts a Day

http://sptimes.ru/index_bp.php?action_id=2&story_id=40009&section=74

https://twitter.com/euromaidanpr/status/492100013355712512
 
U

User 100115

Banned
DanNLY said:
I just wanted to bring to your attention a good article about Russian trolls that have infiltrated almost every large forum on the net. I already see this daily on more then a few forums I frequent and it's showing up more and more on Neogaf...

So whenever you see posts refuting any proof or using what about ism or relativism or any denial of absolute truths it's most likely a paid Russian Putin troll...


Paid #Russians = 30,000 Fake Posts a Day

http://sptimes.ru/index_bp.php?action_id=2&story_id=40009&section=74

https://twitter.com/euromaidanpr/status/492100013355712512
Click to expand...

I don't think someone like that would last long here, if that were true. Mods are pretty good at discovering 'shills' from gaming companies, Russian paid shills would be similarly treated.

In all actuality, any posting like that would either be misinformed or deliberately trying to stir up trouble, not a paid shill.
 
S

Sibylus

Banned
antonz said:
Thats really not true at all unless it is a Russian source. The Social media age is working against Russia. They all love their Russian Facebook etc and are so proud of their actions to defend "Holy" Mother Russia they cant help but post pictures etc.

Heres another


18 Years old Russian Army. Latest post about being in Donetsk
Click to expand...
Can't say I agree whatsoever. Have been through my fair share of twitter reporting and seen so much rumor passed off as report (and nothing unique to the Ukrainian conflict, happens everywhere).
 
M

Mully

Member
Fiction said:
I don't think someone like that would last long here, if that were true. Mods are pretty good at discovering 'shills' from gaming companies, Russian paid shills would be similarly treated.

In all actuality, any posting like that would either be misinformed or deliberately trying to stir up trouble, not a paid shill.
Click to expand...

Yeah at this point there's a ton of Russian supporters who believe the propaganda they're fed. There's no need to pay for shills anymore when supporters actually believe the bullshit Russia Today is spewing.
 
M

MIMIC

Banned
DanNLY said:
I just wanted to bring to your attention a good article about Russian trolls that have infiltrated almost every large forum on the net. I already see this daily on more then a few forums I frequent and it's showing up more and more on Neogaf...

So whenever you see posts refuting any proof or using what about ism or relativism or any denial of absolute truths it's most likely a paid Russian Putin troll...


Paid #Russians = 30,000 Fake Posts a Day

http://sptimes.ru/index_bp.php?action_id=2&story_id=40009&section=74

https://twitter.com/euromaidanpr/status/492100013355712512
Click to expand...

Ban all juniors! =p
 
F

FyreWulff

Member
"To get this tangible stuff back, all we have to say is you kinda sorta exist? Okay"

I don't even see how anyone sane wouldn't take such an easy deal in a heartbeat
 
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