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[StevieP]

Where exactly am I encouraging this crap you speak of? I am talking from SONY's perspective and what I think they should have done better. Of course I would love all that stuff you mention buts it completely irrellevant here. I'm not telling you should pay for these services or buy anything from them. I am saying what SONY should have done because it appears to have worked for the competition.

The world you are talking about DOES NOT exist. Who wouldn't love all that?

PC. Also most games including the non-shitty CoDs (MW2 and BO) have dedicated servers. All free. I booted into CoD4 last night. Nearly 10,000 servers online (not including the mods and the MW2/BO map mods). All free.

This world exists. Just not with friends "jumping from game to game" without a 3rd party app (like Steam) or shitty-ass GFW Live installed.

What Microsoft has done to online gaming on the console front is both innovative and extremely shitty at the same time.

 

[Stephen Colbert]

I think we're lookinga at full DX12 compliance with that sort of release schedule.

Brain Stew, you're pretty familiar with GPUs.

What would you say are the odds that Microsoft will either opt to go with the Nvidia Maxwell, or atleast a custom GPU from Nvidia that packs in all the major innovations from their project denver that allows Maxwell to in their own words "have a 40x fold performance increase over Fermi"?

Basically, a custom ARM+Nvidia CPGPU that includes "virtual memory, pre-emption, enhance the ability of GPU to autonomously process, so that it's non-blocking of the CPU, not waiting for the CPU, relies less on the transfer overheads that we see today."

Given how good Battlefield 3 looks on current gen GPUs, and how good Crysis Warhead looked on last year's GPUs, by the end of the next gen, something like the Maxwell (or whatever ATI has up it's sleeves to compete) combined with a few fancy tricks could have games looking damn close to real life. There might not even need to be a next gen after that, atleast for another decade.

 

[jsnepo]

That's about the only good argument I've read on the matter. I'm sure there's a point of diminishing returns where adding more complexity isn't just worth it, and optimising to run faster is a better use of resources. But we're a long way from that.

I hope devs consider frame rate to be more important next-gen than textures, etc. How awesome it is to play a game with the graphical fidelity of God of War but is running at a constant 60 frames per second.

 

[Emitan]

I hope devs consider frame rate to be more important next-gen than textures, etc. How awesome it is to play a game with the graphical fidelity of God of War but is running at a constant 60 frames per second.

Framerate does't show up in screenshots.

 

[PopcornMegaphone]

edit nevermind

 

[Why For?]

Wow, so there really is no new consoles coming till well after 2013.

Awesome. No really, I'm glad. I want this gen to go for much much longer.

 

[ClovingWestbrook]

Framerate does't show up in screenshots.

Yep. And framerate wont make COD go from 8,000,000,000,000,000,000 on day one to 8,000,000,000,000,000,001.

 

[StevieP]

edit nevermind

No, your criticism of "shitting up" was a valid one, despite the stealth edit. I own PCs and consoles. I just think paying for online sucks ass and it should not be encouraged, let alone made the only choice next gen. Pervasive DLC is a bad enough practice that won't be going away any time soon.

 

[ClovingWestbrook]

edit nevermind

Lol.

 

[Mizzou Gaming]

PC. Also most games including the non-shitty CoDs (MW2 and BO) have dedicated servers. All free. I booted into CoD4 last night. Nearly 10,000 servers online (not including the mods and the MW2/BO map mods). All free.

This world exists. Just not with friends "jumping from game to game" without a 3rd party app (like Steam) or shitty-ass GFW Live installed.

What Microsoft has done to online gaming on the console front is both innovative and extremely shitty at the same time.

Ok, but are you saying this is what SONY should have done or what they should do in the future because you are going in a lot of different directions here.

I'm not saying Xbox Live is great, I'm not saying PSN is bad, and I'm certainly not saying PC's online structure is bad. I completely agree that all that stuff is great. I just don't think it will benefit SONY to implement that kind of a structure. Sure as a PS3 owner I would love all that stuff but I'm being realistic here knowing SONY can't survive with that type of structure.

If you want to disagree with my opinion and say SONY should implement all that free stuff and they will be successful fine, I have no problem with that. Don't say I'm encouraging anything Im not. I'm simply looking at things from their perspective, and offering what I think they should or shouldn't have done.

Edit: Sony or MS building and offerring an affordable console at no loss while also offering free online, free dlc, dedicated servers, etc., is the fantasy world Im talking about.

 

[StevieP]

That's fair. I know it would be in their best interest to model their online service after Live for the sake of profitability. But, as Amir0x would say, that's not what's best for us gamers.

 

[Mizzou Gaming]

That's fair. I know it would be in their best interest to model their online service after Live for the sake of profitability. But, as Amir0x would say, that's not what's best for us gamers.

No its definately not what's best for gamers. That's what is scary, all of that great stuff is currently offered in the PC Gaming World yet its the console market that continues to grow at crazy rates. I am actually terrified of the new avenues companies are going to use to gain revenue next generation.

 

[TOAO_Cyrus]

Brain Stew, you're pretty familiar with GPUs.

What would you say are the odds that Microsoft will either opt to go with the Nvidia Maxwell, or atleast a custom GPU from Nvidia that packs in all the major innovations from their project denver that allows Maxwell to in their own words "have a 40x fold performance increase over Fermi"?

Basically, a custom ARM+Nvidia CPGPU that includes "virtual memory, pre-emption, enhance the ability of GPU to autonomously process, so that it's non-blocking of the CPU, not waiting for the CPU, relies less on the transfer overheads that we see today."

All that stuff is really for GPGPU tasks not graphics. Next gen consoles GPU's probably won't even support double precision as thats just wasted transistors.

 

[codswallop]

I just think paying for online sucks ass and it should not be encouraged, let alone made the only choice next gen.

I don't mind paying, and have just resubscribed to XBL for my third year. I've gone from having to pay for gaming (direct modem-to-modem gets expensive when it drops out regularly), to free with PC gaming, back to paying with consoles. However, I don't feel that I'm getting a good deal out of it -- I think Microsoft should offer a certain number of points a month (I dunno, 150?) but given they're raking it in now, why would they bother.

 

[Dr. Kitty Muffins]

Wow, so there really is no new consoles coming till well after 2013.

Awesome. No really, I'm glad. I want this gen to go for much much longer.

Same here. I don't want a new console until the next Bull market.

 

[Tiago Leite]

New consoles fall 2013 / 2014 means more time, time to...

Believe...
I want to believe...
I want to believe that POWER 7 (with massive vectorial power), plus a R1000/Maxwell and some veRRRy fast RAM can be in the next gen consoles...

We need kazillion processors... I'am at the red team, but I think C++ in Maxwell can make this gap smaller, allowing killing the API's, writting to the metal, and making a revolutional leap in processing graphics.

Pleeeze, someone, make it happen... I beg!

 

[Phoenician_Viking]

MS and Sony´s next console fall 2013.
Nintendo ´s next console fall 2012.

 

[Stephen Colbert]

New consoles fall 2013 / 2014 means more time, time to...

Believe...
I want to believe...
I want to believe that POWER 7 (with massive vectorial power), plus a R1000/Maxwell and some veRRRy fast RAM can be in the next gen consoles...

We need kazillion processors... I'am at the red team, but I think C++ in Maxwell can make this gap smaller, allowing killing the API's, writting to the metal, and making a revolutional leap in processing graphics.

Pleeeze, someone, make it happen... I beg!

Hell yes.

Given how good Battlefield 3 looks on current gen GPUs, and how good Crysis Warhead looked on last year's GPUs, by the end of the next gen, something like the Maxwell (or whatever ATI has up it's sleeve for 2013) combined with a few fancy tricks could have games looking damn close to real life. There might not even need to be a next gen after that, atleast for another decade.

 

[Iksenpets]

2013 at the earliest, but I could see them slowing down production and holding out until 2014 if 360+Kinect is still performing strongly enough for them in 2012 and Sony hasn't made a move to be out in 2013. They're ramping up now to be ready in 2013 if Sony forces their hand, but I think Microsoft's ideal launch point, all other things being equal, is 2014. Plus that way they could basically release a console they designed for 2013 in 2014, and cut the launch price accordingly. I don't think they want to be quite so cutting edge on the tech front this time around if it means launching at anything over $400 after the fiasco of the HD transition and the PS3's pricing woes, though they certainly won't take a two 360s duct taped together Wii-style route, either.

As for the console itself, 360 controller unchanged, built in Kinect, and full BC. No way they don't have BC now that they'e invested so much in building a huge library of digital content on XBL that they can sell without giving anything over to retailers. That'll also mean no huge overhaul to the basic architecture. They won't be upgrading to any crazy, out-there tech like Larrabee.

 

[MomoPufflet]

I miss fat, non-douche Allard

 

[Future PhaZe]

for the love of god please let these things have enough RAM....

 

[bengraven]

We've been having a nice vacation from this kind of stuff. I suppose the vacation is over now and we have to go back to talking about next gen.

 

[Wiseblood]

Whether it's ATI or NVidia or whoever, the hardware is going to be something custom designed to MS's specifications that they're going to own and dictate the manufacture of, like the Xenon/Xenos parts on the 360. No way they're going to make the same mistake they did on the original XBox and simply buy CPU/GPU parts from anybody.

 

[Sydle]

2013 sounds good. I could probably wait until 2015, tbh.

My question is why is MS seeking candidates for these positions now? What happened to the previous team involved with the xbox360 other than J Allard who is no longer with MS?

You mean the team that made RROD famous? I imagine they were fired, or they're definitely not leading the charge this time.

 

[Leucrota]

for the love of god please let these things have enough RAM....

Is RAM cheaper than MS is dumb?

I don't think MS is dumb, so there should be plenty of RAM in next gen consoles.

 

[Imperial Hot]

I would have thought they'd have had people already working on the next-generation Xbox hardware in case Kinect didn't work out.

I guess they were really confident in Kinect that they didn't start work on a next Xbox as a contingency plan.

 

[TheOddOne]

I guess they were really confident in Kinect that they didn't start work on a next Xbox as a contingency plan.

They where going to make it dispite Kinect, that was a given.

 

[I <3 Memes]

My favorite part of the console cycle is finally here. The bullshit PR, the fake as hell CG videos, and the people who believe them. I cant get enough of it.


The countdown now begins for someone at Sony to say that they have heard the complaints of developers and promise this time to make a console that is easier to develop for. Then deliver the most complicated hardware architecture ever created.

 

[low-G]

I think we're lookinga at full DX12 compliance with that sort of release schedule.

Is there any speculation on what DirectX 12 will provide beyond DirectX 11?

 

[snackman]

It's gonna be weird seeing a PS4 because the PS3 didn't really dominate this gen on Xbox or Wii. I'm not sure if Sony will ever go back to the leaders like the 90's again. They probably wish Sega was still making systems lol.

 

[Stephen Colbert]

It's gonna be weird seeing a PS4 because the PS3 didn't really dominate this gen on Xbox or Wii. I'm not sure if Sony will ever go back to the leaders like the 90's again. They probably wish Sega was still making systems lol.

Meh. The PS3 did fine for itself. It won Sony the format war, and Sony has been collected royalty fees from blu rays ever since.

Plus, despite launching an year later at an absolutely ludicrous launch price, it's still neck and neck with MS in terms of worldwide sales. And that's while not even factoring in all the 360s that kicked the bucket thanks to RROD.

And I don't think gamers have anything to complain about either. As far as games go, the PS3 delivered, imo, far more so than any console this gen. I can't get enough of Little Big Planet and Infamous 2's mission maker looks ludicrous.

 

[ClovingWestbrook]

My favorite part of the console cycle is finally here. The bullshit PR, the fake as hell CG videos, and the people who believe them. I cant get enough of it.


The countdown now begins for someone at Sony to say that they have heard the complaints of developers and promise this time to make a console that is easier to develop for. Then deliver the most complicated hardware architecture ever created.

You and be both man. To me the 2 year lead up to the release of the next gen consoles is more entertaining and fun than the release itself. I eagerly await the next couple E3's when we begin to see the trailers where SE style cinematics are referred to as actual game play. Where we're told how these consoles will do everything under the sun and more. Where we're led to believe that they will output 120fps, be cutting edge technology that supersedes even the mightiest of PC's. Where the console warriors grab their shields, swords, and arrows and begin defending their new found king. Its truly a great time for all.

 

[Stephen Colbert]

I think it's fair to say that both the 360 and PS3 delivered on their e3 hype and promises.

Games like Gears, Uncharted 2, God of War 3 etc look better than anyone imagined in even their wildest dreams back then.

Killzone 3 and even Killzone 2 surpassed the CG "target" footage Sony showed at e3, so it's fair to say that the Cell held up to it's hype.

Blu Ray did wind up winning format war and being a useful addition, as did HDMI. Looking at it now, I can't see how anyone can claim Sony and Microsoft didn't deliver on their promises.

The one thing people are disappointed with is that so few titles are natively 1080p60fps. But I don't recall that being promised. Many back then were happy with 720p and 1080i content and that's what they were expecting back then, 1080p was still a brand new format that few people have even seen.

 

[ClovingWestbrook]

I think it's fair to say that both the 360 and PS3 delivered on their e3 hype and promises.

Games like Gears, Uncharted 2, God of War 3 etc look better than anyone imagined in even their wildest dreams back then.

Killzone 3 and even Killzone 2 surpassed the CG "target" footage Sony showed at e3, so it's fair to say that the Cell held up to it's hype.

Blu Ray did wind up winning format war and being a useful addition, as did HDMI. Looking at it now, I can't see how anyone can claim they feel let down.

120fps? Lol. The PS3 has been my console of choice this gen. They have fulfilled some expectations while missing others. Motorstorm graphics?

 

[Stephen Colbert]

Did Sony promise 120fps? It was a long time ago but I don't recall that.

I don't remember the Motorstorm graphics either. But Motorstorm Pacific Rift looked pretty freaking incredible, the upcoming one looks even better. And there are some tracks in GT5 that look damn near photorealistic.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IudlEZ7wNhw

 

[eso76]

I want a 500/600$ price point for the nextbox.
The hardware should be awesome.

i don't understand people going crazy over a 100 or 200 $ price difference for consoles; it's a sum you spend once in 5/8 years, you're likely to spend much more money on games within a year.

 

[MidnightCowboy]

This gen started when I was in 8th grade and might start after I graduate college. Some crazy shit man. I've loved it though.

 

[PopcornMegaphone]

]
Killzone 3 and even Killzone 2 surpassed the CG "target" footage Sony showed at e3, so it's fair to say that the Cell held up to it's hype.

You've been saying some funny things, but this is my favorite. That KZ2 CGI was insane.

 

[Stephen Colbert]

You've been saying some funny things, but this is my favorite. That KZ2 CGI was insane.

Your memory decieves you. The CGI didn't look as good as you remember it. Compare the trailer to the actual game for yourself....

http://www.gametrailers.com/player/21610.html

 

[DR2K]

I want a 500/600$ price point for the nextbox.
The hardware should be awesome.

i don't understand people going crazy over a 100 or 200 $ price difference for consoles; it's a sum you spend once in 5/8 years, you're likely to spend much more money on games within a year.

Because not everyone has a money tree growing in their backyard.

 

[Grampa Simpson]

Yep mine does but when I hook it up my tv shit looks crazy. Ive tried changing resolutions and everything.. it always looks super zoomed in and I cant even see the damn task bar. So I just gave up using it like that. Just get lazy and take it back to my desk. Just feel like it should be more streamlined. I shouldn't have to spend a few hours doing research to run it on there. Plus then controlling it becomes a huge issue due to me hating wireless mouses.


Meanwhile part of me is pushed for a next gen but other part is not. I feel like to few developers will even survive another generation of consoles. But then I see stuff like BF3 footage and I know theres no way consoles will run it that well and having to develop the game for consoles is also probably holding back its true potential.

Heck if more developers would get there games on pc and give them support I'd probably just drop console gaming. But theres still those few games that will never hit PC that bring me back :/.

You've got to love that ATSC forgot that we should no longer need to compensate for the limitations of 1930's television technology.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Overscan

 

[painful fart]

I miss fat, non-douche Allard

Who doesn´t?

Spoiler

I miss young and fat Greenberg as well, old people suck.

 

[Stephen Colbert]

I want a 500/600$ price point for the nextbox.
The hardware should be awesome.

i don't understand people going crazy over a 100 or 200 $ price difference for consoles; it's a sum you spend once in 5/8 years, you're likely to spend much more money on games within a year.

Exactly. I think a $499 price tag for the premium sku is ideal. If you're not willing to pay that much, wait an year for the price to drop, the launch games will suck anyways.

These machines have to last for ten years. If they can target the performance of something like the Nvidia Maxwell or it's ATI competitor, with a few tricks, they can make close to photorealistic games.

If you think that sounds ridiculous, look at how good Battlefield 3 looks on current gen graphics cards.

There is an order of maginitude difference between the performance of todays best GPUs and the GPUs that will show up in late 2013/early 2014.

 

[TAJ]

Meh. The PS3 did fine for itself. It won Sony the format war, and Sony has been collected royalty fees from blu rays ever since.

Plus, despite launching an year later at an absolutely ludicrous launch price, it's still neck and neck with MS in terms of worldwide sales. And that's while not even factoring in all the 360s that kicked the bucket thanks to RROD.

And I don't think gamers have anything to complain about either. As far as games go, the PS3 delivered, imo, far more so than any console this gen. I can't get enough of Little Big Planet and Infamous 2's mission maker looks ludicrous.

Sony's share of Blu-ray royalties is less than 30%. The royalty rates on players and discs were recently lowered quite a bit, too.

 

[Afrikan]

120fps? Lol. The PS3 has been my console of choice this gen. They have fulfilled some expectations while missing others. Motorstorm graphics?

um, the updated Super StarDust HD ran at 120fps for its 3D mode...and at 720p. I think that is what they meant when they said 120fps. They knew they built the PS3 for the future and that it would have 3D. I'm sure there are other 60fps games in the PS3's future, that will need to running at 120fps to keep 60fps in 3D mode. I'm not sure if MLB The Show 11 keeps its 60fps when running in 3D.

Motorstorm was straight CG, Jack f'd up when speaking about it. Poor Evolution Studios, they must've been under alot of stress to match that. That might have benefited us gamers though, cuz the Motorstorm series has pushed some of the best graphics this gen.

 

[OldJadedGamer]

I don't remember the Motorstorm graphics either.]

According to the Motorstorm developers they didn't even know the specs for the PS3 when they made that render. They stated that they found out about the specs of the machine when we did:

http://www.1up.com/news/nigel-kershaw-motorstorm-original-target

Hollywood noted that the video was created before the E3 2005 Sony press conference where the PlayStation 3 was unveiled, but the developer didn't actually know the technical specifications of the PS3 until the conference itself. "They actually announced the specifications on a slideshow presentation [at E3]. We sat and jotted them down, and then they showed our movie," Hollywood explained. "It was like, 'This is what the PlayStation 3 can do, and this is what you'll get on it.' We're sitting there trying to do the math in our head and asking, 'Can we really do this stuff?'"

 

[Stephen Colbert]

That's a pretty hilarious article. Poor guys!

 

[Raide]

I would buy a new Xbox next year, just as long as its 100% backwards compatible. Kinect will be a large part of the next console, so I suspect they will want people to migrate over with their Kinect too.

 

[Hanmik]

Remember the orchestra that played when you booted up you PS3 the first time..? ohh that was nice back when you did it the first time..

I just found the start up tune for the next Xbox..

good startup tune

make it happen..

 

[ZiggyRoXx]

About fucking time......

Not the new Xbox, but the fact its taken nearly 3mths for my account to be activated by NeoGaf Mods.


What the fuck is that all about...?

Just saying like....



Oh, ok , good news about the new Xbox.