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Microsoft sees Xbox 360 in driver's seat

Wulfer

Member
Sega managing to keep selling Dreamcasts would have done nothing to cause the major console dev houses to port their titles to the platform.

and why is that well I think I stated it pretty clearly!!! You want me to say it again "lack of CASH"!!! If, Sega had the cash to back the system developers would not have had this view toward Sega. It seemed everyone wanted Sega out of the hardware business. That doesn't mean the DC wasn't a great system... It clearly was and stood toe to toe will 1st and 2nd gen PS2 titles. That was unreal because the media was trying to say other wise.
 

Tiktaalik

Member
It's just speculation on my part, but I don't see Microsoft getting in the drivers' seat next gen. I haven't seen anything so far to suggest that Sony will drop the ball, or that Microsoft has anything extra special planned. I think that the Xbox360 will do better in NA, maybe even getting to the ~50-50 area of the SNES vs Genesis days, but I don't think it will do as well in Europe and not nearly as well in Japan.

I have an Xbox, along with the other systems, but I actually wouldn't want Microsoft in the drivers' seat in this industry. Looking at the other industries Microsoft leads, it makes me hope that Microsoft never gets to be #1.
 

Tiktaalik

Member
Pimpwerx said:
Why should MS get any greater advantage than Sega coming to market first? The DC got some hot properties early on too, lest we forget. SC and RE and DOA and uh oh....looks similar to something else? The DC lacked EA's support, but for the most part, it had a solid lineup and all the other stuff people want to claim is so important. But it lacked credibility b/c everyone and their mother new the next Playstation was gonna have all the marquee games. Everyone and their mother knows the same about the PS3, why should that change?

I agree 100%. Everytime something cool for the xbox360 comes out, Sony will find some way to remind people that the PLAYSTATION 3 (ooh!) is coming out soon.
 
WULFER said:
and why is that well I think I stated it pretty clearly!!! You want me to say it again "lack of CASH"!!! If, Sega had the cash to back the system developers would not have had this view toward Sega. It seemed everyone wanted Sega out of the hardware business. That doesn't mean the DC wasn't a great system... It clearly was and stood toe to toe will 1st and 2nd gen PS2 titles. That was unreal because the media was trying to say other wise.

I guess that is how a Dreamcast fan might see things in hindsight.

The fact was that console developers weren't going to waste our time developing for it. It was a dead end platform. The PS2 was right around the corner and we knew it was going to go on to sell 100+ million units. And, surprise, we were right.
 

Wulfer

Member
You have to topple the mind/marketshare and momentum that platform has created. PEACE.

CASH and MARKETING can go along way in this department. Look I've been watching this industry since the 16 bit days. Learn these words and you'll be better off, NOTHING IS IMPOSSIBLE in the video game INDUSTRY! Period.....


Sony can fall just like everybody else can. When you read the forums you get a feeling one system will never fall. Nothing could be further from the truth.
 

Pimpwerx

Member
WULFER said:
CASH and MARKETING can go along way in this department. Look I've been watching this industry since the 16 bit days. Learn these words and you'll be better off, NOTHING IS IMPOSSIBLE in the video game INDUSTRY! Period.....


Sony can fall just like everybody else can. When you read the forums you get a feeling one system will never fall. Nothing could be further from the truth.
No one is saying they can't fall. Myself and others are just pointing out that it would take a negative move by Sony at this point to make it happen. They control such a large portion of the market, that they are in the driver's seat. There's really little MS and Nintendo can do on their own right now to change things besides coming up with an actual revolution. It's gonna take a paradigm shift to change the status quo right now, and what MS is coming with right now is an evolution. It says nothing negative of their effort, just of the daunting task at hand. Again, a company can come with the strongest marketing campaign in the world against Windows, and it will amount to nothing b/c you and I both know that computers = Windows. There is a market for Linux and for MacOS, but MS controls the largest chunk by far. To overcome that will take a major stumble by MS more than a good product from the competition. There are better OSes than Windows, yet XP Crap Pack 50 will still sell way more units than anything else. Yet...even they can fall. Nothing's impossible. Some things are just highly improbable. PEACE.
 

Draft

Member
The Windows comparison doesn't work. One of the reasons Windows remains so prevalent is that there are thousands of programs that only it can run. When you buy a new console, it has no effect on your current consoles. Owning an Xbox360 doesn't render all your PS2 games unusable.

I guess you COULD say that the PS3 has the advantage of BC, since it can play all those PS2 games that are lying around. But I don't think many people will be buying next gen systems to play Tekken Tag Tournament.
 

ManaByte

Member
Draft said:
The Windows comparison doesn't work. One of the reasons Windows remains so prevalent is that there are thousands of programs that only it can run. When you buy a new console, it has no effect on your current consoles. Owning an Xbox360 doesn't render all your PS2 games unusable.

I guess you COULD say that the PS3 has the advantage of BC, since it can play all those PS2 games that are lying around. But I don't think many people will be buying next gen systems to play Tekken Tag Tournament.

I personally will NOT buy a multiplatform game on Xbox anymore simply because of how BC will work on 360. I'll buy the title on PS2 or GCN.
 
Sega had so many problems, Sony's PS3 was not the only one by far. In management, SoJ held all the cards, and it was the desire of the higher ups to focus on Arcade support rather than Dreamcast support. There was a period pre-Dreamcast and during the Dreamcast's life where they decided to focus on making as many Dreamcast titles as possible.

When Sega was NOT focusing on the DC, DC sold well enough in America, but sales worldwide were generally sluggish. Sega then focusing on the Dreamcast caused massive Arcade revenue loss, which is the backbone of their company. They tumbled again. They were in a no-win situation.

Software sales were horrible, due to lack of mass-market titles outside of Crazy Taxi, NFL, RE, and Sonic. It was also helped by the massive spread of piracy, which helped Sega lose all hope for Europe (Where piracy might've helped Sonic's popularity, coincidentally).

Publishers began to quietly pull out as well and focus on the PS2 as Sega's knees began to tremble. SoA decided to invest into Sega.Net, which wasn't the wisest decision when they weren't alotted a lot of money in the first place. The Dreamcast crumbled with a bankrupt Sega. Sega wanted Software sales to take precedence on the Dreamcast, and it never really flew.

Microsoft's situation is a bit different. They have no other market, aside PC game development, to focus on. If anything, their involvement in making PC tools and games will only help their Xbox business. Their largest problem by far is getting developers with huge-name titles to take more notice of the X360. They've failed to do that with everyone but EA and SE. They have a huge blockbuster title under wraps in Halo 3, yet they have not started the least bit of Halo 3 hype, leading into their launch only being hyped by the more hardcore Madden-ites and hardcore gamers. Microsoft failed at hyping their product. They have a few more months before launch to correct this, but that's by far the biggest mis-step they had. IMO, their focus is upon getting the Xbox 360 information out there, and creating lots of buzz being the first next-generation console. They saw that as the big thing that led the PS2 to dominate, but the main reason the PS2 dominated was because we saw tech demos and all sorts of amazing games in huge franchises as much as a year before it's launch.

Their biggest advantage may be Sony's ambition. Sony's hoping on including a lot of technology for a perhaps premium price, but make it very worthwhile to the public. If Sony launches at a higher price, while Microsoft maintains a more modest one, that'd be a key advantage. I think Sony is going to go the PSP route with the PS3, adding, for the price of admission, lots of additions that push the definition of the console, like the PSP pushed the definition of a handheld. There was no media playing, web-surfing, high powered game machine video jukebox with an optical drive even in the planning before the PSP. The PS3 will apparently be a PC substitute, with the much touted ability to run new applications not strictly gaming related and it's 'home server' abilities.

Both companies are in a situation where they need the consumer to bite.
 

Agent Icebeezy

Welcome beautful toddler, Madison Elizabeth, to the horde!
I agree with you about the marketing. However, the local DM of my Gamestop has basically said that come October, everybody worldwide will know what the Xbox 360 is. It's ad campaign will make Halo 2's campaign insignificant in comparison. So, around the time of X05. Early adopters will get the system regardless. They need games to run on final kits to show to the consumer. It'll be done. It just needs to run it's course. Time, that is, because things will fall in line
 

Mrbob

Member
ManaByte said:
I personally will NOT buy a multiplatform game on Xbox anymore simply because of how BC will work on 360. I'll buy the title on PS2 or GCN.

What are you talking about?
 

Barnimal

Banned
excellent post snow' but i do disagree in a way about the EA thing. I think that Madden will be THE game that pushes the 360. Its kinda coming out late but think superbowl. EA and MS will have a great time from november right thru superbowl if madden 360 does indeed seem "next gen" enough and MS gets enough systems out there to sell thru january. Call me crazy but I think 3 million+ systems will sell in the US alone with the help of EA. MS doesnt really need a GTA or a Halo yet.
 

ManaByte

Member
Mrbob said:
What are you talking about?

PS3 and Revolution will play all PS2 and GCN games. Unless your game is a best seller (Halo 2) it may or may not be able to be played on X360.
 

Syb

Member
ManaByte said:
PS3 and Revolution will play all PS2 and GCN games. Unless your game is a best seller (Halo 2) it may or may not be able to be played on X360.

I actually heard that all MGS games and titles that were released in 2005 would work out of the box and that niche titles etc would need to have patches downloaded from Live...
 

AniHawk

Member
ManaByte said:
PS3 and Revolution will play all PS2 and GCN games. Unless your game is a best seller (Halo 2) it may or may not be able to be played on X360.

Also, it's kinda difficult to carry over saves.
 

Amir0x

Banned
Mrbob said:
What are you talking about?

Xbox 360 backward compatibility is expansive. It starts out with a collection of the "most popular" games which they play through for full compatability. And then as time goes on they add more and more games into the umbrella until hopefully 100% of the games are BC (downloadable, I guess). Unfortunately...

a.) There's no guarantee we'll ever see close to 100% compatability
b.) There's going to be months and months and possibly years before the goal is ever reached anyway because they have to test every game individually. So there will be a big period of time when you're essentially guaranteed to own a game that isn't compatible if you have any sort of decent collection.
c.) And there's always the possibility Microsoft might find it not feasible to bother reaching the goal (either because most people didn't seem to want it or whatever).

Right now BC is just a marketing thing to make sure the 360 doesn't seem behind the PS3 on any level. But it's not comprehensive BC at launch, which is why some people don't want to get multiplatform games for it. They know Rev and PS3 are guaranteed to be almost 100% backwards compatible, while 360 simply won't.

I hope that explains it.
 

Mrbob

Member
ManaByte said:
PS3 and Revolution will play all PS2 and GCN games. Unless your game is a best seller (Halo 2) it may or may not be able to be played on X360.

We'll see. MS has caved in and licensed nvidia tech now so their plan is to have all games work.

Speaking of saves, the PS3 does not have a standard PS2 memory card slot. How will you transfer your save games to PS3?
 

Syb

Member
Im hoping Microsoft will release some cable that plugs into the XBox's Eth. Port and transfers the saves.

That'd be awesome. \m/
 

AniHawk

Member
Mrbob said:
We'll see. MS has caved in and licensed nvidia tech now so their plan is to have all games work.

Speaking of saves, the PS3 does not have a standard PS2 memory card slot. How will you transfer your save games to PS3?

So the PS3 will allow to save PSOne and PS2 games on its cards?
 

Mrbob

Member
AniHawk said:
So the PS3 will allow to save PSOne and PS2 games on its cards?


????????????????????

This is the million dollar question.

You would think with all the useless crap SCEI is packing into the PS3 they could at least add a standard PS2 memory card slot.
 

Agent Icebeezy

Welcome beautful toddler, Madison Elizabeth, to the horde!
Most people just wanted to know does Halo 2 work when you put it in the 360, and it does. BC problem solved for most. Now, can I play lan on that, when others still have Xbox 1. I don't see why not
 

Barnimal

Banned
you guys are so wrong about the BC that its amazing. check this out. the 360 will be 100% backward compatible from the get go. The reason MS wont just come out and say that is because to claim 100% compatibility they would have to had tested the entire library of games before launch meaning played them all straight thru to make sure there are no hang ups. This is impossible. so why play thru the junk games? Skip to the top sellers first and work their way backwards. get those top sellers working fine, go back and correct the shit that NO ONE WILL PLAY ANYWAY(sneakers anyone? what about room zoom?) later.

Its not like you are going to throw sneakers in your 360 and big red letters are going to flash on the screen OMGWTF. the game MIGHT just happen to crash 75% through.
 

Amir0x

Banned
Barnimal said:
you guys are so wrong about the BC that its amazing. check this out. the 360 will be 100% backward compatible from the get go. The reason MS wont just come out and say that is because to claim 100% compatibility they would have to had tested the entire library of games before launch meaning played them all straight thru to make sure there are no hang ups. This is impossible. so why play thru the junk games? Skip to the top sellers first and work their way backwards. get those top sellers working fine, go back and correct the shit that NO ONE WILL PLAY ANYWAY(sneakers anyone? what about room zoom?) later.

Its not like you are going to throw sneakers in your 360 and big red letters are going to flash on the screen OMGWTF. the game MIGHT just happen to crash 75% through.

...

No no, Barnimal, I'm 100% certain that it is we who are correct here. Since this easily wins most idiotic statement of the night. If it was 100% BC, Microsoft would fucking say so because it would be great PR for them. It's not. They know many games won't work, because there are tons of different engines and all of them need different aspects of the tech to work. Unless there's full testing, it's not a matter of that some games might crash. It's a matter of a lot of games DEFINITELY will crash, period.
 

ManaByte

Member
Yup.

If a game is on PS2, Xbox, and GCN I'll usually buy the GCN one now unless it's something like Madden and then I'd get the PS2 one because of the controller. If it's on PS2 or Xbox I'll get the PS2 one no matter how better looking the Xbox one is.

And with the Revolution at least you know you can not only use saves from the GCN but any controller as well:
igncubes-nintendo-revolution-faq-20050525023043410.jpg
 

ManaByte

Member
Syb said:
How the hell is the WaveBirds 'knoblette' going to fit on that thing?

Why would you need a wavebird when the Revolution pad is wireless??

The plugs are there for the GBA cables, Bongos, and DDR pads.
 

1st Born

Member
I would like to get an XBox 360 for Ghost Recon 3, RR6, and Frame City Killer alone. There is just so much still left on the XBox, Madden 06, Half-Life 2, Prince of Persa 3, Path to Neo, and the new Zelda on the GameCube.
 

1st Born

Member
I do miss the Dreamcast. My favorite system launch by far. I even imported the Asian console before the US version was released w/ Sonic and Soul Calibur. The DC was a machine for the hardcoe Sega fan. Sega.Net was the bomb, Quake 3 and NFL2k was the most fun I had on the weekends.

But, the DC was dead when the PS2 hit. Should have seen the lines at the Sony Meteron DAYS before the system hit, Madden 2002 was a killer app.
 

Ironclad

Member
Syb said:
How the hell is the WaveBirds 'knoblette' going to fit on that thing?
Actually, if you look at it closely, you'll see that the controller ports are flipped. They're pointing in the opposite direction of the ones on the gamecube. They did it that way so it can fit the wavebird receiver.
 

Wunderchu

Member
Striek said:
Yeah they done what alot of people thought they couldn't. They cracked the market.
But in the end they basically split Nintendos marketshare.
And it all comes down to 3 things:
1) Power advantage, this was the #1 reason ANYONE got an Xbox over PS2 (at least around here) for the first couple of years
I agree ... that reason is why I think certain hardcore gamers (i.e.: the types of hardcore gamers who bought Xbox, and for which one of the reasons why they chose to buy the Xbox was because it was the most powerful console), may jump ship from MS's console to PS3, if PS3 is the most powerful next gen. console...




Suburban Cowboy said:
I just can't see how Sony wont win. They have the japanese support, the user base, the power and the name.

The name "Playstation" today has the same recognition as the name "Nintendo" had 10-15 years ago. It is the defining label of the industry. (IE the phrase "Im gonna go play some playstation" is heard all the time in movies and tv just as the name Nintendo was used before it)

In my opinion Sony will have to fuck up pretty bad in order for MS to take 1st in the industry, no matter what fucking ferrari they're driving
I agree ....

casual gamers flocked to the PS2, because of popular games / franchises, and also likely because of brand trust, etc.


.. this time around, PS3 will have those same advantages that PS2 had, with the possibility of an additional advantage of being the most powerful console................
 
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