Dr.Morris79
Gold Member
The day gaming goes complete subscription only is the day I stop.
-
Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.
Microsoft wants to be the "Netflix of Gaming"
- Thread starter Mista
- Start date
LittleBusters
Banned
It's going to be amazing when xCloud trials begin. On Xbox, PC, iOS and Android.
RoyBrown7777
Member
Steaming games isn't an option where I live in Australia, so uh... Yeah. Honestly I just want consoles to go back to being about power and not any gimmick bullshit.
Last edited:
WaterAstro
Member
You're missing the point.
What are the greatest games of all time? Zelda? Mario? Metal Gear? World of Warcraft? Pre-13 Final Fantasy?
It's like if Netflix could never get Lord of the Rings or Shawshank Redemption, or the Marvel movies, but Netflix can. Microsoft can never get the greatest games of all time.
Swauny Jones
Member
Playstation Now doesn't work nowhere near as well as GamePass. Especially when you play the older titles. frame rate drops and lag plague the service. GamePass is just a smooth effortless process that runs great. Plus Playstation Now is more expensive than GamePass
Last edited:
FranXico
Member
Are you comparing downloads to streaming? That is such a dishonest comparison. Wait for xCloud to release and then you can compare that to PSNow streams.
Or compare PSNow downloads (which don't have network lag and work fine) to GamePass downloads.
Last edited:
Swauny Jones
Member
It's fair when you're comparing what you're getting dollar for dollar. I'm comparing the service based on functionality
DeepEnigma
Gold Member
PlayStation Now allows streaming, downloads for PS4 games just like GamePass, as well as you don't have to pay for Plus to play those games online.
It also has a much larger library overall.
Last edited:
Swauny Jones
Member
The bigger library is PS Nows saving grace when compared to GamePass. Like I have both passes. I just tend to use GamePass way more.
12Dannu123
Member
PSNow has no adoption from larger publishers. Game Pass has high adoption from publishers and studios, the reasoning is Microsoft paying them, but also the business model gives exposure to the game.
Last edited:
JustP_Gaming
Banned
Never say never. You should know this by now!
DeepEnigma
Gold Member
Yes they do. Some of the same games recently have been added to both services.
EverydayBeast
thinks Halo Infinite is a new graphical benchmark
I believe the way we play games isn’t going to be a crowning achievement in the gaming industry and that’s okay, there will be a time where Microsoft or Sony will have to make a decision on whether to abandon physical media altogether.
leo-j
Member
http://www.pushsquare.com/news/2018/11/playstation_now_is_the_biggest_gaming_subscription_service
Playstation now owns more than half of the game streaming market at the moment. They also have over 700 games ready to stream.
Which include the likes of SOME of the biggest PS3 GAMES during it's prime, like KILLZONE, UNCHARTED, LAST OF US, ETC.....
and sony let's you download all the ps4 and ps2 games available on the service. All they need to do is add more ps4 games and ps1 games, and make it available on tablets and boom.
Playstation now owns more than half of the game streaming market at the moment. They also have over 700 games ready to stream.
Which include the likes of SOME of the biggest PS3 GAMES during it's prime, like KILLZONE, UNCHARTED, LAST OF US, ETC.....
and sony let's you download all the ps4 and ps2 games available on the service. All they need to do is add more ps4 games and ps1 games, and make it available on tablets and boom.
Elenchus
Banned
This may be the silliest argument I’ve ever heard. The premise makes no sense since Netflix is missing plenty of great movies. And omitting Halo CE from that list of greatest games is an act of pure delusion. No streaming service has a complete set of every movie, song, game, etc.
Clear
CliffyB's Cock Holster
The point is fundamentally correct though, all Gamepass offers is an alternative way to access select Xbox content, a small-ish subset of the games scene as a whole. The problem is that we've already seen how the market responds to Xbox content, how reliant it is on 3rd-party support, and how geographically specific interest is in it.
*The* historic problem facing Xbox has always been lack of interest outside of English-speaking territories. Which is a very big deal considering how Europe and Asia are big, mature, markets. Gamepass does nothing to address this.
quickwhips
Member
Meta gear solid games are on Xbox. Lots of final fantasy are coming to Xbox. I think you upset for no reason. The best place toplay some those games on one console is Xbox one not ps4. As time goes on the best place to play final fantasy and metal gear will be Xbox through bc. Xbox has amazing games just like playstation. I’m sorry you haven’t played them.
Last edited:
Sid Of Bee
Member
They are in the best position. Out of the Big 3 (Nintendo, Sony, & MS) they are the most inclusive to various platforms. It's already started with cross Windows/Xbox play and purchases, Game Pass, and Backwards Compatibility. It won't be inherently streaming, it should work as Game Pass does now.... Downloads tied to the paid service. Netflix didn't have ANY exclusive content for the first few years of streaming. Microsoft actually has a good start and can continue to provide on that front. Third party matters most regardless. It may come down to that you choose Nintendo or Sony devices to play their exclusives, while Xbox is everything else plus whatever content they create. Honestly, as with all media.... It's inevitable. First music. Then movies. Then TV. Video games being next only makes sense. The old business models won't survive forever.... Not with today's youth.
tryDEATH
Member
MS has already positioned themselves perfectly for the Netflix approach. I have said this multiple times, but their games are positioned primarily as MP and GaaS so that gamers have a reason to keep on returning. Having a one and done experience doesn't suit the service, which is what Sony is doing with their 1st party games. Netflix isn't killing it with the movies it's the TV shows that are hooking people into the service that take tens of hours to completely finish and can be enjoyed in portions.
People were laughing and mocking SoT, but the game now is in a very good state so much so that it is one of the most popular games on Twitch something no one even remotely imaged and that is all due to the stream of content being added regularly that is filling up the game world.
The only thing they are missing now is a Destiny/Anthem/The Division like game that truly hooks its teeth into the consumer base and make GP a must have for any Xbox gamer.
People were laughing and mocking SoT, but the game now is in a very good state so much so that it is one of the most popular games on Twitch something no one even remotely imaged and that is all due to the stream of content being added regularly that is filling up the game world.
The only thing they are missing now is a Destiny/Anthem/The Division like game that truly hooks its teeth into the consumer base and make GP a must have for any Xbox gamer.
Elenchus
Banned
No it isn’t. There is no structural impediment to Gamepass’s continued growth and no reason it can’t continue to add to its library. People forget how Netflix’s library started because they have the memory of a knat.
As it stands now people look forward to hearing what’s bring added to Gamepass and a number of third party devs are jumping on board. Some games will not come because the publisher may want to start their own service but the library is growing at a healthy clip and the games are interesting and fresh.
In comparison, most of PS Now’s library is filled with hundreds of dead PS2 games no one cares about. Strip that away and you’ve got PS3 games you can’t download and a smattering of old PS4 games.
I have zero interest in PS Now but if find it adequate for your needs, more power to you friend. I am far more interested in MS’s plans for Gamepass.
12Dannu123
Member
How do you think Sony will do any better? They have the wrong games for the service, have lack critical infrastructure. These are massive problems that you can't get rid by simply by ignoring. Content is a small problem to solve compared to the ones mentioned.
Placing Sony's Single Player games on the PSNow will bankrupt Sony.
Last edited:
Kenpachii
Member
Lol nobody watches netflix here for there own shows. they watch it because they can see movies without commercials and whenever they want on demand without having to walk through hoops or buy physical solutions or rent for extreme amounts of money.
That they create some new content is just a bonus and nothing more.
Mattyp
Gold Member
Xbox has Metal Gear (My opinion Splinter Cell >>>> Anyway..) and with the amazing work they've been allowed to do with FF in backwards compatibility even getting the original cut scenes from Square Enix there's no doubt the HD remake for FF will come to xbox eventually to.
The thing is but, none of these ball busting massive sale third party games will be coming to any of these services on launch ever only years down the line. You need to line up the first party vs first party. Sony will never get Mario & Zelda, Nintendo will never get Halo & Forza, Microsoft will never get Uncharted and Spiderman. This is just a ridiculous argument to make.
And Netflix will shortly no doubt never be able to get the Marvel movies again.
Last edited:
petran79
Banned
You can if you have a cracked Steam dll and place it in your game folder.Had to do it with one game because Steam forced an update that broke some mods.
Snake29
RSI Employee of the Year
They do not have be the best. If they are just a good competition for Xbox then it's already great.
We are at the start with all these services, so everything will improve before next-gen arrives. They do not only have to offer multiplayer games, but games for everyone.
Tell me, have you so inside info? Have you looked inside their data center? You just sucking everything out of your thumb.
What massive problems? A source you might want to share with us?
This service also allows third party games, it's not Sony only games...
You really have no fucking idea what you are talking about, and i have said it a bunch of times in different threads.
--------------------------------------
Something else. Now that i also have a One X, it's funny to see people here talking about how Sony is lacking on the network/infrastructure side. But the funny thing is. The PS4 the only one that can deliver remoteplay over the internet since 2013 without using VPN or something. I've tested both inhouse and the streaming quality with the PS4 Pro is better even in local network then my One X. It's not that the One X streaming is bad but the quality overall when playing can be bad very quick compared to PS remoteplay.
I think a lot of people like to ignore that Sony already has a lot of experience with streaming on the console for years (since the PS3). And gamepass, it's a great service and i like to see Sony doing something similar (PSNow is already doing it), but i hope bigger. But some people are acting like gamepass is something new in tech....it's not. It's nothing more then what the Windows Store of PS Store already is, but with a subscription model on top of it....nothing more.
Another thing that has to do with network and infrastructure is remote download over gamepass or PSN. Gamepass games will not install most of the times remotely with the app. I have seen this several times now and it's really annoying. While with PS4 app, and the latest RE2 remake demo. It was just one click and the download was started on my PS4 Pro. I don't know of all off these things are bugs, but i have seen more problems from others. It's funny that this shit all network/infrastructure related (but but...PSN is bad and slow...haha yeah right).
Last edited:
CeeJay
Member
You obviously have a clear lack of understanding of how a global infrastructure works and how it is essential to execute a successful global streaming service. if you think that Sony are not woefully behind MS with their network infrastructure then you need to do some research. The Azure cloud is Microsoft's ace in the hole as far as their game streaming plans go. They can happily use the datacentres and add their own Xbox custom hardware such as Xbox based blades into the datacentre cabinets without having to worry about bleeding excessive profits to a third party. Just to put it into scale, Azure alone makes more revenue than all of Sony put together. There is no way that Sony can compete on a level ground toe to toe with Microsoft. Sony can use one of the big global clouds themselves but it would be as a third party customer along with the downside that come with it such as the usage cost eating into their profit margin. For Xbox it would be far cheaper and easier not least because they have the over arching CEO firmly behind the streaming plan.
Elenchus
Banned
PS Now is not just getting started. It’s five years old.
“We are at the start with these services”? Lol. You can’t have it both ways my friend. You can’t argue that PS Now is just getting started while simultaneously arguing that Sony has more experience with PS Now.
PS Now was announced in 2014 and was supposed to be on all devices. See below:
“The kind-of-fascinating news: all those games will be streamable to the PS4, PS3 and PS Vita as well as tablets and TVs, so Sony’s going wide (as it should). As House put it, the service will ‘introduce the world of PlayStation to a world of non-console owners, smartphones, TVs and other devices,’ noting that you’ll soon be able to ‘play your favorite PlayStation 3 games on a tablet.’ Sony’s demonstrating the technology on Sony Bravia TVs and Vita systems at its CES booth.”
http://techland.time.com/2014/01/07/sony-unveils-playstation-now-streaming-game-service-at-ces-2014/
In 2017, just 3 yrs later, Sony pulled the plug on its lofty promises. See below:
“On February 15, 2017, Sony announced that the discontinuation of the service across several devices such as PlayStation 3, PlayStation Vita, PlayStation TV, 2013-2015 Sony Bravia TV models, Sony Blu-ray player models, and Samsung TV models which took effect on August 15, 2017 with the 2016 Sony Bravia TV models compatibility discontinued on April 1, 2017.
On February 17, 2017, Sony announced it would discontinue PlayStation Now on PlayStation 3, PlayStation Vita, PlayStation TV, Sony Bravia televisions (modeled between 2013–15), Sony Blu-ray players and all Samsung televisions by August 15, 2017.”
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/PlayStation_Now
You are entitled to your own opinions but not your own facts. PS Now is not new. It’s 5 years old. It’s library is what it is. It’s availability on other devices is what it is. It’s failed reception is what it is.
Sony took its shot and missed. The industry has moved on and folks are looking to MS, Google, and Amazon for the future of game streaming.
I’m happy to give Sony credit for trying and failing and for providing everyone else with data on how not to do it but I can’t pretend with you that the potential for PS Now and Gamepass + Xcloud are the same. That clearly is not true.
Vawn
Banned
You couldn't be more wrong. Netflix spends billions on their own shows and movies that you can only see there.
CeeJay
Member
Did iPod copy Walkman because they are both music players? I don't think so, technology moves on...
It may be streaming but Microsoft are going at it with a significantly different and far more rounded plan with far greater investment. A services popularity lives and dies on its widespread appeal, Sony's PSNow simply doesn't have enough of it. It remains to be seen whether MS will fare any better I agree but comparing PSNow to what MS are planning is not apples to apples.
DForce
NaughtyDog Defense Force
"PS Now have been extremely successful this gen."
Looks like you're putting your own opinions into this discussion and trying to pass it off as a fact.
Streaming is still very young and it still hasn't taken off yet. The casual audience knows LITTLE about streaming and it could take years for it to get there.
As of right now, Sony is ahead of everyone. Sony could either stay on top of move down depending on how streaming services play out in the future. But here's the thing to remember. WE do not know how Sony is going to expand or even improve their streaming services. We know for a fact that's what they're doing, and automatically writing them off is something fanboys love to do on this group.
- Microsoft introduced payed online gaming to the market. If it wasn't for them we could still play online games on console without having to pay a monthly subscription.
- Microsoft introduced timed exclusives. Now we have to live with this cancer of having to wait month for content to be released for another console. The funny thing: despite saying they hate it, they did it again with PUBG.
- Microsoft has killed and ruined some of the best gaming studios in the industry including Rare, Mistwalker and Lionhead.
- If it went according to Microsoft's plan we wouldn't be able to resell or trade our games anymore.
- All the money Microsoft earned didn't benefit the industry at all. Nintendo and Sony at least invested into some of the industry defining games of this console generation. While Microsoft just sucks money out of the industry without reinvesting into it. All they do is releasing sequels for their existing games without innovating on them.
The only good thing Microsoft did was to humble Sony during the PS3 era. That being said, I'd still be fine with paying 500-600$ for a console if I didn't have to pay a monthly sub to play online.
DForce
NaughtyDog Defense Force
Last of Us, Uncharted 4, MLB The Show, GT Sports are multiplayer games Sony has created and they'll have another with Death Stranding and Last of Us Part II coming in the near future. They also have been rumored to be working on a multiplayer title, so it's like Sony is immune to creating multiplayer games.
Snake29
RSI Employee of the Year
I have, because MS Xbox division still have to pay it and they have to build the custom hardware. Both are 2 different divisions and Xbox division is just a costumer for the Azure division. Yes it will be cheaper for them but that doesn't say anything about the whole "Sony can never achive this globally", because that's just bullshit talk. Every other companies in the world that uses a lot of cloud tech, are using existing cloud providers. Why was it possible for Onlive or Gaikai, but not for Sony? Doesn't sound very logical ey?
I mean general
Again...i mean in general and i said "services".
This means that the rest of your post no longer applies.
Last edited:
Clear
CliffyB's Cock Holster
If you just look at the NPD results. Xbox looks reasonably competitive with, although still in third place to Nintendo and Sony. If you look at the global picture it isn't nearly so close. The assumption that an Xbox branded service is going to prove more appealing in those territories than Xbox branded hardware is illogical.
Content is everything, especially when talking about services that are virtual like streaming. If that content isn't appealing in a certain market, no amount of infrastructural superiority will save it.
Most of all though, content is not an "easy" problem to solve. Games take a long time to make, far longer than movies and TV shows, so its inevitable that back-catalogue product will be the mainstay for years to come. Once again, MS are in the weakest position in this regard in having the shortest history and least regionally diverse portfolio to draw upon.
Sony don't need to put their first-party flagship titles on PS Now, its ongoing operation and growth is proof of that, as is the massive success those titles are having in drawing people to their brand. But if they felt they needed to, they could do so at any time.
In future the entire PS4 catalogue could be made available to stream; they have the capability already. That catalogue has empirically more value than the Xbone catalogue judging on global market performance, and as such is one hell of a card to play should they see fit to do so.
Last edited:
CeeJay
Member
How is it bullshit?
Satya sits over both Azure and Xbox, he is fully behind this and openly talking about it on a regular basis. Do you really think that Xbox will still be treated as any other normal third party customer with regard to their use of the Azure cloud infrastructure when the direction of travel for the entire company is moving in harmony with the plan? of course Xbox will be given a huge competitive edge over any competition that doesn't own their own global infrastructure. I don't know why you are quoting "Sony can never achive this globally" as that is not what I said. I said that "There is no way that Sony can compete on a level ground toe to toe with Microsoft." I stand by this.
If Sony and Xbox get into a race to the bottom price war then Xbox will be able to afford to go much lower than Sony and still make profit.
If both Amazon and Google enter the game streaming market then it leaves Sony having to compete in the same market directly against a company that owns the cloud infrastructure that they are relying on for their service.
Also, What have Onlive and Gakai got to do with it, neither exist any longer because they failed to gain a financially sustainable foothold in a fledgling market and got swallowed by bigger fish. They were hardly a bastion of success to support your argument.
WaterAstro
Member
Netflix is a platform that already HAS a ton of great movies and CAN have all the movies. Movies aren't limited to a single platform. Video game is. Xbox will never get Sony, Microsoft, and PC exclusives unless they recreate those games on the Xbox platform. Good luck with that even if they get approval and license.
If I didn't make my analogy any clearer, here's another one more emphasized on the disparity of Netflix and Game Pass.
Let's say the upcoming The Last of Us Part 2 is like Avengers 5. Imagine if Netflix wasn't going to get Avengers 5. Netflix would already be lacking missing out this one movie that everyone is looking forward to.
But Netflix has the Marvel movies, Black Panther, Spiderman, Infinity War, and all other great movies of last year. Imagine if Netflix didn't have any of them. That's Game Pass.
And that's because Game Pass will never get God of War, Spiderman, Detroit, Yakuza, Astrobot, Dragon Quest, Tetris Effect, Pokemon, or Smash Bros.
Heck, it doesn't even have Red Dead Redemption 2 right now, much less Grand Theft Auto V.
Game Pass can't be the Netflix of gaming when it's going to miss out on all the best games of every year.
How much are they investing in XCloud? How is their technology different? What are they doing differently? Once you can actually answer these questions we can have a proper discussion instead of a circlejerk.
Snake29
RSI Employee of the Year
I don't think he will ever have the answer. Why? because at the end everyone gets a stream in front of them with controller input, sound and voice chat capabilities.
People really think xCloud is some science fiction shit.......
Last edited:
CeeJay
Member
I don't know how much they have invested but the answers to your other questions are already common knowledge, search Xcloud Outatime.
Like my reference about Walkman to iPod, both doing the same thing but one is most definitely not like the other.
Elenchus
Banned
No. Looks like you are trying to pass off PSN digital game sales as proof of a significant increase in PS Now subscriptions.
That chart you posted is irrelevant to this discussion. The unsupported claim that "PS Now have been extremely successful this gen” also offers no proof of a significant increase in PS Now subscriptions.
If there is some hard data to support that tweet, let’s see it. Otherwise, the wholesale removal of PS Now from all of the devices it was pitched for, including a number of Sony televisions and gaming devices, strongly supports the general view that the sales were poor.
Businesses that are succeeding tend to expand operations rather than constrict them. Sony is not in the lead of anything. They weren’t the first to try streaming and they clearly are not equipped to be the best at it for obvious reasons already explained by others here.
Vawn
Banned
PS Now surpassed 70 million subscriptions accounting for 52% of all gaming subscription services. I just posted those links on this page.
I looked at the research paper on outatime. Nothing suggests it's being used in xCloud, frankly I don't see it being used either. You would be compensating latency for bandwidth and would require hardware to render multiples of frames transmitting them and the user (thin client) throwing away unused ones. This would severaly increase bandwidth required (talking multiple times more bandwidth required) and very severaly increase rendering power required at the server (to render these unused frames) . The single windowsCentral article that mentions xCloud and that research paper together is as wishful as you are.
I doubt they have 70 million PS Now subscribes. Unless that's a typo.
DForce
NaughtyDog Defense Force
Looks like you're trying to pass off your opinions as proof with literally no support whatsoever. PS Now is contributing to the success of Sony, but you're trying to claim it's a failure.
Unless you have data to support the fact that it's a failure, then do it.
They're the main ones offering streaming services, so do you have any proof that they cannot improve? Or you're just spreading the same claims that other fanboys are doing on here without knowing what Sony has planned in the future?
I need 1) Sony is not and cannot improve PS Now and 2) Proof that PS Now is a failure.
Edit:
That's not how it works. It's going to take years for streaming to be the norm in gaming, which is why the causal market will adapt slowly. That's how streaming is going to work. They will most certainly push next gen even harder when companies really start to compete.
I would clearly take his word over the market than yours as you have a proven to be bias.
Last edited:
Elenchus
Banned
You need to read beyond the headline. The article is about PSN—not PS Now.
Headline is inaccurate. The article states as follows:
“The PlayStation Network now has 70 million monthly ‘active’ users, Sony has disclosed.
Sony revealed the new figure as part of its latest Corporate Strategy Meeting for FY2017, which was released today [PDF]. A slide (below) shows the 70 million number, but does not mention how Sony defines what it means to be ‘active’ or when the number was reached. It likely covers at leastPlayStation 4, PlayStation 3, and PlayStation Vita.”
Sorry buddy. Back to the Google search bar huh?
LittleBusters
Banned
PS Now is in game streaming where smartphones were in May 2007. Read into that what you will. Microsoft is about to revolutionize game streaming.