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[Shmunter]

Despite their different "brand names" there's no secret sauce in texture compression - I wouldn't expect either of MS or Sony's solutions to give better compression than the other given the same data (+/- 10%)

Both gave compression to data ratios of roughy 2x improvment - I'd expect that to be real world.

It just shifts Sony's 2.x times SSD advantage to higher numbers .. same ratio.

Both systems have hardware accelerated decompression too - but there's not enough info to say if one is better than the other (in terms of speed) .. I'd expect them to be similar in performance, though maybe Sony's would be beefier inline with the higher SSD throughput they are expecting..

From Cerney talk I think he mentions their custom decompression chip is equivalent of 9 x Zen2 cores to decompress Kraken at their SSD speed. Seems high so I may be mis-remembering, will need to watch video for a 4th time, lol.

Is xbox compression limited to textures only, or do they indeed have holistic storage compression? What's it called???

 

[Bo_Hazem]

I am not sure if this has already been talked about earlier but since I have not seen it I will post it here. There is a LOT of information so I have put it in pictures.

The following information is taken from ”Moore’s law is dead” youtube channel and specially from his comment section where he talks more indepth what third party developer have told him and his personal analysis.

The comments come from several diffrent videos. Important to know is that his sources are all third party developers and he has inside information om both consoles.

Leaked images and info:


His Info from comment sections:

Just wow! Can't wait to see all the action and juicy comparisons in the near future! Thanks a lot for the great effort to collect all that data.

 

[Deleted member 775630]

Halo’s co-creator says PS5’s SSD tech ‘will make a huge difference’ for designers | VGC

“It will open up the door for more expansive content”…

www.videogameschronicle.com

The PS5 SSD might be a true game changer. Exciting times ahead.

That article title

 

[psorcerer]

Thank you. So we can safely assume 2x raw is the ballpark figure.

Here we have some benchmarks at the bottom.
Essentially Kraken is ~3x on a typical mix of game BCn texture data. And that's without RDO.

 

[rntongo]

Doesn't sound at all like the PS5 solution. No DMA and GPU cache scrubbers is mentioned, which is a corner stone of the performance.

XSX has a DMA Controller as well. But it goes to the CPU. According to a dev working on the machine. We’ll be finding out more in the coming weeks.

 

[Shmunter]

Here we have some benchmarks at the bottom.
Essentially Kraken is ~3x on a typical mix of game BCn texture data. And that's without RDO.

That’s quite the low ball by Sony. Humble Sony is back

 

[rntongo]

4.8GB/s is a peak figure for bcpack Texture compression, if only textures were being streamed which won't always be the case

Too many variables, too little data to draw that conclusion, for instance on the R/W test the advantage of the fastest drive jumped to 780% it depends how well a drive handles random reads, the drive you mentioned took a disproportionate hit for instance. Depends of how frequently games need to stream random data and how devs package data on the install.

PS5 I/O has fine grained modifications to minimize the impact of random reads and Cerny gave a typical in game performance metric of 8-9GB/s which accounts for random reads in gaming.

XSX has compressed SSD speeds of between 4-6GB/s. If we’re to consider which one would result from higher compression ratio for texture data(BCPack), then its the 6GB/s.

 

[Lunatic_Gamer]

“PlayStation chief Jim Ryan has stressed that the PS5 launch should be simultaneous around the globe, according to people in the company’s supply chain,” the website reports.

PS5's Launch Aiming to Be Simultaneous Worldwide

Jim Ryan has apparently requested it

www.pushsquare.com

 

[psorcerer]

That’s quite the low ball by Sony. Humble Sony is back

I still think Sony is giving us real random read numbers. I.e. an average speed of a gather operation on a data in flash memory.
Then it makes a lot of sense.

 

[Shmunter]

This thread is funny, all I see is PS fans high-fiving each other and talking about "Xbox fanboys" and there is no one like that even few pages back. It's really funny to see : D

Yet here you are, Buzz Killington

 

[llien]

True software based RT is far too slow and too much of a resource hog to be used in consoles outside cut scenes.

Well, arguable, to put it softly:



As for "true" RT: it is a fallacy.
We are at least decade away from zero-rasterization runtime full frame ray tracing (and I'm being very optimistic here).
All the crap we have at the moment is lot's of noise blurred out for some shadows and reflections.

 

[M1chl]

Yet here you are, Buzz Killington

I am not saying I am not, I feel the need to break the combo : D

 

[PocoJoe]

many Xbox fanboys reminds me of Apple fanboys, and both have made me dislike their products more than I would dislike them without their collective madness.

Similar deal with both groups, downplaying competitors, exaggerating their features/specs, lying, being emotional, having no real knowledge yet they believe some "tim doggo" if it suits their agenda, being super defensive and have delusions that everything is some kind of great war aka "talk about PS5 specs -> lol defending sony!! xsex is stronger!!". And all the other shit and drama and stubbornness

Like these theories similar to "so one CU of PS5 is the tempest engine!" while it makes no sense and Cerny kind of said it so that it is separate module, not one of GPUs CUs. Or "lol only 100 ps4 games will work!" when it was never said like that.

Talking to them is like talking to religious persons, while it is 100% clear that they are wrong, delusional and making things up from their imagination, it is not possible to talk sense to them as they repeat their faulty logical circle of "god is real because book said it, book is real because god wrote it!" Tim doggo is real because twitter said it, xbox is this and that because tim doggo said it

Dunno if it is because of American companies(as Americans seems to have really different mentality + culture than rest of the world). as worst fanboys I have encountered are xbox+apple+MS and probably the old "amercian cars are best, import cars are shit" wars too, which sounds ridiculous from non-american standpoint as Japanese cars are one of the best and reliable cars on the planet, they just dont drink petrol like a drunkard and arent 4x the size that regular person really needs.

And in the end any of this madness doesn't even matter as casuals wont give a rats ass about specs or great console wars, they just buy what is popular + what games are popular/they like.

There are of course Sony fanboys too, but imo they almost always try to backup their words with facts and what have been officially released, or speculated based on what is technically possible.



Current gen graphics are already passed the limit of being good enough, so I dont think that next gen will be about graphics as much as before, it could be much more about other features, like what SSD / audio + much stronger CPUs can offer, about VR and whatever new they can bake.

Imo it is already kind of boring as games are chacing real life like graphics, I dont want to be in life 2.0, I want to be in fantasy worlds that leave room for imagination to fill the caps. Like reading a book gives much better "special effects" than movies ever can, as imagination is stronger tool.

At 2027 whom still remembers this "lol 12 vs 10 tflops", probably just tim doggo and his cult, rest are just playing and getting ready for waiting release of PS6 vs Xbox series 6 or whatever it is called

 

[BattleScar]

Well, last gen TVs are indeed 1080p, so it would make more than perfect sense. I dunno why people come up with 1440p every now and then when talking about consoles, when they are more than fully aware 1440p doesn't exist on TV market... QHD is roughly 80% more pixels than FHD, so more GPU power and possibly memory/bandwidth required, while the visible difference would be close to none, on a device that's suppose to be as cheap as possible. If anything, I'd expect 720p, if not even 540p with AI upscalling, to use as tiny (cheap) GPU as possible.



This might be it:

An Xbox Game Studio Is Experimenting with Shipping Low-Res Textures To Be AI-Upscaled in Real Time

One of the Xbox Game Studios is experimenting with Machine Learning to ship low-res textures that are then upscaled in real time with AI.

wccftech.com

If MS could actually incorporate AI upscaling on top of BCP in actual games, that could mean they have much less data (GB) to transfer.

This has nothing to do with texture compression. Its using lower-resolution textures (and therefore smaller texture file sizes) and then AI-upscaling them in-game.

 

[scie]

[...]Japanese cars are one of the best and reliable cars on the planet[...]

As a German, I have to disagree with that

 

[Shmunter]

As a German, I have to disagree with that

As a an owner of 2 BMW’s and a Mercedes, I have to disagree with you on the reliability part.

 

[ZywyPL]

This has nothing to do with texture compression. Its using lower-resolution textures (and therefore smaller texture file sizes) and then AI-upscaling them in-game.

With compression per se, no, but it has everything to do with the subject, because if MS could let's say use 2GB of textures instead of 8GB, that means the time required to stream them into RAM is cut by 3/4ths. So with let's say 4GB/s bandwidth the former would need half a sec and the letter two seconds to do the job, that's a drastic difference. Will they actually pull that out tho, that's the question.

 

[Shmunter]

With compression per so, no, but it has everything to do with the subject, because if MS could let's say use 2GB of textures instead of 8GB, that means the time required to stream them into RAM is cut by 3/4ths. So with let's say 4GB/s bandwidth the former would need half a sec and the letter two seconds to do the job, that's a drastic difference. Will they actually pull that out tho, that's the question.

I support such out of the box approaches. Bring it!

 

[sonomamashine]

As a an owner of 2 BMW’s and a Mercedes, I have to disagree with you on the reliability part.

Can you share with us the models you have (which year)

 

[Thirty7ven]

This has nothing to do with texture compression. Its using lower-resolution textures (and therefore smaller texture file sizes) and then AI-upscaling them in-game.

It’s an algorithm, soon enough those kind of solutions will become standard going forward if they prove superior to whatever alternatives developers come up with.

As the gen goes by, big studios will go more and more to the metal on these systems. As far as I understand all these codenames related to API features will become less and less relevant as we get deeper into next gen.

It’s worth considering also that so much effort being put into these debates as if these consoles will be going h2h for the next 8 years when we know that 3 or 4 years in there will be midgen refreshes and then all of the sudden it’s like the PS5 and the XSX never existed. Look at digital foundry or any thread of the like, it’s like the Xbox One never existed...

 

[Shmunter]

Can you share with us the models you have (which year)

M6 2007
X5 50i 2016
ML 350 CDI 2013

The v10 M6 is a fucking drug. The X5 is pretty beefy for a SUV btw. But, that’s all unrelated to reliability.

 

[sonomamashine]

M6 2007
X5 50i 2016
ML 350 CDI 2013

The v10 M6 is a fucking drug. The X5 is pretty beefy for a SUV btw. But, that’s all unrelated to reliability.

The X5 is the best imo.

 

[hardseppo]

Thing 1 and Thing 2 are starting to make the rounds into certain articles....

LOL

This is the dude Phil tells all his secrets to?

"Dont respond to greeny like that."

"You droolz." LMFAO Is this dude in 2nd grade?

Someone want to explain who "we" is? lmfao

That Timdog sounds like a resonable man

 

[BluRayHiDef]

From Cerney talk I think he mentions their custom decompression chip is equivalent of 9 x Zen2 cores to decompress Kraken at their SSD speed. Seems high so I may be mis-remembering, will need to watch video for a 4th time, lol.

Is xbox compression limited to textures only, or do they indeed have holistic storage compression? What's it called???

So, in addition to the eight Zen2 cores in the CPU, the PS5 figuratively has 9 more Zen2 cores, which means that it has the processing power of seventeen Zen2 cores?

 

[PaintTinJr]

Here we have some benchmarks at the bottom.
Essentially Kraken is ~3x on a typical mix of game BCn texture data. And that's without RDO.

I only skim read that, but am I right in assuming the raw source data is long RGBA32 format- because they are talking about jpeg/dds/dxt1 ? Just with all the TFLOP-ing compute in the XsX/PS5 it seems outdated if it isn’t looking at float based textures or vertex data. Especially as lossless compression works better on more intricate data such as higher precision floats. From what I read it doesn’t seem like a very graphics API or console platform agnostic analysis that is entirely suited to the future of RT/path tracing.

As for the don’t z-lib compress jpegs advice in the link, I’m not sure how valid that would be if you had two co-processors in your IO complex. One that might be able to transform inbound data by blending or scrambling data files to an order that would compress optimally (with z-lib); and the other co-processor to disentangle/descramble the data once it has been decompressed – or at least that’s how I would be doing it if committing to a hardware solution.

 

[xool]

I only skim read that, but am I right in assuming the raw source data is long RGBA32 format- because they are talking about jpeg/dds/dxt1 ? Just with all the TFLOP-ing compute in the XsX/PS5 it seems outdated if it isn’t looking at float based textures or vertex data. Especially as lossless compression works better on more intricate data such as higher precision floats. From what I read it doesn’t seem like a very graphics API or console platform agnostic analysis that is entirely suited to the future of RT/path tracing.

As for the don’t z-lib compress jpegs advice in the link, I’m not sure how valid that would be if you had two co-processors in your IO complex. One that might be able to transform inbound data by blending or scrambling data files to an order that would compress optimally (with z-lib); and the other co-processor to disentangle/descramble the data once it has been decompressed – or at least that’s how I would be doing it if committing to a hardware solution.

JPEGS are already compressed with a Huffman encoding after the lossy bit -- applying zlib to that wouldn't give much more compression. PNG uses zlib to compress though...

About floats - those 8 bit primarys (8red,8green,8blue) usually represent albedo - roughly 0-100% in 0.4% steps . that accuracy mostly exceeds the smallest differences the eye can see. With a good monitor you can see this on 0-255 greyscales - the grey scale is continuous with no steps (with a bad monitor the monitor itself will show banding) Possibly tech could go a little higher (like 10 bit) to avoid some some minor issues. When the scene is lit those 0-100% values multiply with a float light intensity to give floating point light vaues anyway/

tldr - I don't think anyone needs more than 24/32bit RGB/RGBA color - but maybe there's special cases.

[edit] RGBA32 is pretty much a standard for working with color images - most computer image libraries will support that format. They may also go higher to avoid errors when processing, but for tranmission 24/32 bit is plenty - This section is actually quite good explanation. The next section explains when higher accuracy is used https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Color_depth#True_color_(24-bit)

[edit2] For light sources "we" are already using a float format -there's a couple variatns but a common one is RGBE (there's also a 7e3 format which is different but similar)

 

[Thirty7ven]

So, in addition to the eight Zen2 cores in the CPU, the PS5 figuratively has 9 more Zen2 cores, which means that it has the processing power of seventeen Zen2 cores?

Context is key, let's not get it twisted. But if in this context XSX relies more on its cpu than the PS5 then that will impact relative performance.

 

[Shmunter]

So, in addition to the eight Zen2 cores in the CPU, the PS5 figuratively has 9 more Zen2 cores, which means that it has the processing power of seventeen Zen2 cores?

Figuratively, The I/o wouldn’t be general computing in nature. Obviously only good at I/o related tasks.

 

[Neo Blaster]

“PlayStation chief Jim Ryan has stressed that the PS5 launch should be simultaneous around the globe, according to people in the company’s supply chain,” the website reports.

PS5's Launch Aiming to Be Simultaneous Worldwide

Jim Ryan has apparently requested it

www.pushsquare.com

A simultaneous worldwide launch would demand production to begin much earlier than last time, considering manufacturing and distribution constraints due to the pandemic. There's no way Sony can go past May without spilling all the beans about PS5.

 

[nosseman]

From Cerney talk I think he mentions their custom decompression chip is equivalent of 9 x Zen2 cores to decompress Kraken at their SSD speed. Seems high so I may be mis-remembering, will need to watch video for a 4th time, lol.

Is xbox compression limited to textures only, or do they indeed have holistic storage compression? What's it called???

No need to wathc it - here it is transcribed:

Transcribe - The Road to PS5 - Mark Cerny's a deep dive into the PlayStation 5 - - The Road to Next Gen Ludens

Thank you Jim. There will be lots of chances later on this year to look at the PlayStation 5 games.Today I want to talk a bit about our goals for the PlayStation 5 hardware and how they influenced the development of the console.

playstationvr.hateblo.jp

Also - saying their custom ASIC for decompressing is like 9 Zen 2 cores is a bit misleading.

This ASIC is good for one thing.

 

[TLZ]

many Xbox fanboys reminds me of Apple fanboys, and both have made me dislike their products more than I would dislike them without their collective madness.

Similar deal with both groups, downplaying competitors, exaggerating their features/specs, lying, being emotional, having no real knowledge yet they believe some "tim doggo" if it suits their agenda, being super defensive and have delusions that everything is some kind of great war aka "talk about PS5 specs -> lol defending sony!! xsex is stronger!!". And all the other shit and drama and stubbornness

Like these theories similar to "so one CU of PS5 is the tempest engine!" while it makes no sense and Cerny kind of said it so that it is separate module, not one of GPUs CUs. Or "lol only 100 ps4 games will work!" when it was never said like that.

Talking to them is like talking to religious persons, while it is 100% clear that they are wrong, delusional and making things up from their imagination, it is not possible to talk sense to them as they repeat their faulty logical circle of "god is real because book said it, book is real because god wrote it!" Tim doggo is real because twitter said it, xbox is this and that because tim doggo said it

Dunno if it is because of American companies(as Americans seems to have really different mentality + culture than rest of the world). as worst fanboys I have encountered are xbox+apple+MS and probably the old "amercian cars are best, import cars are shit" wars too, which sounds ridiculous from non-american standpoint as Japanese cars are one of the best and reliable cars on the planet, they just dont drink petrol like a drunkard and arent 4x the size that regular person really needs.

And in the end any of this madness doesn't even matter as casuals wont give a rats ass about specs or great console wars, they just buy what is popular + what games are popular/they like.

There are of course Sony fanboys too, but imo they almost always try to backup their words with facts and what have been officially released, or speculated based on what is technically possible.



Current gen graphics are already passed the limit of being good enough, so I dont think that next gen will be about graphics as much as before, it could be much more about other features, like what SSD / audio + much stronger CPUs can offer, about VR and whatever new they can bake.

Imo it is already kind of boring as games are chacing real life like graphics, I dont want to be in life 2.0, I want to be in fantasy worlds that leave room for imagination to fill the caps. Like reading a book gives much better "special effects" than movies ever can, as imagination is stronger tool.

At 2027 whom still remembers this "lol 12 vs 10 tflops", probably just tim doggo and his cult, rest are just playing and getting ready for waiting release of PS6 vs Xbox series 6 or whatever it is called

Why do you always like to drag religion into this? You're going to open a whole other unnecessary conversation that doesn't belong in this thread.

 

[Physiognomonics]

No need to wathc it - here it is transcribed:

Transcribe - The Road to PS5 - Mark Cerny's a deep dive into the PlayStation 5 - - The Road to Next Gen Ludens

Thank you Jim. There will be lots of chances later on this year to look at the PlayStation 5 games.Today I want to talk a bit about our goals for the PlayStation 5 hardware and how they influenced the development of the console.

playstationvr.hateblo.jp

Also - saying their custom ASIC for decompressing is like 9 Zen 2 cores is a bit misleading.

This ASIC is good for one thing.

It's not. They would need 9 Zen 2 cores to do the same job. And another 1 or 2 cores in order to do the job of the DMA.

 

[nosseman]

It's not. They would need 9 Zen 2 cores to do the same job. And another 1 or 2 cores in order to do the job of the DMA.

Misleading in the sense that it leads to this:

So, in addition to the eight Zen2 cores in the CPU, the PS5 figuratively has 9 more Zen2 cores, which means that it has the processing power of seventeen Zen2 cores?

 

[Thedtrain]

M6 2007
X5 50i 2016
ML 350 CDI 2013

The v10 M6 is a fucking drug. The X5 is pretty beefy for a SUV btw. But, that’s all unrelated to reliability.

I have a 2016 x5 50i also. Holy hell I love that engine. An SUV has no right to hustle like it does with a bm3 tune.

 

[Darius87]

Also - saying their custom ASIC for decompressing is like 9 Zen 2 cores is a bit misleading.

This ASIC is good for one thing.

no one is saying that you need to read more carefully.

 

[kareemna]

Wasnt the X4 roasted by Top Gear UK against the Land Rover?

 

[Shmunter]

I have a 2016 x5 50i also. Holy hell I love that engine. An SUV has no right to hustle like it does with a bm3 tune.

Have been thinking about the bm3 but read it doesn’t increase throttle response?

 

[icerock]

Just the thought that this guy could be someone's coworker sends shivers down my spine... The problem lies with Microsoft or some of the people at Microsoft endorsing this guy.

Anyway, the way this person behaves is really a combination of histrionic and narcissistic personality disorders. Both medical disorders. There is not a person in this world who can convince me this individual is a sane one.

Indeed, it is not normal behavior. That guy needs a shrink and a rehab center.

“PlayStation chief Jim Ryan has stressed that the PS5 launch should be simultaneous around the globe, according to people in the company’s supply chain,” the website reports.

PS5's Launch Aiming to Be Simultaneous Worldwide

Jim Ryan has apparently requested it

www.pushsquare.com

This is quite old no? He's been pretty consistent on it. Wouldn't surprise me if MS allocate more units for NA at launch, just to repeat the 2013 holiday timeline. It's been donkey years since they scored a win in NPD, it's long overdue.

 

[Thedtrain]

Have been thinking about the bm3 but read it doesn’t increase throttle response?

That parts true...I’ve always just attributed it to turbo lag and lived with it.

 

[BluRayHiDef]

Figuratively, The I/o wouldn’t be general computing in nature. Obviously only good at I/o related tasks.

Well, I know that its purpose is very specific; however, I had raw processing power in mind, regardless of how it's used.

 

[DaGwaphics]

many Xbox fanboys reminds me of Apple fanboys, and both have made me dislike their products more than I would dislike them without their collective madness.

Similar deal with both groups, downplaying competitors, exaggerating their features/specs, lying, being emotional, having no real knowledge yet they believe some "tim doggo" if it suits their agenda, being super defensive and have delusions that everything is some kind of great war aka "talk about PS5 specs -> lol defending sony!! xsex is stronger!!". And all the other shit and drama and stubbornness

Like these theories similar to "so one CU of PS5 is the tempest engine!" while it makes no sense and Cerny kind of said it so that it is separate module, not one of GPUs CUs. Or "lol only 100 ps4 games will work!" when it was never said like that.

Talking to them is like talking to religious persons, while it is 100% clear that they are wrong, delusional and making things up from their imagination, it is not possible to talk sense to them as they repeat their faulty logical circle of "god is real because book said it, book is real because god wrote it!" Tim doggo is real because twitter said it, xbox is this and that because tim doggo said it

Dunno if it is because of American companies(as Americans seems to have really different mentality + culture than rest of the world). as worst fanboys I have encountered are xbox+apple+MS and probably the old "amercian cars are best, import cars are shit" wars too, which sounds ridiculous from non-american standpoint as Japanese cars are one of the best and reliable cars on the planet, they just dont drink petrol like a drunkard and arent 4x the size that regular person really needs.

And in the end any of this madness doesn't even matter as casuals wont give a rats ass about specs or great console wars, they just buy what is popular + what games are popular/they like.

There are of course Sony fanboys too, but imo they almost always try to backup their words with facts and what have been officially released, or speculated based on what is technically possible.



Current gen graphics are already passed the limit of being good enough, so I dont think that next gen will be about graphics as much as before, it could be much more about other features, like what SSD / audio + much stronger CPUs can offer, about VR and whatever new they can bake.

Imo it is already kind of boring as games are chacing real life like graphics, I dont want to be in life 2.0, I want to be in fantasy worlds that leave room for imagination to fill the caps. Like reading a book gives much better "special effects" than movies ever can, as imagination is stronger tool.

At 2027 whom still remembers this "lol 12 vs 10 tflops", probably just tim doggo and his cult, rest are just playing and getting ready for waiting release of PS6 vs Xbox series 6 or whatever it is called

This is a speculation thread, not for your personal reflection in regards to how others see you and feel when they interact with you. Tim dogg not return your calls, you seem hung up on him?

 

[PaintTinJr]

JPEGS are already compressed with a Huffman encoding after the lossy bit -- applying zlib to that wouldn't give much more compression. PNG uses zlib to compress though...

About floats - those 8 bit primarys (8red,8green,8blue) usually represent albedo - roughly 0-100% in 0.4% steps . that accuracy mostly exceeds the smallest differences the eye can see. With a good monitor you can see this on 0-255 greyscales - the grey scale is continuous with no steps (with a bad monitor the monitor itself will show banding) Possibly tech could go a little higher (like 10 bit) to avoid some some minor issues. When the scene is lit those 0-100% values multiply with a float light intensity to give floating point light vaues anyway/

tldr - I don't think anyone needs more than 24/32bit RGB/RGBA color - but maybe there's special cases.

[edit] RGBA32 is pretty much a standard for working with color images - most computer image libraries will support that format. They may also go higher to avoid errors when processing, but for tranmission 24/32 bit is plenty - This section is actually quite good explanation. The next section explains when higher accuracy is used https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Color_depth#True_color_(24-bit)

[edit2] For light sources "we" are already using a float format -there's a couple variatns but a common one is RGBE (there's also a 7e3 format which is different but similar)

I'm not sure your comment about JPEG contradicts the point I was trying to make. Yes, JPEG and zlib share techniques making zlib ineffective on a JPEG, but those same ones and zeros after transformation are only a JPEG in abstraction – by knowing the means to transform the sequence back to its JPEG order – and on the abstract JPEG zlib could be made to be very effect. It is a trade off of compute to reduce storage space and storage bandwidth.

As for RGBA32 being good enough for game textures, in TV terms I would point to 1080p/4K with HDR being the defacto cheap TV spec available now (or by the time XsX/PS5 are mainstream selling in the west) and point to Rec.709, Rec.2020 at 450nits upwards. But that simplifies the precision issue to final output. Many things require far more precision in a simulation before the downsampling to final output. I think the need to do more with half floats and float textures – in place of byte component ones – will be a characteristic of this coming generation; especially if RT makes its mark.

 

[nosseman]

Well, I know that its purpose is very specific; however, I had raw processing power in mind, regardless of how it's used.

Add a couple of hundred cores more then. The work that the GPU does will take many CPU cores to run in "software".

 

[3liteDragon]

Considering it’s low CU count compared to the Series X, I really wanna see PS5’s ray-tracing capabilities in action, which I hope they do show off during the reveal. I wanna see how far it can actually go while running a game at native 4K 60FPS. (Especially after hearing what Moore’s Law is Dead said)

 

[xHunter]

Do we know if any of the next gen consoles support downsampling? I usually play on my pc monitor and i dont really plan on buying a 4k monitor soon, im wondering if sony or microsoft confirmed downsampling?

 

[DaGwaphics]

Do we know if any of the next gen consoles support downsampling? I usually play on my pc monitor and i dont really plan on buying a 4k monitor soon, im wondering if sony or microsoft confirmed downsampling?

It would be crazy not to support supersampling to lower resolutions. Too many 1080p sets, maybe even a few smaller 720p units out there.

 

[xHunter]

It would be crazy not to support supersampling to lower resolutions. Too many 1080p sets, maybe even a few smaller 720p units out there.

yeah and i wasnt sure if ps4 pro or the one x already support it, so i figured i would ask if someone already talked about it.

 

[Darius87]

Considering it’s low CU count compared to the Series X, I really wanna see PS5’s ray-tracing capabilities in action, which I hope they do show off during the reveal. I wanna see how far it can actually go while running a game at native 4K 60FPS. (Especially after hearing what Moore’s Law is Dead said)

i've wonder if ps5 could do audio, gi, shadows and reflections at same time? or its just combinations of them but not all of them ar given frame? cerny mentioned that he saw game runing with RT reflections with moderate penalty on gpu, moderate is about 10% - 20%? that would be high just for reflections but not every frame you need to calculate reflections so it's more dynamic i guess.

 

[PaintTinJr]

i've wonder if ps5 could do audio, gi, shadows and reflections at same time? or its just combinations of them but not all of them ar given frame? cerny mentioned that he saw game runing with RT reflections with moderate penalty on gpu, moderate is about 10% - 20%? that would be high just for reflections but not every frame you need to calculate reflections so it's more dynamic i guess.

I think he meant indirect lighting (multi-bounce even off of largely non specular items that create soft shadows) when he said reflections, so that would be every frame, if that’s what he meant.

 

[Thirty7ven]

Anybody expecting extensive use of Ray Tracing in 4k60, AAA games are delusional. Keeps your expectations in check.