OmegaSupreme
advanced basic bitch
Can I play youtube? Can I press buttons and make the character do things?
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Next gen should every game have an easy mode?
- Thread starter Hostile_18
- Start date
- Opinion
The Bloody-Nine
Member
Explain how you can make something like Dark Souls easier? Extra lives will make no difference because you already have unlimited lives. A large portion of the difficulty stems from the level design (the two examples I already named, primarily). Without redesigning those areas, how can you make it easier?
RedVIper
Banned
Sure dude grab a controller and you can pretend you're playing the game.
OmegaSupreme
advanced basic bitch
So this is a Dark Souls thread exclusively then? Oh, I didn't see that. Easy. Make the enemies easier to kill. See how hard that was?
Hostile_18
Banned
As mentioned a few posts up watching something isnt the same as playing it.
Would you really rather someone not play a game you enjoy because they find it too difficult than letting them play the way they want to?
Hostile_18
Banned
Exactly and what "elite" players dont realize is an easy mode for some people is the equivalent of normal mode for them.
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The Bloody-Nine
Member
Are you intentionally being dense? The thread title says 'EVERY GAME'. That includes Souls games. No one said anything about the thread being exclusively anything.
And I just said the difficulty stems from the level design. Making the enemies easier to kill is completely irrelevant. You are dreadful at this.
OmegaSupreme
advanced basic bitch
Here let me give you guys an example. I love the lore and design of Bloodborne. The game kicked my ass fairly quickly, however. I'm a man of limited free time so I dropped it. I won't get to see all those cool bosses and environments despite enjoying playing the game. So give me an easy mode to make it a little less deadly and it hurts no one and only increases my enjoyment.
Radical Dreamer
Member
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Hostile_18
Banned
Ok so let's address this. No one is saying change the levels to make them easier. That would be alot of work and alter the vision. What about making death less punishing or a quick save in the easiest mode? See it's not that hard and the developers vision for its standard and higher modes is in tact. Everyone gets to play, everyone is happy.
synchronicity
Member
Saber
Gold Member
I have a feeling this was about Soul games. People keep asking the game to have easier modes from time to time.
I completely agree with the guy who answered you. How can one care much about interactivity when you're more worried about time and story telling? Watching videos perfectly fits that criteria, since you fill in with story and don't need to worry about losing time.
I completely agree with the guy who answered you. How can one care much about interactivity when you're more worried about time and story telling? Watching videos perfectly fits that criteria, since you fill in with story and don't need to worry about losing time.
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Trimesh
Banned
Given the way the question was posted, I think that's covered by the answer "no". Saying "no, not every game should do this" does not imply that no game can if the developers wish it.
The Bloody-Nine
Member
In Blighttown, most of the level is toxic, including a swamp that slows you down and poisons you. You have to walk through it, it's unavoidable.
In The Tomb of the Giants, the level is pitch black and you can see about a foot in front of you. There are fatal drops everywhere.
How can you make those areas easier without changing them?
OmegaSupreme
advanced basic bitch
Here I'll help you out. I've played Dark Souls and I don't see how the challenge came from the level design. I was challenged by the bosses killing me in a few hits and being vulnerable. What was challenging about the level design?
OmegaSupreme
advanced basic bitch
Easy answer. I can't play a movie. Like I said. I don't have time to "get gud" bro
The Bloody-Nine
Member
See above.
Saber
Gold Member
If you don't have time then maybe you shouldn't play that game? Lol
Look dude, I'm not here to mock or demand you to get gud. But if you don't have time why not pick a suitable shorter experience? Why the games/devs have to suit expecifically to your needs?
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Hostile_18
Banned
Like I mentioned quick save. Unless your arguing having quick save on an easy mode would ruin it for normal or hard difficulty players.
xrnzaaas
Member
It's an unrealistic thing to wish for, even if PS5/XSEX will have a built-in easy mode (or scene skip mode) some companies will definitely ignore it because of wanting to preserve the magic of their high(er) difficulty games or (worse) because of wanting to sell xp boosters and tons of other microtransactions directly.
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The Bloody-Nine
Member
Quick save? You realise it's an online game, right?
OmegaSupreme
advanced basic bitch
All that can be worked around by making the character less vulnerable. Next?
The Bloody-Nine
Member
I'm intrigued. How does making the character less vulnerable make him immune to falling off cliffs?
OmegaSupreme
advanced basic bitch
Why should they suit your needs or requirements? See how easy that is?
The Bloody-Nine
Member
They don't. They suit the developers. You know, the people making the game.
Saber
Gold Member
What needs?
OmegaSupreme
advanced basic bitch
Whatever they may be. If you like a challenging game then so be it. You can make any game more challenging and no one bats an eye. Do a no-death run of Kid Chamelon(for example lol) Yet there is somehow an uproar over an option to make it easier?
OmegaSupreme
advanced basic bitch
A more lenient respawn would work fine. Next?
Sign
Member
Difficulty is not an accessibility issue. The medium is active and participatory. The art in video games is the "play." You are approaching this topic from the mindset of an observer of passive entertainment. What you think you are doing is asking for subtitles because you can't hear the dialogue when in reality you are asking for the equivalent of a change in character motivation because you can't relate. You are asking for the book to have a different setting because you don't like the current one. You are asking for the lyrics of a song to be changed because you find them offensive.
That is not to say that every game need use the medium to its fullest, most don't, but the games that strive for something greater need to be allowed. Otherwise, all that is left is focus testing into oblivion followed by stagnation and irrelevance.
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The Bloody-Nine
Member
So you agree your first idea was asinine. Good. Please explain your 'more lenient respawn' system.
BlackTron
Member
There is always some way to make a game easier. Look at the characters they added to Mario Bros. U DX. One which doesn't get hurt by enemies (but can't use powerups) and another which gets a super-power up which only they can grab. I thought these were good additions, there's nothing wrong with more choice.
That said...at some point, making games easier will only allow you to "access the content" of the game, if you see that "content" as artwork, music, cutscenes, etc. If you see the content as a gameplay experience, you would be breaking the developers vision and not really have experienced the game.
Nothing is stopping you from filling out a crossword puzzle by looking at the answers, and the crossword book publisher doesn't care as long as you buy it. However, you missed the point in the first place, taking an opportunity for mental challenge/stimulation and replaced it with busywork to fill your time.
As an analogy, I would encourage a kid to start with an easy character in Mario, and also to fill in a lot of free answers in a crossword puzzle to get a grip on how it works. So, yes, let's have the option please. But I wouldn't delude myself into thinking I was "experiencing" either type of game with those kind of training wheels. I want this feature for 8 year olds, but know it will really be for journalists.
That said...at some point, making games easier will only allow you to "access the content" of the game, if you see that "content" as artwork, music, cutscenes, etc. If you see the content as a gameplay experience, you would be breaking the developers vision and not really have experienced the game.
Nothing is stopping you from filling out a crossword puzzle by looking at the answers, and the crossword book publisher doesn't care as long as you buy it. However, you missed the point in the first place, taking an opportunity for mental challenge/stimulation and replaced it with busywork to fill your time.
As an analogy, I would encourage a kid to start with an easy character in Mario, and also to fill in a lot of free answers in a crossword puzzle to get a grip on how it works. So, yes, let's have the option please. But I wouldn't delude myself into thinking I was "experiencing" either type of game with those kind of training wheels. I want this feature for 8 year olds, but know it will really be for journalists.
OmegaSupreme
advanced basic bitch
In that very specific example, sure. It would help tremendously throughout the rest of the game though. Simple respawn having lost none of the progress you've made souls wise. I'm sorry I have to think of all these things for you.
Hostile_18
Banned
Feels like people a are proper grasping at straws to justify no one playing their game on an easy mode. Theres always an unobtrusive way. We can come up with solutions easily and were not even people specialized in game design, imagine what they could come up with.
Funny how people who have the skills try so hard to justify why it would ruin the game experience. I hope when they get older or have less free time they dont get locked out of their favorite franchise/genre.
Funny how people who have the skills try so hard to justify why it would ruin the game experience. I hope when they get older or have less free time they dont get locked out of their favorite franchise/genre.
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The Bloody-Nine
Member
These ideas are just so stupid they didn't occur to me. You should be very proud. Not losing your souls will DEFINITELY prevent you from falling off cliffs in the dark. Have you considered a career as a game designer?
OmegaSupreme
advanced basic bitch
I find it all juvenile. It shouldn't hurt their enjoyment of whatever game if it includes an easy mode yet it somehow does. Why cling on to something that doesn't affect you in the slightest since we are only talking about difficulty options?
RedVIper
Banned
And playing something on easy mode isn't the same as playing the game as intended by the developers, what's your point?
A 10 year old can read Finnegans Wake, but he probably won't get much from the experience.
Should books come with "easy" modes as well?
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OmegaSupreme
advanced basic bitch
That idea took two seconds. Perhaps tell me an idea of yours that would make it easier in that very specific circumstance.
LordOfChaos
Member
I'm fine with more games being accessible, but I'm usually against any forced targets on developers.
Let the people with the vision decide. Miyazaki being forced into making Bloodborne 2 hand holding mode? It just doesn't seem right.
Let the people with the vision decide. Miyazaki being forced into making Bloodborne 2 hand holding mode? It just doesn't seem right.
OmegaSupreme
advanced basic bitch
So why include an easy mode in any game ever then? If it is not the way the developers intended you to play it.
Edit: and a lot of books do come with an easy mode. Cliffs notes.
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The Bloody-Nine
Member
I am not the one arguing that you can implement an easy mode without making major changes to the game. That would be you. I'm not going to make your points for you. If I did that, I wouldn't need you. Hang on....
sircaw
Banned
100% yes from me.
I am now closing in on the 50 year old camp.
When i was younger i would not even give into the notion of easy being allowed in games but now with my eye sight and reactions getting worse by the year, i still wish to see games through to the end more for the story, the level design and the setting. I have played hundreds of games in my life, completed all the usual suspects of dark souls, bloodborne and nioh's etc.
I understand what hard means relative to games but i also know that soon, next 5-10 years i will be unable to complete games like that due to the natural process of getting old.
If people are so hard arsed about giving an easy option for games then just remove the achievements for completing the game on easy, only allowing it to register if completed on hard.
In the future I don't want to have to resort to watching games on you-tube or streamed by others.
Trust me when i say this, getting old is going to effect everyone and the vast majority of your are going to wish for an easier setting later in life.
I am now closing in on the 50 year old camp.
When i was younger i would not even give into the notion of easy being allowed in games but now with my eye sight and reactions getting worse by the year, i still wish to see games through to the end more for the story, the level design and the setting. I have played hundreds of games in my life, completed all the usual suspects of dark souls, bloodborne and nioh's etc.
I understand what hard means relative to games but i also know that soon, next 5-10 years i will be unable to complete games like that due to the natural process of getting old.
If people are so hard arsed about giving an easy option for games then just remove the achievements for completing the game on easy, only allowing it to register if completed on hard.
In the future I don't want to have to resort to watching games on you-tube or streamed by others.
Trust me when i say this, getting old is going to effect everyone and the vast majority of your are going to wish for an easier setting later in life.
Hostile_18
Banned
So what people are saying about Souls now been ruined if it was made easier a few years ago could be leveled at the fighting genre.
Look at Tekken 7 it introduced move shortcuts and players of all skill levels can now pull off moves and have fun. It's less about how to pull it off a complex move but rather when. See the genre adapted and it become more inclusive and it's now more popular than ever.
Inclusivity isnt scary guys. Games are now mass market products, like it or not.
Look at Tekken 7 it introduced move shortcuts and players of all skill levels can now pull off moves and have fun. It's less about how to pull it off a complex move but rather when. See the genre adapted and it become more inclusive and it's now more popular than ever.
Inclusivity isnt scary guys. Games are now mass market products, like it or not.
OmegaSupreme
advanced basic bitch
You gave a very specific circumstance in a specific game. More power to you on that. I never got that far in the game. tbf. I'm curious though... Do you really feel your enjoyment would be diminished if the game had an easy mode?
OmegaSupreme
advanced basic bitch
Well said.
