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[Black-Wind]

Slept on my idea about customizable move sets, decided it would erode the identity of the individual characters (and would be hard to implement for some, like Ice Climbers).

I disagree ... greatly actually.

IDK about anyone else but when I heard "character customization" I could only think of 4 things ...

-Stat Customization
-Move Customization
-Appearance Customization
-Any mixture of the above

Theres really not all that MUCH they could mean by that. "Take the character you built up on the 3DS to the WU game to show off"? There must be something you can gain from doing the 3DS custom stuff.

So what I suggested earlier in this thread (which everyone seems to ignore... really, I see pretty much zero talk on the ONE thing of interest that we know about these games so far) is that maybe this means that they will have a much more effective and heavy use of clones. Want a stronger, heavier Pikachu? Change his stats enough and you can get a Raichu which would be more of what you want. Want the reverse (faster and smaller)? You can get Pichu. Want a stronger Mario? You can get Doc Mario. Want a Mario that can glide? Tanooki Mario.

OR there could be B move customization. Like stances in other fighting games as someone suggested. Pikachu could have Elector Ball as an optional B Move and he has to charge it up for example. OR they could be together so that maybe the clones could have a few unique B moves.

Either way .... there's gotta be a reason Sakurai feels the need to finally allow other members of the crew to help balance this game. No, I'm not in the club that thinks he's gonna punk out and only give the game a hand full of newcomers. W/e he's thinking of doing it needs more than just him to balance and it's gonna be big. Hopefully he took notice of what the fans feel and takes action against the direction Brawl was taking things.

 

[JazzmanZ]

You're all forgetting the obvious titles.

Super Smash bros. Battle

and

Super Smash bros. Rumble

 

[The Xtortionist]

So what I suggested earlier in this thread (which everyone seems to ignore... really, I see pretty much zero talk on the ONE thing of interest that we know about these games so far) is that maybe this means that they will have a much more effective and heavy use of clones. Want a stronger, heavier Pikachu? Change his stats enough and you can get a Raichu which would be more of what you want. Want the reverse (faster and smaller)? You can get Pichu. Want a stronger Mario? You can get Doc Mario. Want a Mario that can glide? Tanooki Mario.

This would be preferable to customizable moves. By linking moves and attributes to certain skins, consistency is maintained.

I'd just hate to fight a Mario online and have no idea what moves he's using.

 

[OrangeGrayBlue]

I know we already touched on this topic, but I don't think Nintendo "owes" 3rd parties anything for letting them use their character. What Nintendo gives them in return is the assurance that their character will be in a game guaranteed to sell at least five million copies. Their character increases the demand for the game, and the game increases demand for their character. It's a symbiotic relationship.

 

[GamerSoul]

This would be preferable to customizable moves. By linking moves and attributes to certain skins, consistency is maintained.

I'd just hate to fight a Mario online and have no idea what moves he's using.

I was thinking along the lines of this when it comes to movesets. It would make sense to have them come as a set combination or even limiting the customization to the special moves. Something like a very limited version of the Tales of series' moveset. The time it would take to really go in to detail with the customization and creating of x amount of moves each for 40+ characters could be time spent creating those moves for a whole different or clone character. But who knows really. There could also be a possibilty to customize final smashes too.

 

[KevinCow]

I know we already touched on this topic, but I don't think Nintendo "owes" 3rd parties anything for letting them use their character. What Nintendo gives them in return is the assurance that their character will be in a game guaranteed to sell at least five million copies. Their character increases the demand for the game, and the game increases demand for their character. It's a symbiotic relationship.

Logically, you're right.

But game publishers tend to be illogical.

 

[Black-Wind]

This would be preferable to customizable moves. By linking moves and attributes to certain skins, consistency is maintained.

I'd just hate to fight a Mario online and have no idea what moves he's using.

Makes sense to have it work that way. So maybe that's what it is. Also doesn't hurt that MOST characters have an outfit/ persona that acts differently in their game series.

Logically, you're right.

But game publishers tend to be illogical.

That's likely why Sakurai was all "No 3rd party asked us to put in a character ...".

They don't want to actively seek out these 3rd party characters and maybe it's because of this.

 

[MisterHero]

I know we already touched on this topic, but I don't think Nintendo "owes" 3rd parties anything for letting them use their character. What Nintendo gives them in return is the assurance that their character will be in a game guaranteed to sell at least five million copies. Their character increases the demand for the game, and the game increases demand for their character. It's a symbiotic relationship.

Yep. Kojima begs to have Snake in Smash Bros.

Snake gets in.

Wii gets least amount of Metal Gear games

 

[Snakey]

I really hope no characters will be cut.

The only cuts I'm fine with are Dr. Mario and Pichu, bring back the other ones (with some new moves) and let them all stay.

I have been saying this too. Also, besides the characters that are already within Smash Bros. are more important/well-known/bigger stars than most of the characters that are not yet playable in Smash Bros.

 

[Black-Wind]

I have been saying this too. Also, besides the characters that are already within Smash Bros. are more important/well-known/bigger stars than most of the characters that are not yet playable in Smash Bros.

What?

Is Ike more Important/ well known than w/e new FE star character? Is Lucario more important than w/e gen 6 pokemon GF will be pimping out as the new gen mascot?

IMO there are simply certain series that are designed in a way that they pass on the star-factor from game to game and it seems that Sakurai is willing to pass those spots to the new holders. FE and Pokemon are those kind of series where I would think that the last "flavor of the month" character will get less priority in the character making process ... like with the 3rd gen Pika-clones and Roy.

 

[Snakey]

What?

Is Ike more Important/ well known than w/e new FE star character? Is Lucario more important than w/e gen 6 pokemon GF will be pimping out as the new gen mascot?

IMO there are simply certain series that are designed in a way that they pass on the star-factor from game to game and it seems that Sakurai is willing to pass those spots to the new holders. FE and Pokemon are those kind of series where I would think that the last "flavor of the month" character will get less priority in the character making process ... like with Mewtwo and Roy.

Fixed.

Mewtwo and Roy were slated to be in Brawl despite Lucario and Ike being in. If it were not for Sonic being added so late, they most likely would have been in.

And yes, both Ike and Lucario are more well known than Chrome and Zoroark. I can at least tell you that Lucario is still far more popular than Zoroark is, and that at this time for pre-Brawl discussion, Lucario had far more requests to be in than Zoroark does now. I have not seen anyone really want Zoroark, they simply just expect him. However, there is not anyone really from 5th-generation that stands out. However, Zoroark's lack of popularity in comparison to Lucario is probably due to him being a retread in regards to the whole "canine anthropomorphic Pokemon" thing.

As for Ike and Chrome, Chrome so far looks like Ike Part 2. Ike was one of the most popular additions to Brawl, and no way they would add THREE blue-haired male sword-users (two of which would probably be very similar to one another).

Sakurai is quite conservative. The most wanted requests for Smash 4 that I saw on Japanese boards were actually for Mewtwo and Roy. In general, there is a strong desire worldwide for him not to do any cuts (aside from possibly third-party guys like Sonic and Snake).

 

[GamerSoul]

What?

Is Ike more Important/ well known than w/e new FE star character? Is Lucario more important than w/e gen 6 pokemon GF will be pimping out as the new gen mascot?

IMO there are simply certain series that are designed in a way that they pass on the star-factor from game to game and it seems that Sakurai is willing to pass those spots to the new holders. FE and Pokemon are those kind of series where I would think that the last "flavor of the month" character will get less priority in the character making process ... like with the 3rd gen Pika-clones and Roy.

Im probably biased but I think Ike is that important and now that well-known compared to other FE characters. Dude has a compelling story and "fights for his friends" always heh. The problem with replacing characters is that in Smash they have their own identity that doesn't necessarily go with the current games of their respected series. That's why I'm not sure what will Sakurai do in terms of keeping characters.

 

[Snakey]

Im probably biased but I think Ike is that important and now that well-known compared to other FE characters. Dude has a compelling story and "fights for his friends" always heh. The problem with replacing characters is that in Smash they have their own identity that doesn't necessarily go with the current games of their respected series. That's why I'm not sure what will Sakurai do in terms of keeping characters.

FE9 and FE10 were two of the three (the other was FE5) poorest selling Fire Emblem games in Japan. However, due to how well Ike was received in Brawl, I doubt he will be cut. He is definitely among the most popular newcomers added.

 

[Barrow Roll]

Super Smash Bros. Generations
Bringing back Classic Smash, with Modern Smash.

Spoiler

I went there.

A Smash 64 mode would be awesome.

High hit lag.
High hitstun.
High shieldstun.
Only Smash DI.
No SideB.
Only floor teching.
No spot dodge or air dodge.
Forward and back throw only, super powerful.
Z-canceling.
Old sound effects.

Would be so awesome.

Next Smash needs tag team battles though. Just sayin.

 

[Watch Da Birdie]

So...I kind of think the three new "franchises" the 3Ds shop is launching, Pushmo, Sakura Samurai, and the Rolling Western should all be represented to help boost their popularity.

- There should be a Pushmo level, with Malo constantly pushing blocks in to take away platforms, and that little brat resetting it every once in awhile, making blocks push out to knock players off. And maybe there'd be different layouts for the level, perhaps a version based off each series icon?, that would be randomly selected.
- I really want Takamaru to get in, and if they introduce alternate costumes, giving him Sakura Samurai dude as an alternate would be pretty neat, especially since I can't think of any other suitable costume for him.
- Dillon should be an AT, perhaps functioning like the old Red Shell item and rolling around on a platform knocking people off.

 

[Azure J]

A Smash 64 mode would be awesome.

High hit lag.
High hitstun.
High shieldstun.
Only Smash DI.
No SideB.
Only floor teching.
No spot dodge or air dodge.
Forward and back throw only, super powerful.
Z-canceling.
Old sound effects.

Would be so awesome.

Next Smash needs tag team battles though. Just sayin.

I miss overpowered throws so badly. <3

As for the tag team idea, I was always under the impression that the next frontier would be building on team battle concepts ever since the Wombo Combo happened. It'd be really cool if they focused on larger numbers of players on screen at once (say 8) and built modes around doubles smash. For example, one mode could have players stuck together via a "rubber band" mechanic where they can snap each other around or quick tag one player from another part of the area to exchange places really quickly and change up offenses and the like. If they're attacked, it becomes a game of making sure they aren't knocked too far out otherwise the teammate could get dragged off screen with the launched party. Silly ideas I know but I'm sure there's a lot of potential in Smash duos.

 

[GamerSoul]

FE9 and FE10 were two of the three (the other was FE5) poorest selling Fire Emblem games in Japan. However, due to how well Ike was received in Brawl, I doubt he will be cut. He is definitely among the most popular newcomers added.

Ouch. I thought they were pretty great but then again I was just itching to get some FE games over here. Ike was my main character for awhile because I was definitely hyped that he was in.

Next Smash needs tag team battles though. Just sayin.

Kinda like in MvC? It would be fun.

 

[Watch Da Birdie]

Team Final Smashes is probably where Final Smashes will travel next, that or perhaps each character having a selectable Final Smash, like how you select Ultras in SSFIV and other fighting games.

Outside of your normal Team Final Smashes, where both players begin their FS together, it'd be neat if certain combinations had their own ones, like Mario and Luigi performing some special move from the Mario and Luigi series, or Marth and Ike performing a move based off the new FE 3DS combination attacks.

 

[Thores]

Mewtwo and Roy were slated to be in Brawl despite Lucario and Ike being in.

Is there any proof of this besides their code being in the game? I always interpreted that as their old Melee code being used as reference in early development. Also wasn't Dr. Mario in the code too? Kinda doubt there were plans to keep him in Brawl, so unless there's other evidence that Mewtwo and Roy were going to be in the finished game at some point, like a confirmation from Sakurai, it's kind of a weak argument.

 

[Sir Ilpalazzo]

Is there any proof of this besides their code being in the game? I always interpreted that as their old Melee code being used as reference in early development. Also wasn't Dr. Mario in the code too? Kinda doubt there were plans to keep him in Brawl, so unless there's other evidence that Mewtwo and Roy were going to be in the finished game at some point, like a confirmation from Sakurai, it's kind of a weak argument.

Young Link and Pichu aren't in the coding at all, but they both had / have replacement characters. There's also data referencing individual victory themes for Mewtwo and Roy (other data suggests that at one point nearly everyone would have their own victory themes), so it's really unlikely that they were just Melee leftovers.

 

[Thores]

Alright, that's still not really conclusive, but at least it's more of an educated guess. Though even if that's the case, there's no way of telling how early in development they were scrapped. Maybe some work was done on Roy and Mewtwo before the decision was even made to add Ike and Lucario to the roster. Then once those additions were decided, maybe work stopped on Roy/Mewtwo because they now had replacements. There's no proof they were worked on concurrently. Plus, some other really early elements of the game are found on the disc, like a prototype classic mode screen that uses Melee sound effects.

There's actually some Sakurai talk to support this... he had no idea what Fire Emblem characters were relevant during Brawl's development, and had to ask Intelligent Systems who he should add. He never said that he did this right away, and maybe he experienced a similar scenario with the Pokemon franchise.

 

[Snakey]

Alright, that's still not really conclusive, but at least it's more of an educated guess. Though even if that's the case, there's no way of telling how early in development they were scrapped. Maybe some work was done on Roy and Mewtwo before the decision was even made to add Ike and Lucario to the roster. Then once those additions were decided, maybe work stopped on Roy/Mewtwo because they now had replacements. There's no proof they were worked on concurrently. Plus, some other really early elements of the game are found on the disc, like a prototype classic mode screen that uses Melee sound effects.

There's actually some Sakurai talk to support this... he had no idea what Fire Emblem characters were relevant during Brawl's development, and had to ask Intelligent Systems who he should add. He never said that he did this right away, and maybe he experienced a similar scenario with the Pokemon franchise.

Actually, there is proof that Mewtwo and Roy were being worked on while Lucario and Ike were in the game.

Look at this list:

snd_bgm_Z01_FMARIO
snd_bgm_Z02_FDONKEY
snd_bgm_Z03_FLINK
snd_bgm_Z04_FSAMUS
snd_bgm_Z05_FYOSSY
snd_bgm_Z06_FKIRBY
snd_bgm_Z07_FFOX
snd_bgm_Z08_FPIKACHU
snd_bgm_Z09_FLUIGI
snd_bgm_Z10_FCAPTAIN
snd_bgm_Z11_FNESS
snd_bgm_Z12_FKUOPA
snd_bgm_Z13_FPEACH
snd_bgm_Z14_FZELDA
snd_bgm_Z15_FSHEIK
snd_bgm_Z16_FICHICLIMBER
snd_bgm_Z17_FMARTH
snd_bgm_Z18_FGAMEWATCH
snd_bgm_Z19_FFALCO
snd_bgm_Z20_FGANON
snd_bgm_Z21_FWARIO
snd_bgm_Z22_FMETAKNIGHT
snd_bgm_Z23_FPITT
snd_bgm_Z24_FZEROSAMUS
snd_bgm_Z25_FPIKMIN
snd_bgm_Z26_FLUCAS
snd_bgm_Z27_FDIDDY
snd_bgm_Z28_FPOKETRAINER
snd_bgm_Z32_FDEDEDE
snd_bgm_Z33_FLICARIO
snd_bgm_Z34_FIKE
snd_bgm_Z35_FROBOT
snd_bgm_Z37_FPURIN
snd_bgm_Z38_FMYU2
snd_bgm_Z39_FROY
snd_bgm_Z41_FTOONLINK
snd_bgm_Z46_FSNAKE
snd_bgm_Z47_FSONIC

Look in the final copy to Brawl for how the characters were listed (in order, go to Sound Test).

 

[Thagomizer]

Can we just get a Metroid stage that isn't banned by house rules by my friends?

 

[The Xtortionist]

Can we just get a Metroid stage that isn't banned by house rules by my friends?

Orpheon is pretty playable imo.

 

[Thagomizer]

Orpheon is pretty playable imo.

It's borderline. The stage is good, but nobody likes the flipping. It gives me and a few other people I play with instant vertigo. I actually like the other stages, but I'm the only one. When we play 64, Zebes is the only stage to get insta-vetoed because of the lava.

 

[bomb]

I of course want Lil Mac but I also really want a character like Super Macho Man.

 

[spanks]

What is the next step for the fighting team? Mo Cap Fighting Team? Texture Fighting Team? Pixel Fighting Team? Looks like a Flash Game will not buy Fighting Team?

Mii Fighting Team for sho. It uses you and your friends' Miis so you end up fighting everyone you know. Also Hitler.

I'd vote against Black Shadow purely for his design. It's so plain and boring, and I already dread the inevitable running gag of him being mistaken for Batman. Samurai Goroh most definitely, his design and fighting style seems completely unique.

I kind of like Black Shadow for the visual variety he brings. He might seem bland compared to Batman, but compared to Nintendo characters, he's actually pretty unique. We've got a bunch of medieval/fantasy type characters, a bunch a cutesy animal characters, a couple plumbers, a bikie, a couple dinosaurs, a soldier, an astronaut, a robot-suited bounty hunter, a couple psychic kids, etc.. and a comicbook villain with Black Shadow. Fits in nicely, and no character so far uses the far end of the color spectrum; a fully black caped villain looks pretty striking.


What other character archetypes could we use?

Cowboy
Flint
Sherrif
Dillon
Wild Gunman
Tin Star

Pirate
Captain Syrup
Kaptain K Rool
Tetra
Linebeck
Shelly (Pokémon Ruby/Sapphire)
Cortez (Paper Mario)

Ninja
Impa
Ryu Hyabusa
Kat & Ana

Robot
Ray MkIII
Chibi Robo
Sukapon
Mike (WarioWare)
Harry (Teleroboxer)

Athlete
Lil Mac
Mike Jones
Ricky Winterborn (1080°/Wave Race)
Starman (Pro Wrestling)
Karate Man

Detective
Mr. Stevenson (Gumshoe)
Kyle Hyde
Professor Layton

Alien
Sylux
Sturm
Orbulon (WarioWare)
Pico (F-Zero)

Mythical
Medusa
Dracula
Anubis (Battle Clash)

Pilot
Mike Anderson (Metal Combat)
Andy
Excitebike Rider
Mach Rider
Lark/Nester

 

[Diddy Kong]

Little Mac needs to be in.

 

[PokéKong]

I sure wish FE8 was super popular, I loved Eirika and Ephraim, and it would be a real nice change of pace to have a FE character who uses a spear or a rapier.

Although they could just add them if Sakurai felt like it, regardless of popularity. If we've learned anything about FE characters, they will go from virtually unknown to fan favorites after inclusion.

 

[Snakey]

I sure wish FE8 was super popular, I loved Eirika and Ephraim, and it would be a real nice change of pace to have a FE character who uses a spear or a rapier.

Marth and Roy use rapiers in their games before getting their holy weapons.

For a character that uses a spear, how about Waddle Dee (Bandanna Dee)? Return to Dream Land was a return to form for Kirby, and sold very well (especially in Japan).

On the topic of FE8, its one of the least popular games in the series.

I am curious though when those Kid Icarus Uprising OVAs are being released. Heck, I don't think there is even an official topic yet for Kid Icarus Uprising here despite the game being a little over a month from release.

 

[Codeblue]

Was FE6 super popular in Japan or something? I didn't much care for Roy or his game. They could put every Lord except Roy in a hat and draw one to take his spot and chances are I'd prefer it.

If they're going to use a character from Roy's universe it's gotta be Hector.

Edit: OTs are made a week before release, so that's why KI doesn't have one.

 

[Snakey]

Was FE6 super popular in Japan or something?

It was the third highest selling game in the series, and Roy is the most popular character from the GBA Fire Emblems.

Also, I think King Dedede is pretty similar to how an axe-fighter would fight (at least in how he swings his hammer).

 

[Black-Wind]

Fixed.

Nope, I mean't Plusle and Minum. Seems like a more appropriate examaple seeing as they're 3rd gen and he's 4th gen and they're also apart of the "Forbidden Seven".

Mewtwo and Roy were slated to be in Brawl despite Lucario and Ike being in. If it were not for Sonic being added so late, they most likely would have been in.

Correct ... which is why I said that they're in a spot where they would have less priority. As in, if shit doesn't work out then too bad. Clearly Ike and Lucario were of higher priority than Mewtwo/ P&M and Roy seeing as they got inearlier.

And yes, both Ike and Lucario are more well known than Chrome and Zoroark. I can at least tell you that Lucario is still far more popular than Zoroark is, and that at this time for pre-Brawl discussion, Lucario had far more requests to be in than Zoroark does now.

... These dates make no sense.
This time "pre-brawl" Lucario would just be getting it's movie in Japan and would still be one of the only 4th gen Pokemon known at all. Hell, from what I remember people where mostly only talking about possible 3rd gen Pokemon because the 4th hadn't even come out by the time Brawl started development and all these misinformed people would assume that it would be too late.

And from what I gather from this very thread ... GameFreak has far more control than anyone thought (back when we were all talking about brawl) in how Pokemon are treated in Smash. Lucario didn't get in because of fan request, he got in because he was the Poster Boy for the 4th gen and GameFreak wanted certain mascots in the roster.

By that logic it wouldn't matter how much people are now chatting it up about Zoroark ... as long as it's the top mascot in GameFreaks eyes it will be on the top of the list for that "non-first gen Pokemon" spot, leaving Lucario in the "if things go well then maybe he will be in" spot.

And even that's moot seeing how there will likely be a new gen of Pokemon out before SSB4 and w/e that mascot is will have more priority than a 4th gen Pokemon.

And on top of THAT ... I'm sure Lucario wasn't more popular and well known than Mewtwo yet Mewtwo was the one with less priority sooo that kinda proves my point.

As for Ike and Chrome, Chrome so far looks like Ike Part 2. Ike was one of the most popular additions to Brawl, and no way they would add THREE blue-haired male sword-users (two of which would probably be very similar to one another).

People said that there was no way TWO blue haired swordsmen from the vast selection of FE characters would be in Brawl.

I'm not a big FE buff but ... is Ike important enough to the series or is in anyway as relevant to the series as he would need to be in order to out rank this new Chrome/ Krome guy when it comes to representing the latest games in the series? Because that seems to be what happened to Roy ... he had less priority compared to Ike and they didn't have time to finish him.

But who knows ... now that they're playing with systems that can actually get DLC they can bring back characters they didn't have time to finish.

Also ... I find it funny that you're defending Lucario when it's basically the Renamon/ Krystal for the Pokemon series. It was designed to attract the people who like anthropomorphic K9s/ animals which is why we now have Zoroark. They just went from trying to make cute Pikachu clones the mascot to trying to make cool furry-bait Pokemon the mascots. As for people not jumping on Zoroark I think that it's because the 5th gen Pokemon are by FAR better designed than the past few gens of Pokemon. 4th gen had a hand full of appealing designs ... but with the 5th gen I love most everything because they look so appealing.

 

[Snakey]

This time "pre-brawl" Lucario would just be getting it's movie in Japan and would still be one of the only 4th gen Pokemon known at all. Hell, from what I remember people where mostly only talking about possible 3rd gen Pokemon because the 4th hadn't even come out by the time Brawl started development and all these misinformed people would assume that it would be too late.

NO. I am talking in the sense by the time Lucario's movie was two years old, he was the most requested Pokemon newcomer for Smash 4. Zoroark's movie is now closing in on two years, and I have seen far more antipathy toward Zoroark than Lucario.

And from what I gather from this very thread ... GameFreak has far more control than anyone thought (back when we were all talking about brawl) in how Pokemon are treated in Smash. Lucario didn't get in because of fan request, he got in because he was the Poster Boy for the 4th gen and GameFreak wanted certain mascots in the roster.

Which is why I have said Lucario is the most likely one to get the boot, if it is indeed the case where Sakurai does not determine all of Smash's Pokemon content.

By that logic it wouldn't matter how much people are now chatting it up about Zoroark ... as long as it's the top mascot in GameFreaks eyes it will be on the top of the list for that "non-first gen Pokemon" spot, leaving Lucario in the "if things go well then maybe he will be in" spot.

The problem is that you are simply assuming the Pokemon they will use to represent 5th-gen would be Zoroark. They have been promoting Victini just as much as Zoroark. Victini seems to be the favorite of the director for Pokemon Black/White btw.

And even that's moot seeing how there will likely be a new gen of Pokemon out before SSB4 and w/e that mascot is will have more priority than a 4th gen Pokemon.

I have talked about this too.

People said that there was no way TWO blue haired swordsmen from the vast selection of FE characters would be in Brawl.

That was simply a minority, mostly just the Lyn fanboys who thought a tutorial lord was more likely than a character with two games under his belt.

I'm not a big FE buff but ... is Ike important enough to the series or is in anyway as relevant to the series as he would need to be in order to out rank this new Chrome/ Krome guy when it comes to representing the latest games in the series?

Ike was basically the most important lord of the Tellius arc (FE9/FE10). Though the Tellius arc was the poorest selling Fire Emblem arc in Japan (FE6 actually sold more than both of those games combined).

Intelligent Systems seems to be turning Ike (a mercenary type lord) into a lord arch-type though. Just look at the official artwork for the My Unit in FE12 and notice the uncanny resemblance to Ike.

Chrome's outfit is also very similar to Ike's Radiant Dawn appearance too.

However, the major obstacle for removing Ike (even if Chrome does not end up as Ike 2.0) is how popular Ike is in Brawl. However, I am going to wait and see for FE13 is released so I can have a better assessment on Chrome.

Also ... I find it funny that you're defending Lucario when it's basically the Renamon/ Krystal for the Pokemon series. It was designed to attract the people who like anthropomorphic K9s/ animals which is why we now have Zoroark. They just went from trying to make cute Pikachu clones the mascot to trying to make cool furry-bait Pokemon the mascots

.

I am not a fan of Lucario, but Lucario definitely had more popularity when he was introduced than Zoroark. I am just against the idea of cutting characters in general. Personally, I would select for Victini as 5th-gen's representative, who seems to be a successor to Pichu in terms of personality. That way no characters would have to be cut, and there would be a 5th-generation representative as well.

Don't assume because I say arguments that defend a character that I am automatically a fan of them (for example, I am not a fan of FFVII, but I would admit that Cloud is probably the only other video game character besides Mega Man, that would create as much hype as Snake and Sonic did).

As for people not jumping on Zoroark I think that it's because the 5th gen Pokemon are by FAR better designed than the past few gens of Pokemon. 4th gen had a hand full of appealing designs ... but with the 5th gen I love most everything because they look so appealing.

This is an opinion, and even if there were polls done indicating it to be true, I still don't see much demand for a 5th-generation character. When the topic of a Pokemon newcomer for Smash 4 comes up, it is almost always Mewtwo.

 

[Thores]

As for Ike and Chrome, Chrome so far looks like Ike Part 2. Ike was one of the most popular additions to Brawl, and no way they would add THREE blue-haired male sword-users

So you're saying no Takamaru then. :]

 

[Snakey]

So you're saying no Takamaru then. :]

What? Takamaru's hair was only blue in-game likely due to the Famicom hardware limitations (color number limitations).

Look at the official artwork for Takamaru in Nazo no Murasame:

 

[Thores]

Then what about his Nintendo-approved redesign for Samurai Warriors 3? Also, his appearance in Captain Rainbow:

According to two recent Nintendo-published games, his hair is blue now, hardware restrictions or no.

 

[Snakey]

Then what about his Nintendo-approved redesign for Samurai Warriors 3? Also, his appearance in Captain Rainbow:

According to two recent Nintendo-published games, his hair is blue now, hardware restrictions or no.

At least in Samurai Warriors 3, his hair is a blackish blue (very, very dark blue). Still, he certainly looks far, far more different than any other Fire Emblem lord just from his attire alone.

 

[Thores]

At least in Samurai Warriors 3, his hair is a blackish blue (very, very dark blue). Still, he certainly looks far, far more different than any other Fire Emblem lord just from his attire and hairstyle alone.

Hahahaha

IT'S OKAY HIS HAIR IS A SLIGHTLY DARKER SHADE OF BLUE

THEREFORE MY ARGUMENT STANDS AND HE'S STILL TOTALLY QUALIFIED


Dude, I was being facetious. I found the way you worded that part of your argument to BW amusing when you're one of the loudest Takamaru advocates in the forum, so I prodded you for it. I don't actually think that a character's hair color makes him less of a candidate for a slot in a fighting game. My point was neither should you.

 

[Snakey]

Hahahaha

IT'S OKAY HIS HAIR IS A SLIGHTLY DARKER SHADE OF BLUE

THEREFORE MY ARGUMENT STANDS AND HE'S STILL TOTALLY QUALIFIED


Dude, I was being facetious. I found the way you worded that part of your argument to BW amusing when you're one of the loudest Takamaru advocates in the forum, so I prodded you for it. I don't actually think that a character's hair color makes him less of a candidate for a slot in a fighting game. My point was neither should you.

Sorry sarcasm does not come across well on the internet, and I have had idiots tell me Takamaru should not be in for that reason (hair being blue), so I assumed you were not another idiot making that argument.

However, the Fire Emblem series having three blue-haired sword-wielders would still be pretty redundant.

 

[Thores]

You can add whatever extra rationale you like at this point and I won't argue with you, "his hair is a blackish blue" is the best thing I've seen in this thread.

 

[Barrow Roll]

As for the tag team idea, I was always under the impression that the next frontier would be building on team battle concepts ever since the Wombo Combo happened. It'd be really cool if they focused on larger numbers of players on screen at once (say 8) and built modes around doubles smash. For example, one mode could have players stuck together via a "rubber band" mechanic where they can snap each other around or quick tag one player from another part of the area to exchange places really quickly and change up offenses and the like. If they're attacked, it becomes a game of making sure they aren't knocked too far out otherwise the teammate could get dragged off screen with the launched party. Silly ideas I know but I'm sure there's a lot of potential in Smash duos.

Ehhh, that seems a little too far out for me. I'd have to see it to really get a feel for it. 8 players on screen at once would be complete madness, though it might be fun on Hyrule Temple.

Kinda like in MvC? It would be fun.

Yep. I think it'd be really cool and depending on it's implementation, I think it could develop an amazing competitive metagame.

 

[ffdgh]

Sakurai better bring back after battle bonuses.

 

[Snakey]

You can add whatever extra rationale you like at this point and I won't argue with you, "his hair is a blackish blue" is the best thing I've seen in this thread.

Ahhh, did I step on your toes?

I am curious what other people think about the idea of collectible AR cards or figurines in relation to Smash 4, since the Wii U controller or console will apparently have NFC.

 

[PokéKong]

Nimble Sakura Warrior is also dark blue.

 

[Kjellson]

I don't think I've even heard of Takamaru before this thread.

 

[Starwolf_UK]

It's borderline. The stage is good, but nobody likes the flipping. It gives me and a few other people I play with instant vertigo. I actually like the other stages, but I'm the only one. When we play 64, Zebes is the only stage to get insta-vetoed because of the lava.

If only you could turn off stage features like these...or make them more frequent. Kind of like the item switch...lava switch.

 

[SmithnCo]

I am curious what other people think about the idea of collectible AR cards or figurines in relation to Smash 4, since the Wii U controller or console will apparently have NFC.

Figurines would be awesome, cause it's the only change some of these characters probably have to get figures. Cards would be interesting too, if less exciting.

 

[BGBW]

Talking of Nintendo Samurais:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jp5-FJQlM0k

Possible colour palette and a reference to Rhythm Tengoku if a stage or character is too hard to make.

 

[KevinCow]

I wish Nintendo would do what Capcom did with Street Fighter 2 HD Remix and get the fan community to contribute music for the game. That would be amazing.

Unfortunately, it's something Nintendo would never do, because Nintendo.

But I would seriously kill for a Metroid Metal track in Smash.