• Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.

Next Xbox is ‘More Advanced’ Than the PS5 according to Insiders.

ethomaz

Banned
I'm just so confused by MS's supposed console ideas here. Why does Lockhart exist if it's potentially weaker than the Xbox One X, but has a better CPU but also has no disc drive? Is Lockhart supposed to replace the Xbox One X? Like I'm confused. And what gamers out there is asking for all of this?
I don't know but if I have to guess Lockhart is a cheaper option for 1080p with CPU compatibility with the stronger brother... something that Xbox One X is not.

There's zero percent chance it could produce Anaconda visuals at 1080p. The GPU is 65% less, the RAM is cut in half, and the bandwidth is also cut in half.
No visuals but the CPU won't be a limitator factor.

With the same CPU you will only scale graphics between the two models.
 
Last edited:

Dabaus

Banned
I'm just so confused by MS's supposed console ideas here. Why does Lockhart exist if it's potentially weaker than the Xbox One X, but has a better CPU but also has no disc drive? Is Lockhart supposed to replace the Xbox One X? Like I'm confused. And what gamers out there is asking for all of this?

I dont think youre the only one confused. MS is just throwing as much crap at the wall as they can hoping, praying something sticks. Youre a hardcore gamer posting on forums, you are in the know and are confused, Imagine how the average Joe will feel walking into walmart with 5 or 6 xbox SKUs to pick from.
 
Last edited:

ethomaz

Banned
I dont think youre the only one confused. MS is just throwing as much crap at the wall as they can hoping, praying something sticks.
To be fair MS didn't throw anything.

These "reliables" leaker are throwing it.. how much of that is real well we need to wait.
 

GoldenEye98

posts news as their odd job
You guys know that if the next Xbox is significantly ahead of ps5 it will cost a lot more, right? Is MS bold enough to throw a 599 console on the market?

We've seen it before and it wasn't beautiful. Also, it was the successor of the most successful console of all time but it didn't matter. Xbox is in third place this gen? I'm not following the market closely, I know PS4 was the leader and now Switch is selling a lot.

Anyway, I'm expecting the ps5 at 449 ~ 499 USD. Can't see MS going beyond that or selling the console at loss.

Just my 2 cents on this.

If they are offering more than one option to consumers then yeah possibly...
 

mckmas8808

Mckmaster uses MasterCard to buy Slave drives
No visuals but the CPU won't be a limitator factor.

With the same CPU you will only scale graphics between the two models.

I hope you're right that this is all leakers possibly making stuff up, because if the Lockhart rumor is right all 1st party MS games will have to be designed with a 6 TF, 12 GBs of RAM, and no NVMe SSD in the console box. And that's a world we all don't want to live in.

If they are offering more than one option to consumers then yeah possibly...

Then which Xbox console would be the "real" next gen Xbox? The Lockhart or Anaconda?
 
Last edited:
It should be somewhat concerning if MS is 3 generations deep and has to "start somewhere" for the launch of the 4th lol.

Personally, I don't think Microsoft gives a shit about Xbox hardware, but I'm frequently wrong.
You're not wrong but previous Xbox leadership has been garbage and closed good studios while gutting others. That's not the case this time around. Allard was great, Mattrick sucked donkey dicks and put Microsoft in the position it's in now.
 
Last edited:

Ar¢tos

Member
Microsoft is forming and buying up studios to do what? As far as Microsoft is concerned they have to start somewhere. Something tells me that they are working on quite a few new IP's.
How many of those studios can compete directly with Sony 1st party? They are mostly small indies and a few AA ones. They exist to create small continuous content for gamepass basically.
 
How many of those studios can compete directly with Sony 1st party? They are mostly small indies and a few AA ones. They exist to create small continuous content for gamepass basically.
Ninja Theory just made a pretty admirable game for the size of their team and I would say they would be a great contender to go up against Playstation's 1st party. The Coalition and 343 Industries seem like they are changing things up for the better. Playground games keeps knocking it out of the park with Forza Horizon and is creating an RPG, meanwhile Sony closed down the DriveClub servers. We know nothing about The Initiative other than it's got some pretty damn good talent behind it and it's based out of Santa Monica. Obsidian has a good track record for making RPG's.

As far as Sony's first party, they make great games, but a lot of them play very similar and are somewhat slow paced outside of Horizon and Spiderman. Both of which I enjoyed immensely. Overall Sony's 1st party story telling is top notch and will be hard to beat. Only time will tell, but Microsoft has a new generation with plenty of new studios and more on the way.
 

Darius87

Member
MS will shoot themself and devs in the foot with multiple skus, but it makes sense because MS going toward PC space, on downside that makes xbox irrevelant because consumers have pc's or can buy one and there's nothing proprietary that xbox have, it have become worthless box.
 

Journey

Banned
Next Xbox can come covered in chocolate, sing and dance and offer relationship advices and still Europe and Asia will ignore it.
There is no need to "beat Sony", xbox might not the number 1, but it is in a good place and it is very profitable. MS should worry in not letting Sony gain more of America to keep that position.


Imo, I think they need to beat Sony in the power department simply because they can't compete with exclusives at the moment, sure we all know they're putting a lot of effort, shown by their recent purchases, but they have a steep uphill climb, so beating them in specs is essential because now you have the base that cares about their multi-platform console games look best on their 4K/8K sets.

Xbox One X is a success because of its hardware (Power, Design, Value) more than it is because of the brand. Sure software is extremely important, but multiplats make the bulk of the available games, so when a game like RDR3 starts Wowing gamers with its amazing visuals, it's going to mean something to have the more powerful hardware to run it on when the PC isn't a viable option, and not just because some games like RDR aren't on PC, but also because there's still a good portion of gamers that prefer the traditional console + TV and have a computer/laptop for work/browsing.
 
Last edited:

Gamezone

Gold Member
It can be as much advanced as possible, but I still care more about the games, where Microsoft has more to prove.
 
You're not wrong but previous Xbox leadership has been garbage and closed good studios while gutting others. That's not the case this time around. Allard was great, Mattrick sucked donkey dicks and put Microsoft in the position it's in now.

People seem to forget this--Mattrick showed up at the end of the 360 run and started making stupid AF decisions, then completely tanked Microsoft at their XBOne launch in 2013.

Mattrick, IIRC, was shown the door resigned from Microsoft in 2014 after people realized he was a festering turd wrapped up in dapper clothing, went on to a stable and healthy Zynga, only to completely tank the company and their stock, and left abruptly in 2015.

Any of the failures of this generation on the Microsoft side begin and end with Mattrick, and the XBO:X was a good palate cleanser for what is coming from new leadership. Will it be perfect? F*** no, nothing ever is, but it will decidedly be better than the XBO era, and likely get the company back to 360-era levels of profitability.
 
4 Billion in R&D and we had to settle for an overpriced and underperforming RSX, What could have been if the originally specced PS3 GPU was ready/delivered in 2006.......That console would have been Ken's Magnum Opus....

And yeah, Nvidia will never get console business again....They had OG XBOX and 360 business and MS still ditched them for XBONE....I guess NV suing MS for OG XBOX, wanting more money per chip, started the slide. NV, typically sells their ware for more than it's worth.....So I guess they realized they had too much in comon with MS, there's usually always friction with such compositions or similar factions.........
I love how it was almost a level headed post but you just HAD to get the dig at MS in at the end.
 

SonGoku

Member
Sony collaborating with IBM and Toshiba on the project.
Why Toshiba though? Did they have any prior experience designing GPUs
People joke on cell all the time, but most times people make jokes of things they don't understand
I think the CELL was impressive and ahead of its time, best looking PS3 exclusives owe it to CELL.
Having said that i don't think it was worth the investment, nor the frequent shoddy PS3 ports. Sony expected the CELL to take over consumer electronics that's why they justified losing billions on it.
I'd wish they would go interview Ken Kutaragi in Japan and let him give us the lowdown on what happened "tech wise" with PS3 development and his vision for it
Damn, wouldn't that be something, but knowing Sony he might have signed NDAs
Personally I felt double cell would have been great and thought single cell alone showed how impressive it was with PS3 exclusives.
Wait what? Im confused now, a few pages back someone claimed the double cell was never a thing, they were designing a GPU with Toshiba.
 

ethomaz

Banned
Why Toshiba though? Did they have any prior experience designing GPUs
Because Cell was designed to be used in TVs, Sound System, Videogames, etc etc... all products that Toshiba sells.
And Cell was first and foremost a CPU with high parallelism... Toshiba has experience in CPUs like the SpursEngine.
 
Last edited:
People seem to forget this--Mattrick showed up at the end of the 360 run and started making stupid AF decisions, then completely tanked Microsoft at their XBOne launch in 2013.

Mattrick, IIRC, was shown the door resigned from Microsoft in 2014 after people realized he was a festering turd wrapped up in dapper clothing, went on to a stable and healthy Zynga, only to completely tank the company and their stock, and left abruptly in 2015.

Any of the failures of this generation on the Microsoft side begin and end with Mattrick, and the XBO:X was a good palate cleanser for what is coming from new leadership. Will it be perfect? F*** no, nothing ever is, but it will decidedly be better than the XBO era, and likely get the company back to 360-era levels of profitability.


Allard was the best, Mattrick was the worst. Allard was just a dude, gaming, balling, making cash.

Rattrick was a rat in a suit, in a suit. The guy was pure sleazeball corporate ball-washing pickle-smoocher.

The only thing is...Microsoft's presentations are still sleazeball stats and powerpoint. From new partnership announcements to car unveils to stats and figures. 80% of Microsoft presentations are boardroom bollox or cringefests.

I hope that changes
 
I don't know but if I have to guess Lockhart is a cheaper option for 1080p with CPU compatibility with the stronger brother... something that Xbox One X is not.


No visuals but the CPU won't be a limitator factor.

With the same CPU you will only scale graphics between the two models.

This seems like the most common sense plan and hopefully what they are doing. That way people who aren't on 4k tvs or just want to save money can still jump into the new gen day one but not have to pay the premium price. Makes total sense to me but we'll see if MS fucks it up.

I dont think youre the only one confused. MS is just throwing as much crap at the wall as they can hoping, praying something sticks. Youre a hardcore gamer posting on forums, you are in the know and are confused, Imagine how the average Joe will feel walking into walmart with 5 or 6 xbox SKUs to pick from.

MS certainly is throwing a lot of crap at the wall for a company who hasn't announced literally anything other than the existence of 2 skus for the next gen Xbox. Take a step back and few deep breaths and you'll feel better.
 

SonGoku

Member
Are you trolling at this point?
No, you are just contradicting yourself. You claimed that MS would produce 5 million Sneks first year because of EUV yields
335mm² dies at 60% yield is 17k functioning chips per hour at 7nm+ using the new NXE:3400C from ASML
120 hours or 5 days are needed for 2 million.
So whats stopping Sony from using it then?
More than I could name because AI can be trained to do a lot but for the lower power Xbox it could be used for super resolution upscaling from 1080P to 4K & for raytracing & volume rendering it can be used to denoise the image .
We know all of this (except bolded) from Nvidia Turing PR, care to expand on volume rendering?
Because Cell was designed to be used in TVs, Sound System, Videogames, etc etc... all products that Toshiba sells.
And Cell was first and foremost a CPU with high parallelism... Toshiba has experience in CPUs like the SpursEngine.
Im confused now, somebody said something about Toshiba designing the GPU.
 
Last edited:
Wait...quite a few of the PS4 exclusives early on *WERE* last gen games, though.
Are you speaking to remasters and the like? If so, I think a certain level of leeway is given to remasters. But if God of War, Horizon Zero Dawn, Uncharted 4, the Order, Spiderman, so on and so forth looked like previous gen games I don't think they would have sold as much as their gameplay is rather samey with some minor nuances here and there. I'm not saying they aren't fun, but part of their greatness is their graphics and subtle details which make them more immersive and the ability to stand there and say "damn that looks good" while taking a pic in photo mode, sharing with friends and enticing them to purchase.

Basically what I'm trying to say is that hardware matters and having the beefiest hunk of plastic under your TV makes all the difference as it's the tool that sells those games and makes it easier for people to give them a chance.
 

Urantian

Neo Member
Another day, another attempt to come into a thread to talk about gaming stuff, another long line of people arguing about how their "guy" is better.
This is why I visit less and less. No adults here, not even gamers, just children trying to justify purchases who don't talk games, but talk shit.
 

SonGoku

Member
Basically what I'm trying to say is that hardware matters and having the beefiest hunk of plastic under your TV makes all the difference as it's the tool that sells those games and makes it easier for people to give them a chance.
I think we can all agree with this. If Sony pushed a rushed and weak PS5 with only 16GB and 8TF, I would personally boycott such a machine.
But if PS5 delivers 24GB & 12TF for $399 vs Snek 24GB (slightly higher bandwidth) & 14TF for $499. Games would look and run the same except from some slight resolution differences.
 
Last edited:

REDRZA MWS

Member
I dont think youre the only one confused. MS is just throwing as much crap at the wall as they can hoping, praying something sticks. Youre a hardcore gamer posting on forums, you are in the know and are confused, Imagine how the average Joe will feel walking into walmart with 5 or 6 xbox SKUs to pick from.

MS isn’t doing any of this. It’s internet “insiders” and pundits. MS will tell you their plans at E3 in June.
 

Gamernyc78

Banned
Just imagine if the final hw for PS5 is more powerful than the next xbox. Fanboys would commit harakiri. Lol

Or come up with bs secret sauces, shit like dx__ in games being a super game changer in the new xbox, hidden gpus, continued cloud computing tht will exponentially make Xbox a beast etc lol anything. Trust me they won't give up the delusions. Mister media and his disciples never stopped lol Crackdown 3 had a clan of scapegoaters telling us the downgrade wasn't real and the graphics were insane 😂😂😂😂😂😭😭😭
 

Gamernyc78

Banned
MS isn’t doing any of this. It’s internet “insiders” and pundits. MS will tell you their plans at E3 in June.

Microsoft has a tendency of being hyperbolic and using alot of smoke and mirrors when talking about their plans/projects. I take nothing they say at face value. Good examples: Milo, Kinect and it's fake, doctored precise videos, Cloud compute and it making Xbox exponentially more powerful, Cloud destructubility initial videos of crackdown compared to tht falsehood we got in CD3. I'm all ears though and looking forward to seeing what they bring forth.
 

REDRZA MWS

Member
Microsoft has a tendency of being hyperbolic and using alot of smoke and mirrors when talking about their plans/projects. I take nothing they say at face value. Good examples: Milo, Kinect and it's fake, doctored precise videos, Cloud compute and it making Xbox exponentially more powerful, Cloud destructubility initial videos of crackdown compared to tht falsehood we got in CD3. I'm all ears though and looking forward to seeing what they bring forth.

Just like Sony and it’s “emotion engine”, the “power of the cell”, the addition of the expensive and slow, now terribly failing bluray. List goes on and on for both.

Point is as of right now, the Cerny interview about the PS5 is the ONLY concrete evidence about a next gen console. Everything else is speculation, internet “insiders” and pundits. You will hear more about what MS next gen consoles and plans are in June.

Lastly, this is all very tiring. Ill be there day 0 for both as i always am. Could care less which box has slightly more power than the other. I want to play next gen MLB the Show and Halo Infinite.
 

Gamernyc78

Banned
Just like Sony and it’s “emotion engine”, the “power of the cell”, the addition of the expensive and slow, now terribly failing bluray. List goes on and on for both.

Point is as of right now, the Cerny interview about the PS5 is the ONLY concrete evidence about a next gen console. Everything else is speculation, internet “insiders” and pundits. You will hear more about what MS next gen consoles and plans are in June.

Lastly, this is all very tiring. Ill be there day 0 for both as i always am. Could care less which box has slightly more power than the other. I want to play next gen MLB the Show and Halo Infinite.
Blu Ray-was worth it and at the time a standalone was like 1000 and allowed for bigger games.

The Cell-Once first party devs figured it out the games they put out ppl couldn't believe and were graphical benchmarks in most of their genres from GOW, to Killzone 2 looking better than anything Halo and Uncharted 2 looking better than Gears and doing stuff ppl couldn't believe.

But I don't disagree tht all companies do these PR claims and hyperbole but Microsoft has just been in another league.

Either which way I'm definitely PS5 and keeping a close eye on Microsoft. Looking for a differentiator to make me take the jump as a slightly more powerful console won't do it for me. Gamepass and it's future features could be tht differentiator.
 

thelastword

Banned
Why Toshiba though? Did they have any prior experience designing GPUs
All prior Sony Systems were done in-house, the engineers were going to design the graphics system using cell....It's high bandwidth alone would lend to some impressive results...Moreover, cell was more than just playstation, the intention was for cell adoption in TV's, medical equipment, entertainment centers etc......They envisaged lots coming from the investment apart from PS for all partners involved, it's just that it didn't pan out as they wanted, PS was suppose to be the driver.......This is why I believe; if PS3 had double cell and run out the gate screaming, and if they launched on time with a more attractive pricepoint, cell technology may have taken off on quite a few devices as planned, where all partners would have reaped the rewards....Perhaps cell, would have evolved to something even bigger now........Yet, the only product we know that pushed cell was a $600 system which did not burst out of the blocks, so that hindered momentum for the vision and adoption across the divide....

I think the CELL was impressive and ahead of its time, best looking PS3 exclusives owe it to CELL.
Having said that i don't think it was worth the investment, nor the frequent shoddy PS3 ports. Sony expected the CELL to take over consumer electronics that's why they justified losing billions on it.
Well with all that bandwidth, better framerates and effects could have been a possibility, so perhaps we would not have been downtrodden by bad ports as such....The raw power and bandwidth would have been there....And of course, eventually, most devs would tune up.....Gabe hated the PS3, but eventually he came over, I think double cell would have worked better than RSX for the simple fact it would have had more raw power......

Damn, wouldn't that be something, but knowing Sony he might have signed NDAs
Tbh, I thought about that too, but it's been years already and PS5 is approaching, I think they can give us some info on PS3...I'd say, you probably would not share that information just after the PS3 gen ended....but PS3 is done and dusted right now, since a second gen is appraoching after PS3.....So they can definitely talk about it now......

[/QUOTE]
Wait what? Im confused now, a few pages back someone claimed the double cell was never a thing, they were designing a GPU with Toshiba.
[/QUOTE]It wasn't just the GPU, they collaborated and were partners on every aspect of the design......


Or come up with bs secret sauces, shit like dx__ in games being a super game changer in the new xbox, hidden gpus, continued cloud computing tht will exponentially make Xbox a beast etc lol anything. Trust me they won't give up the delusions. Mister media and his disciples never stopped lol Crackdown 3 had a clan of scapegoaters telling us the downgrade wasn't real and the graphics were insane 😂😂😂😂😂😭😭😭
Anaconda could be an 8TF box just barely better than XBONEX and people would defend it...Speak of how balanced it is...and how it supports 480fps monitors, even though games would barely do 4k 60fps with such a spec....They would spout 480Hz monitor support as the reason to own the box.......I know, I've seen people touting XBONEX's 120Hz support as holy grail material, when the console struggles with dynamic 4k, sub 30fps and tearing in many games.....
 

SonGoku

Member
It wasn't just the GPU, they collaborated and were partners on every aspect of the design......
Ok but i need an explanation on the second cell/gpu part, im getting conflicting reports:
  1. Double CELL was the original plan
  2. Double CELL was never a thing and Sony was designing a GPU with Toshiba that didn't pan out.
So which one is it? Now I understand this info isn't publicly available so we can only speculate but what is the prevailing theory on this aspect?
 
Ok but i need an explanation on the second cell/gpu part, im getting conflicting reports:
  1. Double CELL was the original plan
  2. Double CELL was never a thing and Sony was designing a GPU with Toshiba that didn't pan out.
So which one is it? Now I understand this info isn't publicly available so we can only speculate but what is the prevailing theory on this aspect?
I'm not sure, some of the rumors from that era suggested a second cell modified with basic rendering functions.

But they're just rumors
Why Toshiba though? Did they have any prior experience designing GPUs
I think toshiba was involved in ps2's emotion engine design with sony which had vector graphic operations processing. Not sure if they contributed to the ps2's graphic synthesizer.
 
Last edited:
Ok but i need an explanation on the second cell/gpu part, im getting conflicting reports:
  1. Double CELL was the original plan
  2. Double CELL was never a thing and Sony was designing a GPU with Toshiba that didn't pan out.
So which one is it? Now I understand this info isn't publicly available so we can only speculate but what is the prevailing theory on this aspect?

Second Cell was never in any design docs or patents, someone from Sony stated that double cell was considered, but not at the "was supposed to happen" level.

Also what does this have to do with the thread title or the OP?
 

THE:MILKMAN

Member
Second Cell was never in any design docs or patents, someone from Sony stated that double cell was considered, but not at the "was supposed to happen" level.

Also what does this have to do with the thread title or the OP?

Just to add to this because I've read a lot of 'RSX was a last minute thing'.

The collab between Sony and Nvidia was publicly announced in December 2004 in which it is said they (Nvidia) had already spent 2 years working on the project.

https://www.nvidia.com/object/IO_17342.html
 

mckmas8808

Mckmaster uses MasterCard to buy Slave drives
This seems like the most common sense plan and hopefully what they are doing. That way people who aren't on 4k tvs or just want to save money can still jump into the new gen day one but not have to pay the premium price. Makes total sense to me but we'll see if MS fucks it up.



MS certainly is throwing a lot of crap at the wall for a company who hasn't announced literally anything other than the existence of 2 skus for the next gen Xbox. Take a step back and few deep breaths and you'll feel better.

Think about what you are saying here for a moment. Don't allow people to tell you that Lockhart and Anaconda are just resolution differences away from being the same console. They are not. At least not with the rumored hardware that they have.

Also....think about this. When the PS3 launch it also had 2 skus. A $499 PS3 with a 20 GB HDD and a $599 with a 60 GB HDD. That was the only difference (well something with fewer USB ports too but who cares lol). People called the 20 GB PS3 the PS3 Poor. It was a PR nightmare than Sony bailed out of super quick.

You think MS will be able to shake the Xbox Next Poor label for Lockhart? Think about it. Lockhart will have no disc drive, half the RAM, half the HDD space, a GPU that's 65% or more weaker, and less bandwidth. And how much cheaper do you really think they'll sell this console for? $100 less? Maybe, but who would buy it if it cost $399? It wouldn't be worth it. Any hardcore gamer that feels the need to spend $399 on a new console, proper already has a 4K TV or will be buying one within the next year or two. Why gimp yourself with the Xbox Next Poor? Why not just save an extra $100 and get the "REAL" Xbox Next"?
 
Think about what you are saying here for a moment. Don't allow people to tell you that Lockhart and Anaconda are just resolution differences away from being the same console. They are not. At least not with the rumored hardware that they have.

Also....think about this. When the PS3 launch it also had 2 skus. A $499 PS3 with a 20 GB HDD and a $599 with a 60 GB HDD. That was the only difference (well something with fewer USB ports too but who cares lol). People called the 20 GB PS3 the PS3 Poor. It was a PR nightmare than Sony bailed out of super quick.

You think MS will be able to shake the Xbox Next Poor label for Lockhart? Think about it. Lockhart will have no disc drive, half the RAM, half the HDD space, a GPU that's 65% or more weaker, and less bandwidth. And how much cheaper do you really think they'll sell this console for? $100 less? Maybe, but who would buy it if it cost $399? It wouldn't be worth it. Any hardcore gamer that feels the need to spend $399 on a new console, proper already has a 4K TV or will be buying one within the next year or two. Why gimp yourself with the Xbox Next Poor? Why not just save an extra $100 and get the "REAL" Xbox Next"?
Lot of assumptions based on no info here.
 

ethomaz

Banned
Just to add to this because I've read a lot of 'RSX was a last minute thing'.

The collab between Sony and Nvidia was publicly announced in December 2004 in which it is said they (Nvidia) had already spent 2 years working on the project.

https://www.nvidia.com/object/IO_17342.html
nVidia was always the GPU maker for PS3.

What happened is that the project of the GPU exclusive to PS3 won't be read in time so nVidia choose to get the G80 arch and modify at last minute to supply Sony.

RSX was suppose to be more custom and more like the next-generation architecture of nVidia but it ended being a capped G80/G81 GPU.

That is why I guess people says it was a "last minute thing".

PS. I'm just remembering from my mind... so I'm not sure if it was G80/G81 at time... it is over 10 years ago.
 
Last edited:

onQ123

Member
We know all of this (except bolded) from Nvidia Turing PR, care to expand on volume rendering?

Instead of using a bunch of triangles to make it appear as if you have a 3D object on the screen Volume rendering actually use 3D objects to make the images.


it would take 12 triangles to make a cube but a cube can be made using only 1 voxel , but then again you will never see all sides of a cube on a screen at one time so I should probably say 6 triangles to make up a cube. creating other 3D objects use even more triangles but can be made with one or more volumes & since these 3D objects can be made at the sub-pixel level the noise also need to be cleaned up at a sub-pixel level.
 
Instead of using a bunch of triangles to make it appear as if you have a 3D object on the screen Volume rendering actually use 3D objects to make the images.


it would take 12 triangles to make a cube but a cube can be made using only 1 voxel , but then again you will never see all sides of a cube on a screen at one time so I should probably say 6 triangles to make up a cube. creating other 3D objects use even more triangles but can be made with one or more volumes & since these 3D objects can be made at the sub-pixel level the noise also need to be cleaned up at a sub-pixel level.

would that be related to this?
 
Last edited:
Allard was the best, Mattrick was the worst. Allard was just a dude, gaming, balling, making cash.

Rattrick was a rat in a suit, in a suit. The guy was pure sleazeball corporate ball-washing pickle-smoocher.

The only thing is...Microsoft's presentations are still sleazeball stats and powerpoint. From new partnership announcements to car unveils to stats and figures. 80% of Microsoft presentations are boardroom bollox or cringefests.

I hope that changes

And Sony isn't?

Let's be honest with ourselves: Sony and Microsoft are both sides of the same coin--only difference is that the former failed to successfully diversify (though their assets still held worth and saved Sony Entertainment as a whole when they were sold off), and the latter was able to successfully diversify their business portfolio. They both have crappy corporate policies, have made mistakes, and use PowerPoint and business men out of touch with their core audiences to promote products.

The former had their backs (fiscally-speaking) against the wall starting this gen and came out successful after a less-than-successful prior gen, while the latter promoted a rat in a suit, got burned by it, but put someone in that doesn't have their head lodged in their rectum, and they're turning the ship around (and are afforded the luxury of doing this by virtue of their vast successful portfolio).
 
Last edited:

SonGoku

Member
Instead of using a bunch of triangles to make it appear as if you have a 3D object on the screen Volume rendering actually use 3D objects to make the images.


it would take 12 triangles to make a cube but a cube can be made using only 1 voxel , but then again you will never see all sides of a cube on a screen at one time so I should probably say 6 triangles to make up a cube. creating other 3D objects use even more triangles but can be made with one or more volumes & since these 3D objects can be made at the sub-pixel level the noise also need to be cleaned up at a sub-pixel level.
But you don't need AI for voxels, how does AI benefit volume rendering?
 

Dabaus

Banned
Microsoft has a tendency of being hyperbolic and using alot of smoke and mirrors when talking about their plans/projects. I take nothing they say at face value. Good examples: Milo, Kinect and it's fake, doctored precise videos, Cloud compute and it making Xbox exponentially more powerful, Cloud destructubility initial videos of crackdown compared to tht falsehood we got in CD3. I'm all ears though and looking forward to seeing what they bring forth.

Im sure it will be a good show but i expect the Next gen/cloud streaming segment to the the "killzone 2" reveal of the generation in that they will make hyperbolic, over the top, un provable or measurable claims about their next gen hardware.
 
But you don't need AI for voxels, how does AI benefit volume rendering?

I imagine just like you can upsample a 2d image you might be able to do something akin to deeplearning supersampling for a 3d voxel representation, creating a higher voxel count with ai or procedurally. Might even be possible with fractal upscaling too.
 
Last edited:

SonGoku

Member
What happened is that the project of the GPU exclusive to PS3 won't be read in time so nVidia choose to get the G80 arch and modify at last minute to supply Sony.

RSX was suppose to be more custom and more like the next-generation architecture of nVidia but it ended being a capped G80/G81 GPU.
Not at all, if that was the case RSX would had been a beast
RSX is G70/G71 arch, essentially a cut down 7800gtx
Just to add to this because I've read a lot of 'RSX was a last minute thing'.

The collab between Sony and Nvidia was publicly announced in December 2004 in which it is said they (Nvidia) had already spent 2 years working on the project.

https://www.nvidia.com/object/IO_17342.html
Wow So there is no defending nvidia after all, they fucked Sony over with a obsolete overpriced chip
 

ethomaz

Banned
Not at all, if that was the case RSX would had been a beast
RSX is G70/G71 arch, essentially a cut down 7800gtx

Wow So there is no defending nvidia after all, they fucked Sony over with a obsolete overpriced chip
You just confirmed I was wrong with the codename like I said at the end of my post.

So RSX was suppose to be based in a new gen arch from nVidia but ended at last minute a capped G70/G71.
 
Top Bottom