And lets get one thing straight about Koizumi and his insistence on adding more story to Mario. One of the games Koizumi directed was Mario Sunshine, and that game was straight up embarrassing when it came to telling a story. You had to sit through cutscenes of Mario listening to a talking water pack that ended up displaying more character than the game's star protagonist. It was awful.
But that's your opinion. I loved the cut scenes and story of Sunshine. I was disappointed Mario Galaxy didn't have much of that going on. I also enjoyed the voice acting. I was replaying Sunshine last month and am STILL enjoying everything it had to offer. So I hope Koizumi can do things like that again. It was great and amazing and would love for that to return. It gave Mario that "AAA" feel.
This thread is hilarious. Whenever a game is criticized for violence or misogyny, gamers left and right argue to leave the creative vision to the creators. Here people want the opposite because the creative vision isn't to their liking.
I am on opposite end of the spectrum as I cannot find a single redeeming quality about it. It remains the only entry I have not completed. I saw no creativity whatsoever. The characters were bland, no sense of population...hell the game begins with an important ceremony around a goddess and then only three people attend...
environments are cliche: Green, fire, water...been there done that. And despite this limitation, they have you reenter these environments repeatedly!
Fetch quests: how do they help?
There are some very strong and valid reasons why people such as myself despise it.
You did not play long enough or you would know that the water element was handled in its most creative way in possibly any video game to date. (Hint: Water was never an element of a dungeon nor was it an area)
We've got a lot of Tezuka lately and people weren't too impressed by that lol (NSMB).
Though I hope he gives good advice to GoodFeel to make Yarn Yoshi awesome. (For once, the WiiU project is more promising than the 3DS title)
You did not play long enough or you would know that the water element was handled in its most creative way in possibly any video game to date. (Hint: Water was never an element of a dungeon nor was it an area)
ALttP: Fantastic game. The dungeons, visual design, sound effects, and mechanics were all wonderful. Story was pretty good, too. OoT: Fantastic game. Graphics were killer at the time. Scope was huge. Story was engaging. Best finale in the series. I still get chills from the music and atmosphere. MM: Fantastic game (that I didn't quite finish because of life). The atmosphere is the game's strongest point. The Song of Healing is one of my favorite game compositions ever. Masks were pretty fun. WW: ?? [I haven't played it yet. Considering getting the HD version.] TP: Fantastic game. I loved Midna as a character. Scope was huge. I didn't notice the emptiness that others complain of. Best mode of travel in the series, as I loved the horseback swordplay. The floating temple is particularly memorable. SS: Fantastic game. Motion controls worked extremely well (except the thrust) and made the combat the most engaging in the series so far.
Sailing on the desert ocean for the first time
was one of the biggest "wow" moments I've ever had in gaming. The art was just gorgeous (I hated it at the reveal, but it eventually clicked with me). Upgrade system, bug system, potion crafting, etc. were all very fun additions. Fully orchestrated soundtrack really was nice.
"But wait," you say, "X had Y flaws." Yes, it does. Every one of those games has flaws. But their merits so far outweigh their flaws that they're all still wonderful. It takes some serious focus on flaws to drop any one of those games below "great" status.
Imo they should rotate their best talent between several of their major franchises. Always having the same leads on the same franchise is a good way to dry them out creatively. Why not create healthy competition and stimulate new approaches by alternating staff? Keep things a bit fresher.
Imo they should rotate their best talent between several of their major franchises. Always having the same leads on the same franchise is a good way to dry them out creatively. Why not create healthy competition and stimulate new approaches by alternating staff? Keep things a bit fresher.
This seems reasonable, but you do run the issue of longer dev times as people have to ramp up in making fundamentally different games as opposed to games that have a similar core concept with different execution.
Not that I'm against the idea altogether. I'd be curious to see a Koizumi Zelda or a Aonuma Mario, but I'm not sure that management would consider that the most efficient use of resources.
Imo they should rotate their best talent between several of their major franchises. Always having the same leads on the same franchise is a good way to dry them out creatively. Why not create healthy competition and stimulate new approaches by alternating staff? Keep things a bit fresher.
This isn't how Nintendo (or more specifically, Miyamoto) think about games. Whether or not he is right or wrong is up to you, but they use their IPs to drive gameplay, not gameplay to drive their IPs. That's why each of their IPs roughly stays within the same genre of game, only evolving with new gameplay ideas and never pushing out to include other genres.
This seems reasonable, but you do run the issue of longer dev times as people have to ramp up in making fundamentally different games as opposed to games that have a similar core concept with different execution.
Not that I'm against the idea altogether. I'd be curious to see a Koizumi Zelda or a Aonuma Mario, but I'm not sure that management would consider that the most efficient use of resources.
There used to be tons of crossover between the main staff on Mario and Zelda, and that's when the series was the most creatively vital and well balanced imo. We're talking about some of the most talented developers in the world, I don't think switching between platformers and adventure games is going to stretch them beyond their abilities or hinder production.
I do think there's already a trend, and a continuing danger, in series becoming stale if they lean on the same themes and concepts too often, and continually using the same staff on the same franchise every time almost guarantees a lack of perspective and that certain concepts will invariably be stretched thin.At this point there are several people at Nintendo I would rather have at the helm of the next Zelda than Aonuma. Too many of the same fundamental design flaws keep recurring under his watch. Give the poor guy some new stimulation and time to recharge his batteries on Zelda. His next effort in the series would probably only be stronger for it. As it is I'm anticipating a new Zelda that repeats all the same mistakes that have been stumbling blocks to my enjoyment since Wind Waker.
This may sound too harsh but I think Nintendo entirely is not in need of Miyamoto anymore. I also think Zelda may not need Aonuma either. In fact I am quite sure that what Zelda needs is not having Aonuma.
It suffers from padding and some hand-holding, but its certainly not short of some brilliant moments. The dungeons are really fascinating and some of the best in the series, I enjoyed the motion controls, some cool items and mechanics throughout...
I liked Skyward Sword. I also hated how the Sky was empty as hell and every area essentially was a dungeon. Very disjointed. Didn't feel like Hyrule all that much. Maybe that was the point I guess.
I liked Skyward Sword. I also hated how the Sky was empty as hell and every area essentially was a dungeon. Very disjointed. Didn't feel like Hyrule all that much. Maybe that was the point I guess.
I think that very much was the point. While the world didn't feel as "organic" or lived-in as in something like OOT or MM, from a purely game design perspective, I thought those areas were fascinating to run around in and explore. The opening forest area felt like one big playground like the first stage in Mario 64. Lots of little things to just mess around with, see where you could go, find shortcuts, etc.
I think that may actually be a better comparison now that I think about it. If you just replaced Mario 64's castle with Skyward Sword's sky section, you basically have these fairly confined areas that stand on their own, not necessarily as parts of a world as Zelda games usually feel like, but basically as levels. Like the paintings, I suppose.
It's a shame the sky wasn't NEARLY as fun to explore as the Castle in Mario 64 was, but that said, I think that kinda better frames what they were trying to do with Skyward Sword.
I think that very much was the point. While the world didn't feel as "organic" or lived-in as in something like OOT or MM, from a purely game design perspective, I thought those areas were fascinating to run around in and explore. The opening forest area felt like one big playground like the first stage in Mario 64. Lots of little things to just mess around with, see where you could go, find shortcuts, etc.
I think that may actually be a better comparison now that I think about it. If you just replaced Mario 64's castle with Skyward Sword's sky section, you basically have these fairly confined areas that stand on their own, not necessarily as parts of a world as Zelda games usually feel like, but basically as levels. Like the paintings, I suppose.
It's a shame the sky wasn't NEARLY as fun to explore as the Castle in Mario 64 was, but that said, I think that kinda better frames what they were trying to do with Skyward Sword.
Koizumi's strength is arguably as a storywriter, he was responsible for it in Link's Awakening, Ocarina of Time and Majora's Mask - probably the three games in the series with the strongest and most engaging plot and characters. He also was responsible for Rosalina and the Luma's story in Super Mario Galaxy.
Now you tell me that his talent isn't being wasted on the Mario series, where the most plot you'll pretty much ever get is "oh no Peach captured by Bowser again". The interview with Koizumi which was linked earlier in this topic tells you all you need to know, particularly this snippet:
YK: You’re right, EAD doesn’t tend to focus on the big story in most of their games. But I was the one coming up with scenarios, just on my own, ever since the time of Link’s Awakening. But even at that time, I felt like I came up with this entire scenario and a backstory for Link, but nobody really seemed to care. They were always saying, let’s not try to push the story forward too much.
So I would sort of try to find sneaky ways to get it in without them noticing too much. For example, I always liked the idea of you coming upon another character and hearing little bits of conversation that slowly begin to reveal different parts of the story. And that was the way that I tried to work on Ocarina of Time and Majora’s Mask. A lot of the EAD games that do seem to have a lot of story, a lot of that came from my influence. But those are aspects of the games that Miyamoto wasn’t nearly as fond of and occasionally didn’t like.
While it wasn't a bad game by any means, it could have been better. Game was way too easy and straightforward. The constant annoyance that is Fi also hurt the game for me. Boss fights were an improvement over prior entries but they were still pretty easy.
lookin at the last page...yeah, i called it, tingle's game was used as an example of "kiddie zelda". we didn't even get that one, but it's still inevitable, somehow.
Yeah, it was a great soundtrack. However, I don't think it had as strong of melodies as some of the other entries. After playing OoT once, for example, I could hum the melodies of tons of songs (the Ocarina probably helped solidify them, but even songs you don't play like Gerudo Valley stuck).
By the way, did anyone else get an American Beauty vibe from the Fi's Farewell song?
i think that koizumi should do zelda, aonuma should do some new thing, and the nsmb/pikmin guys should do the next 3d mario.
it would also be cool if miyamoto really was running his own mini studio making games like in the nes days for eshop stuff. of course his ideas wind up being made into full productions because they tend to sell that well, so maybe it won't happen.
as far as skyward sword is concerned: it has a really clever way of progression. the backtracking is almost never bad, and the entire game is structured very very similarly to the super mario galaxy titles. it has a bland overworld and too much handholding, but my biggest issue with the game is the lack of motion controls within the puzzles. as in, there is pretty much nothing of the sort. the only motion controls in the puzzles are how you manipulate your weapon or item to solve a problem. some more zack and wiki type thinking would have made those dungeons truly special. however, that final dungeon is a certain kind of awesome for me.
Yoichi Yamada is another likely canditate to take the reigns of the series with Kozuimi busy with other projects and Tezuka getting old while having not worked on a zelda game since FSA. His credentials:
The Legend of Zelda series
Zelda II: The Adventure of Link (1987) – director
The Legend of Zelda: A Link to the Past (1991) – assistant director
The Legend of Zelda: Ocarina of Time (1998) - game system director
The Legend of Zelda: Majora's Mask (2000) - memory management director
The Legend of Zelda: Oracle of Seasons-Ages - supervisor
The Legend of Zelda: The Wind Waker (2002) – assistant director
The Legend of Zelda: The Minish Cap - supervisor
The Legend of Zelda: Twilight Princess (2006) - sub-director
The Legend of Zelda: Phantom Hourglass (2007) - supervisor
Links Crossbow Training (2007) - assistant Director
The Legend of Zelda: Spirit Tracks (2009) - supervisor
The Legend of Zelda: Skyward Sword (2011) - Lead Planner
Other games
Star Fox - Assistant Director,Course Designer
Star Fox 2 - Assistant Director,Course Designer
Super Mario 64 - Course Director
Wave Race 64 - Cinema Scene Director
Pikmin - Debug
Luigi's Mansion - Assistant Director
Fujibayashi (director and or writer on SS, OOX games, FS, PH and MC) is actually more likely I think being much younger than the other candidates but still highly experienced. Personally, I would still prefer Yamada if it was between the two though I know yamada is much older so that could be a factor in whether he is takes the role and how long for if he does.
Koizumi's strength is arguably as a storywriter, he was responsible for it in Link's Awakening, Ocarina of Time and Majora's Mask - probably the three games in the series with the strongest and most engaging plot and characters. He also was responsible for Rosalina and the Luma's story in Super Mario Galaxy.
Now you tell me that his talent isn't being wasted on the Mario series, where the most plot you'll pretty much ever get is "oh no Peach captured by Bowser again". The interview with Koizumi which was linked earlier in this topic tells you all you need to know, particularly this snippet:
That interview makes me so sad. As far as I'm concerned Sakurai and Koizumi are the two most talented people working for Nintendo right now. That they're not utilizing their talents properly is downright depressing.
To me, Sakurai isn't in the list because he's not properly a "corporate" developer. I wouldn't be too surpirsed to see him develop, later, even for non-Nintendo platforms. Or, even avoiding to push this too far, I know that he has a lot of freedom in his projects (and how handle them)
Btw, I firmly believe that Myiamoto should retire after his latest IP (next year?), and let the following being...themselves:
Aonuma
Koizumi
Konno
Eguchi
Tezuka
Shimizu
Let them work on established franchises (Zelda, Mario New-3D-Galaxy, Animal Crossing, Kart), testing them with other known franchises and giving them freedom for a new IP each.
That interview makes me so sad. As far as I'm concerned Sakurai and Koizumi are the two most talented people working for Nintendo right now. That they're not utilizing their talents properly is downright depressing.
Imo they should rotate their best talent between several of their major franchises. Always having the same leads on the same franchise is a good way to dry them out creatively. Why not create healthy competition and stimulate new approaches by alternating staff? Keep things a bit fresher.
Because these series have a "feel" to them that gamers know, and you can't just walk in cold and make a Mario game? The history of gaming is littered with people who have tried, almost nobody ever nails it. It takes years to get that down.
I just wish it had Classic Controller support. I loved almost everything about that game, except for flying (worse than sailing). Having to motion control the bird was just goofy. And the sword motions were tough for me. Link would do horizontal slashes when I tried for diagonals, and I could hardly ever get the stab motion to work.
I enjoyed the game and played it to completion, but I'll probably never re-play it because of the things I found frustrating.
People who decry SS for its padding have to realize WW and TP were much worse in this regard. Aonuma is a terrible director and should not direct another Zelda ever again if it were up to me.
There is absolutely no way Link's awakening's humor is "tongue in check" while the other SS is cute all over, if anything it is completely the other way around.
Also, Tp is just as serious, if not more so, than LTTP.And MM is one of the darkest games in the series.
I guess your point went over my head as well because I just don't get what you are trying to prove.
Well, I usually thought of there being some lovably "queer" characters like Happy Mask Guy, but as soon as I saw those Lake Hylia guys in Twilight Princess and Girahim, I thought "Okay, they've gone full on gay." Come to think of it, doesn't Tetra have a flamboyant crew member? Okay, looks like Zelda's had "queer" characters for a while now. edit: Oh duh! Tingle appeared in Majora's Mask, how could I forget.
Different departments. I don't think they've ever actually worked on a game together (maybe apart from both having some influence on the original Metroid Prime).
, not the entire series.
