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[Ourobolus]

The key here is that you insist on Verelios being taken out first. You're consistent on this front. The most convincing argument you could make is to lynch yourself first to prove your role claim, and then we lynch Verelios/Ezekel on your word. Would you be willing to make this sacrifice?

If we're really gonna go that route, then fine. But if I go, lynch both Verelios and Zeke.

I just think it's a pointless sacrifice since my ability can still be useful. But sure, 2-for-1 scum/town trade is a good deal.

 

[nin1000]

We aren't as close as we used to be.

Since I am Town, I read this as either.

You being scum

Or

You being neutral

Can you clear out what you meant by this please ? Was it me not being as active the reason you wanting to vote me out ?

 

[EzekelRAGE]

The key here is that you insist on Verelios being taken out first. You're consistent on this front. The most convincing argument you could make is to lynch yourself first to prove your role claim, and then we lynch Verelios/Ezekel on your word. Would you be willing to make this sacrifice?

Exactly! He has posted many times that a 1 for 1 trade is defineitly worth it. Well if he dies first to prove he is WM then that effectively gives town a 2 for 1. Me for lying about WM and him for his real cop read of Vere.

 

[Haly]

VOTE: Ourobolus

 

[Ourobolus]

VOTE: Ourobolus

Sigh.

 

[Bronx-Man]

Between these three there is definitely scum, maybe even a neutral. The tricky part is figuring out which order we should lynch them in though.

 

[Ourobolus]

For the record, if this does go down.

Top scum, in order:
Verelios
EzekelRAGE
Barrylocke
Ty4on
Burbeting

Lynching Verelios gets you a scum kill. Lynching Zeke gets you a likely scum kill. Lynching me kills a town.

Top town (no order):
Mazre
cabot
nin1000
Haly
Sophia

 

[EzekelRAGE]

No. My claim, character-wise, is irrelevant to this discussion. We can deal with you next since you are falsely claiming Widowmaker to counter my claim to try and save your buddy. Verelios flipping scum tells us two things - I am telling the truth, and you are full of it. Let's say, in a fantasy world, that I flip something else - what does that tell us? Nothing. I'm town, whether you like it or not, so even if you were the real Widowmaker, it doesn't tell us anything.

But characters don't matter in this game according to Sorian. Who cares who WM is? All that matters is town and scum. I'm town, I saw that Verelios was scum. The fact that you are so earnestly trying to save him only leads me to believe that you are scum as well. Now, what hero you are, I have no idea- all that matters is that you and he are scum.

I was too tired to notice you started the backpedaling of being widow way early this morning lol.

 

[WhereAreMahDragonz]

Jesus Christ this is getting old

I trust Ouro's claim more than I trust Zeke. My vote stays.

 

[Ourobolus]

I was too tired to notice you started the backpedaling of being widow way early this morning lol.

Who's backpedalling? You can keep ringing that bell, but I'm just answering your counterclaim. Even though the scenario is impossible, I'll still respond to you and your misguided allegations.

 

[Burbeting]

Zeke's later posts have given me the vibe of "lynch ouro or me, as long as Verelious is not lynched"-

 

[EzekelRAGE]

Who's backpedalling? You can keep ringing that bell, but I'm just answering your counterclaim. Even though the scenario is impossible, I'll still respond to you and your misguided allegations.

Where is your list of scenarios?

 

[melonrabbit]

Since I am Town, I read this as either.

You being scum

Or

You being neutral

Neither of these things is true. I've just noticed a change. Activity level? Sure. But also in other ways I can't quite articulate yet. Regardless, it is best resolved at a later date.

 

[WhereAreMahDragonz]

Zeke's later posts have given me the vibe of "lynch ouro or me, as long as Verelious is not lynched"-

Yes, but why?

I am so confused.

 

[Ourobolus]

Where is your list of scenarios?

Is this like a trick question or are you just not reading my posts since the day began

 

[melonrabbit]

Zeke's later posts have given me the vibe of "lynch ouro or me, as long as Verelious is not lynched"-

Kinda where I'm at.

The fact he's become V's lawyer and star witness is telling.

 

[Burbeting]

Yes, but why?

I am so confused.

No idea. Like I said before, I can't see a scum motivation to do this. At D2, no scum would be so visibly protecting their scum teammate.

 

[Burbeting]

Maybe Zeke has the power Palmer had in Star Wars? Neutral who has to protect certain person?

 

[Ourobolus]

Maybe Zeke has the power Palmer had in Star Wars? Neutral who has to protect certain person?

Well he already claimed JOAT - that + Unlyncher would be a little odd, to me

 

[Burbeting]

Well he already claimed JOAT - that + Unlyncher would be a little odd, to me

Well I mean, he could be easily lying about the role. Or maybe the JOAT powers are stuff to protect his target.

 

[melonrabbit]

We won't be any closer to having reason, motive, or information to base any of these claims until we lynch V.

Some of this speculation is being manufactured by scum. And I think it might be best to keep the wild theories to a minimum until we have something to actual base any of these claims on.

 

[Bronx-Man]

If we end up lynching a townie today, we'll still have insight into which one of the three is scum. So we might as well hurry up and get this over with.

 

[melonrabbit]

I strongly disagree with rushing to hammer. We have the luxury of added time. We should use it.

 

[EzekelRAGE]

Yes, but why?

I am so confused.

Zeke's later posts have given me the vibe of "lynch ouro or me, as long as Verelious is not lynched"-

Burb/Melo/WMD Where have I said to never lynch Vere? I str8 up said we can lynch vere 2mrw.

Lynching him today says nothing about the WM claim. Vere's flip doesn't say who the real WM is.

I don't want to risk getting NK'd due to Vere's flip and it possibly giving more credit to Ouro's lie.

Is this like a trick question or are you just not reading my posts since the day began

Splinter called you out on a post where you said I could be WM, you promised to go into detail about why you said I was WM. You have yet to deliver.

 

[WhereAreMahDragonz]

Burb/Melo/WMD Where have I said to never lynch Vere? I str8 up said we can lynch vere 2mrw.

Lynching him today says nothing about the WM claim. Vere's flip doesn't say who the real WM is.

I don't want to risk getting NK'd due to Vere's flip and it possibly giving more credit to Ouro's lie.


Splinter called you out on a post where you said I could be WM, you promised to go into detail about why you said I was WM. You have yet to deliver.

If vere flips town and Ouro becomes public enemy number one, then chances are scum are gonna keep you around as a distraction to prevent his lynch. I don't think they will NK you over this counter claim.

The issue here isn't about who the real WM is. The issue here is all about alignment and motive; who is town, who is scum, and why they do the things they do.

 

[Ourobolus]

Splinter called you out on a post where you said I could be WM, you promised to go into detail about why you said I was WM. You have yet to deliver.

Are you referring to this? Because that was my answer. I've been going over the scenarios - I wasn't saying I was going to do it that post. They've been covered already.

Why are you telling us what it means for you to NOT flip Widowmaker?

I'm going to address scenarios, even the impossible ones.

 

[Burbeting]

If Verelious flips town, (and Ouro isn't a lyncher) Ouro is definitely lying. So that too can give resolution to the issue, unless you think there is some scum ouro bussing scum verelious scenario going on.

Why would scum ouro claim a role than you could easily counter? And don't give me that flavor reasoning, it's dumb.

 

[Ourobolus]

If vere flips town and Ouro becomes public enemy number one, then chances are scum are gonna keep you around as a distraction to prevent his lynch. I don't think they will NK you over this counter claim.

The issue here isn't about who the real WM is. The issue here is all about alignment and motive; who is town, who is scum, and why they do the things they do.

Not to mention it would be weird for scum to NK scum.

 

[Burbeting]

Not to mention it would be weird for scum to NK scum.

Why do you think Zeke counter-claimed you? Do you really think scum would do that just to protect their scum partner?

 

[Ourobolus]

Why do you think Zeke counter-claimed you? Do you really think scum would do that just to protect their scum partner?

I have no idea. Either Verelios is something SUPER IMPORTANT or Zeke is really, really brazen.

 

[WhereAreMahDragonz]

If Verelious flips town, (and Ouro isn't a lyncher) Ouro is definitely lying. So that too can give resolution to the issue, unless you think there is some scum ouro bussing scum verelious scenario going on.

Why would scum ouro claim a role than you could easily counter? And don't give me that flavor reasoning, it's dumb.

I mean it's possible, it happened to me in Bar, but on day 2? And a bus this hard? It would be a horrible play for scum; it kills one player and paints a huge target on the other. It does not seem like a worthwhile strategy when town isn't necessarily damaged all that much as a result.

Either Ouro is neutral or scum and bussing a lynch on town Verelios, or Ouro is town and Verelios is scum. Those are the only two scenarios I can think of that make sense.

I'm not sure how Zeke fits into all of this

 

[Xamtheking]

I have no idea. Either Verelios is something SUPER IMPORTANT or Zeke is really, really brazen.

Zeke's very headstrong

 

[EzekelRAGE]

If vere flips town and Ouro becomes public enemy number one, then chances are scum are gonna keep you around as a distraction to prevent his lynch. I don't think they will NK you over this counter claim.

The issue here isn't about who the real WM is. The issue here is all about alignment and motive; who is town, who is scum, and why they do the things they do.

Ouro's flip gives the biggest answer to the motive then. Why he lied about WM.

If Verelious flips town, (and Ouro isn't a lyncher) Ouro is definitely lying. So that too can give resolution to the issue, unless you think there is some scum ouro bussing scum verelious scenario going on.

Why would scum ouro claim a role than you could easily counter? And don't give me that flavor reasoning, it's dumb.

1) You haven't answered mine or Splinter's posts about your flavor comment.

2) I think he may have wanted to get WM out. He may have to kill WM which is why he has been so insistent on me surviving until the night. If you have someone counter claiming you the logical thing to do is lynch the person you know 100% is lying.

But 99% of the time he has said lynch Vere and leave me for 2mrw and telling someone to outright shoot me.

NOT

Kill Zeke, prove I(Ouro) am WM, thus proving I am cop as well. Then kill Ouro. He didn't want me to be lynched today because he knows his lie would be proven after the flip.

 

[Ourobolus]

Lynching you doesn't prove I am a cop, it just proves I am WM, which isn't indicative of anything. Lynching Verelios shows I am a cop, or a ridiculously bold and dumb scum.

Or a Lyncher, but you guys can't seem to make up your mind if it is Verelios or Zeke.

Hint: it's neither, nor am I a lyncher.

 

[Burbeting]

I don't know what you're referring to here?

-The choosing of which heroes were scum was done completely at random. Preconceptions of who is good or bad does not transfer over to this game.

.

 

[Burbeting]

There is no reason to claim WM as "grey area" when the "grey area" does not seem to exist in the context of this game.

 

[Burbeting]

Where is Verelios anyway. He has disappeared into thin air, it seems.

 

[Sophia]

I can't think of a scenario in which two of the three could be of one alignment, and the remaining person of the other. Either I end up running into "Why would town fakeclaim?", "Why would scum attempt such a poor bus attempt?" or I run into silly hypothetical that can't be answered right now.

Unless someone can think of a scenario I haven't, I think we're simply going to need to lynch to figure this out. I'm in favor of testing Ouro's cop claim, at any rate.

Also, could someone get us a vote count?

 

[Ourobolus]

Current vote count:

Verelios (9)
Ourobolus
Bronx-man
*Splinter
Franconp
AbsolutBro
Melonrabbit
Xamtheking
Haly
WhereAreMahDragonz
Kingkitty
Burbeting
nin1000

Ourobolus (3)
EzekelRAGE
*Splinter
Haly

nin1000 (1)
Barrylocke

StanleyPalmtree (1)
cabot

*Splinter (0)
cabot

Absolutbro (0)
Burbeting

Mazre (0)
Haly

Bronx-man (0)
Kingkitty

EzekelRAGE (0)
Barrylocke

Kyanrute (0)
Melonrabbit

11 votes needed for majority

 

[kingkitty]

Can anyone kill three people at the same time during the day? Asking for a friend.

Anyways, I still feel okay going for Verelios at the moment. Even if Vere is town, as long as he's telling the truth, then we only effectively killed a powerless townie.

But thinking over the Widowmaker question, how important is this for scumEzeke? Is Ouro just a fucken neutral or a dumb scum? Or was this scum Ouro's plan, to lure out the real Widowmaker? Instead of using my brain to decide which Widowmaker is the real Widowmaker, I'm going to kick the can and stick with consuming Verelios, the safest choice for now.

 

[EzekelRAGE]

Ouro has never offered to have me be lynched.

Let's make a deal. You are widow maker the cop, you die and prove it. I will gladly lay my head on the chopping block 2mrw and town can go down the rest of ur list.

Ok, Surrogate Verelios. Feel free to lynch me after your scumbuddy.

This is the scenario you have painted. You linked me and vere together for some reason. Idk if he is town or not. But what I do know is that you are not widow maker.

You die and you are wm - I die because I lied about WM n so does Vere since it would be believed I lied to protect him. Then continue with your list.

You die and aren't wm. - we get a clearer picture of ur motive. It's the most logical thing that has the least amount of possible town casualties.

Again, I am fine with getting lynched tomorrow if people think this is a bus.

Also, if we have a vig, feel free to shoot Zeke tonight after we lynch Verelios. It'll save us some discussion tomorrow.

Thoughts on lynching me, proving I am wm and kynching Ouro next? depending on his flip you can do vere next. But a town cop wouldn't lie about his character.

I offered myself to be lynced today to prove Ouro wrong.

In response Ouro doesn't want me lynched.

I don't know why you are so keen on protecting Verelios here.

If you flip scum, how does that change anything?

Look, my offer still stands. On the off-chance that shenanigans happened last night and Verelios flips town, you guys can do what you want with me. Lynch me, shoot me, idc.

Backpedaling on WM claim.

The key here is that you insist on Verelios being taken out first. You're consistent on this front. The most convincing argument you could make is to lynch yourself first to prove your role claim, and then we lynch Verelios/Ezekel on your word. Would you be willing to make this sacrifice?

I offered this earlier but Ouro ignored it. He couldn't ignore Haly because he knew ppl don't gloss over Haly's posts. He couldn't be against the idea since if he was really town, he would go for that 2 for 1.

If we're really gonna go that route, then fine.

There is no reason to claim WM as "grey area" when the "grey area" does not seem to exist in the context of this game.

Grey area being falling on either scum/neutral/town.

 

[Burbeting]

Grey area being falling on either scum/neutral/town.

Sorian clearly states that it's random which heroes are town or scum. I can only assume this means it's random who is neutral, as well. Claiming any hero would be "Grey Area" in this case, not just widowmaker.

 

[Ourobolus]

Ouro has never offered to have me be lynched.

I offered myself to be lynced today to prove Ouro wrong.

In response Ouro doesn't want me lynched.

How does you being lynched help address the fact that Verelios is scum and was caught?

Backpedaling on WM claim.

That's not backpedaling. That's my assumption that my results weren't tampered with by a switcher or something at night. Nothing to do with my claim.

I offered this earlier but Ouro ignored it. He couldn't ignore Haly because he knew ppl don't gloss over Haly's posts. He couldn't be against the idea since if he was really town, he would go for that 2 for 1.

Coming from your perspective it didn't mean anything to me. When someone that I think is town brought it up, then it warranted a response. And I said I'd go through with it, though we're just kicking the can down the road at this point, and my flip doesn't give nearly as much information as Verelios'.

 

[kingkitty]

I offered myself to be lynced today to prove Ouro wrong.

In response Ouro doesn't want me lynched.

So just to be clear, you are 100 percent okay getting yourself lynched today?

 

[Sophia]

An Ezekel lynch would tell us if he's genuinely counter-claiming Ouro or not. That being said, it still leaves Verelios' alignment a mystery.

 

[kingkitty]

How does you being lynched help address the fact that Verelios is scum and was caught?

but in the end, you do believe they're both scum, right? because he is for some reason contradicting you on the character name. So if Ezekel dies first, wouldn't it still be a win for town? Although it still keeps the Verelios question in the air.

 

[Ourobolus]

but in the end, you do believe they're both scum, right? because he is for some reason contradicting you on the character name. So if Ezekel dies first, wouldn't it still be a win for town? Although it still keeps the Verelios question in the air.

I mean, yes, I still believe Zeke is scum. But since I know Verelios is scum, it just doesn't make much sense to me to get rid of the "might be" option.

 

[Sophia]

I'm not entirely convinced Ezekel is scum because all of his actions would be extremely bold and/or foolish then. That means he's putting himself on the chopping block to protect Scum Verelios, he's bussing Scum Ouro, or he's trying to get townie points by counter-claiming against neutral Ouro.

 

[*Splinter]

Just catching up, I'm at a point where people are confused about Zeke's motivations and accusing him of being "Verelios' lawyer.

Imagine someone claimed your character. This isn't complicated.

 

[EzekelRAGE]

How does you being lynched help address the fact that Verelios is scum and was caught?

and my flip doesn't give nearly as much information as Verelios'.

Again Ouro is arguing against me being lynched. Your flip, proves I was telling the truth about WM and if you have a cop ability. With the latter, cop ability or not we can still lynch Vere next day phase.

So just to be clear, you are 100 percent okay getting yourself lynched today?

I would rather not be lynched since Ouro would just say he still has a cop ability, but he fudged the character. He already started goin that path earlier when he mentioned I would flip WM.

Ask yourself this, why would a town cop lie about his character?

An Ezekel lynch would tell us if he's genuinely counter-claiming Ouro or not. That being said, it still leaves Verelios' alignment a mystery.

Ouro flip tells us Vere's alignment (assuming ouro has cop ability) and whether I lied though. 2 birds one stone.

I mean, yes, I still believe Zeke is scum. But since I know Verelios is scum, it just doesn't make much sense to me to get rid of the "might be" option.

Again, he doesn't want me lynched.

Just catching up, I'm at a point where people are confused about Zeke's motivations and accusing him of being "Verelios' lawyer.

Imagine someone claimed your character. This isn't complicated.