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PoliGAF 2017 |OT3| 13 Treasons Why
- Thread starter RustyNails
- Start date
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RustyNails
Member
But old people are immune to enthusiasm...they like their bingo and their republicans.
I wonder how their debate will influence voters.
tedrotheredro
Member
You didn't hear? Obama and Hillary are using the deep state and the MSM to impeach Trump and the entire GOP so they can come back into power and rule forever until the rapture.
I wish I were kidding.
They'll be attacking Hillary for decades to come.
fredrancour
Member
It's not like they have any talking points that are positive to focus on instead.
You Know Nothing
Member
Once Hillary dies, the GOP and right wing media will dig up her corpse whenever they want to change the subject.
Plinko
Wildcard berths that can't beat teams without a winning record should have homefield advantage
Scathing article about the democratic party with comments from Michigan democrats:
http://www.freep.com/story/news/col...ke-duggan-detroit-democratic-party/362434001/
Way more at the link. Well worth the read. I don't necessarily agree a third party will emerge, but I do think if they don't get their act together people just won't vote.
http://www.freep.com/story/news/col...ke-duggan-detroit-democratic-party/362434001/
Way more at the link. Well worth the read. I don't necessarily agree a third party will emerge, but I do think if they don't get their act together people just won't vote.
From what I gather, the media, and people on the left alike, feel Hillary having lost the election should fall off the face of the earth, and if she does not and speaks candidly about her experience, if she doesn't say all my fault and I suck as a human/candidate then EXCUSES!!!11!!
TestOfTide
Banned
All the donations liberals and progressives have been getting needs to spread far and wide for local and state races to create young and diverse benches across the 50 states.
Clearly these people are looking for local and state candidates to look up to and aren't finding anyone. If Dems just at least started investments everywhere (doesn't even have to be BIG for everyone at the start like Ossof got) then people like in the article would naturally gravitate to them.
Spoiled Milk
Banned
She doesn't have to disappear but she needs to stop talking about the election.
Poodlestrike
Banned
I can get behind this. "I've said my piece, let's talk about [whatever the event is about] now."
GoldenEye 007
Member
A third party, huh? It'd be interesting to see a red Detroit.
I just think that's unrealistic and in a lot of ways unfair. The election was clearly grueling and one of the most significant periods of her life. Denying her the right to talk about it isn't fair. I don't see why any of it matters, she's not running for anything and is speaking as herself. No one should be putting any stock into it besides their own curiosity of her experience.
so I just turned on the tv for a moment and see all this stuff about the potential to invoke executive privilege to block Comey testimony. My mouth dropped open thinking about what a completely indefensible and ludicrous step that would be to take. So....he's gonna do it, isn't he?
Um... That bolded part is pretty far-reaching, isn't it? I mean, it's not generally the "done thing" for states to form an alliance, right?
I wonder how much of this is embarrassment that she lost? Both embarrassment for their part in it, and embarrassment on behalf of her.
Emerson
May contain jokes =>
Sounds like a Republican's dream.
I look forward to whatever contrived objection to it they come up with.
Host Samurai
Member
Its Friday guys. You know what that means...... 
Poodlestrike
Banned
I agree that it's massively unfair. It also seems to be necessary. Literally anything she says about the election that in any way implies that she's not wholly responsible gets picked up, twisted, and broadcasted, overriding whatever else she wanted to say.
"People treat Hillary Clinton entirety ubfairly" is the story of her entire political career, and that's a goddamn shame, but it's the framework we live in right now. Until the media actually does some basic ass soul searching that's unlikely to change. So it's time for her to just refuse to speak on the subject. Everything she's said has been right,
and it's not like refusing to elaborate is the same as a retraction.
balladofwindfishes
Member
Its Friday guys. You know what that means......
I have to go grocery shopping after work?
Well, formal compacts are unconstitutional without Congressional approval, but there is nothing they can do to stop states from informal alliances. Another example is the push to subvert the electoral college
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Popular_Vote_Interstate_Compact
an alliance of states?...hmmm...by definition would that not be a Confederation?
AntraxSuicide
Banned
It's explicitly forbidden in the Constitution but the SC ruled that it can be done if it doesn't take usurp federal power. These states could just agree to follow the agreement without needing to negotiate a foreign deal.
benjipwns
Banned
balladofwindfishes
Member
ACHA probably not passing senate this year
Also fat chance they pass this in an election year, so yea...
I don't think they've even done any serious writing of this bill at all.
Also fat chance they pass this in an election year, so yea...
I don't think they've even done any serious writing of this bill at all.
BlastProcessing
Member
They still won't say if Trump believes in climate change. They have no answer.
BoogieWoogie
Banned
They passed this through the House for absolutely nothing and won't even get to reap the benefits of it. They'll never come up with a plan, no matter how much time they have.
She continues to have a perception problem. She didn't fight valiantly and lose to some terrible evil, she was Casey at the Bat up against an underhand pitcher (even if the pitcher was getting Russian grease for the baseball) and the fans in the stands are chucking beer cans on the field for good reason.
I understand that "don't vote for the other guy" isn't a winning GOTV strategy. But I also don't understand why not! If you're not a Trump voter, why doesn't "vote for the other major candidate because Trump is fucking crazy" but a stirring enough message to get you off your ass?
Why not? Democrats did in 2010. The GOP might also want to hedge their bets on picking up some more seats in the Senate in the midterms, so that they can have another go in 2019 and get a House-friendly bill passed with enough of a cushion in their majority that losing Portman, Collins, Murkowski, et al. wouldn't kill the deal.
In any event, I think we should stop saying with any confidence that no health care bill is going to happen. Especially when the last time we were gloating about it, the House passed a fucking health care bill.
Why not? Democrats did in 2010. The GOP might also want to hedge their bets on picking up some more seats in the Senate in the midterms, so that they can have another go in 2019 and get a House-friendly bill passed with enough of a cushion in their majority that losing Portman, Collins, Murkowski, et al. wouldn't kill the deal.
In any event, I think we should stop saying with any confidence that no health care bill is going to happen. Especially when the last time we were gloating about it, the House passed a fucking health care bill.
Huh, learn something new everyday.
Literally said the same thing to my wife when I first read that tweet.
BoogieWoogie
Banned
I'm never watching one of those again, all they do is make me angry.
Like I mentioned before, the whole bit about them taxing employer sponsored healthcare means they just want to kill the AHCA outright. Least that's what it implies. No one is fucking touching healthcare in 2018.
that would basically kill Trump's entire legislative agenda so we'll see
taxing employer-sponsored healthcare benefits is straight out of Paul Ryan's better way plan, but even he was smart enough not to try to pass it in the AHCA
It should be taxed though. Makes no sense to treat it differently. You also end up with dumb situations like mine, where my employer-sponsored coverage is tax free, but the same coverage I receive for my girlfriend is not deductible (AND carries additional imputed income taxes)
balladofwindfishes
Member
What agenda?
Emerson
May contain jokes =>
It was for plenty of people. For others, it wasn't.
It would be a better strategy if his opponent wasn't the person most maligned by the conservative media in history.
It will work better in 2020, when anyone other than Trump's hopeless base will have seen that he's every bit the idiot they feared he might be, even if they gave him the benefit of the doubt in 2016.
It shouldn't be the core of the Democrats' message, because they still need to tell the people what they're going to do better. But completely ignoring the enormous orange elephant in the room isn't the right play either. "Fuck Trump" is a rallying cry for the left right now.
Tax breaks/reform depends on freeing up budget through healthcare reform.
If they can't finish healthcare, they won't move on to tax reform.
balladofwindfishes
Member
I think "I'm not George W Bush" would have worked in 2008, we just won't ever know because Obama was Obama.
Those weren't going anywhere anyway. He wasn't even seriously working on it.
Those weren't going anywhere anyway. He wasn't even seriously working on it.
Fenderputty
Banned
Actual Study:
http://www.healthycaliforniaact.org/wp-content/uploads/Pollin-Economic-Analysis-SB-562.pdf
TLDR:
http://www.healthycaliforniaact.org...t-state-spending-on-healthcare-by-18-percent/
uhhh is this gonna gain traction?
http://www.healthycaliforniaact.org/wp-content/uploads/Pollin-Economic-Analysis-SB-562.pdf
TLDR:
http://www.healthycaliforniaact.org...t-state-spending-on-healthcare-by-18-percent/
uhhh is this gonna gain traction?
All the same, they go hand in hand for the proposal, all the better for us either way.
People are selfish, maybe? "Tell me what you can do for me!" rather than "Tell me how morally repugnant your opponent is."
I will continue to argue that, whilst Hillary should've focused more on a positive message in the last month/6 weeks of the campaign, she absolutely thought the US electorate cared more for the moral good of a person's character than they actually did. 60+ million people voted for a spousal rapist and sexual assaulting idiot.
Autodidact
Banned
Good point.
Now we see what happens when you structure a legislative agenda like a row of dominoes. You need to address healthcare before you can handle tax reform, but if the first domino won't fall or falls in the wrong direction, nothing gets accomplished.
Everything already feels borderline paralyzed. If Ossoff wins, we might see total immobility of the legislature except housekeeping business.
benjipwns
Banned
Indeed many northern states had these provisions. Indiana, Illinois, etc.
He can be kicked out of the caucus, stripped of his seniority, etc. You know, all the things they didn't do to Joe Lieberman.
A Serious Man
Member
McConnell knows taking ownership of healthcare would cost him the Senate and that's his chief concern.
Trump's agenda is stalled, sure, but that would be admitting its completely dead. Even putting aside the inability to pay for anything without the AHCA medicare cuts, moving on to anything else will mean a new budget resolution and that would kill reconciliation for the current AHCA, making them vote on it again. Of course, there is no way in hell the House will vote on the AHCA in 2018. The Senate could probably get away with it given the map
Dominican Power
Member
This administration is full of shit. You can't believe a single word they say.
Autodidact
Banned
Right. And someone in OT made a good point regarding the legislative filibuster. Nuking it would obliterate the moderation of the Senate, allowing the far-right loonies to obtain more power. McConnell might lose control of his caucus and the Senate in general.
BoogieWoogie
Banned
It's 100% certain if Ossoff wins but the fact that its so close in a section of GA that swung +20 last election is so telling anyway. Anyone can see it and the GOP must know what this means for swing states.
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