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[Rentahamster]

Of course, the interview covers a lot of topics, but this one stuck out.

http://www.vulture.com/2014/11/chris-rock-frank-rich-in-conversation.html

You recently hosted Saturday Night Live, and in the monologue, where you were talking about the opening of One World Trade, my wife and I both felt just like you: No way are we going into that building. But you look online the next morning, and some people were offended2and accused you of disparaging the 9/11 victims. The political correctness that was thought to be dead is now—

Oh, it’s back stronger than ever. I don’t pay that much attention to it. I mean, you don’t want to piss off the people that are paying you, obviously, but otherwise I’ve just been really good at ignoring it. Honestly, it’s not that people were offended by what I said. They get offended by how much fun I appear to be having while saying it. You could literally take everything I said on Saturday night and say it on Meet the Press, and it would be a general debate, and it would go away. But half of it’s because they think they can hurt comedians.​

That they can hurt your career?

Yeah. They think you’re more accessible than Tom Brokaw saying the exact same thing.
​

What do you make of the attempt to bar Bill Maher from speaking at Berkeley for his riff on Muslims?

Well, I love Bill, but I stopped playing colleges, and the reason is because they’re way too conservative.​

In their political views?

Not in their political views — not like they’re voting Republican — but in their social views and their willingness not to offend anybody. Kids raised on a culture of “We’re not going to keep score in the game because we don’t want anybody to lose.” Or just ignoring race to a fault. You can’t say “the black kid over there.” No, it’s “the guy with the red shoes.” You can’t even be offensive on your way to being inoffensive.​

When did you start to notice this?

About eight years ago. Probably a couple of tours ago. It was just like, This is not as much fun as it used to be. I remember talking to George Carlin before he died and him saying the exact same thing.

A few days ago I was talking with Patton Oswalt, and he was exercised about the new reality that any comedian who is trying out material that’s a little out there can be fucked by someone who blasts it on Twitter or a social network.

I know Dave Chappelle bans everybody’s phone when he plays a club. I haven’t gone that far, but I may have to, to get an act together for a tour.​

Does it force you into some sort of self-censorship?

It does. I swear I just had a conversation with the people at the Comedy Cellar about how we can make cell phones into cigarettes. If you would have told me years ago that they were going to get rid of smoking in comedy clubs, I would have thought you were crazy.

It is scary, because the thing about comedians is that you’re the only ones who practice in front of a crowd. Prince doesn’t run a demo on the radio. But in stand-up, the demo gets out. There are a few guys good enough to write a perfect act and get onstage, but everybody else workshops it and workshops it, and it can get real messy. It can get downright offensive. Before everyone had a recording device and was wired like fucking Sammy the Bull,4 you’d say something that went too far, and you’d go, “Oh, I went too far,” and you would just brush it off. But if you think you don’t have room to make mistakes, it’s going to lead to safer, gooier stand-up. You can’t think the thoughts you want to think if you think you’re being watched.​

I assume you worked on the SNL material in the confines of the studio and that it never went before an audience?

Comedy Cellar all week. If I messed up a word here and there, which I did, it could really be get-him-out-of-here offensive. But you just watch to make sure nobody tapes it. You watch and you watch hard. And you make sure the doorman’s watching. What Patton’s trying to say is, like, comedians need a place where we can work on that stuff. And by the way: An audience that’s not laughing is the biggest indictment that something’s too far. No comedian’s ever done a joke that bombs all the time and kept doing it. Nobody in the history of stand-up. Not one guy.​

I thought the bit about how he doesn't play at colleges because they're too "conservative", or sensitive to rough jokes, was interesting. I wonder how many other comedians feel this way.

Other comedians' thoughts on political correctness:

Stewart Lee, British comedian

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1IYx4Bc6_eE

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bmsV1TuESrc

George Carlin:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yeB7dnXFMcg


There are a lot of other standup bits about this topic, and you can find them through googling. Try to be aware of strawman arguments in standup, though, and how they are used for hyperbole and comedic effect.

Thoughts?

Should comedians be judged like this? Context is important of course. And then we have the "should regular people be fired over their shitty social media posts?" thread too.

Some comedy-related incidents that come to mind regarding race-themed jokes:

Rosie O'Donell "ching chong" news bit:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cbwPu_LuTZs
http://www.people.com/people/article/0,,20004252,00.html

Stephen Colbert "ching chong ding dong foundation" bit:
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/03/28/colbert-report-asian-joke-cancel-colbert_n_5048662.html
http://www.newyorker.com/news/news-desk/the-campaign-to-cancel-colbert
http://www.npr.org/blogs/codeswitch/2014/04/06/299699625/asian-americans-cancelcolbert

Sarah Silverman
(joke @ 4:20) http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x9ipzg_sarah-silverman-2001-interview_fun
http://www.manaa.org/politicallyincorrect.html


The rest of the Chris Rock have a lot of important topics too. His thoughts on Cosby, Obama, and other stuff. It would be way too much for one thread, though.

 

[MHWilliams]

I thought the bit about how he doesn't play at colleges because they're too "conservative", or sensitive to rough jokes, was interesting. I wonder how many other comedians feel this way.

A great number of them, for the reasons Rock stated in the interview. They have to try out jokes that totally won't work in public. That can and does go bad for them.

I disagree to a point, but I see where he's coming from personally.

 

[Slayven]

His right about how social media has changed standup comedy. The joke that ethered Bill Cosby? Hannibal had been telling it for weeks, but it wasn't a thing until someone taped it and put it on youtube

 

[Succinct Verbosity]

I think most people would agree with his interpretation of college students.

 

[elfinke]

It's a fabulous interview, thanks for bringing it up OP.

Do you think gay-rights progress has more to do with the shaming of people or the education of people?

Both. I always call Ellen DeGeneres the gay Rosa Parks. If Rosa Parks had one of the most popular daytime TV shows, I’m sure the civil-rights movement would’ve moved a little bit faster too.

Tim Cook, the CEO of Apple, just came out as gay.

Which I think is actually bigger than the football player. Because the average person in that locker room is in his 20s. And it’s just not a big deal to be around a gay guy — if you’re in your 20s. Whereas Tim Cook is around these corporate guys. That is the epitome of a boys’ club. That is sexist, ­racist — the least inclusive group of people you’re ever going to find. Men who have no problem being called owners. Who actually wants to be called an owner, even if you owned a football team? Just the title owner is just so nasty and disgusting.

It does have a kind of antebellum ring.

So Tim Cook came out to those guys. He’s in that club. My God.

==============

So, to say Obama is progress is saying that he’s the first black person that is qualified to be president. That’s not black progress. That’s white progress. There’s been black people qualified to be president for hundreds of years. If you saw Tina Turner and Ike having a lovely breakfast over there, would you say their relationship’s improved? Some people would. But a smart person would go, “Oh, he stopped punching her in the face.” It’s not up to her. Ike and Tina Turner’s relationship has nothing to do with Tina Turner. Nothing. It just doesn’t. The question is, you know, my kids are smart, educated, beautiful, polite children. There have been smart, educated, beautiful, polite black children for hundreds of years. The advantage that my children have is that my children are encountering the nicest white people that America has ever produced. Let’s hope America keeps producing nicer white people.

==============
Great stuff.

 

[Doc Holliday]

I agree with a lot of what he's saying. Never thought political correctness would come back like it has especially from the left. I consider myself a liberal but fuck now you get shit from both flanks if you say the wrong joke. It's kinda weird honestly.

I remember going to a comedy show and Dave Atell was benign heckled for some dark humor. It was pretty tame compared to the shit Pryor and Eddie Murphy used to get away with.

i wonder if a movie like blazing saddles could be made today.

I love his Obama comments, dude needs to make another special.

 

[border]

"Social justice" is the new "politically correct." It's about trying to shout down anyone who says something that might be offensive to anyone else (regardless of whether you are personally offended), and it's about having absolutely zero sense of humor or irony.

I saw Lisa Lampanelli a few weeks ago. Packed house, tons of "problematic" humor. Everyone had a good time and it never really felt that hateful or mean-spirited. I kinda wonder what the point is in launching angry Twitter PR campaigns against Stephen Colbert over some uber-mild joke when there are still people like Lampanelli and Trey Parker/Matt Stone making careers out of pretty flagrantly racist and sexist material. I tend to just assume the social justice crowd is in such an echo chamber that they've forgotten about all the worst offenders.

 

[Booshka]

Great quotes, I agree with pretty much all of it. Comedians need to be able to bomb and try out offensive jokes in an act, if it's not funny, don't laugh and they won't tell the joke anymore. Some Twitter rant or exhaustive blog post about how offended you are by a Comedian seems to be more self-serving wankery than legitimate outrage.

Other problem is that Stand up comedy doesn't get the same artistic pass that movies, books, paintings and music gets. If a character in a movie says something offensive and outrageous, it's just an actor playing a character. If a Comedian says something offensive for the sake of a joke, it's taken completely literally and becomes an indictment of them personally.

I like Patrice O' Neals take on this subject as well.

 

[Nokagi]

Good read. I love Chris and I love this quote about Obama lol

There’s an advantage that Bush had that Obama doesn’t have. People thinking you’re dumb is an advantage. Obama started as a genius. It’s like, What? I’ve got to keep doing that? That’s hard to do! So it’s not that Obama’s disappointing. It’s just his best album might have been his first album.

But yeah as for political correctness he's dead on. And I hate it. Especially when it comes to comedy.

 

[ViewtifulJC]

Really liked the part about Gone Girl vs Anchorman. A lot more people could have made Gone Girl work compared to making Anchorman work. Comedy is harder than drama, and yet it never gets the respect it deserves.

 

[BrokenEchelon]

Agree with him. Political correctness has gone too far, people are too easily offended at dumb shit, and some people froth at the mouth for the opportunity to dogpile on someone via social media, whether it be twitter, facebook, or these very forums.

Also, fuck the "everyone's a winner" mentality. Earn your damn victories.

 

[Mammoth Jones]

Good read. I love Chris and I love this quote about Obama lol But yeah as for political correctness he's dead on. And I hate it. Especially when it comes to comedy.

Agreed. Comedy has suffered greatly due to political correctness. One twitter storm and your career is over. Not worth the risk now, lol.

 

[block tower]

he's right. people get offended about EVERYTHING.

 

[watershed]

While it's true that social media has made everyone hyper aware and hyper sensitive, I think in the end, if you are funny then you can be politically incorrect and crude. I favorite examples are C.K., Carlin, and Chris Rock. All 3 use words or say things I find to be disgusting, but I get that it's comedy, it makes me laugh, and I don't see any malicious intent in their routines.

 

[jchap]

I've been banned from this forum for making non-politically correct jokes. My opinion is that political correctness is awesome-sauce

 

[Ramza]

Also, fuck the "everyone's a winner" mentality. Earn your damn victories.

I volunteer for a few weeks out of the year at a middle school where my old drama teacher works. I help the kids out with the technical theater aspect since that's what my specialty was in high school. It's a cesspool of the "everyone's a winner" attitude and I fucking hate it. Everybody gets a trophy and nobodies feelings are allowed to be hurt. I'm waiting for the day I get asked not to come back because I'm telling a kid that they're doing a bad job or something like that.

 

[ivysaur12]

(Sort of a tangent on comedy, and then I'll circle back): I don't really love the term political correctness or "social justice warrior" in general, because it seems to come from a place where people don't have a right to take issue with anything and a lack of empathy for groups who might have a justifiable issue with something. I generally see it as passive and dismissive.

That being said, comedy requires context, and most should be given an artistic license that can convey satire or the like. That doesn't necessarily mean that anything a comedian says should be shielded from any criticism, but many times critics of "controversial" comedy don't take the time to understand the context of that joke. In that sense, I don't see them as a victim of political correctness, but instead sheer stupidity.

 

[Mammoth Jones]

While it's true that social media has made everyone hyper aware and hyper sensitive, I think in the end, if you are funny then you can be politically incorrect and crude. I favorite examples are C.K., Carlin, and Chris Rock. All 3 use words or say things I find to be disgusting, but I get that it's comedy, it makes me laugh, and I don't see any malicious intent in their routines.

But you're missing his point of the comedians that AREN'T established superstars that are trying to build their material, experiment, write, rework, test in front of an audience. Re-write...etc.

Those are the people that really struggle in this atmosphere of not being able to make any joke that offends my "liberal/conservative" sensibilities. The point is I don't think there will be more Rocks/C.K.s/Carlins w/ the current politically correct environment.

Comics need to experiment. But you're worried about being destroyed on twitter it can hamper that process. Twitter bullshit controversies make national news now. It's crazy.

(Sort of a tangent on comedy, and then I'll circle back): I don't really love the term political correctness or "social justice warrior" in general, because it seems to come from a place where people don't have a right to take issue with anything and a lack of empathy for groups who might have a justifiable issue with something. I generally see it as passive and dismissive.

That being said, comedy requires context, and most should be given an artistic license that can convey satire or the like. That doesn't necessarily mean that anything a comedian says should be shielded from any criticism, but many times critics of "controversial" comedy don't take the time to understand the context of that joke. In that sense, I don't see them as a victim of political correctness, but instead sheer stupidity.

Like Rock said...the immediate feedback is no one laughs. That's the point. Gotta test new material though. Crossing the line is a part of that process for some comics. Doesn't make them stupid. It's called learning.

 

[Balb]

I volunteer for a few weeks out of the year at a middle school where my old drama teacher works. I help the kids out with the technical theater aspect since that's what my specialty was in high school. It's a cesspool of the "everyone's a winner" attitude and I fucking hate it. Everybody gets a trophy and nobodies feelings are allowed to be hurt. I'm waiting for the day I get asked not to come back because I'm telling a kid that they're doing a bad job or something like that.

Do you actually tell kids that they're doing bad jobs?

 

[Ramza]

Do you actually tell kids that they're doing bad jobs?

Usually it's in a joking manner and we have a laugh about it, but I'm real with those kids. I treat them like they're human beings that are capable of mistakes rather than the "little innocent angels" that the teachers do. And the kids usually respect me for it. I love telling them that the world will eat them alive if they don't believe that failure is possible.

 

[Mammoth Jones]

Do you actually tell kids that they're doing bad jobs?

I got told I was doing a bad job as a kid sometimes. And I was. Either I needed help or I was just being lazy. I somehow didn't develop low self esteem, lol.

 

[Dennis]

I like him pissing on colleges. He is right on the money with that one.

Neo-prissy prudes is the term I would use for the average college inhabitant.

Full disclosure: I work at a university.

 

[JCX]

I've been passing this around to my comedian friends, we pretty much agree on it, though the political correctness part didn't really stand out to me.

There's a difference between a person just saying something a comedian saying something. There's a level of trust between a comedian an the audience, an understanding of what type of comic is on stage and what the audience paid to see

"Social justice" is the new "politically correct." It's about trying to shout down anyone who says something that might be offensive to anyone else (regardless of whether you are personally offended), and it's about having absolutely zero sense of humor or irony.

I saw Lisa Lampanelli a few weeks ago. Packed house, tons of "problematic" humor. Everyone had a good time and it never really felt that hateful or mean-spirited. I kinda wonder what the point is in launching angry Twitter PR campaigns against Stephen Colbert over some uber-mild joke when there are still people like Lampanelli and Trey Parker/Matt Stone making careers out of pretty flagrantly racist and sexist material. I tend to just assume the social justice crowd is in such an echo chamber that they've forgotten about all the worst offenders.

Lampanelli and South Park are supposed to be offensive. People generally expect comedians to have some sharp POV that will by its nature target someone (the whole fear of sitting in the front row), so people aren't shocked by it. Liberals who (probably don't regularly watch) Colbert but were generally fans saw Suey Park's twitter misrepresentation and formed their initial opinion off that, instead of watching the full clip (that had existed online for about a day before the pitchforks came out).

The bigger part to me was about banning cell phones and being unable to workshop bits in peace. Like most comics, I started off pretty awful and broad before finding my voice. The fact that someone can just record you trying something new, put it online, then start a campaign against you kind of has a chilling effect. I'm definitely more careful when I try out new bits for this reason.

 

[sprsk]

he's right. people get offended about EVERYTHING.

Well when you make blanket statements like that...

 

[MHWilliams]

I've been passing this around to my comedian friends, we pretty much agree on it, though the political correctness part didn't really stand out to me.

There's a difference between a person just saying something a comedian saying something.There's a level of trust between a comedian an the audience, an understanding of what type of comic is on stage and what the audience paid to see

Lampanelli and South Park are supposed to be offensive, so people aren't shocked by it. People who (probably don't regularly watch) Colbert saw Suey Park's twitter misrepresentation and formed their initial opinion off that.

The bigger part to me was about banning cell phones and being unable to workshop bits in peace. Like most comics, I started off pretty awful and broad before finding my voice. The fact that someone can just record you trying something new, put it online, then start a campaign against you kind of has a chilling effect. I'm definitely more careful when I try out new bits for this reason.

Bingo.

What most people decry as "political correctness" is just those who previously didn't have the voice or ability to speak out being able to do so easily.

 

[Kuroyume]

Absolutley agree with him. And it pisses me off. Really pisses me off. The harder people push me to correct what I say the harder I'm beginning to push back. Everyone feels their entitled to an apology. For example, that thread about the scientist having to apologize for his shirt was an embarrassment.

 

[LosDaddie]

Great interview! I agree with pretty much all of what Rock said. It's always been tough to be a standup comedian, but I imagine it's even worse today.

You can actually see a lotof what he's complaining about on GAF.

I agree with a lot of what he's saying. Never thought political correctness would come back like it has especially from the left. I consider myself a liberal but fuck now you get shit from both flanks if you say the wrong joke. It's kinda weird honestly.

I remember going to a comedy show and Dave Atell was benign heckled for some dark humor. It was pretty tame compared to the shit Pryor and Eddie Murphy used to get away with.

i wonder if a movie like blazing saddles could be made today.

I love his Obama comments, dude needs to make another special.

"Social justice" is the new "politically correct." It's about trying to shout down anyone who says something that might be offensive to anyone else (regardless of whether you are personally offended), and it's about having absolutely zero sense of humor or irony.

I saw Lisa Lampanelli a few weeks ago. Packed house, tons of "problematic" humor. Everyone had a good time and it never really felt that hateful or mean-spirited. I kinda wonder what the point is in launching angry Twitter PR campaigns against Stephen Colbert over some uber-mild joke when there are still people like Lampanelli and Trey Parker/Matt Stone making careers out of pretty flagrantly racist and sexist material. I tend to just assume the social justice crowd is in such an echo chamber that they've forgotten about all the worst offenders.

Agree with him. Political correctness has gone too far, people are too easily offended at dumb shit, and some people froth at the mouth for the opportunity to dogpile on someone via social media, whether it be twitter, facebook, or these very forums.

Also, fuck the "everyone's a winner" mentality. Earn your damn victories.

Great posts.

 

[watershed]

But you're missing his point of the comedians that AREN'T established superstars that are trying to build their material, experiment, write, rework, test in front of an audience. Re-write...etc.

Those are the people that really struggle in this atmosphere of not being able to make any joke that offends my "liberal/conservative" sensibilities. The point is I don't think there will be more Rocks/C.K.s/Carlins w/ the current politically correct environment.

Comics need to experiment. But you're worried about being destroyed on twitter it can hamper that process. Twitter bullshit controversies make national news now. It's crazy.



Like Rock said...the immediate feedback is no one laughs. That's the point. Gotta test new material though. Crossing the line is a part of that process for some comics. Doesn't make them stupid. It's called learning.

Well we are in a new age so no one can predict how it will work out. Comedians will adapt and be smarter about how they provide a comedic context for crude language or controversial topics. Being a comedian is and has always been tough. Audiences are brutal. I'm not familiar with comedians' careers being ended over twitter, but in general comedians have to be tough in order to make it.

I've seen bad comedians think ugly words are a punchline in and of themselves, and I've seen great comedians have the intelligence to couch their language into an overall funny routine.

 

[Bobby Roberts]

It's weird that this is the thing in that interview that prompted the thread. I believe that was also the only usage of the term "political correctness" in the entire interview, as well.

It's a historically loaded term, and was poisoned early in its life much like "Social Justice Warrior" has been poisoned now. Hopefully when we repeat history further on in the 21st century, we'll remix the dumb shit with a little more aplomb than that particular example.

Usually what happens is the phrase "Political Correctness" is used, and that's more often than not a signal for people who think life's gotten more unfair now that marginalized people aren't willing to stay marginalized for the sake of you having a cheap ha-ha at their expense.

And I used the word "cheap" there on purpose. There's a reason. What stand-ups do isn't cheap, usually. It's work. It's their way of life. Rock mentions having to workshop his jokes. He doesn't just fart them out at work, or burp them up on twitter and call it a day. He works on his shit, and like he says, so does EVERY OTHER STAND-UP HE KNOWS.

When those guys are taking subjects that can be touchy, and trying to figure out how to mine legitmate laughs from them, that's not cheap. That's not thoughtless. They're putting a ton of thought into their art, and hoping it helps give their career more fuel to continue on, keeping them paid, keeping them secure.

This is not really all that comparable to you feeling upset because you shit up a thread with the first "edgy" thing that popped into your ass and people called you out on the stink.

And that's usually what happens when discussions about comedy and "political correctness" pop up. Because it's not really about comedy, or political correctness. It's just another avenue for whiners to whine about how unfair it is that they don't get to be giant fucking assholes to less fortunate people without repercussion.

 

[IdreamofHIME]

His right about how social media has changed standup comedy.

Social Media has changed every thing. Before when you wanted to vent an opinion you had to do with friends or family, and as such most didn't due to being scared/embarrassed at what others would think of their crazy opinion.

..but now facebook and twitter directly connects these people with each other and give them strength in their views. Hey, if some guy in Arizona is saying the same thing as me, then I must be right!

Being offended is just about the worst shield someone can use to fight anything. It really doesn't matter if you're offended. Anyone can be offended at anything, it's not a measure of something's worth on it's own.

 

[ivysaur12]

It's weird that this is the thing in that interview that prompted the thread. I believe that was also the only usage of the term "political correctness" in the entire interview, as well.

It's a historically loaded term, and was poisoned early in its life much like "Social Justice Warrior" has been poisoned now.

Usually what happens is the phrase "Political Correctness" is used, and that's more often than not a signal for people who think life's gotten more unfair now that marginalized people aren't willing to stay marginalized for the sake of you having a cheap ha-ha at their expense.

And I used the word "cheap" there on purpose. There's a reason. What stand-ups do isn't cheap, usually. It's work. It's their way of life. Rock mentions having to workshop his jokes. He doesn't just fart them out at work, or burp them up on twitter and call it a day. He works on his shit, and like he says, so does EVERY OTHER STAND-UP HE KNOWS.

When those guys are taking subjects that can be touchy, and trying to figure out how to mine legitmate laughs from them, that's not cheap. That's not thoughtless. They're putting a ton of thought into their art, and hoping it helps give their career more fuel to continue on, keeping them paid, keeping them secure.

This is not really all that comparable to you feeling upset because you shit up a thread with the first "edgy" thing that popped into your ass and people called you out on the stink.

And that's usually what happens when discussions about comedy and "political correctness" pop up. Because it's not really about comedy, or political correctness. It's just another avenue for whiners to whine about how unfair it is that they don't get to be giant fucking assholes to less fortunate people without repercussion.

You said this better than I could.

Like Rock said...the immediate feedback is no one laughs. That's the point. Gotta test new material though. Crossing the line is a part of that process for some comics. Doesn't make them stupid. It's called learning.

That's not actually what I said, though. I called people who don't understand the context of said joke are stupid, not the people making the joke. Comedians can be stupid too, but that's different.

 

[Massive Duck. C.M.]

The whole interview is good, but something tells me only some parts of it will be picked up

It's weird that this is the thing in that interview that prompted the thread. I believe that was also the only usage of the term "political correctness" in the entire interview, as well.

It's a historically loaded term, and was poisoned early in its life much like "Social Justice Warrior" has been poisoned now. Hopefully when we repeat history further on in the 21st century, we'll remix the dumb shit with a little more aplomb than that particular example.

Usually what happens is the phrase "Political Correctness" is used, and that's more often than not a signal for people who think life's gotten more unfair now that marginalized people aren't willing to stay marginalized for the sake of you having a cheap ha-ha at their expense.

And I used the word "cheap" there on purpose. There's a reason. What stand-ups do isn't cheap, usually. It's work. It's their way of life. Rock mentions having to workshop his jokes. He doesn't just fart them out at work, or burp them up on twitter and call it a day. He works on his shit, and like he says, so does EVERY OTHER STAND-UP HE KNOWS.

When those guys are taking subjects that can be touchy, and trying to figure out how to mine legitmate laughs from them, that's not cheap. That's not thoughtless. They're putting a ton of thought into their art, and hoping it helps give their career more fuel to continue on, keeping them paid, keeping them secure.

This is not really all that comparable to you feeling upset because you shit up a thread with the first "edgy" thing that popped into your ass and people called you out on the stink.

And that's usually what happens when discussions about comedy and "political correctness" pop up. Because it's not really about comedy, or political correctness. It's just another avenue for whiners to whine about how unfair it is that they don't get to be giant fucking assholes to less fortunate people without repercussion.

basically

 

[smokeandmirrors]

Absolutley agree with him. And it pisses me off. Really pisses me off. The harder people push me to correct what I say the harder I'm beginning to push back. Everyone feels their entitled to an apology. For example, that thread about the scientist having to apologize for his shirt was an embarrassment.

What exactly are you saying all the time that people are "correcting" you on...?

 

[block tower]

Well when you make blanket statements like that...

but people do. people will find something to get offended about. for instance in America, you could tell someone "merry christmas" and they get offended; or you could tell someone "happy holidays" and they get offended. people will literally whine and get "offended" by anything these days. and dont get me wrong, im fully in support of hammering away at bigots and others with prejudicial opinions, but im not in support of just get offended at things i dont agree with.

 

[Rentahamster]

It's weird that this is the thing in that interview that prompted the thread.

Why is that weird?

I believe that was also the only usage of the term "political correctness" in the entire interview, as well.

What does it matter? It was the topic that brought forth the entire part of the interview that I quoted.

 

[JCX]

(Sort of a tangent on comedy, and then I'll circle back): I don't really love the term political correctness or "social justice warrior" in general, because it seems to come from a place where people don't have a right to take issue with anything and a lack of empathy for groups who might have a justifiable issue with something. I generally see it as passive and dismissive.

Pretty much agree with that. Someone saying "hey I don't like the use of that word/phrase because it has a long history of bigoted use" doesn't stop someone who is "anti-PC" from continuing saying that word.

What appears to be the root is that people are mad that what were once dominant, safe opinions, are now being threatened with pushback for the first time, and nobody wants to feel like the bad guy.

edit: Beautifully stated, BobbyRoberts.

 

[watershed]

Absolutley agree with him. And it pisses me off. Really pisses me off. The harder people push me to correct what I say the harder I'm beginning to push back. Everyone feels their entitled to an apology. For example, that thread about the scientist having to apologize for his shirt was an embarrassment.

You sound angry. What are you saying that people are trying to correct? If your speech is continually catching heat it's quite possible you are out of step with your social context to say the least.

 

[Rentahamster]

The whole interview is good,

It is.

but something tells me only some parts of it will be picked up

That's by design. I mentioned this in the OP. There's many different topics that get touched in the interview, all with good quotable bits. But it would be hard to have a focused discussion in a thread, because there will be 5 different topics being discussed at the same time.

 

[MHWilliams]

The whole interview is good, but something tells me only some parts of it will be picked up

Like his black people/nigga bit. Which he dropped.

 

[Infinite]

It's weird that this is the thing in that interview that prompted the thread. I believe that was also the only usage of the term "political correctness" in the entire interview, as well.

It's a historically loaded term, and was poisoned early in its life much like "Social Justice Warrior" has been poisoned now. Hopefully when we repeat history further on in the 21st century, we'll remix the dumb shit with a little more aplomb than that particular example.

Usually what happens is the phrase "Political Correctness" is used, and that's more often than not a signal for people who think life's gotten more unfair now that marginalized people aren't willing to stay marginalized for the sake of you having a cheap ha-ha at their expense.

And I used the word "cheap" there on purpose. There's a reason. What stand-ups do isn't cheap, usually. It's work. It's their way of life. Rock mentions having to workshop his jokes. He doesn't just fart them out at work, or burp them up on twitter and call it a day. He works on his shit, and like he says, so does EVERY OTHER STAND-UP HE KNOWS.

When those guys are taking subjects that can be touchy, and trying to figure out how to mine legitmate laughs from them, that's not cheap. That's not thoughtless. They're putting a ton of thought into their art, and hoping it helps give their career more fuel to continue on, keeping them paid, keeping them secure.

This is not really all that comparable to you feeling upset because you shit up a thread with the first "edgy" thing that popped into your ass and people called you out on the stink.

And that's usually what happens when discussions about comedy and "political correctness" pop up. Because it's not really about comedy, or political correctness. It's just another avenue for whiners to whine about how unfair it is that they don't get to be giant fucking assholes to less fortunate people without repercussion.

God damn this post is good.

 

[Massive Duck. C.M.]

It is.

That's by design. I mentioned this in the OP. There's many different topics that get touched in the interview, all with good quotable bits. But it would be hard to have a focused discussion in a thread, because there will be 5 different topics being discussed at the same time.

I wasn't only talking about the thread

 

[Bobby Roberts]

Why is that weird?

Because for as expansive and illuminating as that interview was, as insightful and interesting, to take a tiny portion of it and use it as a placemat for forum posters to arrive, not read, wipe off their feet and barrel in with ready-to-go opinions about how kids these days have all the crusts cut-off and people everywhere are losing weight and keeping trim burning calories through marathon bouts of faux outrage on how offensive everything is? Seems sorta like... I dunno, like it's wasting the interview. Or at least kinda misrepresenting it.

But I guess if people actually click on it and read the whole thing, then it's all to the good, regardless what got them there. So you're right, my complaint is a little weird, too.

 

[studyguy]

I dunno, I hit up the laugh factory in hollywood on the regular and a ton of those dudes really walk the line in those offensive issues or try to be real in your face about it. What I've noticed is that when they do, they seriously try to make the joke hit hard with the crowd or they don't do it at all though. Feel like a lot of things that would otherwise be offensive tend to get more of a pass if they intended joke is genuinely funny.

Still, I have seen a shitload less stereotyping jokes outside of the comedian's own race while out there so I can't disagree. Then again these types of dudes probably don't have the kind of national spotlight the ones in the interviews have so who knows what kind of flak they catch on the regular.

 

[Coffee Dog]

It's weird that this is the thing in that interview that prompted the thread. I believe that was also the only usage of the term "political correctness" in the entire interview, as well.

It's a historically loaded term, and was poisoned early in its life much like "Social Justice Warrior" has been poisoned now. Hopefully when we repeat history further on in the 21st century, we'll remix the dumb shit with a little more aplomb than that particular example.

Usually what happens is the phrase "Political Correctness" is used, and that's more often than not a signal for people who think life's gotten more unfair now that marginalized people aren't willing to stay marginalized for the sake of you having a cheap ha-ha at their expense.

And I used the word "cheap" there on purpose. There's a reason. What stand-ups do isn't cheap, usually. It's work. It's their way of life. Rock mentions having to workshop his jokes. He doesn't just fart them out at work, or burp them up on twitter and call it a day. He works on his shit, and like he says, so does EVERY OTHER STAND-UP HE KNOWS.

When those guys are taking subjects that can be touchy, and trying to figure out how to mine legitmate laughs from them, that's not cheap. That's not thoughtless. They're putting a ton of thought into their art, and hoping it helps give their career more fuel to continue on, keeping them paid, keeping them secure.

This is not really all that comparable to you feeling upset because you shit up a thread with the first "edgy" thing that popped into your ass and people called you out on the stink.

And that's usually what happens when discussions about comedy and "political correctness" pop up. Because it's not really about comedy, or political correctness. It's just another avenue for whiners to whine about how unfair it is that they don't get to be giant fucking assholes to less fortunate people without repercussion.

thanks for this post

 

[Rentahamster]

I wasn't only talking about the thread

OK.

Because for as expansive and illuminating as that interview was, as insightful and interesting, to take a tiny portion of it and use it as a placemat for forum posters to arrive, not read, wipe off their feet and barrel in with ready-to-go opinions about how kids these days have all the crusts cut-off and people everywhere are losing weight and keeping trim burning calories through marathon bouts of faux outrage on how offensive everything is? Seems sorta like... I dunno, like it's wasting the interview. Or at least kinda misrepresenting it.

But I guess if people actually click on it and read the whole thing, then it's all to the good, regardless what got them there. So you're right, my complaint is a little weird, too.

I get your point, and my first and last sentences of the OP encouraged reading the whole thing, but I had to choose something.

ready-to-go opinions about how kids these days have all the crusts cut-off and people everywhere are losing weight and keeping trim burning calories through marathon bouts of faux outrage on how offensive everything is? Seems sorta like... I dunno, like it's wasting the interview. Or at least kinda misrepresenting it.

Misrepresenting? Rock stated how it's affected his jobs. He doesn't play colleges anymore, because he thinks it's not worth it due to stuff like this. Maybe he's being unreasonable, but that's what he decided to do.

 

[John Kowalski]

Usually it's in a joking manner and we have a laugh about it, but I'm real with those kids. I treat them like they're human beings that are capable of mistakes rather than the "little innocent angels" that the teachers do. And the kids usually respect me for it. I love telling them that the world will eat them alive if they don't believe that failure is possible.

I am generally ok with being nice and positive with kids and avoiding making them feel bad, but there is one especially hypocritical behaviour i've noticed. It's that the same society that encapsulates children in a magical plane of socioeconomical flourish and curated learning is the same that blames them for their incapacity to adapt to the "real world", in some way carrying the twisted notion that the first paradigm is the perfect introduction to the second.

Sorry for the ot.

 

[Boom Boom Pow]

Absolutley agree with him. And it pisses me off. Really pisses me off. The harder people push me to correct what I say the harder I'm beginning to push back. Everyone feels their entitled to an apology. For example, that thread about the scientist having to apologize for his shirt was an embarrassment.

so what exactly are you saying that people are correcting you on?

 

[krioto]

I love Stewart Lee

 

[Riposte]

I would love to see Chris Rock in a Marvel movie lol

 

[cdyhybrid]

How many people will take this as him decrying political correctness in general, and not specifically when it comes to comedians (which is what he was actually talking about)?

I'm guessing a lot.