Crossbow laser blast to the kidneys is more powerful than most things I'd say.
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Return of the Jedi Cinematography.
- Thread starter supermarioworldE
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Crossbow laser blast to the kidneys is more powerful than most things I'd say.
ROTJ's space battle still has some of the greatest effects shots of all time.
And my favorite:
http://i.imgur.com/eeL8j2v.gifv
And my favorite:
http://i.imgur.com/eeL8j2v.gifv
While nothing is concrete about Rey's background, I thought the general consensus was that she was most likely a former student, and while very young when her training ended, some of that technique and training was retained in some subconscious. Don't forgte Luke didn't have any formal training until he was like...20? Obviously his strength in the force made up for the lack of training.
Rey is probably the same way as I expect she's the new space Jesus a la Anakin. It would be interesting if they can put some logical spin on why that happens. Maybe the force occasionally takes the form of a human, takes part in skeeball tournaments on Coney island and once in a while gets lucky.
Rey is probably the same way as I expect she's the new space Jesus a la Anakin. It would be interesting if they can put some logical spin on why that happens. Maybe the force occasionally takes the form of a human, takes part in skeeball tournaments on Coney island and once in a while gets lucky.
Some of you must be young. The final duel in ROTJ is one of the greatest scenes in cinema due to the emotional depth and music. This is almost factual. TFA cannot compare because it's utterly simple, dramatically.
It's like the Godfather 2, when Michael tells Fredo "I know it was you, Fredo. You broke my heart". Nothing fancy is going on in terms of camera work or action, yet it's an incredibly powerful scene.
It's like the Godfather 2, when Michael tells Fredo "I know it was you, Fredo. You broke my heart". Nothing fancy is going on in terms of camera work or action, yet it's an incredibly powerful scene.
DiipuSurotu
Banned
Stevetopsy
Member
I admit, there was a feeling of something not quite sitting right at first, considering what we know and have seen about these characters specifically and the force itself. I feel like it works for me ultimately because of the extreme self-doubt the Kylo character had been shown to struggle with. You see it in the mind-reading scene how it totally gets to Kylo when Rey says out loud what his fears are. In the final fight he is almost certainly thinking about how he needs to show her she was wrong and that he is on the level of Vader. He wants to have a flawless victory essentially and with every successful blow Rey lands, or mistake he makes, just fills him with more self doubt, more anger, and makes him increasingly unfocused. His worst fears begin to feel more and more like truths. His offer to train Rey felt like the desperate move of a man who had been seen right through for who he really is and will try anything to save face. Maybe he'd feel like he had some power over Rey if he trained her, maybe he'd try to learn the secret of her ease with the force then kill her, or maybe he was sincere and wants to eventually kill Snoke. Regardless, the hit from the crossbow on the bridge plus his blinding anger and frustration with Rey's apparent skill and success during their fight despite her lack of training or experience of any kind contributed to Kylo's poor performance. He simply wasn't 100% as we see him in the opening.
I can totally identify with that kind of self doubt and how it can affect your performance too, and it's one of my favorite things that VII contributed to the mythos. We've never really seen a Jedi/Sith struggle with their craft in that way. I think back to when I was skateboarding all day, everyday for years and years and thought I was at least pretty good. All of a sudden a video called Baker 2G came out and had a section where these little-ass kids who not only had a part in a major video of the day, not only were skating all these sick spot with famous pro's, but they were tricking down massive stair sets and handrails that put my biggest tricks to shame like it was nothing. It's amazing how much something like that can affect your actual performance if it hits an area of vulnerability or insecurity.
Or just the fans way of rationalizing her illogical progress with the force
Wowzers, this is gonna look great on blu-ray
I don't think that's true...
Rey's fighting for Han & Finn. Upto that point, Han's the one that gave her a job. Han's the one that's looked out for her. She forms emotional bonds quickly, and I'm sure Han became a sort of father figure she looked up to. Especially after she does the whole bypassing the something-o-rather on the Falcon and her shows off to Han so giddily earlier in the movie. Finn's the same way. Rey, fundamentally is alone in the universe, and Finn saved her from that. Finn also came to save Rey, so she's indebted. And at that point, Ren's just taken "everything" away from her, what she's always wanted - a family.
I'd say her wanting to avenge Han & Finn is a big reason I personally found the fight full of emotionl.
Mighty Chin
Banned
Be right back uhhhh I'm going to go be by myself for a few minutes.
Escape Goat
Member
No fair. Some of those, if not all, of thise space shots are from the redos. But that flight into the death star was great. I wish we had got more Lando.
PhoncipleBone
Banned
Still the best space battle. And all the more impressive when you think that it is all motion control work and optical compositing. It was damn impressive in 1983, it is damn impressive now. That whole sequence was just ILM showing off.
ROTJ's space battle still has some of the greatest effects shots of all time.
And my favorite:
http://i.imgur.com/eeL8j2v.gifv
You forgot the best shot
It also had two movies before it to build up that degree of emotion.
The fact the two scenes are compared just shows that TFA does a fantastic job setting up those emotions. Is it up there with RotJ? No but how could it be while remains the same length?
And I disagree that it's "simple" since the characters involved are both struggling through a torrent of emotional states from what had just happened.
Yeah it's easily the best space battle ever filmed, which is kinda sad considering how much easier it is to do space battles today with CGI. The only thing that annoys me is you don't see the capital ships firing at each other but given how much work it was to do that space battle I can forgive them, much like I can forgive the Deep Space Nine space battles for not showing shields.
I hope the new Star Wars trilogy has another major capital ship battle like the one in RotJ at some point. I was also disappointed that the new Star Trek trilogy didn't have any massive capital ship battles.
DrForester
Kills Photobucket
Empire is better, but there is nothing that tops this sequence.
Best moment in the entire trilogy. Everything about it is perfect.
I never saw Kylo as well trained in the lightsaber. He was built up as a powerful force user, but I don't think he was particuarly skilled with the saber. For one, he's using a cobbled together lightsaber that could blow up at any moment. While he can easily defeat untrained people like Finn, and Rey prior to her tapping into the force, there's nothing in the film to suggest he's skilled at it overall.
DrForester
Kills Photobucket
bah...
The space battle from Return of the Jedi wasn't changed at all in the special editions, you're thinking of the one from A New Hope, which had many shots replaced with CGI.
lastflowers
Banned
The entire Vader-Luke-Emperor sequence at the end is absolutely beautiful. Sure, maybe it could be improved, but there's no real reason for alteration. The scenes reveal a lot more about the characters than one could ever expect. At least to me, that is.
The capital ships do fire at each other. Just hard to tell unless your looking for it, but they do
The Battle of Endor has remained intact since release.
DrForester
Kills Photobucket
Well, when RotJ was made, Luke and Leia's mother wasn't killed by Vader.
Dem Jedi acrobatics
You have to remember that in the original they were imitating old sword style duels, and were also using actual powered props, so they also couldn't swing them very hard.
The indy wrestling flippy shit came later when they were using what amounted to practice fencing rods and better equipment to edit out wires and shit.
I loved this attention to detail. She's using the sword like her staff that she was using up to that point.
PhoncipleBone
Banned
They removed some matte lines here and there, and then added the shockwave as the Death Star exploded. I think that was about all they changed.
DrForester
Kills Photobucket
Well, and they brought on GOAT, Bob Anderson...
Beerman462
Member
Vigilant Walrus
Member
I think TFA saber fight was partially inspired by Kurosawas tracking.
I cannot find any good gifs but he was a master at doing these long tracking shots that had a lot of emotion in the shots themselves. It created a lot of action and made the shots a lot more interesting than just your average boring steady cam bullshit you'd see in the Avengers or something like that.
I cannot find any good gifs but he was a master at doing these long tracking shots that had a lot of emotion in the shots themselves. It created a lot of action and made the shots a lot more interesting than just your average boring steady cam bullshit you'd see in the Avengers or something like that.
Yes. The final Luke/Vader duel in the throne room is peak Star Wars. It's why I personally prefer Jedi over Empire.
Empire is better, but there is nothing that tops this sequence.
Hans first.
Maybe a little bit but you don't see nearly as much capital ship fire as you would expect given how many capital ships are in the battle, you mostly just see the fighters shooting. I don't really mind it that much though.
George Oscar Bluth II
Banned
Oh Han
TheSecondSpitter
Member
Between two old men too.
I don't care that Lucas thought Yoda could fight like a firefly on speed in Ep.2.
avatarquote.jpg
Monocle
Member
This fight is probably third best in the series, after ROTJ's Throne Room fight and ESB's Cloud City fight.
For story and thematic reasons, as much as the great choreography and cinematography.
RareFantasy64
Member
I know it has some of the lowest lows in the OT, but for the the Han rescue scene (I feel all the characters show how capable they have become during this opening scene and I love the camaraderie they all have for one another), the amazing Death Star 2 fight and Luke and Vader's resolution, I have ROTJ as my fav movie in the OT. It's a mixed bag, I know that. But I love the good stuff the movie has
Escape Goat
Member
waaat
I thought for sure I noticed them sticking some capital ships in there to make the battle look more intense.
Escape Goat
Member
No. Thats not true. Thats impossible!
RareFantasy64
Member
I never knew this either. Fascinating
He's not even dodging anything when the Falcon comes up to the camera! What, is Lando drunk or something?
Escape Goat
Member
MiamiWesker
Member
I understand Empire is the better film but ROTJ is still my favorite. As many pointed out The emperor throne room scenes are the best scenes of the entire series. Plus this is the movie where Luke becomes Luke, the previous two movies were all a build up to see him become the man he is in this movie.
Plus I feel the movie is just more entertaining at times than Empire. The whole battle of endor is just awesome. I love the escape from jabbas palace as well.
Plus I feel the movie is just more entertaining at times than Empire. The whole battle of endor is just awesome. I love the escape from jabbas palace as well.
TheSecondSpitter
Member
I always laugh at the people who rank RotS ahead of RotJ just to sound edgy and convey the impression they have deep thoughts about the SW universe.
The two films are not even in the same ballpark.
Monocle
Member
No doubt.
Her progress makes perfect sense if you pay attention to all the wordless moments where she's grasping with her mind and senses. A lot of people are absolutely hopeless interpreters of visual storytelling, though, so the inaccurate complaints about Rey's growth persist.
I swear, some viewers would need an actual training montage to get it.
Warm Machine
Member
They dodge past that one rebel ship. However that shot mostly exists because it was first done in Empire Strikes Back.
and people say gaf is full of hyperbole.
https://www.theasc.com/magazine/starwars/
There's some fantastic contemporaneous articles here about the filming of all the movies, but the OT ones are the best. Really detailed information on how the model shots were set up, filmed, composited, edited etc. The complexity of those shots in ROTJ is all the more incredible when you read how it was done.
If I just got handed the keys to the Falcon, I'd want to swoosh it about a bit too. Warm the tires up.
Magic Mushroom
Member
Space battle is awesome, but I always loved the speederbike chase through Endor as well.
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