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[@gkTH]

This would be the first time I will not follow suit of the mid-refresh. The native games still not come out enough.
The original PS5 is still limited to find so why it wastes investing in this but rather produce and distribute the PS5 as much as they can.

Random rumor without base logic.
Even true, I won't buy.

 

[Fenix34]

Soon will be console like pc with upgrades.

 

[Tal Shiar Agent]

I don't want to see them for consoles this time but I am surprised we haven't seen one for the Switch yet, Nintendo has done one for almost all of their handhelds so far.

Game Boy Color was a mid-gen upgrade for the GB, DSi for the DS, New3DS for the 3DS. Only one that didn't get one was the GBA, but that is likely due to how its lifespan was truncated by the DS.

 

[ByWatterson]

Xbox Series Flex

 

[TheTony316]

The slim launched first though. I am thinking the supply chain issues delayed things by a year minimum. Since that is how long it takes to even get certain cars you want built due to those very issues.

It did but it was only two months before the Pro.

 

[sinnergy]

Soon will be console like pc with upgrades.

Soon?? we are discussing these kind of upgrades for 20 years now there is nothing holding them back those years to have socketed CPUS and GPUS. You could upgrade, or even Ram. At least I envisioned those features at least 20 years ago. Didn’t happen.

 

[Calverz]

I don’t think you will see mid gen refreshes unless some new tech becomes fairly mainstream like 8k TV’s. The big reasons we got them last gen was the transition to 4K TV’s. Sony went first to encourage sales of their 4K TV’s. Microsoft then followed up with the x to join the club and give themselves a much needed power boost.

I don’t see this situation arising this gen.

 

[sinnergy]

I don’t think you will see mid gen refreshes unless some new tech becomes fairly mainstream like 8k TV’s. The big reasons we got them last gen was the transition to 4K TV’s. Sony went first to encourage sales of their 4K TV’s. Microsoft then followed up with the x to join the club and give themselves a much needed power boost.

I don’t see this situation arising this gen.

I don’t think either, they still have a lot of untapped potential on the table for these consoles .. at least 5 years .

 

[JetBlackPanda]

Yeah no. Fuck that.

Gaming PC and steamdeck for me now.

My PS5 and series X sit idle right now anyways and I have friends that still haven’t secured a PS5.

 

[PeteBull]

Just skip it. I did last time.

I did and it sucked, ps4 versions were much worse from ps4pro(not just resolution but many times framrate too), this time im smarter and waiting for midgenupgrade already, skipped ps5 simply then when midgen hits i get best version of games(console wise) and till then there will be plenty exclusives- best of both worlds

 

[Dodo123]

Why are you always so surprised with such info? Do you even follow this business? Every gen, same shocked responses.

Yes, these companies have hardware divisions and they DO SOMETHING there. If you don't expect at least a new slimmer version to release at the end of next year, then I highly suggest you to read about the history of this industry.

 

[noise36]

A less big and ugly ps5 would be a real win.

 

[Team Andromeda]

Look forward to this in 2 years time

 

[DenchDeckard]

Imagine if these things launch and its the only way to play real current gen games at 60fps. Genius but also painful pill to swallow. Would j7st be better with PC.

I think this gen I'll maybe switch to PC completely....which seems insane to me. I'll keep hold of these current consoles for a while and see if we get true next gen games within the next two years. If not I'm out.

 

[Vr46]

A less big and ugly ps5 would be a real win.

this 100%

 

[Slicker than your average]

A less big and ugly ps5 would be a real win.

I kinda like how it looks like a cervix

 

[KormaChameleon]

Seems a bit too soon, have developers even made the current hardware tapped out yet?

 

[rofif]

Imagine if Sony applied the same design principle of the PS4 Pro to the PS5 Pro: a sort of "double hamburger" PS5 Fat. What a monstrosity.

You are forgetting something.
Ps4 pro was the new big model and ps4 slim replaced original ps4.
So pro is not double whammy of original. it is almost double whammy of slim !

 

[sankt-Antonio]

Last time the mid-Gen consoles released it made sense - at the time the price of 4K was dropping rapidly and adoption was widespread — and the PS4/XB0 couldn’t handle that output. There’s absolutely zero logic behind a mid-Gen refresh at this point, as it’s been pointed out %99 of games are still cross-Gen and no one has come close to exploiting the full power of the current machines. 8K landed with a thud, and the average person still can’t buy a next-Gen machine by walking into the store.

They can sell a more expensive console sooner as an option. Game dev is not getting much more expensive. Win win for Sony/Ms.

No app pushes the new iPhone. But it’s still on a yearly release scheduled.

 

[Wandering Leopard]

Seems a bit too soon, have developers even made the current hardware tapped out yet?

The PS4 Pro came out 3 years after the original PS4, so assuming the rumour is true, late next year or early 2024 would make sense.

 

[Caio]

Yeah no. Fuck that.

Gaming PC and steamdeck for me now.

My PS5 and series X sit idle right now anyways and I have friends that still haven’t secured a PS5.

But Microsoft and Sony do not care about you and your friends, or your gaming PC, it has nothing to do with the Mid Gen upgrades...
I think we will get the Mid Gen upgrades by Sept 2024; the best multiplatform games will be much more demanding from 2023, and going towards the end of this generation, so why not giving a much more powerful PS5 and XSX to those enthusiastic console players who want better performance and visuals on Consoles ? What's the big deal ? Is this hurting the ones who will not buy them ?
I would be the first in line to buy a PS5 PRO or XSX on roids, as I did with XBox One X, one of the best Console I have ever owned, and Jesus, Forza Horizon 4 on One X, WOW ! Mid Gen upgrades are so welcome for me, the beauty of taste and opinions.

 

[In Cold Blood]

I don't see the point at this stage.
I was watching MVG and he has developed for both PS5 and XSXS. He was saying both consoles have only just scratched the surface so far with what they are capable of.
On PS5 no games have taken advantage of the SSD or the Primitive Shaders, while nothing yet on XSXS uses Mesh Shaders, Sampler Feedback Streaming, Velocity Architecture or Direct ML.
Just adding some more Compute Units or faster frequency is just lazy.

 

[hoplie]

I don‘t get the talk about the consoles didn‘t yet show their full potential.
Generational advantages: SSD and CPU. We have fast loading times and 60 fps.
GPU though is very weak comparing to old generation.
So the refresh has to deliver in this topic, they really need more GPU power.
Switching console every 3 years is perfectly fine.
Also, refreshes would help that more consoles are available, as they clearly would not be made with the same process.

 

[thegame983]

Extra 10 bucks for pro version of game?

 

[Physiognomonics]

I don't see the point at this stage.
I was watching MVG and he has developed for both PS5 and XSXS. He was saying both consoles have only just scratched the surface so far with what they are capable of.
On PS5 no games have taken advantage of the SSD or the Primitive Shaders, while nothing yet on XSXS uses Mesh Shaders, Sampler Feedback Streaming, Velocity Architecture or Direct ML.
Just adding some more Compute Units or faster frequency is just lazy.

That's not true. Not sure about primitive shaders (but I'd guess plenty of games already use them) but we have a few games on PS5 using its custom I/O, notably all Insomniac games as those are loading a whole new level from 0.5 sec to 2 sec depending of game / scene.

And We actually know from interview that they use the custom decompression engine to stream assets in-game and that this actually improves performance a lot (compared to PC not having it).

 

[John Wick]

Sony & Microsoft can't even produce enough consoles for their current gen never mind mid gen refreshes. Makes no sense and is fake.

 

[TheRedRiders]

That's not true. Not sure about primitive shaders (but I'd guess plenty of games already use them) but we have a few games on PS5 using its custom I/O, notably all Insomniac games as those are loading a whole new level from 0.5 sec to 2 sec depending of game / scene.

And We actually know from interview that they use the custom decompression engine to stream assets in-game and that this actually improves performance a lot (compared to PC not having it).

As far as I’m aware there’s no games right now taking advantage of Primitive and Mesh Shaders on either console.

They’re one of the biggest features these new consoles have and they offer really cool functionality such as creating micro-polygon rendering systems similar to what Unreal Engine is doing with Nanite.

There’s also a learning curve associated with these features since they require the graphics pipeline to be completely re-written (more so with Mesh Shaders compared to Primitive Shaders). I’d expect the next Spider-man to be leveraging Primitive Shaders since it’s a PS5 exclusive and it falls in line with when we expect such features to be adopted (second and third wave of games).

 

[StealthGoblin]

Sony can barely get away with doing this given they’ve released an acceptable amount of first party games this gen.

Microsoft can get in the bin. I’d be fucking fuming if I was a Series X owner who cared about the power of the box only for a new one to come along without many games justifying the current box.

 

[MALpractice311]

If we're talking slim versions, this sounds great. Both these consoles, particularly the PS4, are massive and can barely fit in my living room entertainment unit.

If we're talking pro versions, this makes no sense yet. Due to covid and chip shortages, there's still many people who want these consoles but haven't been able to get their hands on them and there's barely any current gen exclusive games yet. Most games are still cross platform, so you know developers haven't truly taken advantage of the power of these consoles yet.

 

[vivftp]

Sony & Microsoft can't even produce enough consoles for their current gen never mind mid gen refreshes. Makes no sense and is fake.

I have no idea about MS's plans, but Sony are likely going to be shipping 23 million PS5's on the low end and 30.5 million PS5's on the high end next FY, based on the data/rumors we have. If these mid-gen refreshes occur they likely won't be until 2024 and by then the supply shortages will be a distant memory.

I don’t think you will see mid gen refreshes unless some new tech becomes fairly mainstream like 8k TV’s. The big reasons we got them last gen was the transition to 4K TV’s. Sony went first to encourage sales of their 4K TV’s. Microsoft then followed up with the x to join the club and give themselves a much needed power boost.

I don’t see this situation arising this gen.

The mid-gen refreshes last gen coincided with the rise of 4K TVs, but they weren't the sole reason for them. Sony themselves said that the PS4 Pro was meant to offer their console gamers a more powerful solution to try and capture some of that market that might jump to PC gaming because they wanted more than what the base console could offer. If a mid-gen refresh happens again then that could be the sole reason for it, and it'd be perfectly justifiable.

There will always be a segment of the market willing to pay more for better performance and all the bells and whistles. If they can retain some of that market via a Pro console then why not.

If we're talking slim versions, this sounds great. Both these consoles, particularly the PS4, are massive and can barely fit in my living room entertainment unit.

If we're talking pro versions, this makes no sense yet. Due to covid and chip shortages, there's still many people who want these consoles but haven't been able to get their hands on them and there's barely any current gen exclusive games yet. Most games are still cross platform, so you know developers haven't truly taken advantage of the power of these consoles yet.

Remember that these rumors are about something that likely won't happen for a couple of years. You can't use the current state of things to judge the logic behind something that won't happen until years from now. By then supply shortages won't be a thing anymore, cross gen will be dead and there will be tons of games taking full advantage of these consoles.

 

[Lillie]

At this point I wont even bother with my PS5 and XSX... I'll just update my PC then...

 

[FeralEcho]

Mid-gen refresh already for two consoles that haven't even left cross-gen nor do they appear to leave it anytime soon...but hey we need that extra power for the new batch of remakes coming up.Embarassing display of the current state of the gaming industry all around!

An industry wide gaming crash can't come soon enough!!!

 

[vivftp]

Mid-gen refresh already for two consoles that haven't even left cross-gen nor do they appear to leave it anytime soon...but hey we need that extra power for the new batch of remakes coming up.Embarassing display of the current state of the gaming industry all around!

An industry wide gaming crash can't come soon enough!!!

Seriously, I'm now convinced that some people don't know the difference between an official announcement of something happening soon and a rumor of something that likely won't happen until a couple of years from now.

 

[Tal Shiar Agent]

Sure yoy could upgrade your PC, but I mean you could buy a PS5, XSX, and a Steam Deck for the price of a 4090 alone.

 

[Dr. Wilkinson]

Given you still can’t walk into a store and buy either of these machines, I really think this is unnecessary.

Only thing that would change my mind is if the plan with these, unlike last time, is to replace the current models, rather than be a new premium-priced tier. We’re going into a recession and these machines are already $500, and it’s still hard to even buy one.

 

[Tal Shiar Agent]

Given you still can’t walk into a store and buy either of these machines, I really think this is unnecessary.

You can though, at least PS5s.

 

[DaGwaphics]

Sure yoy could upgrade your PC, but I mean you could buy a PS5, XSX, and a Steam Deck for the price of a 4090 alone.

The value of consoles will always be their greatest strength. I don't have a problem with a higher priced tier though as long as skus still get released at the lower price points. $800 or $900 could still be a great value for a complete system if the performance offered is good enough.

 

[JetBlackPanda]

But Microsoft and Sony do not care about you and your friends, or your gaming PC, it has nothing to do with the Mid Gen upgrades...
I think we will get the Mid Gen upgrades by Sept 2024; the best multiplatform games will be much more demanding from 2023, and going towards the end of this generation, so why not giving a much more powerful PS5 and XSX to those enthusiastic console players who want better performance and visuals on Consoles ? What's the big deal ? Is this hurting the ones who will not buy them ?
I would be the first in line to buy a PS5 PRO or XSX on roids, as I did with XBox One X, one of the best Console I have ever owned, and Jesus, Forza Horizon 4 on One X, WOW ! Mid Gen upgrades are so welcome for me, the beauty of taste and opinions.

I never said they cared. I said fuck that as a consumer.

More power to them though

 

[HTK]

Some of the reactions here you would think this thing comes out tomorrow. By the time this Pro model comes out the stock issue will be solved, more games that push the boundaries of the PS5 will be out. It will come out at the right time for those looking for the upgrade.

I have a feeling it will look just like the current PS5 with some minor visual tweeks to differentiate itself. This will not require new R&D and production process will be streamlined.

 

[cireza]

Utterly pointless. They haven't even started making games specifically for current consoles. I don't think that I have any game that is Series only, and not Xbox One at the same time.

Ridiculous.

 

[Dr. Wilkinson]

You can though, at least PS5s.

??? What market are you in?

This has never been the case in the US, we are nowhere near that yet. And it’s been 2 years.

 

[playsaves3]

Due to the hardware based approach to back compatibility there is always a slight limitation as to what can realistically be achieved in a Pro tier PlayStation device. Previously, Sony utilised the butterfly method in the PS4 Pro to overcome this limitation. It was a method that worked well for them. Feasibly, they could potentially push things by adding even more compute to a potential Pro tier die, unfortunately, that isn’t too likely due to both cost and complexity.

PS5 Pro via butterfly would be roughly double the performance of the PS5 depending on clocks. So the existing ~10.3 TFlops of the PS5 would double to ~20.6 TFlops in the PS5 Pro using this method (36 RDNA2 CU doubles to 72). This of course is all speculation.

To me, a mid-gen Xbox is far more interesting. Microsoft have no limitations whatsoever. They can do whatever they want as their games work via virtualised abstraction layer. They could feasibly shift to RDNA3 if they so desired. I wish they would just throw the kitchen sink at a mid-gen device just to rock the boat. The mid-gen refresh isn’t for the mainstream anyways. Make it enthusiast, make it expensive and give us more power. Something absurd like 3x the Series X. 36 TFlops sounds pretty good to me.

That’s why you make it based on rdna 4 which is why these shouldn’t come till 2024 so they can do it

 

[playsaves3]

I don‘t get the talk about the consoles didn‘t yet show their full potential.
Generational advantages: SSD and CPU. We have fast loading times and 60 fps.
GPU though is very weak comparing to old generation.
So the refresh has to deliver in this topic, they really need more GPU power.
Switching console every 3 years is perfectly fine.
Also, refreshes would help that more consoles are available, as they clearly would not be made with the same process.

It’s the cpu that’s weak not the gpu

 

[playsaves3]

The value of consoles will always be their greatest strength. I don't have a problem with a higher priced tier though as long as skus still get released at the lower price points. $800 or $900 could still be a great value for a complete system if the performance offered is good enough.

Actually being able to play physical games will be it’s greatest strength

 

[DaGwaphics]

Some of the reactions here you would think this thing comes out tomorrow. By the time this Pro model comes out the stock issue will be solved, more games that push the boundaries of the PS5 will be out. It will come out at the right time for those looking for the upgrade.

I have a feeling it will look just like the current PS5 with some minor visual tweeks to differentiate itself. This will not require new R&D and production process will be streamlined.

Even if something like this did release tomorrow, I don't get the consternation over it. If you aren't interested, don't buy it and its existence won't change anything for you.

Even if there was no new tech and it was basically just a 6800xt in there, that's still going to perform a lot better than the base consoles and would be worth buying for people that value that type of thing. New RDNA3 and Zen4 tech would be an added bonus. I suspect if MS did this they would want to jump the CPU capabilities substantially over the existing systems, doubling of FPS could be important for Xcloud performance down the road.

 

[HeisenbergFX4]

??? What market are you in?

This has never been the case in the US, we are nowhere near that yet. And it’s been 2 years.

I am starting to see more and more PS5s in the wild sitting on shelves but nothing like the Series X

Even if something like this did release tomorrow, I don't get the consternation over it. If you aren't interested, don't buy it and its existence won't change anything for you.

Even if there was no new tech and it was basically just a 6800xt in there, that's still going to perform a lot better than the base consoles and would be worth buying for people that value that type of thing. New RDNA3 and Zen4 tech would be an added bonus. I suspect if MS did this they would want to jump the CPU capabilities substantially over the existing systems, doubling of FPS could be important for Xcloud performance down the road.

These things could drop tomorrow and I would gladly buy both and keep playing my current games

Give me Hell Let Loose on my PS5 Pro 4k 120fps

 

[DaGwaphics]

Actually being able to play physical games will be it’s greatest strength

Honestly, that's probably a benefit that's not too long for this world. I can see both MS and Sony dropping disk drives from the base configs either during this gen with slim/refresh models or next-gen. Yeah, they might offer a standalone drive that can be connected, but that will lead to a sharp decline in the number of titles that get physical releases to begin with.

 

[Dr. Wilkinson]

I am starting to see more and more PS5s in the wild sitting on shelves but nothing like the Series X


These things could drop tomorrow and I would gladly buy both and keep playing my current games

Give me Hell Let Loose on my PS5 Pro 4k 120fps

I live in a very populous area in the US with multiple Best Buys, Walmart, Meijer, Target, etc all around and I have never seen PS5 stocked. It hasn’t happened yet, there have always been signs up in the cases that say they are only available online and in limited supply, etc.

 

[HeisenbergFX4]

I live in a very populous area in the US with multiple Best Buys, Walmart, Meijer, Target, etc all around and I have never seen PS5 stocked. It hasn’t happened yet, there have always been signs up in the cases that say they are only available online and in limited supply, etc.

My area in Southern Indiana doesn't have the largest population and thats where I have seen several on shelves and just saw one a few days ago at a Gamestop in Jupiter FL though it was a bundle

 

[playsaves3]

Honestly, that's probably a benefit that's not too long for this world. I can see both MS and Sony dropping disk drives from the base configs either during this gen with slim/refresh models or next-gen. Yeah, they might offer a standalone drive that can be connected, but that will lead to a sharp decline in the number of titles that get physical releases to begin with.

They would be gargantuan idiots to drop it. I would have 0 reason to continue using consoles and not just going to ox at that point or dropping new systems altogether