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So Capcom released an Early Access game, priced like a full one

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Meant to be an actual question and not sarcastic or flamebaity: How different is this from Splatoon? That launched with a thin campaign and multiplayer featuring only two modes and five maps, a inconsequential amount of content for a multiplayer-focused game, and promised updates over the subsequent months to eventually bring the game up to "feature-complete" or whatever.

I get that behind the scenes it seemed that Splatoon was just holding back and drip-feeding completed content as a strategy to keep the playerbase active while this kind of seems to be Capcom just not having finished the game yet, but putting that aside and looking only at the products themselves (and assuming Capcom is good to their word regarding updates), are they very different situations?


WHOA!!! Very very different. Splatoon had a really good single player, a multiplayer mode that was complete and future updates were free.

Ranked mode and team battles should have been from the start but it was a complete game (the added features added to the game for sure)
 
『Inaba Resident』;195654986 said:
Which is what they would have done regardless of what was in the game. Like every other fighting game. The only difference here is that you have the option to get characters for free and if not, you pay the same amount of money you normally would for a character. What's the issue?

The issue here is the goal is for you to pay.

Its nice to assume they won't adjust the prices for things after the fact (alll they really said on the record was -Edit-Alex-Edit-would essentially be free), but we dont know. Assuming this is capcom being altruistic towards the playerbase is false

Its nice to assume we've got all this dlc coming out to help make the game complete but its not as if we signed a contract or they genuinely owe us.

Shoot. Tomorrow they could be like, "Shit, our bad. We fucked this up. No more updates! Super SF5 next spring!" and we would have to take it (a la Marvel vs Capcom 3)

I can understand the company pr people to be like,"trust us" but im confused at the playerbase acting like the critique and mistrust aint founded.
 
Capcom probably should have kickstarted SFV instead. People probably would have been okay with its current state and future plans.
 
WHOA!!! Very very different. Splatoon had a really good single player, a multiplayer mode that was complete and future updates were free.

Ranked mode and team battles should have been from the start but it was a complete game (the added features added to the game for sure)

Was Splatoon's single player all that great? It was mostly decent but ended on a really strong note so I think people rate it higher because of that. And it certainly lacked Multiplayer content in the beginning.

Great game overall, though.
 
Was Splatoon's single player all that great? It was mostly decent but ended on a really strong note so I think people rate it higher because of that. And it certainly lacked Multiplayer content in the beginning.

Great game overall, though.

I thought Splatoon's single player was awesome from start to finish, although it was a bit short.

The online content was incredibly light at launch though, no doubt about it. But man did Nintendo make good on their promise to flesh the game out. If Capcom does the same, then great! Unfortunately, their current roadmap doesn't instill much confidence, at least for this year. I'm hoping they're just saving a bunch of future SF V announcements for E3 or EVO.
 
WHOA!!! Very very different. Splatoon had a really good single player, a multiplayer mode that was complete and future updates were free.

Ranked mode and team battles should have been from the start but it was a complete game (the added features added to the game for sure)
Splatoon was a complete game but just like Capcom did with Monster Hunter 4 Ultimate I'm still going give them criticism for drip feeding ON DISC LOCKED CONTENT! To the community and pretending to grace us with "free" content that has no business being locked in the first place.At least in Street Fighters V case the content is simply not there and their not drip feeding locked content.
 
The issue here is the goal is for you to pay.

Its nice to assume they won't adjust the prices for things after the fact (alll they really said on the record was sean would essentially be free), but we dont know. Assuming this is capcom being altruistic towards the playerbase is false

Its nice to assume we've got all this dlc coming out to help make the game complete but its not as if we signed a contract or they genuinely owe us.

Shoot. Tomorrow they could be like, "Shit, our bad. We fucked this up. No more updates! Super SF5 next spring!" and we would have to take it (a la Marvel vs Capcom 3)

I can understand the company pr people to be like,"trust us" but im confused at the playerbase acting like the critique and mistrust aint founded.

So you're pretty much making up scenarios in your head and distrusting capcom because of them.
 
I can understand the company pr people to be like,"trust us" but im confused at the playerbase acting like the critique and mistrust aint founded.

I've yet to play an SF game that wasn't supported for years.

They've earned my trust with the way they've handled the franchise in the past. I have no reason not to believe everything they've said about the game.
 
Splatoon was a complete game but just like Capcom did with Monster Hunter 4 Ultimate I'm still going give them criticism for drip feeding ON DISC LOCKED CONTENT! To the community and pretending to grace us with "free" content that has no business being locked in the first place.At least in Street Fighters V case the content is simply not there and their not drip feeding locked content.

To be fair, a huge chunk of Splatoon's current content was not on the disc.
 
Hold the phone here.

You can't even fight the CPU outside of Story and Survival Mode?

In a fighting game?

In 2016?

Wow. This is some bare bones shit.

Yeah...well training mode too I think.. I'd say that arcade mode, while a fighting game staple and something that's probably not that hard to include (I could be wrong I don't know shit about making games), isn't really necessary. You can fight the CPU in training forever. You can fight every character in survival if you want to KO the CPU and see intros and victory poses. I don't think they're going to bother with many endings and such if they did include arcade, since they're going to have a story mode.

That being said, I've seen someone here or GameFAQs mention that there is an arcade mode that they created, but they left it out of the game. When they took versions of the game to events to let people play, it was present then. They should just put the damn mode in since it has been created.
 
Well yeah, I think it's about to become a niche franchise. Up until this point though, it's been a pretty popular, mainstream series. It's one of the staples of the entire video game industry.
Nice trolling but that doesn't mean it is going to become niche even if you want it to be.

WHOA!!! Very very different. Splatoon had a really good single player, a multiplayer mode that was complete and future updates were free.

Ranked mode and team battles should have been from the start but it was a complete game (the added features added to the game for sure)
Splatoon at launch wasn't a complete game, there was a bunch of content that was locked on disc for like 4 months after it was released. It's a complete game now but it took at least 3 months to get that way.
 
A fighting game released feature complete the first time probably means it didn't do well enough to get more content later.

I hope SF5 remains unfinished for 6 or 7 years.
 
A fighting game released feature complete the first time probably means it didn't do well enough to get more content later.

I hope SF5 remains unfinished for 6 or 7 years.

Vanilla SF IV's console release was "feature complete" as in folks didn't have much of an issue with the content present at release and look how long that lasted and how much new content it got.

This is a joke in comparison.
 
Cancelled my pre-order and got my $64.94 back. Can't believe Capcom did this after all the backlash from so many other titles.
 
Nice trolling but that doesn't mean it is going to become niche even if you want it to be.

Ummmm what? How am I trolling? I love Street Fighter and bought V yesterday!

Why the heck would I want it to become niche? It's one of the best franchises in gaming.

Are most people in the FGC like this? If you disagree with me or think I'm crazy, fine. But I'm not trolling.
 
To be fair, a huge chunk of Splatoon's current content was not on the disc.
And that will also eventually apply to Street Fighter V but it's that intial drip feeding that REALLY gets to me (seriously I had to wait 6 MONTHS for Capcom to bother unlocking 1 monster that has been there since day 1 in Monster Hunter 4 Ultimate) and I hate it whenever someone pulls this off in a game I play.
 
So you're pretty much making up scenarios in your head and distrusting capcom because of them.

Because DLC plans have never failed?

I just feel I am in bizarro world where you can pay full price for a game, get less then you did last time(vanilla sf4) and everyone is like "Dont worry, they promised us eventually we are going to get what we are missing and essentially paid for in 4-12 weeks!" and everyone is cool with it, lol.
 
And that will also eventually apply to Street Fighter V but it's that intial drip feeding that REALLY gets to me (seriously I had to wait 6 MONTHS for Capcom to bother unlocking 1 monster that has been there since day 1 in Monster Hunter 4 Ultimate) and I hate it whenever someone pulls this off in a game I play.

No, I get it. It can bother me sometimes as well. MH4U, not so much, because that game was loaded with stuff to do on day one.
 
I basically equate it to 2K releasing a basketball game with only a practice mode and then online multiplayer. Some people can claim all they want that they mostly play it online, but that doesn't change the fact that it has less content then what you normally get at the same price.

People threw a fit about NHL and that still had a lot more content in it with certain game modes removed.
 
Vanilla SF IV's console release was "feature complete" as in folks didn't have much of an issue with the content present at release and look how long that lasted and how much new content it got.

This is a joke in comparison.

Huge difference there :).

I agree that this is a shitty showing in comparison to most fighters out there, but the only time it will be "complete" is when they're done adding to it.
 
Ummmm what? How am I trolling? I love Street Fighter and bought V yesterday!

Why the heck would I want it to become niche? It's one of the best franchises in gaming.
Okay doesn't mean your point was doing exactly that, I don't think it's going to become niche and I don't see how anyone can honestly feel this way especially if they are a fan of street fighter.
 
Vanilla SF IV's console release was "feature complete" as in folks didn't have much of an issue with the content present at release and look how long that lasted and how much new content it got.

This is a joke in comparison.

Console version wasn't the first version though.

The SF5 we have now is basically the arcade release.
 
I thought Splatoon's single player was awesome from start to finish, although it was a bit short.

The online content was incredibly light at launch though, no doubt about it. But man did Nintendo make good on their promise to flesh the game out. If Capcom does the same, then great! Unfortunately, their current roadmap doesn't instill much confidence, at least for this year. I'm hoping they're just saving a bunch of future SF V announcements for E3 or EVO.

The big difference between Splatoon and Street Fighter 5 is that Nintendo laid out their service-type system for it a month in advance. They said what modes were there on day 1, and how we'd get more weapons, maps and modes over time for free. They even extended the service twice and might get another round of DLC as well.

Street Fighter 5, as of launch day, still surprised people in regards to what was and wasn't in the package on Day 1. There's a good reason why people are still stunned when stuff like Arcade Mode isn't in the game right now, and doesn't look like it will be. The fact that the game is basically online only while trying to hand-wave like it isn't is bullshit since you can't unlock anything while offline. You can scream 'MAH FIGHT MONEY' all you want, but it's simply something that is negatively affecting other aspects of the game, namely disconnecting and halting all progress for "Offline" modes, forcing players to start again. It's not something players asked for, but because Capcom disguised it as 'oh, you can get the DLC for free' most people applauded and praised Capcom for it.
 
The gameplay matters so much more than the amount of content.

Take Splatoon. Even at launch it was already the best multiplayer FPS/TPS of this generation. Gameplay matters a lot! If I could get a game that was 8/10 gameplay and 15 maps or 10/10 gameplay with 5 maps I'm taking the later every single time.

In my limited time with SF V it already seems like a tremendous improvement and the right direction for the series after a misstep with IV. Too early to call it yet, but gameplay-wise it seems great so far.
 
The big difference between Splatoon and Street Fighter 5 is that Nintendo laid out their service-type system for it a month in advance. They said what modes were there on day 1, and how we'd get more weapons, maps and modes over time for free. They even extended the service twice and might get another round of DLC as well.

Street Fighter 5, as of launch day, still surprised people in regards to what was and wasn't in the package on Day 1. There's a good reason why people are still stunned when stuff like Arcade Mode isn't in the game right now, and doesn't look like it will be. The fact that the game is basically online only while trying to hand-wave like it isn't is bullshit since you can't unlock anything while offline. You can scream 'MAH FIGHT MONEY' all you want, but it's simply something that is negatively affecting other aspects of the game, namely disconnecting and halting all progress for "Offline" modes, forcing players to start again. It's not something players asked for, but because Capcom disguised it as 'oh, you can get the DLC for free' most people applauded and praised Capcom for it.

Hey man, I'm with you. I made a thread about being shocked that Arcade Mode is missing. I'm hoping Capcom has a lot of unannounced content coming, because as of now, I'm not impressed with their current roadmap.

That being said, SF V's gameplay is sublime, so they've got the most important part nailed, which I'm happy about.
 
People weren't fine with that. There was tons of complaining about how barebones it was at launch.

Splatoon didn't have any microtransaction horseshit and SFV does, which is the key difference. Capcom intends for people to end up paying for the extra characters, whereas all the splatoon content was 100% free so far for everybody

Except for the Amibo content. That's locked behind buying a cheap little action figure. But lets just ignore that because Nintendo, right?

Even vanilla SF games have a proper versus and arcade mode.

How many different formats should they construct for people to play against the CPU? They have the prologue, survival, and are bringing out a story mode. The game isn't releasing in arcades and a CPU versus mode is basically a one off arcade mode.

Would people really have been happier if Capcom had just stuck more menu options on the front end when in reality you're just playing different packages of the same v. CPU fights?

As someone growing up with real quality games, seeing this trend of half-assed products released at higher prices than before (CAD sucks) is both incredibly sad and frustrating. There were a lot of titles I anticipated but didn't buy because of DLC or fear of getting an incomplete product. Stuff like Fallout 4 and now Street Fighter V.

It's pretty stupid that gamers think this is OK. Either most of them are too young to remember what are actually complete, great products or they don't care anymore and would rather spend more money to get the Complete Experience (TM)

Online-only for the most part is another slap in the face for SFV. We are lucky enough to get review codes, but I'd never spend $69.99 + tax for such a shallow game. Doesn't bode well for Resident Evil 7 either, which will probably also be plagued by microtransactions.

So how many of those "complete" games you reference from years gone by offered online play? How many had problematic bugs that got fixed or imbalanced gameplay corrected after release? How many of those games did you finish, want additional content in that world, and then have it delivered to you?

Gaming post-internet/digital distro revolution is different, obviously, but then so is everything else post-internet. Dating, looking for jobs, actually doing your job, hell even ordering a pizza is entirely different than what it was in the mid-90's.

Maybe try tipping down those nostalgia shades for a second and realize that:
1. SFV is a damn good fighting game at it's core out of the box. No one is being asked to pay for a game lacking proper balance, unable to run in a stable fashion on the hardware, etc..

2. SFV is going to see substantial upgrades down the road. A small part of those upgrades is additional characters that cost money. Another part is the first full story mode in a SF game, free. The most important of all however? Rolling balance adjustments. In the past if someone found an exploit in the system it was just a fact of life. Now we get to have those unintended issues ironed out and the game improved. Capcom can't provide us a feature complete SF on release because a HUGE part of what completes a SF game is handing it over to the competitive scene and seeing what they do with it, then responding.

The real phenomenon at play here is the misconception of what the fighting genre is today. Fighting games have not jumped on the "more filler content uber alles" mantra that so many other genres have. They have not been streamlining and simplifying their core mechanics to appeal to a wider base. The genre does not fit the stereotypical "even if you don't like X kind of games this one is so good you need to get it!" viewpoint great titles from other genres are often argued in favor of.

Fighting games have gotten more focused on the core, less focused on the filler, and as a result the "best" fighting games are not pick up and play experiences for the average person, no matter how good the core game might be. They're moving in literally the exact opposite direction as the mainstream shooters and action/adventure games.

The online issues are depressing but to be expected. This is every major competitive game launch basically for all time here, nothing new. But if you bought a fighting game expecting some kind of massive time sink single player mode or series of modes to keep you coming back without ever playing against real people you made the mistake, not Capcom.
 
The gameplay matters so much more than the amount of content.

Take Splatoon. Even at launch it was already the best multiplayer FPS/TPS of this generation. Gameplay matters a lot! If I could get a game that was 8/10 gameplay and 15 maps or 10/10 gameplay with 5 maps I'm taking the later every single time.

In my limited time with SF V it already seems like a tremendous improvement over IV and the right direction for the series after a misstep with IV. Too early to call it yet, but gameplay-wise it seems great so far.

Could you elaborate on the tremendous improvements in 5 over 4? Genuinely curious.

Also...people saying Splatoon is the best shooter of this generation...yikes.
 
It's amazing how many people are willing to just let gamess like this slide or give excuses for how lacking it is. Even if you compare it to SFIV on launch and that didn't even have a beta. This had 4!
 
Vanilla SF IV's console release was "feature complete" as in folks didn't have much of an issue with the content present at release and look how long that lasted and how much new content it got.

This is a joke in comparison.

A few things.

1. The game was "feature complete" due to a completely different console market and needs of that market: games had to be complete to a certain extent and not contingent of people being able to download patches.
2. Development costs have gone up from last gen.
3. This game won't be "feature complete" until the last patch/update is released
4. These type of releases (Destiny, Drive Club, Battlefield 4, etc.) are the future of online focused games.

If you go back on GAF the past few years, this is how many of the games launched. This will not change and will continue to happen. Online focused games will start off in semi-working states and evolve as time goes on. There is no way around this. This is how it will be for the foreseeable future.
 
Youd still be paying for characters if fight money wasnt in here fyi. All this does is allow a way for people to get characters at no extra cost.

And besides, how much Splatoon content that was released was actually made post release vs locked on the disc?
(genuinely curious about this)

We actually know what was, at least in part, on the splatoon disc.
http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1068073

Presuming that to be accurate, about 6 (of 16) maps were developed completely after launch.

Except for the Amibo content. That's locked behind buying a cheap little action figure. But lets just ignore that because Nintendo, right?
I never stop bitching about how much I hate virtually any amiibo content (feel free to check). Fundamentally though, even then, the amiibo content had no effect on the multiplayer which is the bulk of the game. A few skins is hardly comparable to player characters in a fighting game.
 
I've yet to play an SF game that wasn't supported for years.

They've earned my trust with the way they've handled the franchise in the past. I have no reason not to believe everything they've said about the game.

Supported? You mean when they made users buy a new version everytime they added a couple new characters?
 
I'm sure I have another Fighter that has less options from lastgen.
 
Console version wasn't the first version though.

The SF5 we have now is basically the arcade release.

This is very true. I was going to make this point except for the whole "no arcade mode" thing being the easiest way to pick apart this argument.

But really, the only fighting games that don't launch with a bare bones release are MKX and Smash. The rest started with an arcade title and then got a second budget for the console release.

Vanilla SF4 effectively only added 6 characters to the game (8 if you count two NPCs being made playable). The features the console edition added are basically the same ones SFV did, except trials.
 
Hey man, I'm with you. I made a thread about being shocked that Arcade Mode is missing. I'm hoping Capcom has a lot of unannounced content coming, because as of now, I'm not impressed with their current roadmap.

That being said, SF V's gameplay is sublime, so they've got the most important part nailed, which I'm happy about.

I just used your post as a jumping off point more than anything. Seemed like a good place to start.

As of right now, I think Capcom has too much "unannounced content" because it means they're not planning on it. While Nintendo was vague on specifics, they did lay it out much better than Capcom.

There's so much misinformation and lack of information about what''s coming, what's not, and how to do stuff in SF5 right now that it does boggle the mind a bit. And tying everything into their vague 'Fight Money' and vague 'CFN' system (which is just a dressed up version of USF4 had) just complicates matters to the point of exhaustion.
 
I'm bummed I can't play the game in its current state, can't get a refund (GMG) and I don't know how long it's going to take to fix.

Game plays in slow motion, underwater street fighting. It decides to not use my nvidia gpu and uses the integrated gpu. Forcing it through the nvidia control panel, doesn't work.
Changing the SF5.exe compability to Vista makes it use the nvidia gpu, but the FPS degrade over time (Going from 60 to 30) and in 10 mins we are back to massive slow downs, game ran fine in the Beta.

Tried playing with a friend, can't add his id but he can add mine. Tried battle lounge but it doesn't work.

On top of the technical issues we have the minimal content, which I was expecting but not this bad, I was expecting at least a player vs cpu. What we got was an option in training which is not the same.
Overall yes, it does feel like an early access game and it is unfortunate.
 
This hasn't been the case for years

It's been the case with every single Street Fighter with SFIV being the sole exception. And the original release of SFIV wasn't even set up to allow dlc, so even then you had to buy another version.

So yeah, that statement I replied to was an odd one to make.
 
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