Dr. Kitty Muffins
Member
Why leave out the Gran Turismo series? Polyphony is Japanese too. I'm not only talking about the teams over at Japan Studio.
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Sony admits PS4 is a tougher sell in Japan
- Thread starter Bundy
- Start date
Why leave out the Gran Turismo series? Polyphony is Japanese too. I'm not only talking about the teams over at Japan Studio.
The word baffling is perfect for this situation. Its like sony decided to leave japan out of the conversation for PS4 launch.
im not a game developer, but I would guess making a minna no golf title for the ps4 doesnt require a big studio and a long development time? Am I wrong?
Sorc3r3r
Member
Question is: is japan still worth as home console market?
Is there money to be made there?
Pushing and having more "japanese" games will be reflected in a significative raise of the sales of the ps4?
I honestly think that home console in japan are a thing of the past.
The last "traditional" successful console was the ps2.
(And yeah i know there was a console called Wii, but i think you can concede that it was a little different than the usual)
Is there money to be made there?
Pushing and having more "japanese" games will be reflected in a significative raise of the sales of the ps4?
I honestly think that home console in japan are a thing of the past.
The last "traditional" successful console was the ps2.
(And yeah i know there was a console called Wii, but i think you can concede that it was a little different than the usual)
Fushichou187
Member
Tell that to SE so I can get my Dragon Quest VII damn it!
You don't say? The home console market itself is struggling and they're not helping the PS4 with the software. Very few are interesting for japanese gamers and half of them, if not more, are still cross gen and considering this trend, japanese devs are more willing to develop for PS3 that has a bigger fanbase.
They must convince them to move with projects like Freedom Wars, japanese-like I mean, on PS4.
They must convince them to move with projects like Freedom Wars, japanese-like I mean, on PS4.
Nightengale
Member
In terms of overall management, yes. But in terms of internal content development? It's not a direct confirmation, but there's enough hearsay about a certain level of independence that WWS gets in terms of their own internal studio culture and stuff, and even at the SCE internal business level, House recently mentioned in his Develop conference that each business unit has its own distinctiveness from a cultural/regional perspective, even if the overall guiding hand at the top of the pyramid is western.
Ultimately, unless the western leadership goes down to the granular level of slapping Kazunori to fix his shit, it doesn't look like GT's changing anytime soon. We know Japan Studio is in the phase of that change with increased productivity, but their output thus far has been Vita-focused, so we've yet to see how their PS4 prospects will turn out.
Well, I was looking strictly at Japan Studio's internal development.
TMaakkonen
Member
It doesnt feel like Sony cares that much. Considering that PS4 sold way above expectations worldwide, Sony gives no shit if it sells like crap in some market. Even if that market is Japan.
...What could they even do? Most of their games dont sell that much in Japan either way, or atleast not as much anymore. Could they even manage to get 3rd parties to do stuff on PS4? Hell, is that even worth it? They are probably gonna do another waiting game again like with PS3. As PS3 managed about 10 m sales in 8 years, they probably can wait same time again. And if PS4 keeps selling constantly well worldwide, they might not care if PS4 fails in Japan.
...Its so weird that Japanese Company is so non-Japanese. They only have 2 Japanese studios while they have way more studios in both USA and Europe.
...What could they even do? Most of their games dont sell that much in Japan either way, or atleast not as much anymore. Could they even manage to get 3rd parties to do stuff on PS4? Hell, is that even worth it? They are probably gonna do another waiting game again like with PS3. As PS3 managed about 10 m sales in 8 years, they probably can wait same time again. And if PS4 keeps selling constantly well worldwide, they might not care if PS4 fails in Japan.
...Its so weird that Japanese Company is so non-Japanese. They only have 2 Japanese studios while they have way more studios in both USA and Europe.
blizzardjesus
Banned
There's no japanese style games on the near horizon to get people there pumped. And I'm in the same boat.
I currently have the White Destiny bundle preordered, and outside of the indie games on PSN, I don't see much that I would want to play on it(from what is coming out this year). The games I'm most interested in are the same games that I bought a PS3 for, KH3, FF15 and Last Guardian. And we still don't have confirmed release dates for any of them.
Games like Uncharted, Killzone and Last of US don't do much for me, I don't see them as system sellers, especially in japan. Metal Gear is a joke of a series now, no matter how good it looks. Knack and LBP are trash. And there are no JRPG's or "weird fun type" japanese games (Katamari/EDF 2025) coming out this year or in the near future.
Meanwhile PS3 has Xillia 2, KH:HD2 and Akibas Trip coming out this fall. And as far as we know Persona 5 is still PS3/360 only.
No Man's Sky isn't out till next year at the earliest.
So like post Japanese publishers and gamers, I don't see a reason to drop my ps3 any time soon. For what I want out of a system the PS4 isn't there yet. Is ps4 going to be like the PS3 where there's nothing I'm interested in till it's 3rd year?
I currently have the White Destiny bundle preordered, and outside of the indie games on PSN, I don't see much that I would want to play on it(from what is coming out this year). The games I'm most interested in are the same games that I bought a PS3 for, KH3, FF15 and Last Guardian. And we still don't have confirmed release dates for any of them.
Games like Uncharted, Killzone and Last of US don't do much for me, I don't see them as system sellers, especially in japan. Metal Gear is a joke of a series now, no matter how good it looks. Knack and LBP are trash. And there are no JRPG's or "weird fun type" japanese games (Katamari/EDF 2025) coming out this year or in the near future.
Meanwhile PS3 has Xillia 2, KH:HD2 and Akibas Trip coming out this fall. And as far as we know Persona 5 is still PS3/360 only.
No Man's Sky isn't out till next year at the earliest.
So like post Japanese publishers and gamers, I don't see a reason to drop my ps3 any time soon. For what I want out of a system the PS4 isn't there yet. Is ps4 going to be like the PS3 where there's nothing I'm interested in till it's 3rd year?
That is another way to look at it and I agree.I'd argue that only western AAA games usually are the slaves to the....hmm how do I say this? "Making the game more accessible and more appealing to broader audiences." But with the AAA market being such a dominant presence I suppose I'm actually agreeing with you after all.
Fortunately, Indie games, which don't have to have fhe "broad appeal" (read qte/other unsavory bits) are going through such a boom in the west.
Cliff notes: I, for one, welcome our new indie overlords.
AAA games in general are tailored to the largest audience possible and by that definition the result will be targeted toward the western market at large.
AA and A games can be made with a smaller, more targeted audience in mind, and those are really lacking on every current gen console today. Therefore, no games exist specifically targeting the Japanese audience, yet on PS4 at least.
Indie games, a separate discussion really, I don't think have the appeal in the east yet.
Dr. Kitty Muffins
Member
I was talking about the Japan division. They released good content and even published quite a few titles for japanese developers over there. Now, we don't as many partnerships with japanese devs as we are used to and the output is weak/infrequent. They need an influx of talent, IMO. I think they are on the right track by cutting down the number of projects being worked on and reshpaing their development practices but after seeing Knack it makes you wonder if that is all that is wrong over there.
KillerMan91
Member
Western games are selling better and better each year in Japan. GTAV is already in top 5 of the best selling games on PS3 in Japan.
funkystudent
Member
Well a lot of Japanese developers are only starting to support the PS3.
The PS3 support out of Japan is insane right now. I dont know why Sony isnt pushing for those games to be also released on PS4 but I chalk it up to "SCEJLOL"
The PS3 support out of Japan is insane right now. I dont know why Sony isnt pushing for those games to be also released on PS4 but I chalk it up to "SCEJLOL"
Monty Mole
Member
PS4 needed a strong Japanese line-up at launch for instantaneous success, but unfortunately Japanese publishers/developers are more cautious about supporting a platform until it is a proven success. It's a horrible chicken and egg situation, but will hopefully improve as we move through the lifecycle. They really need to get some compelling JRPGs out there too, and of course, Final Fantasy.
Nightengale
Member
In reality, the short but painful answer to this is that Japanese publishers, when it comes to content tailored to their local regions, don't care about shifting hardware anytime soon.
One just needs to look at the tail end of PSP support that's going on till this day. How long was the PS2 supported. How long did it take for PS3 to have a healthy range of software. How long until Vita started having a healthy dose of Japanese content.
A large part of the problem was all on Sony, though. SCEJ has done a bloody terrible job over the years in terms of building and nurturing IPs that should be the definitive identity on their Japanese side. They've let IPs like Arc the Lad, Wild Arms, etc just rot with mediocre releases. They don't build stables of key IPs during their PSP heydays. They've funded mediocre releases that fail to be what they need to be. There was just poor internal software development management as a whole from Japan's side.
One just needs to look at the tail end of PSP support that's going on till this day. How long was the PS2 supported. How long did it take for PS3 to have a healthy range of software. How long until Vita started having a healthy dose of Japanese content.
A large part of the problem was all on Sony, though. SCEJ has done a bloody terrible job over the years in terms of building and nurturing IPs that should be the definitive identity on their Japanese side. They've let IPs like Arc the Lad, Wild Arms, etc just rot with mediocre releases. They don't build stables of key IPs during their PSP heydays. They've funded mediocre releases that fail to be what they need to be. There was just poor internal software development management as a whole from Japan's side.
Napalm_Frank
Member
I just hope the western sales can carry franchises like FF, KH, RE, MGS, DMC ect. on next gen since I'm gettin a little nervous about their selling power in Japan. I can deal with the rest of the smaller games (that ain't on the mobile yet that is). It's just that even the big software is nowhere to be seen with the exception of MGSV that is cross-gen and who knows when even that releases.
Psycho_Mantis
Banned
I think he nailed it with the staement about lack of Japanese games.
The systems release schedule is largely if not entirely Western games at this moment in time.
Japanese pubs these days are always late to the party -___-
Anyway 2015 looks to better in the sense that there's actually some notable games:
BloodBorne
MGSV
FF Type 0 HD
Yakuza 6 ( I expect this to be 2015)
Miku ( iirc there was some announcement)
TGS should give us an insight on what some of the smaller devs are doing such as NIS, Falcom and GUST. We've also had announcements if you can call it that of Gundam, EDF and Idolm@ster.
SCEJ should really step in with something. Anything, enough with the Vita support.
The systems release schedule is largely if not entirely Western games at this moment in time.
Japanese pubs these days are always late to the party -___-
Anyway 2015 looks to better in the sense that there's actually some notable games:
BloodBorne
MGSV
FF Type 0 HD
Yakuza 6 ( I expect this to be 2015)
Miku ( iirc there was some announcement)
TGS should give us an insight on what some of the smaller devs are doing such as NIS, Falcom and GUST. We've also had announcements if you can call it that of Gundam, EDF and Idolm@ster.
SCEJ should really step in with something. Anything, enough with the Vita support.
Nightengale
Member
I disagree. Partnerships are about the same as ever, it's just different names now. Level-5 and Media.Vision were the common names associated with SCEJ publishing, but now they're partnering with MAQL , Acquire, Shift, Dimps, etc.
The problem is that the output is primarily Vita at the moment, and also that these partnerships is also, from a perspective, nowhere near as good as their old partnership with Level-5, where at least the games are seen to be AAA. So there's a perspective that SCEJ's output now lacks quality.
As for Knack, I'd cut the team some slack. It was a game being developed while the lead is double-heading the PS4 project. It was clearly unambitious as far as project ideas went.
Byron Bluth
Banned
The Wii U sells more every week, so there's that.
rokkerkory
Member
Console gaming is just hard in japan period. People are too on the go.
shadowsdarknes
Member
I think the PS4 certainly has the potential for Japanese appeal.
It really just needs software.
It really just needs software.
Both of these are cross gen and the same franchises PS4 got for its launch already.
Isn't even announced for Japan and after the PSP version not many will run out and buy another console to play the same game again.
And to think two big AAA titles like Tales of Zestiria and Persona 5 are to get released on PS3 between late 2014 and 2015... sigh...
If Sony can't get exclusive titles on Ps4 at the very least should push for cross-gen releases; wouldn't push so much but would at least cater some attentions.
And to think the potential is all there: Square Enix, Capcom, Konami, Namco and smaller ones could stil push out some great selling titles in their homeland, but sadly they're blinded by terrible management and mobile-fever.
And probably TGS won't bring any miracle resurrections.
And to think that during Ps2 era i only played japanese games, how much has changed since then.
If Sony can't get exclusive titles on Ps4 at the very least should push for cross-gen releases; wouldn't push so much but would at least cater some attentions.
And to think the potential is all there: Square Enix, Capcom, Konami, Namco and smaller ones could stil push out some great selling titles in their homeland, but sadly they're blinded by terrible management and mobile-fever.
And probably TGS won't bring any miracle resurrections.
And to think that during Ps2 era i only played japanese games, how much has changed since then.
Nightengale
Member
Winning Eleven 2015.
Dr. Kitty Muffins
Member
Sony should team back up with Level 5. I would flip my shit for a Dark Cloud 3 - just without the randomized dungeons.
Nightengale
Member
I think the question is really more on whether or not Level-5 even cares at this point.
As a company, it's pretty clear that they've tilted into dedicated focus on their own IPs, mobile + 3DS, and multimedia product approach. ( games, tv, merchandise )
Japanese developers know that the domestic market is shifting, that that the PS4 is expensive to develop for, and that their western counterparts already hold an advantage over them in terms of development pipelines, team size, and preparedness. It's gonna be a tough go for all console developers in Japan from here on out.
It might not be worth Level 5's time anymore though. Why work on someone else's IP?
Aquamarine
Member
sörine;120517639 said:
Well, considering the struggles Level 5 has been having recently, I'm sure they wouldn't say no to a huge cash inflow from Sony's coffers. Depends on how sweet of a deal they get.
SatelliteOfLove
Member
Get thee to a Media Create thread, please; there are people taking your questioning as fact.
I think the talent's there, but bad leadership (LG!) and general malaise from weakened sales, the PS3 shitting the bed upon release, and a Japanese double standard kept them listing, and now they're starting to be a kind of code crew (like with Bloodborne or Knack). That "soup to nuts Japanese and in-house" bit will take some doing, and perhaps and hopefully they have something under wraps upcoming.
BlackLagoon
Member
Maybe he means there was a concern in Japan for the future of the (global) console market? I mean "consoles are dead, future is mobile" wasn't exactly only spoken about the Japanese market before the PS4 exploded out of the gate.
Struggles? Isn't Yokai Watch 2 about to sell a million it's first week?
I don't get the impression Sony's coffers run too deep either.
test_account
XP-39C²
I shouldnt matter where they publisher make the money though. If the main income comes from sales within Japan or from outside of Japan, its the final income result that matters. That quote is about getting japanese developers to develope for the PS4. Its not a good arguement if a developers insist on only releasing their game(s) inside of Japan though, but its a good arguement for those who want to release their game outside of Japan too (seeing how the PS4 is the best selling console outside of Japan).
Aquamarine
Member
GTA V was the best-selling PS3 game in Japan last year.
Aquamarine
Member
sörine;120518605 said:
Yeah, but their other tentpoles (Inazuma Eleven, Layton) are dying and they've had a few unfortunate flops recently.
Tidus_Great
Banned
ps4 needs more RPGs like ps1/ps2
lots of western style shooter games right now so it's easy to see why ps4 is doing well i nthe west.
lots of western style shooter games right now so it's easy to see why ps4 is doing well i nthe west.
I can't really think of any recent flops? I guess back in 2012 there some like Girls RPG and Time Travelers but recently it's seemed like things are going pretty for them with Fantasy Life, Yokai Watch and western Ni No Kuni. And even while dying games like Layton and Inazuma Eleven are still outselling almost everything out of Japan Studio.
I don't know, I just don't get the impression that if Level 5 really needs money that SCE is the place they'll find it. Sony barely invests in Japan anywmore, they're nearly on par with Microsoft.
Pops Maellard
Member
This isn't going to help anything....
Well, I guess I'm importing a PS4. This is pretty much best thing.
Pffffwhaahahaah, when the Wii U is outselling your system in Japan it isn't doing "okay."
This isn't going to help anything....
I don't know, I want that and I am not even Japanese.
Bro-fist.
Aquamarine
Member
sörine;120520303 said:
And Gundam AGE...big project that flopped badly for Hino and Level-5.
With Layton and Inazuma Eleven dying, they needed something to take up the slack. Fantasy Life is doing decently but it's no replacement.
The only thing they really have is Youkai Watch, which doesn't completely replace what they had with Layton + Inazuma Eleven. But they're lucky it was a surprise hit.
doesn't sound promising.
This isn't going to help anything....
Honestly, I'd buy that too, but it should have been the white PS4.
Actually Yokai 2's first week does look like it's going to sell what the best selling Layton and IE games did their first weeks combined. Level 5 doesn't seem to be hurting right now at all.
Nightengale
Member
sörine;120520303 said:
I don't see how Sony's investment in Japan within the past few years is any different from their investment in years before that.
Vita games... exist, you know.
Besides, SCE has money. The only question is whether or not they'd want to invest in a Level-5 game. ( assuming Level-5 even wants to make a Sony IP game anymore )
It seems to me that 90% of your posts are taking delight in the fact that Japan has abandoned the console market in favor of the mobile market and rubbing it in the face of the many people (including myself) who prefer Japanese games but also prefer playing on console.
Aquamarine
Member
sörine;120522277 said:
Domestically, but Youkai Watch doesn't have an international following like Layton in the USA + Europe or Inazuma Eleven in Europe.