Games would update but I had no way of creating a profile for the games to save to once it was connected to the internet. The console worked offline but what is the point if I can't create a profile or save games. In my eyes this is bricking it as it pretty much kills most of the functionality.
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Sony Permanently Banning PS4 Console
- Thread starter GVA1987
- Start date
Games would update but I had no way of creating a profile for the games to save to once it was connected to the internet. The console worked offline but what is the point if I can't create a profile or save games. In my eyes this is bricking it as it pretty much kills most of the functionality.
Simply Sami
Member
So what should Sony do? Allow the seller to continue his so called chargeback fraud? Banning the console deters him of doing it again. Because most the profit he has made would have to go towards a new console. Obviously stupid EB games helped him out in this situation.
OmegaDL50
Member
This is on point.
An account ban would be more sufficient in the case of chargebacks and not outright banning of the console.
All digital content and purchases are tied to the account. So by banning the accounts that did a specific wrongdoing, Sony has effectively nullified the specific users to no longer to make purchases or continue to used the voided licenses of purchases of that specific account.
To expand upon this further that isn't enough there is also the viability of rejecting the credit card or paypal account that was tied to account that did a wrong doing.
All of this would have prevented the issues the OP had and the original owner if he decided to pick up another PS4 would still be rightfully punished because his account and licenses would be completely useless regardless on whatever PS4 he tries to tie his banned account to.
I totally get your argument, but you must understand that without knowing what the guy did to get banned, blaming Sony just seems like a misdirection of emotions. Sony should probably create an OS-level indicator -- something during bootup or on the main UI -- that denotes a permanently banned console. That way, when you test your console at EB, you'll be able to know if the console is banned or not. Other than that, it's really hard for me (and others) to comprehend how they're at fault for not supervising the used console market. It's quite literally none of their business.
This. If your console is bricked by Sony by whatever reason, your PS4's second hand value should go down considerably.
However, there should be a method to unlock this by trusted 3rd party re-sellers maybe, by paying Sony some symbolic amount of money. The trusted 3rd party could check the PS4, see it's bricked, price it accordingly, and unlock the PS4.
Would Sony care for such elaborate systems? No. That said, when one buys a PS4, second hand or not, one probably wants to play games with it. Let them.
PeakPointMatrix
Member
Brick and mortar stores should do an online log in check before they buy the console from the seller. If they recieve the error code that indicates the console was banned by Sony, they should refuse to purchase. This'll really leave the banned user with a brick, as they deserve.
No. I was replying to the OP's argument.
EB Games can't control what Sony does, but EB Games can control what they sell and don't sell. The problem isn't that Sony has a banning policy. The problem is that a banned product was sold.
Still not a brick. It miiiiight classify as semi brick but hardly even that. Its a banned unit. Simple as that. A brick does not even boot into the system.
Yes because banking systems are equipped for this and that person's credit rating will go down the toilet if he picks up a habit of doing chargebacks, that's where the deterrent should come from.
jadedm17
Member
Nailed it.
Sony did nothing wrong, and you fixed the error with the company at fault, saying this is a "bad start" for enjoying your PS4 is a little misplaced; Lets be honest, we're all adults and know saving a few bucks on used will have its own set or pros and cons. You learned something.
travisbickle
Member
I do not agree with the idea of blocking a console in any manner, but I've never understood how far Sony (or any company) can go. So it's blocked from the network but that actually has knock-on effects for saving games?
captainraincoat
Banned
Its funny the whole chargeback issue....i contacted ms to get a refund on a digital purchase because under australian law you can request a refund if there are issues with a product or service.....ms and sony are not set up to do this apparently.....so their advice....do a charge back on the credit card....lucky i asked them to record the conversation because ms blocked my xbox about 2 months later and i had to phone them up to get unblocked.
Not sure about the sony process as they are split up when it comes to billing and psn and the left hand doesnt always talk to the right hand so you will get bounced around the place.
Not sure about the sony process as they are split up when it comes to billing and psn and the left hand doesnt always talk to the right hand so you will get bounced around the place.
cookie-monster
Member
Because now there is a perfectly good, functioning console that can never be used.
Sony are simply shifting the problem to second hand console buyers, who probably aren't even aware that consoles could be banned.
What, like any other second hand goods you buy privately?
This is like buying a car from someone, the car not working and then you complaining to the manufacturer that you were sold a dodgy car.
Even in the most consumer friendly legal environments, buying anything second hand always places the risk on the purchaser.
Same opinion.
Its the previous owners and EBs fault.
The previous owner probably did something really offensive to deserve a ban.
Also, not familiar with "EB", but they should be testing every console if its been banned or not before they buy it from the seller.
At least EB exchanged it for a working one.
Simply Sami
Member
What?
Chargebacks do not affect credit rating. They are a part of the service. One of the benefits of using a credit card as you are protected. So do not know where you got that from.
All the scammer has to do is ring his CC provider and says he does not recognise all the Sony transactions. The CC provider won't know they all coming from different accounts. All they'd see is transactions to Sony.
wow, what the fuck, i never heard this shit.
#fucksony
my controller died last week because i tried to charge it with the wrong micro-usb cable.
sony still hasnt replied to me.
and i know, they wont replace or they will replace it with a standard controller...
i had similar problems in ps2-days and sony does dogshit for their customers
i hope there is workaround or a solution... bricking a console wont help.
#fucksony
my controller died last week because i tried to charge it with the wrong micro-usb cable.
sony still hasnt replied to me.
and i know, they wont replace or they will replace it with a standard controller...
i had similar problems in ps2-days and sony does dogshit for their customers
i hope there is workaround or a solution... bricking a console wont help.
Sure, initially it's part of the service. But if the bank keeps seeing you do chargebacks over and over again, especially to one seller, Sony, that raises flags. At first they will probably assume your card info got stolen, so they'll give you a new one. What happens when they see a whole bunch of Sony chargebacks on the new card?
There are systems in place that you can't beat.
Ninja Scooter
Member
wow, what the fuck, i never heard this shit.
#fucksony
my controller died last week because i tried to charge it with the wrong micro-usb cable.
sony still hasnt replied to me.
and i know, they wont replace or they will replace it with a standard controller...
i had similar problems in ps2-days and sony does dogshit for their customers
i hope there is workaround or a solution... bricking a console wont help.
You borked your own controller completely at fault of your own and sony is dogshit for not responding to you?
Can't please everyone, I guess. Service industry is a pain in the ass.
How about #accountability?
They make more money off preowned consoles that that: any new game sale, any digital purchase, any new peripherals, PS+ subs... Just because someone bought the most expensive part of console buying second hand doesn't preclude them from putting a lot of money down on brand new stuff in the future.
Not to mention the fact that people being able to sell your product on is important to keep the value of that product in the consumer's mind.
This is a dumb policy. Anyone with common sense would realise that as soon as the console is banned, someone will pass that console on to an unsuspecting someone else. And if they really want back into your ecosystem, they'll just spend that money on another machine and start defrauding you that way.
Theognosis
Member
I agree. It is also the fault of EB Games for buying and then selling the "broken" unit. They should test all units for online connectivity first before offering them to the public.
As for Sony, they have every right to ban consoles from connecting to their online services for serious violations. At the very least, it cleanses the online infrastructure of cheaters, pirates and hackers who modify PS4's. I won't be surprised if the OP's first unit was used for this purpose.
Shotgun Kiss
Member
Because they have no way of verifying with 100% certainty if a console has changed hands. And they're not really obligated to either, as they're not responsible for overseeing/accounting for the used market.
The fault is on the retailer, who didn't test the online connectivity of the console. I don't think I've ever seen a retailer do that, but they really need to make it a standard to prevent situations like this. It also protects their best interests, as now they have a console they have to write off, meaning they've lost money on it.
The issue with chargebacks are that the person request it removes Sony (in this case) from the proceedings entirely. I know there's confusion about this but by requesting a chargeback you have declared that you have reached the end of the line with the company that you're raising it against, you are not willing to deal with them again.
A chargeback request exists for specific reasons, for example if you're dealing and they cease trading and you've not received goods from them. It's not there to speed up a refund, it's there because you've exhausted all other legal means.
If you request one via a third party payment service such as PayPal, it's even worse as you're now making a claim against PayPal even though they may have nothing at all to do with what's happened. That's why people find that when PayPal is involved that PayPal will also stop other payments using that PayPal account, including ones that have already been made which may cause for customers across all the services they use PayPal for.
That's what happens when declare to PayPal that they've broken the rules, that they've done something they're not allowed to do, that you've chosen to not use their service because of the things that you're accusing them of.
A chargeback request is a severe action to take against any company and people need to try and understand that, or face the consequences of doing such a thing. This is something that financial institutions should be making their customers aware of before they allow them to make such a request.
Yoshi
Headmaster of Console Warrior Jugendstrafanstalt
Considering cases like the one where Sony was basically stealing the money from a person who was victim of an error in their shop by saying they will not give him the money back, but only add it to their wallet, sometimes removing Sony, who are often times acting inappropiate, ist the only solution.
Sangetsu-II
Member
I'm not sure if you think we disagree or agree?
test_account
XP-39C²
They didnt brick the console, its not allowed to be used online with their servies (in other words, you cant connect to PSN). I think they did this with the PS3 as well, same did Microsoft with the Xbox 360, and i'm sure it applies to Xbox One too. Nintendo can also do they same thing, ban the whole system from connecting to their online services.wow, what the fuck, i never heard this shit.
#fucksony
my controller died last week because i tried to charge it with the wrong micro-usb cable.
sony still hasnt replied to me.
and i know, they wont replace or they will replace it with a standard controller...
i had similar problems in ps2-days and sony does dogshit for their customers
i hope there is workaround or a solution... bricking a console wont help.
Just out of curiousity, what reply are you wating for from Sony's support when you acknowledge that you broke your own controller?
Alpha Centauri
Member
What exactly do you want them to say? Acknowledgment that yes, you did in fact break your controller due to misuse?
DeepEnigma
Gold Member
but you broke your controller though, what do you expect them to do?
also, they most likely bricked the console so the previous owner couldn't profit off it. EB games should've made the correct checks to ensure they aren't selling second hang bricked consoles
edit-
lmao exactly
Because the ban would have no point at all, it would be easy to abuse.
Imagine you did something wrong and got the console bricked; then you sell it to your friend and he shows the receipts to Sony so they unlock it; your friend returns your money and he returns your console; you play like nothing happened.
Ron Mexico
Member
This happens, but not to the degree it should IMO. With any Reg E disputes (essentially any card-based transaction, plus some others), the person filing the claim is generally required to sign a written statement under penalty of perjury that the claims in their dispute are in fact valid. The issue there is everyone just signs regardless and the cost to follow up on a fraudulent claim is usually more than the claim itself.
Yoshi
Headmaster of Console Warrior Jugendstrafanstalt
I don't know if we agree or not, it's more like an addendum to what you said. You are right, this is removing the recipient from the equation and it will not be taken lightly by the company in question, but still I say that Sony brings it into themselves with their behaviour and that there are a lot of cases where I think the action is justified, even though it certainly is risky / ensures revenge acts by Sony.
test_account
XP-39C²
Do you have any examples of such cases? You can mention cases where people have got hacked and such, although it seems that the problem is that its hard to find out if that actually happened or not, or what they actual cause for the hack was. Its really not that easy to know in every case what the real story is.
Starwolf_UK
Member
If this is a new thing doesn't Sony have some responsibility to let their retail partners know. Yeah I know Sony may prefer people to buy new but isn't it in their interested to make sure second hand inventory is fully functional.
Chargeback=account ban is the expectation (download codes can be affected, I remember a thread where someone purchased a SM3DW download code and had their account banned as the buyer used a stolen credit card to get this code) though rarely the game gets revoked and no further action happens.
Hardware mods leading to hardware ban was done by Microsoft while Nintendo...
Would do? No no DID DO:
How do you make it happen? Take a Korean Wii (which were much cheaper than $250 due to no Gamecube support, no bundled games and also exchange rate), change its region, update firmware to 4.2 or higher.http://www.nintendo.com/consumer/wfc/en_na/ds/results.jsp?error_code=003&system=Wii&locale=lang said:
How does the seller/Gamestop know this has been done? Check the case/serial area for something like RVL-...(KOR)
joecanada
Member
It's like the first thing I thought of but yet we have pages of people asking why Sony would ever do this .
That 2013 E3 is surely long ago for you
Yes. Not the same case, but CFW/modding last-gen was worse on Sony's case.
Sony = console and account banned
MS = only console
Nintendo = lol
If you chargeback on PSN purchases I'm guessing.
Jeronimo Jones
Member
I didn't know about this, but I guess it's buyer beware on pre-owned systems in the internet age. This makes sense from Sony's end to prevent abusing the system.
The original owner likely sold it because it was banned. At least OP was able to swap it out.
The original owner likely sold it because it was banned. At least OP was able to swap it out.
ThoughtsOfSpeaking
Banned
That's my only take away from this. We already know Sony's CS is shit, but with the console being on the market nearly 3 years. This is literally the only time this kind of story has popped up.
Sony (and other console manufactures )
are within their rights to block a console from online use.It's part of the tac's.
BUT.Stopping you from creating an account and saving games/doing other offline stuff that's tied to an account should still work even when banned.
I think on a banned xbox 360 you could create an account and profile you just couldn't go online to play multiplayer or buy from the store.
are within their rights to block a console from online use.It's part of the tac's.
BUT.Stopping you from creating an account and saving games/doing other offline stuff that's tied to an account should still work even when banned.
I think on a banned xbox 360 you could create an account and profile you just couldn't go online to play multiplayer or buy from the store.