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South Park Creators backing off Trump.. "Satire has become reality"

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The Adder

Banned
We've been trying to figure out for 17 pages what more people want them to say about Trump than they've already said and done to him. Maybe you have an answer. Just how much time should be focused on Trump so that they're no longer cowards?

There's a lot of ground between constantly harping on the same target over and over every single episode and saying they're just not going to bother trying at all because it's somehow too hard. You'd think people who make a show where the philosophical truth is always found somewhere in the middle would understand this.

EDIT:

Let me elaborate. That is the reason they are cowards. Because they spent twenty years building their comedy on the easy joke of "ha ha, you care about something". Of any intensely held belief being an extreme. Of every side being wrong. They sat on the fence and threw rocks because that was the easy thing to do.

And now, when there is one side very clearly worse than the other? A relevant topic in which that style of comedy can no longer seem prescient or informed or in any way true enough to generate humor? They tuck tail and they run. Because, as they themselves say, it is too hard.

Because they are cowards. And they only know one joke.

The emperors are naked.
 

abundant

Member
20 years of saying both sides are bad, then the first time one side immediately comes right out and says with evidence "no, we're actually much worse", they distance themselves. Matt and Trey can both fuck off

Did you watch the last season? They practically endorsed Hillary by having Mr. Garrison (Trump) tell the voters not to vote for him.
 

Mega

Banned
20 years of saying both sides are bad, then the first time one side immediately comes right out and says with evidence "no, we're actually much worse", they distance themselves. Matt and Trey can both fuck off

There's a lot of ground between constantly harping on the same target over and over every single episode and saying they're just not going to bother trying at all because it's somehow too hard. You'd think people who make a show where the philosophical truth is always found somewhere in the middle would understand this.

EDIT:

Let me elaborate. That is the reason they are cowards. Because they spent twenty years building their comedy on the easy joke of "ha ha, you care about something". Of any intensely held belief being an extreme. Of every side being wrong. They sat on the fence and threw rocks because that was the easy thing to do.

And now, when there is one side very clearly worse than the other? A relevant topic in which that style of comedy can no longer seem prescient or informed or in any way true enough to generate humor? They tuck tail and they run. Because, as they themselves say, it is too hard.

Because they are cowards. And they only know one joke.

The emperors are naked.

Bullshit. Give some examples instead of speaking in vague general terms about what you think their show is about. They have firmly committed themselves to one side on many issues. I have asked repeatedly for examples and you all in this thread tuck your tails and run because you know it's the flimsy argument of a person who either doesn't watch the show or doesn't pay attention, buying instead into the post-season-19 criticism that they're "both sides cowards" after they bashed PC culture and touched a nerve.
 

The Adder

Banned
Like, let me tell you what they really mean by this.

"We want to make fun of Trump but we have no equivalent on the other side to make seem just as bad. We could make fun of the protests, but we actually agree with them. We also don't have anyone working with Trump to make seem comically reasonable and competent to counter balance making fun of Trump. Until the next easily mockable Democrat steps up, or Democrats make an easily mockable move, we don't know how to apply our style of humor to Trump. And we refuse to evolve."

Bullshit. Give some examples instead of speaking in vague general terms about what you think their show is about. They have firmly committed themselves to one side on many issues. I have asked repeatedly for examples and you all in this thread tuck your tails and run because you know it's the flimsy argument of a person who either doesn't watch the show or doesn't pay attention, buying instead into the post-season-19 criticism that they're "both sides cowards" after they bashed PC culture and touched a nerve.

You realize we're talking about the people who came up with the thesis that all elections come down to Three Sandwich vs Giant Douche, right?

The people who assert that Atheism will just become religion once religion is gone.

The ones that affirm that the only people who talk about actions they take to preserve the environment are just doing so to sniff their own farts.

They don't firmly commit to sides, they firmly and consistently commit to being against extremes. Which is fine. But don't try to pretend it's anything else.
 

Mega

Banned
Like, let me tell you what they really mean by this.

"We want to make fun of Trump but we have no equivalent on the other side to make seem just as bad. We could make fun of the protests, but we actually agree with them. We also don't have anyone working with Trump to make seem comically reasonable and competent to counter balance making fun of Trump. Until the next easily mockable Democrat steps up, or Democrats make an easily mockable move, we don't know how to apply our style of humor to Trump. And we refuse to evolve."

Bullshit. Give some examples instead of speaking in vague general terms about what you think their show is about. They have firmly committed themselves to one side on many issues. I have asked repeatedly for examples and you all in this thread tuck your tails and run because you know it's the flimsy argument of a person who either doesn't watch the show or doesn't pay attention, buying instead into the post-season-19 criticism that they're "both sides cowards" after they bashed PC culture and touched a nerve.
 

The Adder

Banned
THEY ALREADY DID IT

WHILE ALSO SHITTING ON HILLARY TOO. Because it gave them someone on the other side to spend the season also making fun of. In the end, they picked a side. Because hey, turd sandwich vs giant douche, you gotta pick one. Which is the exact same philosophical bent as the original episode about that very same thing.

And if you're referring to Canadian Trump, that was when he was in the primaries and they didn't think he'd be the nominee.
 

Mega

Banned
WHILE ALSO SHITTING ON HILLARY TOO. Because it gave them someone on the other side to spend the season also making fun of. In the end, they picked a side. Because hey, turd sandwich vs giant douche, you gotta pick one. Which is the exact same philosophical bent as the original episode about that very same thing.

And if you're referring to Canadian Trump, that was when he was in the primaries and they didn't think he'd be the nominee.

I'm glad we've established you don't know what you're talking about.
 

Real Hero

Member
WHILE ALSO SHITTING ON HILLARY TOO. e.

So what? The entire seasons was about how dangerous nostalgia is and can lead to an idiot Fascist taking over. Joking about Hillary getting in her own way is not making an 'equivalent on the other side to make seem just as bad.' as you say. It's just not true.
 

smokeymicpot

Beat EviLore at pool.

Cindres

Vied for a tag related to cocks, so here it is.
The reactions in this thread are just straight up confusing, anyone would think they'd come out and publicly endorsed Trump or something.
 

kirblar

Member
WHILE ALSO SHITTING ON HILLARY TOO. Because it gave them someone on the other side to spend the season also making fun of. In the end, they picked a side. Because hey, turd sandwich vs giant douche, you gotta pick one. Which is the exact same philosophical bent as the original episode about that very same thing.

And if you're referring to Canadian Trump, that was when he was in the primaries and they didn't think he'd be the nominee.
The point of bringing up GD/TS in a season about the dangers of nostalgia went right over your head.
 

The Adder

Banned

So, my entire argument is that they do not know how to write comedy, at least not their brand of social commentary comedy, without two sides that balance out. Their humor is based on "look at these idiots with strongly held beliefs on one side or the other, aren't they silly?" And the fact that they are incapable of writing humor without it. It's not a matter of equally terrible, it's a matter of terrible and equally prominent. Their excuse that what is going on can't be satirized is nonsense, The Onion and SNL soldier on, unless you add "in our style" to it.

The fact that they refuse to try to evolve beyond it is what makes them cowards.

Quote me on this, if liberals do something monumentally stupid, we'll get another episode satirizing both Trump and said stupid thing.

I'm glad we've established you don't know what you're talking about.

I'm glad we've established you're not worth acknowledgement.

The point of bringing up GD/TS in a season about the dangers of nostalgia went right over your head.

The sentence about "same philosophy AS said episode" went right over yours. I'm saying THAT Parker and Stone choose a side in the end is no surprise given the philosophical views they established in said episode. Unless you believe their opinions on the nature of politics has changed.
 
I didn't read the entire thread, I confess. This is my initial reaction to the OP posted, as I think I am allowed.

I understand they have gone at him during the campaign, but if they won't go at him while he has actual power, it comes off as fear. And, to be honest, I don't blame them; I wouldn't want Trump angry at me at this point either. As it stands, it's one less voice calling him out.
So with no knowledge of the show or what they've done against trump or against other parties where their life is in danger and were only stopped by comedy central which has gotten some episodes banned, you come in and give us your opinion based on absolutely nothing besides 'I'm sure alt right folks enjoy this show'

You have the right to come and shit on them with no knowledge, we have the right to call you out on it.

Yall forget these guys drop whole characters from the show when they realize they can't do anything funny with them anymore. These guys are ultimately trying to make comedy, and last season wasn't comedy. They've never had a season this involved on a presidential race. I hope they drop it all together and go back to random modern topics so they get inspired again I don't need them to do trump anymore it wasn't as funny.
 

Scrooged

Totally wronger about Nintendo's business decisions.
The South Park OT wasn't very active this last season while they mercilessly made fun of Trump. It's hilarious how many people are coming in here now putting Trey and Matt through a purity test while making ignorant accusations about the season they didn't watch.
 

kirblar

Member
The sentence about "same philosophy AS said episode" went right over yours. I'm saying THAT Parker and Stone choose a side in the end is no surprise given the philosophical views they established in said episode. Unless you believe their opinions on the nature of politics has changed.
Their opinions on the nature of politics has changed. The season was in part about how nostalgia (MAGA) is a very dangerous thing. You don't think they learned their lesson after Bush?

GD/TS = both are equally bad but you have to pick one. That was clearly not their opinion this election cycle, and if you thought the message was that Hillary/Trump were the same after watching the season play out, there is likely nothing anyone could say to convince you otherwise, because that view is completely out of sync with reality. The only thing they went after Hillary on was that she seemed to shoot herself in the foot unnecessarily.
 

CassSept

Member
I'm glad we've established you're not worth acknowledgement.

He's saying that because it's obvious you didn't watch the last season. They threw a few weak jokes about Hillary, while also carrying out a season-long, brutal total teardown of Donald Trump.

They basically begged people to vote for Hillary because of how dangerous Trump is.

How you came to your conclusion is mind-boggling. I didn't like the season but in no way is what you're saying remotely anything resembling truth.
 

The Adder

Banned
How you came to your conclusion is mind-boggling. I didn't like the season but in no way is what you're saying remotely anything resembling truth.

Before I continue, what is my conclusion? As from the majority of these replies I get the distinct feeling most of you are arguing with the folks saying "Stone and Parker are Pro/Scared of Trump" and not with me.
 

CassSept

Member
Before I continue, what is my conclusion? As from the majority of these replies I get the distinct feeling most of you are arguing with the folks saying "Stone and Parker are Pro/Scared of Trump" and not with me.

This
And now, when there is one side very clearly worse than the other? A relevant topic in which that style of comedy can no longer seem prescient or informed or in any way true enough to generate humor? They tuck tail and they run. Because, as they themselves say, it is too hard.

does not reconcile with them talking loud and clear begging everyone to vote for Hillary.
 

smokeymicpot

Beat EviLore at pool.
He's saying that because it's obvious you didn't watch the last season. They threw a few weak jokes about Hillary, while also carrying out a season-long, brutal total teardown of Donald Trump.

They basically begged people to vote for Hillary because of how dangerous Trump is.

How you came to your conclusion is mind-boggling. I didn't like the season but in no way is what you're saying remotely anything resembling truth.

Garrison even spoke to everyone saying please don't vote for Trump if I am not mistaken. The gian douche scene was to bring in Member Berries.
 

.JayZii

Banned
I have to assume it's because doing the "both sides are stupid, and we're smart for not caring" schtick won't work with Trump in the Whitehouse. If they only go against Trump, but not the Democrats, then they would be taking an actual, unequivocal stance.
 

Mega

Banned
So, my entire argument is that they do not know how to write comedy, at least not their brand of social commentary comedy, without two sides that balance out. Their humor is based on "look at these idiots with strongly held beliefs on one side or the other, aren't they silly?" And the fact that they are incapable of writing humor without it. It's not a matter of equally terrible, it's a matter of terrible and equally prominent. Their excuse that what is going on can't be satirized is nonsense, The Onion and SNL soldier on, unless you add "in our style" to it.

SNL's skits mocking Trump have consisted entirely of reiterating what he said the previous week, almost word for word, and has relied primarily on the strength of Alec Baldwin's spot-on impression. Sometimes it still isn't that funny and falls a little flat. It certainly isn't clever when you realize they could've played back a real video clip and achieved the same effect.

And that's only 2-3 minute skits. SNL didn't have to carry an entire half-hour episode on this stuff and certainly not an entire season. You misinterpret their remarks as cowardice and giving up because you think they're incompetent, when what they're saying is they'd simply rather not. It's by the numbers, low hanging fruit humor thats essentially "look what Trump did last week, he's such an idiot". As someone pointed earlier here, 2000-2008 led to a lot of safe, hacky comedy taking easy potshots at Bush. I and many others do not want a repeat of safe boring "humor" aimed at braindead easy targets. I would prefer SP does original creative material like in their first semi-serialized season 18 (Grounded Vindaloop, Cock Magic, Magic Bush). Some of SNL's Trump skits from October-November are already dated and not funny.
 

Dynasty

Member
The South Park OT wasn't very active this last season while they mercilessly made fun of Trump. It's hilarious how many people are coming in here now putting Trey and Matt through a purity test while making ignorant accusations about the season they didn't watch.

The only reason why I can think of why it wasnt that active was because of all the Gaf members who got there feeling hurt over the PC Principal thing from the season before.
 
The only reason why I can think of why it wasnt that active was because of all the Gaf members who got there feeling hurt over the PC Principal thing from the season before.
Nah it wasn't very active because it wasn't that good of a season. I stopped posting because after an episode I didn't really feel inspired to come share my thoughts on a 'meh' episode
 

The Adder

Banned
This


does not reconcile with them talking loud and clear begging everyone to vote for Hillary.

It very much does when it was leading into a storyline where it turned out that Hillary was also a massive villain that got waylaid when Trump actually won.
 
SNL's skits mocking Trump have consisted entirely of reiterating what he said the previous week, almost word for word, and has relied primarily on the strength of Alec Baldwin's spot-on impression. Sometimes it still isn't that funny and falls a little flat. It certainly isn't clever when you realize they could've played back a real video clip and achieved the same effect.

And that's only 2-3 minute skits. SNL didn't have to carry an entire half-hour episode on this stuff and certainly not an entire season. You misinterpret their remarks as cowardice and giving up because you think they're incompetent, when what they're saying is they'd simply rather not. It's by the numbers, low hanging fruit humor thats essentially "look what Trump did last week, he's such an idiot". As someone pointed earlier here, 2000-2008 led to a lot of safe, hacky comedy taking easy potshots at Bush. I and many others do not want a repeat of safe boring "humor" aimed at braindead easy targets. I would prefer SP does original creative material like in their first semi-serialized season 18 (Grounded Vindaloop, Cock Magic, Magic Bush). Some of SNL's Trump skits from October-November are already dated and not funny.

It's kind of hilarious when people act like having Baldwin read Trump tweets for three minutes a week is remotely comparable to dedicating entire seasons to mocking him.
 

Sunster

Member
omg this is a 19 page thread where all posters are saying the same exact things over and over.


a) cowards
b) no they are not
a) we should bash trump more than ever
b) but it's not funny and normalizes him// SNL sucks
a) no they just sympathize with trump
b) but they raped him to death

c) why are people so mad at sp???
d) some people on gaf just got mad about the pc principal joke. lol
 
omg this is a 19 page thread where all posters are saying the same exact things over and over.


a) cowards
b) no they are not
a) we should bash trump more than ever
b) but it's not funny and normalizes him// SNL sucks
a) no they just sympathize with trump
b) but they raped him to death

c) why are people so mad at sp???
d) some people on gaf just got mad about the pc principal joke. lol

So it's like every Gaf thread that passes 2 pages.
 

The Adder

Banned
I'll add to my last post:

That's also why last season ended so weakly and felt so poor. Not just because their plans fell apart and they continued to salvage what they could from the "Hillary Clinton is a vengeance seeking megalomaniac and we just made her President" plotline, but because they couldn't make their normal format evolve. Their ridiculous villain that had been unseated by the seemingly rational, but secretly evil all along, candidate couldn't come back and be the hero the world needs to balance her out.
 

Trojita

Rapid Response Threadmaker
I'll add to my last post:

That's also why last season ended so weakly and felt so poor. Not just because their plans fell apart and they continued to salvage what they could from the "Hillary Clinton is a vengeance seeking megalomaniac and we just made her President" plotline, but because they couldn't make their normal format evolve. Their ridiculous villain that had been unseated by the seemingly rational, but secretly evil all along, candidate couldn't come back and be the hero the world needs to balance her out.

You have access to South Park Studios planned story documentation or is this tales from stuff you're making up?
 

The Adder

Banned
You have access to South Park Studios planned story documentation or is this tales from stuff your making up?

Fucking really?

I have fucking eyes, ears, and a memory that lasts more than one season.

We all know their original plan was for Hillary winning. That was the joke about "Oh Jeez" being given that title. Hell, it was the premise for the advertisement for the episode.

That scene with her meeting Kyle's dad, her deep ties to Troll Trace, Bill & Bill's Gentlemen's club. None of it makes any god damned sense with her having lost. Every saw the seams at the time, but suddenly, when it's all hands on deck to defend Matt and Trey, it's crazy talk? Bullshit.

From there it's a matter of knowing their usual patterns. Where they were headed was obvious, unfortunately for them, and the rest of us, reality bit us all in the ass.

EDIT: By the way, was meaning to say this earlier. Those of you accusing me of not watching the show, or this last season, can fuck right on off.
 

.JayZii

Banned
omg this is a 19 page thread where all posters are saying the same exact things over and over.


a) cowards
b) no they are not
a) we should bash trump more than ever
b) but it's not funny and normalizes him// SNL sucks
a) no they just sympathize with trump
b) but they raped him to death

c) why are people so mad at sp???
d) some people on gaf just got mad about the pc principal joke. lol
Biting, accurate, detached commentary.

You should write for South Park.
 

kirblar

Member
From there it's a matter of knowing their usual patterns. Where they were headed was obvious, unfortunately for them, and the rest of us, reality bit us all in the ass.

EDIT: By the way, was meaning to say this earlier. Those of you accusing me of not watching the show, or this last season, can fuck right on off.
So yes, you watched the show, but you're just making up your own "alternative ending."
 

The Adder

Banned
So yes, you watched the show, but you're just making up your own "alternative ending."

So do you think the "Hillary is behind Troll Trace" plotline was created after she lost? Because it is fact that the episode they'd originally made, their entire plot for the season, revolved around her winning. This is a thing we know and they joked about.

Because, if not, then literally the only part I'm making any assumptions on is Garrison coming back to counter balance Hillary.

Shit, they even ended the ACTUAL season with Troll Trace being defeated and the internet being reset by reactivating the Skankhunt troll network and overloading the system!
 

Sunster

Member
Biting, accurate, detached commentary.

You should write for South Park.

fine.

this season was trash. I don't need sp to tell me how bad trump is but I can also understand why that would be important. I'd rather they do it without featuring the incredibly annoying mr garrison character though. maybe use cartman as the avatar for the alt-right. idk.
 

Trojita

Rapid Response Threadmaker
Fucking really?

I have fucking eyes, ears, and a memory that lasts more than one season.

We all know their original plan was for Hillary winning. That was the joke about "Oh Jeez" being given that title. Hell, it was the premise for the advertisement for the episode.

That scene with her meeting Kyle's dad, her deep ties to Troll Trace, Bill & Bill's Gentlemen's club. None of it makes any god damned sense with her having lost. Every saw the seams at the time, but suddenly, when it's all hands on deck to defend Matt and Trey, it's crazy talk? Bullshit.

From there it's a matter of knowing their usual patterns. Where they were headed was obvious, unfortunately for them, and the rest of us, reality bit us all in the ass.

EDIT: By the way, was meaning to say this earlier. Those of you accusing me of not watching the show, or this last season, can fuck right on off.

First off that wasn't even going to be the title. That episode was originally going to be titled "The Very First Gentleman".

I also don't know what advertisement you are talking about. As far as I know this was the only advertisement for "The Very First Gentleman" until they had to change everything after election night.
 

The Adder

Banned
First off that wasn't even going to be the title. That episode was originally going to be titled "The Very First Gentleman".

I also don't know what advertisement you are talking about. As far as I know this was the only advertisement for "The Very First Gentleman" until they had to change everything after election night.

That's the fucking point. It was called The Very First Gentleman because they expected Hillary to win. They changed it to Oh Jeez because she lost and threw their plans into the garbage, but the plot points remains. And the advertisement I'm talking about is post defeat when they had to change things last minute. You're making my argument for me.

Trojita, did you just reflexively respond without even trying to comprehend what you're actually trying to argue against? Is the need to defend this show and its creators that intense.
 

Herne

Member
Yep. I honestly can't think of anything they could come up with that could be any more hilariously horrible than things already are.
 

Trojita

Rapid Response Threadmaker
That's the fucking point. It was called The Very First Gentleman because they expected Hillary to win. They changed it to Oh Jeez because she lost and threw their plans into the garbage, but the plot points remains. And the advertisement I'm talking about is post defeat when they had to change things last minute. You're making my argument for me.

Trojita, did you just reflexively respond without even trying to comprehend what you're actually trying to argue against? Is the need to defend this show and its creators that intense.

What are you talking about? Everyone knows the episode was changed. We are specifically talking about you making up stuff on how the story would have went.
 

kirblar

Member
So do you think the "Hillary is behind Troll Trace" plotline was created after she lost? Because it is fact that the episode they'd originally made, their entire plot for the season, revolved around her winning. This is a thing we know and they joked about.

Because, if not, then literally the only part I'm making any assumptions on is Garrison coming back to counter balance Hillary.

Shit, they even ended the ACTUAL season with Troll Trace being defeated and the internet being reset by reactivating the Skankhunt troll network and overloading the system!
The idea that it was going to lead to her being "THE REAL VILLAIN AFTER ALL" is complete unfounded conjecture on your part. TrollTrace was about Doxxing and open information on the internet being a bad thing, and linking Hillary in as part of a liberal overreach on that is, again, nowhere close to what they were doing w/ Trump.

edit: If they even did that, I was only half-paying attention on the back end of the season cause I was not into it.
 
Are we seriously at the point where we can create fanfiction and then use that fanfiction as proof to indict the original material.

Adder, even with your complete fucking fantasy story THAT ISN'T EVEN HILLARY SATIRE. Like what the fuck? Making Hillary in charge of TrollTrace is a statement of what? Everything about Garrison was completely a thousand percent Trump reality and they went on him HARD the entire way through and continued even harder on him after his win.

Seriously look at your idiotic fantasy plotline again.

"Hillary Clinton is a vengeance seeking megalomaniac and we just made her President"

How the hell is this Clinton satire? Has anyone ever claimed Hillary to be a vengeful person? Where the hell do you even get megalomania from the storyline? You're completely pulling out of your ass.
 

Trojita

Rapid Response Threadmaker
See my reply to Kirblar

Because it is fact that the episode they'd originally made, their entire plot for the season, revolved around her winning. This is a thing we know and they joked about.

Because, if not, then literally the only part I'm making any assumptions on is Garrison coming back to counter balance Hillary.

Shit, they even ended the ACTUAL season with Troll Trace being defeated and the internet being reset by reactivating the Skankhunt troll network and overloading the system!

Wow. Go back and watch episode "Fort Collins". There is literally nothing to suggest Hillary was supposed to be behind Troll Trace. Quite the opposite in fact.
 

.JayZii

Banned
I don't think Mr Garrison has a daughter.
You can't imagine a season long arc of him being reunited with a daughter he didn't know he had, falling in love with her despite his relationship with Putin, and their love triangle ultimately culminating in the scene I described?

Maybe I should write for South Park.
 
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