Pretty sure they are not losing that much money.
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Steam monthly active users now at 67 million compared to 70 million for PSN
- Thread starter Poetic.Injustice
- Start date
Pretty sure they are not losing that much money.
There are plenty of games on Steam with a smurf culture.
There are people with multiple accounts on both sides.
However, it should again be repeated that Steam's numbers only include users who played a game in the last month.
(Notice how the wording is 'monthly active players' for Steam and 'monthly active users' for PSN?
But for real, does anyone know what Sony counts as an 'active user'?)Backwards Compatibility should be a huge issue at Sony right now. That's really what they are competing with if they want to compare themselves with Valve. The value proposition of buying a piece of hardware like a new PC with tons of games already on the system (that you own) is enormous.
Sad Affleck
Member
Steam is even easier than piracy. Downloading a torrent and waiting for a new crack every time the game gets patched vs just hitting Play. Straight from the horse's mouth:
http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2011-11-28-valve-piracy-a-non-issue-for-steam
It's no wonder Valve is in the dominant position that it is.
There are people with multiple accounts on both sides.
However, it should again be repeated that Steam's numbers only include users who played a game in the last month.
(Notice how the wording is 'monthly active players' for Steam and 'monthly active users' for PSN?
For several years I only used my PS3 as a Blu Ray player and I'm sure they counted me as a monthly active user since it was connected to the Internet.
SmokedMeat
Gamer™
It's not the only way for them to happen. That's a fact.
They don't loose money at all, if anything they earn more, EA, Blizzard and Ubisoft games have huge market, they don't need Steam visibility, people buy them on PC regardless the Steam support, and by using their own client those companies don't have to pay that 30% royalties to Valve so they make more money than they would on Steam.
I'd like to have every game on one client too, and Steam is the best one there, but not gonna happen
PetriP-TNT
Member
It's funny because I am pretty sure I am not an active user in Steam right now, despite owning 1400 games on the service and browsing the client daily. Just haven't had the time to play any games as of late.
Yeah, although steam is missing out on some of the largest PC communities since stuff like League of Legends, Minecraft, all Blizzard's stuff is missing. Googling around, LoL claims to have 100 million monthly users on its own.
They also have full control over advertising, marketing, game discovery and player data at the expense of infrastructure to develop and run the platform.
Also, corporate synergy is slightly easier to use and defend due to these other factors.
If they truly see PC as competition they absolutely should pay more attention to backwards and forwards compatibility. It's why I tend to favour buying the PC version in most cases despite my PC now having to run some recent games at below PS4 settings. Long term access to my purchases is important to me.
ArtHands
Thinks buying more servers can fix a bad patch
Its best not to point that out. Some people wouldnt be able to handle knowing that.
Turin Turambar
Member
Most people don't use computers anymore unless they have a specific task in mind, they use their smartphones/tablets in their daily lives.
Rellik
Member
Yeah, I'm also not counted as an active user right now but I added 4 to the PSN number.
Now if people would actually be spending the same amount, we would be gold. But most of these accounts are probably used mainly for very specific games.
Yes, this is pulled out of my ass, but if sales for PC games are always that much lower despite these healthy monthly numbers, then I don't know what else to deduce from this.
Yes, this is pulled out of my ass, but if sales for PC games are always that much lower despite these healthy monthly numbers, then I don't know what else to deduce from this.
Turin Turambar
Member
Maybe Origin is growing at the same rate?
ArtHands
Thinks buying more servers can fix a bad patch
The sales for PC games generally has a long sale legs due to its longevity, and the fact that users are spread across all types of games (both new and old, really niche type and major games) rather than just only concentrating on AAA games. Dont mix up the buying behavior of PC and console gamers. There is a reason why publishers like Sega are starting to make more games on Steam in recent years.
Sales for pc games aren't "always lower", they're predominantly lower within the genre of good looking but shallow cinematic experiences because of a difference in audience.
Gameplay focused games (Dark Souls, NuDoom), especually RPG and strategy titles (DOS, XCOM) complex multiplayer titles (PUBG, Dota) and nearly all indie games sell on par or often far above their console versions.
StrongBlackVine
Banned
Not very impressive for Steam considering it is the most popular PC gaming service and it doesn't reset its user base each generation.
Welfare
Member
I actually can't tell if this is sarcasm, so good one?
Because if you're serious, Steam doesn't have a monopoly.
scoobs
Member
Valve is a private company, so financials aren't made available to the public unless Valve feels like it. We know Gabe is worth more than $1 billion though so... its doing well.
StrongBlackVine
Banned
I phrased that wrong. They don't have a monopoly, but a huge percentage of PC gamers do use their services primarily along with others.
I hear this kind of elitism often, but what if I brought up Nier, which sold more than 2x as many copies on PS4
how will you counter this
That's a really easy one. Nier is a personal GOTY candidate, but Square's handling of the PC version was (and still is) utterly abysmal and let's not even start with the stupidity they pulled in the Asian countries. The entire marketing leading up to the release was a shitshow.
To date, the game still doesn't run above 900p in fullscreen without a 3rd party tool.
The game flat out didn't work on certain graphics cards and has not been patched once. This had to be fixed in driver updates and still doesn't run without issues for everyone.
As much as I love the game, it doesn't deserve the sales it has on PC.
That PSN figure includes last gen MAU as well (PS3, PSP, Vita). The only discontinued "platform" is PS mobile.
Steam's also only 3 years older than PSN.
It's not elitism, its a fact that these two markets have different preferences
Nier is not a particular complex game and very narratively focused, the opposite of what I've been talking about.
In addition to that, the pc version received no marketing and was pretended to not be existent more often than not.
Every single trailer and ad exclusively mentioned the ps4 version, willfully omitting the existence of a pc release, even live on stage the game was once called PlayStation exclusive.
Furthermore, the game launched with delay and little fanfare as a bad port whose issues have not been fixed to this very day, including crashes, resolution locks and a missing online feature.
It also happened to be the 4th game In a franchise that had all games releasing on PlayStation platforms but not a single one on pc prior.
The same goes for the developers own pedigree who just now started releasing their games like vanquish and bayonetta on pc, meaning their was no platinum fanbase garnered on pc over the years the same way it was on console.
These sales are hardly comparable.
hanspampel
Banned
Sonys G&NS made ~$14 billon the last 12 months
Valve made ~3 billion on game sales in 2016 according to Steamspy (does not include F2P and MTX money)
Microsofts gaming division made ~9 billon
Rellik
Member
I log onto Steam all the time but I'm not counted because I haven't played a game in the last month.
martino
Member
it's normal it's taken as elitism..but being more mainstream mean you will find there more people to buy what mainstream media tell them to buy.
i doubt pc is more mainstream than consoles.
This. It took me a while to accept pc gaming. I took the plunge back in May and bought a gaming rig that can handle almost anything on ultra 1080p 60fps and ever since then I've been very critical of Microsoft and Sony and how they're handling their boxes. Microsoft is making great steps but since they're crossbill with PC anyway I don't need an Xbox One X.
ItalianJoe83
Member
I'm sure PSN active users count will drop soon for some "Plus" reason...
martino
Member
There is such thing as opinion you know.
Saying "fucking fanboys" and then pushing your opinion like it's fact makes you hypocritical.
Cool, thanks.
So Monthly active users does mean much if one is making more revenue (by a lot) I guess? someone else could explain it better.
You think people will completely stop using their Playstation consoles because PS+ subscription costs will rise? I doubt it.
llien
Member
It objectively is a monopoly (controlling 70%+ of the market and having no major competitors), explaining it doesn't have it is more like finding excuses for it.
hanspampel
Banned
Steam does not control 70% of the PC gaming market.
They're maybe at ~15%
What you're maybe mistaken it fore is the Console AAA games on PC and the indie games. that is where Steam is stronger than anyone else by a good margin
Both is important
A big part of Sonys and Microsofts revenue is Hardware with low margins.
Valve is doing fine and has a better gross margin.
Profits are sadly impossible to compare, because we don't have data for MS and Valve
Where are you getting 70% from?
iirc, one of the reason PSN numbers are so high is because because it's actually including all Sony Entertainment Network accounts, which includes a bunch of non-Playstation products, and the actual PS numbers were way lower. Like, it includes tablets, televisions, smartphones, etc. If it's digital and connected to the internet and made by Sony, it's considered to be part of PSN, particularly Bravia and Experia devices. iirc, the biggest single contributor to these numbers was actually Bravia TVs, but this is like... ancient news.
I do want to point out that Sony apparently had 70 million accounts back when they had their data breach in 2011, so... what, has there been literally no growth at ALL since then? Or was that 70 million accounts total, and they've only just now hit 70 million MAUs?
I do want to point out that Sony apparently had 70 million accounts back when they had their data breach in 2011, so... what, has there been literally no growth at ALL since then? Or was that 70 million accounts total, and they've only just now hit 70 million MAUs?
Lister
Banned
Last numbers indicate Steam being about < 20% of the PC gaming market. So no.
PC gaming is larger than both main consoles combined.
And that's another thing, these numbers are misleading even when just comparing Steam vs PSN users. The PSN numbers are "active player base". We don't have a definition for this as far as I can tell, but let's assume it means purchasers of games who have logged in the past several months (though all indications point to this NOT being the case, but instead all users of the PSn network accross a number of devices, posisbl including non gamign devices).
The Steam numbers are active PLAYERS. This is a different metric. Steam's active user base is MUCH larger than 67 million, as Steamspy will happily tell you. They cannot arrive at their fairly accurate owner numbers for games by just taking those 67 million into acocunt.
Lister
Banned
You may want to actually look up the word monopoly in a dictionary. Also Steam is not 70% of the PC marketplace. It's closer to 15-20%.
You're only proving that you don't know what the word monopoly means