• Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.

Super Smash Bros. for 3DS & Wii U Thread 8: Put mii in, coach

JoeInky

Member
I see no issue with the small list that Revven suggested, personally.
That said, like many I guess I just like to get my hands on something to get a feel for it myself and put everything in perspective before I can really related to the feedback other people are giving :3

I guess it's also worth mentioning that it's funny what players will overlook on their first impressions due to whatever mindset they go in with: In one of the earlier versions of a combat system for a board game I'm dabbling with one of the playtesters (a very experienced professional board game designer) was honestly baffled why I'd included one of the moves in the game, as it basically required both you and your opponent to not move for a turn to connect. I pointed out it's theoretical usage (which is more than you'll get from Sakurai admittedly :p ) inspired by tactics I'd noticed in actual high-level matches of Soul Calibur, but the tester seemed unconvinced and claimed he could never see a situation coming up where he'd use it...
Two turns later he won the entire fight decisively by using the move in question, much to the amusement of all present XD

Moral of the story here is... there might be tactics we're not seeing yet just because we don't have the right line of thinking to spot them. All the same, however, I see no issue with people giving constructive feedback anyway and if they're not enjoying it then it's the task of a good designer to work out why and see if it can be/needs fixed :3

I think what a lot of people fail to understand is that the competitive minded people that went there weren't in the mindset of looking for ATs that they already know about like wavedashing and this made them forget that the game will have it's own ATs that we'll find out as we play the game, they went in with the mindset of hoping the new smash has good base mechanics, things that are necessary for the new smash to be viable.

We've had 3 smash bros. games now, we know by now what sort of mechanics sets apart smash from the rest of all the fighting games, we know what works - it's the fluidity of all the movement systems working together to make a freeform combo system that makes it hard to go back to other fighting games once you've had a taste of what proper competitive smash is like. You can't just say "It doesn't matter if there's way more landing lag, there might be something we don't know about until we play it that makes it better in other aspects", because either the ability to reduce landing lag or just reduced landing lag in general is practically the source of the entire combo game in smash.

People aren't criticising certain tactics (other than maybe the fact that currently a much better tactic is to stall and lay defensively), tactics is about how you use the mechanics available to you against the opponent, people are complaining about the base mechanics that are affecting the lack of strategies available to the player.
 

Golnei

Member
From my calculations, depending on the price I am going to spend over 100-150 dollars on Smash figures alone. I don't know how to feel about it.

I can't even think about buying them all doe.

I'm likely to just pick up Samus, Ike and maybe Marth. If they introduced Smash-Amie for your amiibo fighter, though...
 
For people who are afraid that some characters are getting cut, here's the list of Brawl characters returning from Melee that were not officially revealed before release.

Luigi
Ganondorf
Falco
Jigglypuff
Captain Falcon
Ness
Marth
Mr. Game & Watch

Assuming the leaks are correct, the only character that's really at threat is Lucas. I doubt Snake will return either. I've seen people thinking characters like Ganondorf, Wario and Captain Falcon aren't returning since they haven't been revealed yet which is strange. It's not particularly seen here but still.
 
RemorsefulBarrenCreature.gif


I dunno if anyone saw.
Someone pointed out the blue Pikmin brings the Pitfall seed back to Olimar. Pretty neat new feature for them.

Oh wow that's awesome
 

Tripon

Member
OT8: Pac-man for life.
OT8: What do you mean the new Smash is Brawl 2.0!?
OT8: A song of Palutena and Pit.
OT8: CAN U PALMIIMAN TAKE IT!?
OT8: Mii can't take it anymore!
OT8: Did they really based Pac-man design from Pac-man land?
 

Jawmuncher

Member
I almost want snake back just to see how it would fuck with everyone's list. Since everyone has him cut. Reminds me of Ike who was cut from a lot of people's list then boom he's in actually.
 

Berordn

Member
I don't want to see Snake cut because he's a unique character with unique attributes. It's the same reason why I'd like to see Squirtle and Ivysaur back in some capacity as well. While the latter two probably can't stand with the Smash cast on their own merits, Snake is at least something of a gaming icon who owes a lot of his heritage to his NES games giving his series the chance to grow, so seeing him return wouldn't be absolutely crazy.
 

Golnei

Member
I almost want snake back just to see how it would fuck with everyone's list. Since everyone has him cut. Reminds me of Ike who was cut from a lot of people's list then boom he's in actually.

Hopefully they're all preparing for disappointment, and don't genuinely want him out. I still think it's possible. If we can't re-enact this infamous shot in SSB4, it'll be really depressing.
 
I don't want to see Snake cut because he's a unique character with unique attributes. It's the same reason why I'd like to see Squirtle and Ivysaur back in some capacity as well. While the latter two probably can't stand with the Smash cast on their own merits, Snake is at least something of a gaming icon who owes a lot of his heritage to his NES games giving his series the chance to grow, so seeing him return wouldn't be absolutely crazy.

The NES port of Metal Gear was butchered and the second Metal Gear on NES wasn't even by Kojima and it isn't canon, just sayin.
 

TheChits

Member
Yea, there's a big issue with the game and it has a few was to describe it. Lag, recovery, delay, etc. Most attacks are very unsafe, making the overall feel very defensive. You wait for someone to screw up, instead of being proactive and offensive.

I believe this to be attached to a specific design issue with Smash 4, and it's that animations are taking priority over fun. Most have these very elaborate pre and post animations to their attacks, and sometimes they just take too damn long. As a result, the player has to be overly cautious about what they press and when they press it, moreso than ever before in a Smash game.

On a technical level, returning to neutral takes too much time for way to many characters. At the moment, there's a couple that don't seem to have this issue, IE Zero Suit Samus.
This is extremely concerning. I really hope they listen to all the feedback since the complaints are seemingly pretty consistent
 

Golnei

Member
The NES port of Metal Gear was butchered and the second Metal Gear on NES wasn't even by Kojima and it isn't canon, just sayin.

But without that game, Kojima wouldn't have been inspired to make his version of Metal Gear 2, and by proxy the entire series. So, in a way; Metal Gear Solid owes its existence to the NES.
 

Berordn

Member
The NES port of Metal Gear was butchered and the second Metal Gear on NES wasn't even by Kojima and it isn't canon, just sayin.

The fact that the second game was so bad is what drove Kojima to make a canon real sequel.

Snake owes his modern-day existence to Nintendo.

edit: preach it brother
 
Not sure if posted yet but Clashtournaments got a lot of E3 footage of Smash 4 but the most important bit is that they also got several 1v1 matches recorded: https://www.youtube.com/user/CLASHTournaments/videos

It's the thumbnails with the character art on them that are the 1v1s, the ones before that are FFAs. Unfortunately, they still have items on so it's hard to tell how the characters would play without them at this stage. Still, it's footage nonetheless I thought people would appreciate.

Inkay appears in this video. Does anyone know what it actually does??

EDIT: Upon closer inspection, Inkay appears to trip characters at ground level.
 
The fact that the second game was so bad is what drove Kojima to make a canon real sequel.

Snake owes his modern-day existence to Nintendo.

edit: preach it brother

There were two different sequels. The one Kojima hated was Snake's Revenge on NES, the one Kojima worked on was Metal Gear 2: Solid Snake on MSX2.
 
I've been playing brawl in preparation for the new smash and fuck some of these challenges. I'm pretty sure I've cleared all-star on intense multiple times but nope, that challenge trophy is still locked.
 

Watch Da Birdie

I buy cakes for myself on my birthday it's not weird lots of people do it I bet
No. Alt costumes most probably won't change who your character is. Palutena will always stay Palutena.

Yep.

I don't think we'll see any costumes where the name of the character would conflict with their appearance...like I don't even think we'll see Mrs. Pac-Man because that's not simply a gender swap of an avatar like with Villager and WFT, but a different character.
 

Berordn

Member
Yep.

I don't think we'll see any costumes where the name of the character would conflict with their appearance...like I don't even think we'll see Mrs. Pac-Man because that's not simply a gender swap of an avatar like with Villager and WFT, but a different character.

The only alt Pac-Man needs:
pacmanpaclanddfs1n.jpg
 

Golnei

Member
Yep.

I don't think we'll see any costumes where the name of the character would conflict with their appearance...like I don't even think we'll see Mrs. Pac-Man because that's not simply a gender swap of an avatar like with Villager and WFT, but a different character.

Though if Peach's Daisy palette, Mario's Wario colours and Falcon's Blood Falcon costume are any indication, we'll still get some palettes based on other characters.
 
I'd love to see Viridi in as playable but it's not going to happen... they couldn't even be bothered to animate her model in the background of her stage and as others have pointed out, alternative models seem to follow a rule that they can't change the name of the character so Paliridi isn't happening as anything more than a recolour :p

It'd be a crime if one of the threads after the 3DS version comes out, leading up to the wii-u release isn't "Winter is coming" :3
 
Indeed, very good to read. I am getting more and more optimistic about this game's competitive outlook - especially since I can't imagine SDI being absent from the final game.

Pretty clear that the 3DS version was made to not be competitive.
I would assume that it has more or less the same physics as the Wii U version, so the two games should, in theory, be equally competitive. Although we prolly won't see 3DS version tournaments any time after the Wii U version's release because of wireless issues.
 
Top Bottom