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[Ekai]

NPR

Months after the Obama administration advised school districts that transgender students should be given access to bathrooms based on their gender identity, a federal judge in Texas has blocked the guidance from going into effect — for now.

U.S. District Judge Reed O'Connor has granted a preliminary, nationwide injunction in response to a lawsuit filed by Texas and a number of other states.

The preliminary injunction would mean that, until that lawsuit works its way through the courts, the "status quo" would be maintained and the guidance could not be considered enforceable.

In their lawsuit, Texas and other states argue that references to "sex" in Title IX refer only to biological sex, and that the administration's interpretation is a "radical re-authoring" of the term.

The states also say that while the administration describes the documents as interpretation and guidance, they are "coercive" in practice.

In a ruling issued Sunday, O'Connor concluded that there is a strong likelihood the states will win their case, justifying an injunction in the meantime. He found that the administration didn't follow the proper notice and comment process for the guidelines.

He determined that the law is "not ambiguous," writing that "t cannot be disputed that the plain meaning of the term sex as used ... following passage of Title IX meant the biological and anatomical differences between male and female students as determined at their birth."

He also said that the guidelines are "compulsory in nature."

Under his injunction, O'Connor ordered all parties to "maintain the status quo." He says the administration can't enforce the guidelines — or make any sort of investigation based on the idea that "the definition of sex includes gender identity." The White House would also be barred from using the guidelines in any lawsuits, he wrote.

ACLU attorney Joshua Block, who has worked on high-profile trans cases, notes on Twitter that the administration can request a stay of the injunction, which could be granted by an appeals court or the Supreme Court.

Meanwhile, five civil rights organizations, including the ACLU and Lambda Legal, issued a joint statement calling the ruling "unfortunate and premature."

They addressed school districts, saying "your obligations under the law have not changed," and advising them that the injunction does not block other courts or lawyers from relying on the Obama administration's stated interpretation of the law.

The link also has the full document for O'Conner's injunction.

Injunct me if old.

 

[Squalor]

Everything's bigger in Texas, even the bigotry.

 

[perfectchaos007]

The "status quo" is actually transgendered people using the bathrooms of their identified gender and people not giving a shit. This whole thing has been blown up by the media in the past 12 months and has made it a national debate

 

[PopeReal]

What a great use of taxpayer money.

 

[thehypocrite]

Why antagonize people over this?

 

[EdibleKnife]

The "status quo" is actually transgendered people using the bathrooms of their identified gender and people not giving a shit. This whole thing has been blown up by the media in the past 12 months and has made it a national debate

Acknowledging this would mean the same people would have to acknowledge transgender individuals are natural, equal human beings that aren't a brand new or uncommon occurrence sent by the devil to break down our god-fearing society.

 

[Gutek]

Small government in action. Show me your genitalia before you go potty!

 

[Septimus Prime]

Everything's bigger in Texas, even the bigotry.

Can't spell "bigotry" without "big."

 

[mre]

NPR


The link also has the full document for O'Conner's injunction.

Injunct me if old.

Putting aside all other aspects of the ruling, if this is true:

He found that the administration didn't follow the proper notice and comment process for the guidelines.

and it's arguable that the policy is compulsory (i.e., substantive) rather than optional (or interpretive), then the injunction should be upheld on those grounds alone. This means that the executive branch dropped the administrative ball when promulgating the regulation, which sucks for those affected.

 

[Team Alucard]

This is a battle that the Obama administration is going to lose.

 

[Ekai]

The "status quo" is actually transgendered people using the bathrooms of their identified gender and people not giving a shit. This whole thing has been blown up by the media in the past 12 months and has made it a national debate

Basically. It's like a 99% chance that everyone against these laws has been in a bathroom with someone who is trans and never even realized it.

But it would require them to acknowledge our humanity so, you know, can't give up that fight. Even if it's a huge waste of time and money. And trans students lives are being played with in the meantime.

 

[PopeReal]

So are racist retired old guys and their online alt right meme makers forming bathroom police squads yet?

 

[Omegasquash]

Why antagonize people over this?

Because Obama "coerced and compelled schools by overstepping his constitutional authority."

At least that's what they say. IMO, they're just mad because a black guy shapes policy.

 

[Lesath]

The "status quo" is actually transgendered people using the bathrooms of their identified gender and people not giving a shit. This whole thing has been blown up by the media in the past 12 months and has made it a national debate

If people weren't bigots it wouldn't be a story.

 

[Freddy Barry]

Basically. It's like a 99% chance that everyone against these laws has been in a bathroom with someone who is trans and never even realized it.
e.

You're joking right?

 

[Ekai]

You're joking right?

Why would it be a joke?
We've been around for a long long time. It's not like we only just came into existence now.

 

[richiek]

Man I can't wait till Hillary becomes president and installs liberal justices.

 

[Freddy Barry]

eh not touching this one.

 

[Ahasverus]

You're joking right?

Why would he?

?

Now if this is bigotry GTFO

 

[Link]

This is a battle that the Obama administration is going to lose.

The Obama administration perhaps, purely because of time constraints, but the war will be won eventually. Bigots always lose.

You're joking right?

What's the matter? Afraid you might have caught something?

 

[Freddy Barry]

Why would it be a joke?
We've been around for a long long time. It's not like we only just came into existence now.

99% of people?

Anyway, from the looks of it, Obama will likely lose this. Which I know will be an issue for a number of people.

I don't get the Texas bigotry claims though, I mean if you have multiple states suing for the same thing the judges action makes sense. IMO.

 

[perfectchaos007]

You're joking right?

I can't recall being in a restroom with someone who was trans. However, when I'm in a public restroom I'm not looking at the guys walking in trying to decide if they are trans or not. Given how many times I've used public restrooms and how many transgendered men there are, yeah I would say there's a 99% chance I've been in a restroom with someone trans that I wasn't aware of. What's so outlandish about that?

 

[Ekai]

Why would she?

I don't know if I agree with GTFO(thought their posts are bordering on offensive). It could be a good learning opportunity for this poster.

 

[Lesath]

eh not touching this one.

Nuh-uh. I saw what you posted before you edited.

Explain yourself.

EDIT: To which I mean, in response to EdibleKnife's quote "transgender individuals are natural". You replied, "?".

 

[Ashby]

Why can some dumb yokel 2,000 miles away in Texas affect my sensible laws in the Northeast? I thought the point of states rights was to prevent bullshit like this.

 

[tmarg]

99% of people?

How many thousands of people have you shared a public restroom with in your life?

Yes, the odds are overwhelmingly in favor of one of them being trans.

 

[Zoe]

Putting aside all other aspects of the ruling, if this is true:

and it's arguable that the policy is compulsory (i.e., substantive) rather than optional (or interpretive), then the injunction should be upheld on those grounds alone. This means that the executive branch dropped the administrative ball when promulgating the regulation, which sucks for those affected.

There's no need for your legal mumbo jumbo here.

 

[Ahasverus]

I don't know if I agree with GTFO(thought their posts are bordering on offensive). It could be a good learning opportunity for this poster.

It's a dog whistle, check his post history.

 

[aeolist]

note: this court has several vacancies because texas senators have blocked obama from appointing replacement judges for the last 8 years

https://www.wikiwand.com/en/United_...he_Northern_District_of_Texas#/Current_judges

 

[Freddy Barry]

The Obama administration perhaps, purely because of time constraints, but the war will be won eventually. Bigots always lose.

What's the matter? Afraid you might have caught something?

99% chance that everyone against these laws has been in a bathroom with someone who is trans and never even realized it.

That statement is broad and the populations of those who identify as such isn't big enough. I understand about people shouldn't be giving a crap but you're(or the guy I am responding to) is making it seem like that a lot of these people had been going to the bathroom with trans the whole time and are only just now complaining when it's more likely they hadn't seen a trans at all.

I don't get your subtle jab there.

 

[Ekai]

Nuh-uh. I saw what you posted before you edited.

Explain yourself.

What had they said?

Why can some dumb yokel 2,000 miles away in Texas affect my sensible laws in the Northeast? I thought the point of states rights was to prevent bullshit like this.

Enough Republican states fought against it more or less. Which aren't even that many states from what I recollect.

99% of people?

Anyway, from the looks of it, Obama will likely lose this. Which I know will be an issue for a number of people.

I don't get the Texas bigotry claims though, I mean if you have multiple states suing for the same thing the judges action makes sense. IMO.

Yea, probably 99% of people. Of course I have no proper statistic for this but given how many of us there are and how often one goes to the restroom, there's a pretty damn good chance you've been in one with someone who was trans at least once in your life at some point and never knew.

I don't see how it's likely he'll lose this. What causes you to believe this?

Just because an action is pushed forth by a judge doesn't mean it's not bigotry. It's sorta like saying fighting against civil rights or removing sections from the civil rights act isn't bigotry.

It's a dog whistle, check his post history.

Ahh, I see.

 

[Link]

That statement is broad and the populations of those who identify as such isn't big enough. I understand about people shouldn't be giving a crap but you're(or the guy I am responding to) is making it seem like that a lot of these people had been going to the bathroom with trans the whole time and are only just now complaining when it's more likely they hadn't seen a trans at all.

I don't get your subtle jab there.

No, the fact is the bolded is absolutely what's happening, whether you want to admit it or not.

It's a problem that didn't exist until bigots on the right made it one, just like voter fraud.

 

[NeOak]

Everything's bigger in Texas, even the bigotry.

especially the bigotry

 

[Freddy Barry]

Yes, the odds are overwhelmingly in favor of one of them being trans.

I know white people who haven't seen a black person directly in their lifes until relatively recently, and that's 12% of the population, you really think a lot of these people of multiple races have a HIGH chance of having been in the same bathroom with a trans?

 

[Ahasverus]

I don't get your subtle jab there.

You just put into question the naturality of transgendered people. Now that's subtle.

This is a humans rights topic we're discussing there, regarding real people, don't act surprised when those, largely already suppressed, people are getting mad because other unrelated, privileged by default people are deciding how to rule their own behavior.

 

[Risette]

I know white people who haven't seen a black person directly in their lifes until relatively recently, and that's 12% of the population, you really think a lot of these people of multiple races have a HIGH chance of having been in the same bathroom with a trans?

It's not "a trans" -- it's "trans people/person". We're not animals.

 

[2002whitegt]

I still don't get how in the last year this whole bathroom issue became a thing. It makes no sense, as trans-gendered people go unnoticed in the restroom of their choice; yet a m2f or f2m having to use the restroom of their birthed gender would essentially cause what the alt. right wants to stop.

The only reason I can see that so many states started passing bathroom laws is because they can't complain against gay marriage anymore, so they have to complain and be bigots about something. Ignorance at it's best.

That being said, I think the Obama administration will have a tough time fighting this.

 

[Freddy Barry]

there's a pretty damn good chance you've been in one with someone who was trans at least once in your life at some point and never knew.
.

I don't know what numbers you are using but I'm pretty sure that's not how it works. Heck aren't there more native americans in populations than identified transgenders?

 

[Link]

I still don't get how in the last year this whole bathroom issue became a thing. It makes no sense, as trans-gendered people go unnoticed in the restroom of their choice; yet a m2f or f2m having to use the restroom of their birthed gender would essentially cause what the alt. right wants to stop.

The only reason I can see that so many states started passing bathroom laws is because they can't complain against gay marriage anymore, so they have to complain and be bigots about something. Ignorance at it's best.

That being said, I think the Obama administration will have a tough time fighting this.

Ding ding ding!

 

[Ekai]

note: this court has several vacancies because texas senators have blocked obama from appointing replacement judges for the last 8 years

https://www.wikiwand.com/en/United_...he_Northern_District_of_Texas#/Current_judges

Interesting bit of news. Of course Texas would do this.

That statement is broad and the populations of those who identify as such isn't big enough. I understand about people shouldn't be giving a crap but you're(or the gal I am responding to) is making it seem like that a lot of these people had been going to the bathroom with trans the whole time and are only just now complaining when it's more likely they hadn't seen a trans at all.

I don't get your subtle jab there.

I'm a woman, thank you.

And yea, no. It's pretty damn likely you've been in the restroom with a trans individual at one point in your life. To act like we don't exist is a bit weird. Even weirder still to act like we only just came into existence now. What you are proposing has never been an issue until the Republicans made it one. That's the point here. We've been using the restroom in accordance to our identity for forever now. These laws simply make it safer for students and trans individuals in general.

 

[Poltergust]

I know white people who haven't seen a black person directly in their lifes until relatively recently, and that's 12% of the population, you really think a lot of these people of multiple races have a HIGH chance of having been in the same bathroom with a trans?

De facto segregation is a thing, while trans people can be literally anyone.

To bring up a more common example, you probably are close with one or two gay people, whether you know it or not. Now apply this logic to trans people, and the general volume and use of public bathrooms, and it is extremely likely you've been in the same bathroom as a trans person.

 

[John Kowalski]

I don't understand this, is there any way the guidelines could have been considered not coercive? Isn't that what they're supposed to be in the first place?

 

[Squalor]

Liberal people in diverse cities on the Coasts tend to forget how absolutely segregated and homogenized (not just from a racial standpoint) Middle America and rural southern states are.

The people who live in those places are also much less likely to travel.

You guys are having a dumb fucking argument, but if I had to bet money, I would go under 99% of Americans having co-occupied a bathroom with a transgendered person.

 

[Team Alucard]

I don't understand this, is there any way the guidelines could have been considered not coercive?

By not threatening to defund the schools if they refused to comply?

 

[PSqueak]

That statement is broad and the populations of those who identify as such isn't big enough. I understand about people shouldn't be giving a crap but you're(or the guy I am responding to) is making it seem like that a lot of these people had been going to the bathroom with trans the whole time and are only just now complaining when it's more likely they hadn't seen a trans at all.

I don't get your subtle jab there.

The have on both accounts, just they didn't know, they're throwing a fit about it just now because trans awareness is at an all time high, so they're panicking because they don't understand that trans people, like gay people before them, have had access to the bathrooms since forever and their salvage accusations of sexual attacks have never actually happened.

 

[Ekai]

I know white people who haven't seen a black person directly in their lifes until relatively recently, and that's 12% of the population, you really think a lot of these people of multiple races have a HIGH chance of having been in the same bathroom with a trans individual?

I would say so yes. At least once, yes.

Liberal people in diverse cities on the Coasts tend to forget how absolutely segregated and homogenized (not just from a racial standpoint) Middle America and rural southern states are.

The people who live in those places are also much less likely to travel.

You guys are having a dumb fucking argument, but if I had to bet money, I would go under 99% of Americans having co-occupied a bathroom with a transgendered person.

My point is it's quite likely it's happened at least once in somebodies life. I'm aware the 99% is quite high. That said too, there's lots of LGBT individuals even in the South. There's lots of cases of violence against us down there after all. So it's within the realm of possibility it's happened for them at least once in their life without them knowing.

It's not "a trans" -- it's "trans people/person". We're not animals.

Basically this.

You just put into question the naturality of transgendered people. Now that's subtle.

This is a humans rights topic we're discussing there, regarding real people, don't act surprised when those, largely already suppressed, people are getting mad because other unrelated, privileged by default people are deciding how to rule their own behavior.

This as well.

The have on both accounts, just they didn't know, they're throwing a fit about it just now because trans awareness is at an all time high, so they're panicking because they don't understand that trans people, like gay people before them, have had access to the bathrooms since forever and their salvage accusations of sexual attacks have never actually happened.

Right on the money, yo.

 

[OceanBlue]

I don't know much about the issues of trans people, but isn't this a problem for trans people who can't afford medicine or reassignment surgery. People like that would have a much harder time going into the bathroom they identify with, wouldn't they?

 

[Freddy Barry]

I still don't get how in the last year this whole bathroom issue became a thing. It makes no sense, as trans-gendered people go unnoticed in the restroom of their choice; yet a m2f or f2m having to use the restroom of their birthed gender would essentially cause what the alt. right wants to stop.

The only reason I can see that so many states started passing bathroom laws is because they can't complain against gay marriage anymore, so they have to complain and be bigots about something. Ignorance at it's best.

That being said, I think the Obama administration will have a tough time fighting this.

Because the media, which is left based, pushed it as such, and started throwing it in the spotlight in news and TV. This is something I don't understand why advocates won't admit. They brought it to be an issue. Not saying that the right wings didn't help just that you know, there are two sides to a coin.

By doing this, in combination of Obama announcing guidlines to follow, which not following could result in cutting federal funding, which is a threat, why is it surprising these states are passing bathroom bills, and also suing?

This was done poorly, if it was done a different way then maybe this wouldn't be happening. But let's not act like Obama helped the situation or the media.

 

[Lenardo]

AS for being in the bathroom comment and not knowing it,

i am 50 yrs old.

to my knowledge i have never been in a bathroom with anyone besides males- Except for those times i was taking my ~3-4yr old daughter to go to the bathroom in the mens room when my wife was not with us(or some other guy was doing that for his daughter). in those instances i stood outside the stall and waited for her(not if it was not my daughter naturally), potentially, a female was in a stall while i was in the rest room, and i did not know it,,, Wait, once when i was at a baseball game a bunch of women went into the mens room as i was exiting to use the stalls since the line for the ladies room was like 40 people long....but i digress.

as for the rule in general, it's idiotic, a person who has not has had the sex change operation, is TECHNICALLY the sex they were born with, even after said operation, genetically they are the sex they were borth with, just the "equipment" is different now.

i see no issue with females using a stall in the mens bathroom and i see no issue with males using a stall in the womens room(provided they are not perverted jackasses), provided said stall has a proper door on it, ya ain't gonna know jack about the person in there until they come out and even then, its not a big deal most men at urinals don't flash their dicks around so its not like a woman see's anything besides a bunch of guys standing near the wall...

 

[Link]

Because the media, which is left based, pushed it as such, and started throwing it in the spotlight in news and TV. This is something I don't understand why advocates won't admit. They brought it to be an issue. Not saying that the right wings didn't help just that you know, there are two sides to a coin.

By doing this, in combination of Obama announcing guidlines to follow, which not following could result in cutting federal funding, which is a threat, why is it surprising these states are passing bathroom bills, and also suing?

This was done poorly, if it was done a different way then maybe this wouldn't be happening. But let's not act like Obama helped the situation or the media.

Yeah fucking right. Republicans have repeatedly proven themselves be completely disgusting human beings toward anyone that's not a straight, white male. No matter how this was approached, they'd fight it tooth and nail.

EDIT - I'm not even gonna touch your media comments.