Support NeoGAF

[beelzebozo]

I don't dislike RE4, although I do dislike RE5. I thought RE4 was a good game, but it really wasn't what I expected from an RE game so I was a bit disappointed. My Dad did write it off after playing it for a bit though. (We've played ever RE game up to 3 together.)

i could see if you were just completely not into shooters whatsoever and appreciated the puzzly aspects of earlier resident evils how you might not like RE4. it certainly makes it difficult, though, considering how good it is in nearly every respect, challenging you to actively dislike it and largely obliterating potential critics in its wake. someone like your dad i can imagine, though, who's very set in what he wants from it.

 

[Yeef]

The village and the lab had great atmosphere, the rest of the game did not. I love RE4 (played through it at least 15 times and own both the GC and PS2 versions), but it doesn't come anywhere close to creating a creepy atmosphere on par with REmake or RE 3.5

 

[Sapiens]

RE4 is a really really great game that's well executed in pretty much every area.

But the Midget Napoleon Ramon Salazar is a terrible character. Awful design, awful characterization. Just a total joke. He ruins every single scene he's in. Just terrible.

It's a good thing I wasn't playing RE for the story.

 

[beelzebozo]

i actually relish every second salazar is on screen.

 

[Leon S. Kennedy]

So much better than the final product, it's not even funny.

But there's nothing creepy about it. It's a dull action game that we'd seen many times before. Granted the execution was superb, but.. It's just another game. There's nothing unique.

RE4 is anything but dull. It had its scary parts and it was fantastic action game. I'll admit that I missed the puzzles for previous REs. The previous REs were more frustrating than scary due to the horrible controls.

RE5 was a generic and dumbed down run of the mill action game I have to admit.

I hope RE6 isn't so dumbed down like RE5. Hopefully we'll be playing RE6 in 2012.

 

[beelzebozo]

for old time's sake

 

[rvy]

it looks super atmospheric and actually scary.

It's a Mikami game.

 

[luka]

Eh, not impressed. I'm happy we got the glorious Gamecube version, one of the best action games of all time.

And the existence of Dead Space invalidates every "tank controls are awesome!" people anyways.

I've finished re4 in it's entirety about 15 times. I haven't finished dead space once, and usually get bored around level 3 or 4 each time I try it. Just putting that out there.

I love RE4 and think it's one of the most wonderfully paced and satisfying action games ever made, but I do hope the series moves back in the slow paced 'creeping horror' direction soon. Just keep the killer dolls and ghost men out of it please. This is biohazard not poltergeist.

 

[beelzebozo]

I've finished re4 in it's entirety about 15 times. I haven't finished dead space once, and usually get bored around level 3 or 4 each time I try. Just putting that out there.

DEAD SPACE did a lot of things right, and i loved it, but it ain't no RE4.

 

[DonMigs85]

you guys forgot the most important fact: Ashley was voiced by Sandy from Spongebob

 

[Fimbulvetr]

for old time's sake

Where's the emotion?

"MIIIIIIIKE!"

 

[luka]

Where's the emotion?

"MIIIIIIIKE!"

He knew a good bar.

 

[Dresden]

I've finished re4 in it's entirety about 15 times. I haven't finished dead space once, and usually get bored around level 3 or 4 each time I try it. Just putting that out there.

I loved RE4 so much that I even wrote a guide for it (albeit a pretty bad one). I like Dead Space, and beat it twice, but it's no RE4.

But it certainly has better controls, which is what I was talking about. It feels so fluid and natural compared to, say, RE5.

 

[Night_Trekker]

Where's the emotion?

"MIIIIIIIKE!"

You have to love how over-the-top RE4 is in every way. Sure the writing is terrible, but they go all out in every scene to create a super-effective, interactive mega-action movie. You have to sort of respect that. And the voice acting is actually really good, despite the words being spoken.

There are some genuinely great scenes, too. The unexpected knife through Salazar's hand makes me laugh every time I see it.

 

[scitek]

I don't know how anyone can watch RE3.5 and wish for that combat again. Those little things on the floor look SO annoying.

 

[PetriP-TNT]

Best Resident Evil-line EVER:

Wesker, You're pitiful

The delivery is just perfect. http://www.realmofdarkness.net/sounds/vg/residentevil-soundboard.htm


also: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gqf7Tbb49Bw&feature=related

 

[Prime Blue]

for old time's sake

NOOOOO! HE KNEW A GOOD BAR!!!!!!

 

[Gin]

This is a 5 minute gameplay demo of an early version of RE4.. I think this is based on the second stage of development according to the OP. I was, and still am, blown away by the video. It had so much potential. Aside from all the dolls and ghosts bs, it looks super atmospheric and actually scary. It's exactly what I wanted RE4 to be. Not that I didn't like RE4.

i would so buy this game if it came out..

re4 was good - but re5 is trash - please make the series go back to the roots

 

[luka]

I loved RE4 so much that I even wrote a guide for it (albeit a pretty bad one). I like Dead Space, and beat it twice, but it's no RE4.

But it certainly has better controls, which is what I was talking about. It feels so fluid and natural compared to, say, RE5.

Well my point was the controls are a 100% non-issue for me and the overall design is the most affecting thing. I don't subscribe to the notion that game design should pander to the arbitrary whims of people who want 'more freedom' just because they can. Games all have their own internal logic and rules and they are built around it. No one complains that you can't suddenly turn around in monopoly because you missed that property you wanted to buy, despite being a totally unrealistic design choice. It's just the way the game works and the difficulty was balanced on that.

I would agree about the controls if they were unintuitive in some way or actually caused me to die at any point rather than by my own mistakes but that has never been the case. I think it's important that games retain their unique feel without being pressured to become homogenized clones.

 

[Night_Trekker]

Well my point was the controls are a 100% non-issue for me and the overall design is the most affecting thing. I don't subscribe to the notion that game design should pander to the arbitrary whims of people who want 'more freedom' just because they can. Games all have their own internal logic and rules and they are built around it. No one complains that you can't suddenly turn around in monopoly because you missed that property you wanted to buy, despite being a totally unrealistic design choice. It's just the way the game works and the difficulty was balanced on that.

I would agree about the controls if they were unintuitive in some way or actually caused me to die at any point rather than my own mistakes but that has never been the case. I think it's important that games retain their unique feel without being pressured to become homogenized clones.

What is this reasonable opinion doing on GAF?

 

[scitek]

RE4's dialogue always sounded like an over-the-top criticism of the Bush administration to me. Like the film The Day After Tomorrow and other things out around the same time.

Leon: "This is no ritual, it's terrorism."
Salazar: "Isn't that a popular word these days."

Krauser: "You don't seriously think a conservative mind can chart
a new course for the world, do you?"

 

[Dresden]

Well my point was the controls are a 100% non-issue for me and the overall design is the most affecting thing. I don't subscribe to the notion that game design should pander to the arbitrary whims of people who want 'more freedom' just because they can. Games all have their own internal logic and rules and they are built around it. No one complains that you can't suddenly turn around in monopoly because you missed that property you wanted to buy, despite being a totally unrealistic design choice. It's just the way the game works and the difficulty was balanced on that.

I would agree about the controls if they were unintuitive in some way or actually caused me to die at any point rather than by my own mistakes but that has never been the case. I think it's important that games retain their unique feel without being pressured to become homogenized clones.

There's nothing wrong with suggesting that another game improved on RE4's controls.

And the controls are unintuitive. There's a little period of time where you must get used to the way Leon handles in the game.

This is an asinine argument because you're insisting that a flaw in the game somehow contributes to it's 'unique' feel. Reminds me of people who insist that the camera in Snake Eater should have stayed the way it was, instead of being improved in Subsistence.

 

[scitek]

The only reason RE4 controls the way it does is because it was designed for the Gamecube and its one "good" analog stick. That C-stick sucked for shooters, and Mikami knew it.

 

[Dresden]

The only reason RE4 controls the way it does is because it was designed for the Gamecube and its one "good" analog stick. That C-stick sucked for shooters, and Mikami knew it.

I didn't mind RE4's controls. They worked for that game.

But they didn't improve on the controls for RE5 and other games have stepped up that improved on the formula without destroying the tension, or whatever it is that Capcom thinks its doing.

 

[Ridley327]

The difference is that that gameplay in RE4 was very clearly designed around the controls, whereas MGS3's camera was completely at odds with the game design. I get not liking tank controls, but they didn't put them in there because they didn't know any better.

I didn't have much a problem with RE5's controls (thanks to the extra-retard AI), but it is weird that they gave such a half-assed solution to tank control whiners.

 

[revolverjgw]

The controls are fucking awful, the game would be even better with a character that controlled like a human. It's still the best action game ever though. I'll never get over how long and diverse this game was. No action adventure can compete with it, and I guess no game ever will as long it takes so much money and resources to develop these games now.

 

[luka]

There's nothing wrong with suggesting that another game improved on RE4's controls.

And the controls are unintuitive. There's a little period of time where you must get used to the way Leon handles in the game.

This is an asinine argument because you're insisting that a flaw in the game somehow contributes to it's 'unique' feel. Reminds me of people who insist that the camera in Snake Eater should have stayed the way it was, instead of being improved in Subsistence.

They are not unintuitive because they behave exactly like you would expect. You push forward, you move forward. You push left and right, you turn left and right. I don't know how you can get more intuitive than that. It's a lot simpler than the dual stick mechanic in dead space.

 

[scitek]

I didn't mind RE4's controls. They worked for that game.

But they didn't improve on the controls for RE5 and other games have stepped up that improved on the formula without destroying the tension, or whatever it is that Capcom thinks its doing.

You know, I wouldn't be surprised if there was some sort of RE 4.5 that was single-player only at one point. When they started RE5, I think they thought fans just wanted RE4 HD. Then, Gears hit and took what RE4 did and improved upon the controls and added co-op to the mix. Jun Takeuchi even referred to the new control scheme as "Gears-like", so I wouldn't be surprised if the co-op was an idea that came about after the very first stages of the game were completed and they felt they had to add it to stay current.

 

[Dresden]

You know, I wouldn't be surprised if there was some sort of RE 4.5 that was single-player only at one point. When they started RE5, I think they thought fans just wanted RE4 HD. Then, Gears hit and took what RE4 did and improved upon the controls and added co-op to the mix. Jun Takeuchi even referred to the new control scheme as "Gears-like", so I wouldn't be surprised if the co-op was an idea that came about after the very first stages of the game were completed and they felt they had to add it to stay current.

Wouldn't surprise me considering how bad average the game ended up being.

They are not unintuitive because they behave exactly like you would expect. You push forward, you move forward. You push left and right, you turn left and right. I don't know how you can get more intuitive than that. It's a lot simpler than the dual stick mechanic in dead space.

The dual stick scheme has been a console standard for years.

 

[Mr_Zombie]

The dual stick scheme has been a console standard for years.

Fuck standards; not every game has to be played the same way :/

 

[How About No]

RE4 didn't have what made the other RE's great. Sense of exploration and non-linearish progression. Almost Metroid-ish but with keys instead of weapons.

RE5 didn't have what made RE4 great. Great pacing, memorable encounters, a self-contained story that doesn't take itself seriously at all, and kept Wesker out of the spotlight because it was lame what they did to him in RE5

Spoiler

"THE RIGHT TO BE A GOD, THAT RIGHT IS NOW MINE" Seriously? God fucking dammit

I sure like curb-stomping/impaling, though.

And music!

 

[MiamiWesker]

Well my point was the controls are a 100% non-issue for me and the overall design is the most affecting thing. I don't subscribe to the notion that game design should pander to the arbitrary whims of people who want 'more freedom' just because they can. Games all have their own internal logic and rules and they are built around it. No one complains that you can't suddenly turn around in monopoly because you missed that property you wanted to buy, despite being a totally unrealistic design choice. It's just the way the game works and the difficulty was balanced on that.

I would agree about the controls if they were unintuitive in some way or actually caused me to die at any point rather than by my own mistakes but that has never been the case. I think it's important that games retain their unique feel without being pressured to become homogenized clones.

You are awesome.

 

[luka]

RE5 didn't have what made RE4 great. Great pacing, memorable encounters, a self-contained story that doesn't take itself seriously at all, and kept Wesker out of the spotlight because it was lame what they did to him in RE5

Spoiler

"THE RIGHT TO BE A GOD, THAT RIGHT IS NOW MINE" Seriously? God fucking dammit

 

[MiamiWesker]

The dual stick scheme has been a console standard for years.

And I don't like it. One stick is more than enough to move a character. That character can either move in the direction pressed which is the main standard most every third person game uses or make it tank like.

Dual stick works for FPSs and it should stay there. I've never liked it in third person games.

 

[MiamiWesker]

I am still kind of shocked at the RE5 hate. Not as good a game as RE4 obviously but so much better than most action games of this gen. I put it in the same category as games like Zelda WW and MGS2 as sequels that don't live up to their predecessor so they get an unfair amount of hate when in reality they are great games in their own way.

 

[InfiniteNine]

And I don't like it. One stick is more than enough to move a character. That character can either move in the direction pressed which is the main standard most every third person game uses or make it tank like.

Dual stick works for FPSs and it should stay there. I've never liked it in third person games.

My Dad agrees with you. He pretty much said as much when I got him to try Uncharted.

While I don't hate RE4 I do have a grudge against it for destroying my bonding with Dad time. The only time we'd actively do something together is whenever played/replayed RE1-3. When he didn't like RE4 that pretty much killed that.

You're my bro luka.

 

[cvxfreak]

Well my point was the controls are a 100% non-issue for me and the overall design is the most affecting thing. I don't subscribe to the notion that game design should pander to the arbitrary whims of people who want 'more freedom' just because they can. Games all have their own internal logic and rules and they are built around it. No one complains that you can't suddenly turn around in monopoly because you missed that property you wanted to buy, despite being a totally unrealistic design choice. It's just the way the game works and the difficulty was balanced on that.

I would agree about the controls if they were unintuitive in some way or actually caused me to die at any point rather than by my own mistakes but that has never been the case. I think it's important that games retain their unique feel without being pressured to become homogenized clones.

Well my point was the controls are a 100% non-issue for me and the overall design is the most affecting thing. I don't subscribe to the notion that game design should pander to the arbitrary whims of people who want 'more freedom' just because they can. Games all have their own internal logic and rules and they are built around it. No one complains that you can't suddenly turn around in monopoly because you missed that property you wanted to buy, despite being a totally unrealistic design choice. It's just the way the game works and the difficulty was balanced on that.

I would agree about the controls if they were unintuitive in some way or actually caused me to die at any point rather than by my own mistakes but that has never been the case. I think it's important that games retain their unique feel without being pressured to become homogenized clones.

Well my point was the controls are a 100% non-issue for me and the overall design is the most affecting thing. I don't subscribe to the notion that game design should pander to the arbitrary whims of people who want 'more freedom' just because they can. Games all have their own internal logic and rules and they are built around it. No one complains that you can't suddenly turn around in monopoly because you missed that property you wanted to buy, despite being a totally unrealistic design choice. It's just the way the game works and the difficulty was balanced on that.

I would agree about the controls if they were unintuitive in some way or actually caused me to die at any point rather than by my own mistakes but that has never been the case. I think it's important that games retain their unique feel without being pressured to become homogenized clones.

Well my point was the controls are a 100% non-issue for me and the overall design is the most affecting thing. I don't subscribe to the notion that game design should pander to the arbitrary whims of people who want 'more freedom' just because they can. Games all have their own internal logic and rules and they are built around it. No one complains that you can't suddenly turn around in monopoly because you missed that property you wanted to buy, despite being a totally unrealistic design choice. It's just the way the game works and the difficulty was balanced on that.

I would agree about the controls if they were unintuitive in some way or actually caused me to die at any point rather than by my own mistakes but that has never been the case. I think it's important that games retain their unique feel without being pressured to become homogenized clones.

THESE.

 

[scitek]

I am still kind of shocked at the RE5 hate. Not as good a game as RE4 obviously but so much better than most action games of this gen. I put it in the same category as games like Zelda WW and MGS2 as sequels that don't live up to their predecessor so they get an unfair amount of hate when in reality they are great games in their own way.

To me, it wasn't fun until I unlocked infinite ammo.

 

[War Peaceman]

I didn't mind RE4's controls. They worked for that game.

Exactly. They were perfectly designed for the environments and set-pieces of the game. Actually RE4 is pretty much the pinnacle of excellent design. Mikami and his team were/are clearly talented but this 4 is on another level. They had the time and the ability to work through everything. It impresses me every single time that I play it (which is a great many times).

In fact 5 only proves this point. The environments and levels are designed less tightly because of coop (and perhaps lesser developers) and the controls are therefore noticeably bad.

 

[Mr_Zombie]

RE5 didn't have what made RE4 great. (...) a self-contained story that doesn't take itself seriously at all, and kept Wesker out of the spotlight (...)

But this was what lots of RE fans (the kind of fans that spend days talking about the series on message boards) wanted. Lots of people were dissapointed at the way RE4 handled the story - the entire 2 minute explanation about Umbrella being finished because "it's stock prices crashed"; especially since every main game, starting with RE2, built the grand finale with lines such as "It's up to us to take out Umbrella", "That's it. Umbrella is going down." and "It's payback time! We've got to destroy Umbrella, once and for all!".

because it was lame what they did to him in RE5

Spoiler

"THE RIGHT TO BE A GOD, THAT RIGHT IS NOW MINE" Seriously? God fucking dammit

Wesker was lame since RECV, when he suddenly resurrected and received Matrix-like powers. And cat eyes. And started to collect every damn virus he knew about without the intention to ever used it.

At least RE5 tried to explain why he turned into this super-power human while ommiting one of the biggest plot holes in the entire series (that the virus Wesker used was Birkin's).

And yes, you can say "who cares?", but believe it or not, there are people who do care about storyline in RE series.

 

[Blue~]

Resident Evil 4 could have been a totally different and new action game. But Capcom put the name RE on it so the game could sell.

 

[luka]

Resident Evil 4 could have been a totally different and new action game. But Capcom put the name RE on it so the game could sell.

It WAS a totally different and new action game. They called it Devil May Cry. As far as I remember it sold very well.

 

[MiamiWesker]

Resident Evil 4 could have been a totally different and new action game. But Capcom put the name RE on it so the game could sell.

It basically saved the franchise so yeah I am very happy it was a RE game.

 

[How About No]

But this was what lots of RE fans (the kind of fans that spend days talking about the series on message boards) wanted. Lots of people were dissapointed at the way RE4 handled the story - the entire 2 minute explanation about Umbrella being finished because "it's stock prices crashed"; especially since every main game, starting with RE2, built the grand finale with lines such as "It's up to us to take out Umbrella", "That's it. Umbrella is going down." and "It's payback time! We've got to destroy Umbrella, once and for all!".

Oh believe, me, that's what I wanted back then, too. But then, RE5 and Umbrella Chronicles came out and I realized I was wrong. The whole storyline of the games is one big cocktease to something mindblowing and great, but then that event happens and I just just felt "So...that's how they're gonna handle it, huh? Oh =/"

Those disappointing events being Umbrella's fall, Wesker's motivations, Jill's return, Sherry Birkin dropping out after RE2 (come on, girl who can use G-Virus powers at will to kick some monster ass!). The events I felt were handled better where things like the Redfield reunion in CVX and Ada's return in RE4.

Wesker was lame since RECV, when he suddenly resurrected and received Matrix-like powers. And cat eyes. At least RE5 tried to explain why he turned into this super-power human while ommiting one of the biggest plot holes in the entire series (that the virus Wesker used was Birkin's).

Can't comment too much on the shock of Wesker returning since I had it spoiled and didn't actually play CV 4 years after it came out, but I sure enjoyed the hell out of any scene he showed up. And his ultra retarded cliche motivations hadn't been brought to light yet, so bonus points for CV Wesker!

And yes, you can say "who cares?", but believe it or not, there are people who do care about storyline in RE series.

Worry not, I was one of those nerds on Gamefaqs making and supporting various theories before RE4 and 5 came out! Those days are gone, though I'm afraid

 

[USD]

RE5 didn't have what made RE4 great. Great pacing, memorable encounters, a self-contained story that doesn't take itself seriously at all, and kept Wesker out of the spotlight because it was lame what they did to him in RE5

Spoiler

"THE RIGHT TO BE A GOD, THAT RIGHT IS NOW MINE" Seriously? God fucking dammit

What. Wesker is awesome sauce in RE5. :lol

"Poor deluded Chris."

"Poor performance indeed!"

"Here I am offering you my precious time, and you waste it by running around."

"COMPLETE... GLOBAL... SATURATION"

"Natural selection leaves the survivors strong and better! Humans have escaped this winnowing for far too long!"

"THE HUMAN RACE REQUIRES JUDGMENT" :lol

I sure like curb-stomping/impaling, though.

People can hate on RE5, but the ground finishers are one of the things that makes the combat in RE5 much better. Headshot > roundhouse > knife gets incredibly tedious.

 

[Mr_Zombie]

Those disappointing events being Umbrella's fall, Wesker's motivations, Jill's return, Sherry Birkin dropping out after RE2 (come on, girl who can use G-Virus powers at will to kick some monster ass!).

I can agree with you. Neither Umbrella's fall from UC, nor

Spoiler

Wesker's death

in RE5 satisfied me. But at least both things at least happened and the series can now continue without that big baggage.

Can't comment too much on the shock of Wesker returning since I had it spoiled and didn't actually play CV 4 years after it came out, but I sure enjoyed the hell out of any scene he showed up. And his ultra retarded cliche motivations hadn't been brought to light yet, so bonus points for CV Wesker!

Yes, Wesker in CV was awesome, especially the grand finale between him and Chris at the end of CVX. However, Wesker's ressurection (and CV overall) IMO was the jump the shark moment for the entire series; a moment when everything just started to fall apart and dumb villains: super humans or intelligent Tyrants, started to become a standard. :/

 

[Ranger X]

The dev time of Resident Evil 4 was quite a clusterfuck but it seems it was worth it. Best RE hands down (except maybe the first game)

.

 

[beelzebozo]

Where's the emotion?

"MIIIIIIIKE!"

He knew a good bar.

NOOOOO! HE KNEW A GOOD BAR!!!!!!

the real tragedy comes into play when you realize that this means leon spent the rest of his days going to bad bars

The dev time of Resident Evil 4 was quite a clusterfuck but it seems it was worth it. Best RE hands down (except maybe the first game)

.

i would wish such a clusterfuck upon every game if the end result were like this.

 

[Teknoman]

Capcom needs to take the ideas from the first and second trailers, and create a new survival horror series. Preferably on the Wii or PS3 with remote aiming for flashlights.

 

[Ranger X]

i would wish such a clusterfuck upon every game if the end result were like this.

lol , me too!

.