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The Legend of Zelda: Breath of the WIld Combat

T

The Lamp

Member
Cartho said:
Do we know if there's a proper "dodge" button / dodge roll / some kind of sidestep shuffle dodge ala Bloodborne? Or is it just - back away / jump out of the way?

***EDIT***


Did... Did he just smack that guy's projectile back at him? Hold me GAF.
Click to expand...

Pretty sure games including Zelda games have had projectile return for years.
 
A

Alexm92

Member
Man, I think I'm going to have to buy a Wii U or Switch for this. It's the first game in ages that made me think FUCK that looks SO good.
 
Majmun

Majmun

Member
Pif said:
Actually own it too. Forgot about it.

Still, interactivity wise and gameplay freedom, doesn't seem to be on the same Plateau as BotW. Excuse the pun.
Click to expand...

Did you pay it tho?

Just Cause 3 gives you a lot of freedom in everything. It's the ultimate sanbox game. I haven't seen anything like it yet. Not even in Zelda

FBq4wqR.gif
 
D

Dremorak

Banned
Comrade Crunch said:
Red Faction Guerrilla
Just Cause 2 and 3
Gravity Rush 1 and 2 (more so 2 than 1)
Dishonored 1 and 2
Dying Light
Click to expand...

Yep. However, none of these games have the ability to cut down trees, craft by physically combining items (not in a menu), fire that spreads based on wind direction or physics puzzles.
 
M

Mory Dunz

Member
Looks good enough to get the job done. And fun to mess around. But I still don't doubt the best option will be to run through most of the time swinging.

thankfully, the game is centered on puzzles and not combat, so anything I get from there is extra to me.
 
C

Coda

Member
Mory Dunz said:
Looks good enough to get the job done. And fun to mess around. But I still don't doubt the best option will be to run through most of the time swinging.

thankfully, the game is centered on puzzles and not combat, so anything I get from there is extra to me.
Click to expand...

I bet running around swinging could get the job done but what's the fun in that? It seems like using your environment and using explosions is an easier and faster way to take care of enemies in this game.
 
C

Comrade Crunch

Member
Dremorak said:
Yep. However, none of these games have the ability to cut down trees, craft by physically combining items (not in a menu), fire that spreads based on wind direction or physics puzzles.
Click to expand...

I mean, sure, but it isn't like any of those are new either. I don't know what you're trying to argue here.
 
Majmun

Majmun

Member
Pagusas said:
If only it was more fun to actually play :(
Click to expand...

I'll have to agree!! You can do the craziest shit in the game, but it got boring really fast. Only fun in short bursts.

Just saying that Just Cause 3 looks more impressive physics/tech wise. I'm sure Zelda will be way more focused and polished. And probably more fun to play.
 
N

Nanashrew

Banned
I guess if we're also listing stuff, there's the weather system in BotW and how it effects the world. Bad thunderstorms can have strong winds and lightning. The lightning can even strike the land and create fires too. You also can't use fire based weapons in the rain because the water puts it out.
 
P

Pif

Banned
Beysus said:
Did you pay it tho?

Just Cause 3 gives you a lot of freedom in everything. It's the ultimate sanbox game. I haven't seen anything like it yet. Not even in Zelda

FBq4wqR.gif
Click to expand...

Yes I did. Huge fan. But apart of pulling/hanging things with the ropes, I felt most of my time was spent blowing red shit up. The game was fun, but I felt the devs didn't take full advantage of the mechanics they built. I got really adicted at flying around though, I wish Zelda had a propulsion system while flying.
 
M

Mory Dunz

Member
LUCKY n WILD said:
I bet running around swinging could get the job done but what's the fun in that? It seems like using your environment and using explosions is an easier and faster way to take care of enemies in this game.
Click to expand...

Personally, I always mess around in Zelda. In stuff like WW, I'd be flipping around to make the combat seem really cool and fun, whereas it really wasn't necessary. At least in this game, the skills seem to be needed on certain occasion.
 
C

Comrade Crunch

Member
Dremorak said:
Well...The point was people were saying Zelda isnt doing anything new and people are just thinking it is because its zelda
Click to expand...

Who are these "people" though? Feels like a strawman to me.

It doesn't really matter if it's trying to do anything new anyways, the game looks awesome, why not leave it at that?
 
Refreshment.01

Refreshment.01

Member
watomsk said:
I love the weapons breaking and how important it is to have the right equipment (and enough weapons) before fighting enemies.
Click to expand...
Don't you guys have any critcism on how the games handle weapon degradition and how this affects gameflow?

This is mostly in regards to how quickly items brake and how players are forced to constantly pause the game and combat to browse a menu. For something like wooden arms/shields, rusted weapons or magical ones quick degradation is somewhat justifiable. However, picking a woodcutter axe that quickly explodes after a few hits in battle makes little sense.

One reason to do this is to avoid item hording and prevent any issues this my cause. However, this could be fxed by limiting the amount of same items near the player's character proximity and automatically deleting the more degraded ones.

Also this quick degradation is not needed to make combat dynamic. To retain this dynamism as well as making weapon last longer they just need to make a small adjustments to the way weapons are pixked up. When promped typing A stores the weapon in the inventory, while holding A would equipped automatically.

For example, i could equip an iron spear that degrades slowly as my main weapon. Say a bokoblin is attacked and he drops his stick, by pressing and holding A Link picks and equips the stick instantly, make some attacks with it and use R to throw it which causes Link to automatically equip the spear.

Cerium said:
You can cycle weapons with a single button.
Click to expand...

Aaronrules380 said:
There's a quick switch option as well as going into the menu though?
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
But this doesn't solve how quickly weapons degrade.

brad-t said:
The breaking mechanic is so brilliant because it works so perfectly in tandem with the throwing mechanic. If the weapons didn't break, you'd never want to throw them. But because throwing a weapon that's about to break has no drawbacks, you're encouraged to do it basically every time.
Click to expand...
In no way it was suggested to take weapon breakdown out of the game.

Just a more sensical way to handle weapon degradation. An axe doesn't degrade so quickly when the targets are mainly flesh and bones. Constantly cycling through weapons the way is handled in the game breaks the gameflow. At least in this early stages since this can change when the master sword is gained.

Also the adjustment i described does encorage weapon flinging.
 
R

Rodin

Member
Comrade Crunch said:
It isn't really, pretty much all the mechanics are things we've seen before, but it's got that Nintendo polish, and looks super fun.
Click to expand...

For some people it seems really hard to understand that you haven't seen ALL of them in a SINGLE game, and that how they're used in a systems driven gameplay IS something new

"Hey look, Zelda is using mechanics we've seen in 40 different games and it makes all of them work in a cohesive way where every mechanic influences other 20 of them, Nintendo fans praising its gameplay are unbearable"

Also saying that you've already seen "all of them" might be a bit of a stretch

Refreshment.01 said:
Don't you guys have any critcism on how the games handle weapon degradition and how this affects gameflow?

This is mostly in regards to how quickly items brake and how players are forced to constantly pause the game and combat to browse a menu. For something like wooden arms/shields, rusted weapons or magical ones quick degradation is somewhat justifiable. However, picking a woodcutter axe that quickly explodes after a few hits in battle makes little sense.

One reason to do this is to avoid item hording and prevent any issues this my cause. However, this could be fxed by limiting the amount of same items near the player's character proximity and automatically deleting the more degraded ones.

Also this quick degradation is not needed to make combat dynamic. To retain this dynamism as well as making weapon last longer they just need to make a small adjustments to the way weapons are pixked up. When promped typing A stores the weapon while holding A automatically equips it. For example, i could equip an iron spear that degrades slowly as my main weapon. Say a bokoblin is attacked and he drops his stick, by pressing and holding A Link picks and equips the weapon instantly, then make some attacks with it and use R to throw it which causes Link to automatically equip the spear.
Click to expand...

Zelda's gameplay and combat system are designed to make it work, so there's nothing to really criticize about it. It's not like in Witcher 3 for example, that's just annoying.

Btw, i think that axes *will* have more durability than deku sticks.
 
A

Aaronrules380

Member
Refreshment.01 said:
Don't you guys have any critcism on how the games handle weapon degradition and how this affects gameflow?

This is mostly in regards to how quickly items brake and how players are forced to constantly pause the game and combat to browse a menu. For something like wooden arms/shields, rusted weapons or magical ones quick degradation is somewhat justifiable. However, picking a woodcutter axe as seen exploding after a few hits makes little sense.

One reason to do this is to avoid item hording and prevent any issues this my cause. However, this could be fxed by limiting the amount of same items near the player's character proximity and automatically deleting the more degraded ones.

Also this quick degradation is not needed to make combat dynamic. To retain this dynamism as well as making weapon last longer they just need to make a small adjustments to the way weapons are pixked up. When promped typing A stores the weapon while holding A automatically equips it. For example, i could equip an iron spear that degrades slowly as my main weapon. Say a bokoblin is attacked and he drops his stick, by pressing and holding A Link picks and equips the weapon instantly, then make some attacks with it and use R to throw it which causes Link to automatically equip the spear.
Click to expand...

There's a quick switch option as well as going into the menu though?
 
C

Cerium

Member
Refreshment.01 said:
Don't you guys have any critcism on how the games handle weapon degradition and how this affects gameflow?

This is mostly in regards to how quickly items brake and how players are forced to constantly pause the game and combat to browse a menu. For something like wooden arms/shields, rusted weapons or magical ones quick degradation is somewhat justifiable. However, picking a woodcutter axe that quickly explodes after a few hits in battle makes little sense.

One reason to do this is to avoid item hording and prevent any issues this my cause. However, this could be fxed by limiting the amount of same items near the player's character proximity and automatically deleting the more degraded ones.

Also this quick degradation is not needed to make combat dynamic. To retain this dynamism as well as making weapon last longer they just need to make a small adjustments to the way weapons are pixked up. When promped typing A stores the weapon while holding A automatically equips it. For example, i could equip an iron spear that degrades slowly as my main weapon. Say a bokoblin is attacked and he drops his stick, by pressing and holding A Link picks and equips the weapon instantly, then make some attacks with it and use R to throw it which causes Link to automatically equip the spear.
Click to expand...
You can cycle weapons with a single button.
 
J

jdstorm

Banned
watomsk said:
Not sure, I've seen videos and it seems like you have to dodge right before the enemy attacks. I imagine depending on the enemy pattern this is probably easy enough or more difficult. I can see how it might be more difficult to pull off than say, the parry attack from Wind Waker (which was downright broken in my opinion), but still seems superfluous because the combat seems to be really fun without the flurry rush mechanic already.

The only other detail about this game that bothers me is the food hoarding, and that you can pause time to eat at any moment. It seems like a step back from Skyward Sword and many other games. This doesn't bother me as much because you can at least choose not to carry a lot of food, and cooking is up to you.

My main concern is that these mechanics might make the combat too easy, but I suppose Zelda games have never been particularly hard and that has never stopped me from enjoying them. Still, I'm hoping for hero mode.
Click to expand...

Clothing has Stats, so you can always set your own difficulty level by changing outfits and going full glass cannon
 
1

13ruce

Banned
Rodin said:
Is it so hard to understand that you haven't seen ALL of them in a SINGLE game, and that the way they're used in a system driven gameplay IS something new

Also saying that you've already seen "all of them" might be a bit of a stretch
Click to expand...

Kinda this i find it impressive that they bundle everything together and make it work well thats pretty new imo. And honestly i never saw any game where you littarly can climb any mountain you see.

Snowboarding of them with a shield is gonna be amazing lol.
 
V

Vanguard771

Member
Refreshment.01 said:
Don't you guys have any critcism on how the games handle weapon degradition and how this affects gameflow?

This is mostly in regards to how quickly items brake and how players are forced to constantly pause the game and combat to browse a menu. For something like wooden arms/shields, rusted weapons or magical ones quick degradation is somewhat justifiable. However, picking a woodcutter axe that quickly explodes after a few hits in battle makes little sense.

One reason to do this is to avoid item hording and prevent any issues this my cause. However, this could be fxed by limiting the amount of same items near the player's character proximity and automatically deleting the more degraded ones.

Also this quick degradation is not needed to make combat dynamic. To retain this dynamism as well as making weapon last longer they just need to make a small adjustments to the way weapons are pixked up. When promped typing A stores the weapon in the inventory, while holding A would equipped automatically.

For example, i could equip an iron spear that degrades slowly as my main weapon. Say a bokoblin is attacked and he drops his stick, by pressing and holding A Link picks and equips the stick instantly, make some attacks with it and use R to throw it which causes Link to automatically equip the spear.
Click to expand...
There is either an ingame prompt or its the description (I don't remember which) but you are told that the woodutter's axe is not meant for combat and won't hold up well. That's why it breaks in combat so quickly.
 
B

brad-t

Member
The breaking mechanic is so brilliant because it works so perfectly in tandem with the throwing mechanic. If the weapons didn't break, you'd never want to throw them. But because throwing a weapon that's about to break has no drawbacks, you're encouraged to do it basically every time.
 
M

Mory Dunz

Member
We still don't know if there are locations that give weapons a longer life, or repair them. But yea, so far they break quickly.

I'm okay with it assuming "main" weapons don't break, but probably just get dull.
 
C

Comrade Crunch

Member
Rodin said:
"Hey look, Zelda is using mechanics we've seen in 40 different games and it makes all of them work in a cohesive way where every mechanic influences other 20 of them, Nintendo fans praising its gameplay are unbearable"
Click to expand...

How did you get this from my reply? I said it looks awesome.

Just because I'm not acting like it's the best thing since sliced bread doesn't mean I'm not looking forward to mucking about with the systems, familiar as they may be.
 
E

Enduin

No bald cap? Lies!
The fact that weapons seem to plentiful(especially in that you can knock them from enemies hands and not simply get them after defeating them), it's easy to switch between them and they can be thrown for extra damage really makes the durability system not seem like a real pain like most games where's mainly used as a means to drain you of your money or other resources.

In all the footage we've seen it never seemed like an issue to those playing. Certainly there were times when a few players were without weapons, but that was mostly due to their own negligence, but it also leads to a race to pick up loose weapons if any are around. It's seems pretty well balanced.
 
J

Jonneh3003

Banned
Conkerkid11 said:
I really hope not.

The open world in this looks nowhere near as shitty as MGSV's.
Click to expand...

+1
I hated MGSV's open world, it pretty much ruined the game. I had to force myself to slowly play it for over a year just because I've played all the other games in the series. It can be a fun game at times but the open world is just so utterly boring.
 
1

13ruce

Banned
Conkerkid11 said:
I really hope not.

The open world in this looks nowhere near as shitty as MGSV's.
Click to expand...

I mean gameplay wise haha my bad, i am glad that Zelda's open world looks way ahead and way bigger then that of MGS V that one was pretty bad yeah but the gameplay.... Was god tier.
 
D

Dangerous1992

Member
Let's see if the world of botw can give me the same feeling of freedom like Mira did, it gives me similar vibes, but i think that's normal its probably using the same engine or a modified one.
 
C

Coda

Member
Jonneh3003 said:
+1
I hated MGSV's open world, it pretty much ruined the game. I had to force myself to slowly play it for over a year just because I've played all the other games in the series. It can be a fun game at times but the open world is just so utterly boring.
Click to expand...

MGSV's open world is why I stopped playing the game after 15 hours or so. The game was just so drab and boring.
 
R

Rodin

Member
Comrade Crunch said:
How did you get this from my reply? I said it looks awesome.

Just because I'm not acting like it's the best thing since sliced bread doesn't mean I'm not looking forward to mucking about with the systems, familiar as they may be.
Click to expand...

I didn't get that from your reply, i got it from tons of replies in tons of threads from people who are actively downplaying Zelda's gameplay mechanics because reasons.

Jonneh3003 said:
+1
I hated MGSV's open world, it pretty much ruined the game. I had to force myself to slowly play it for over a year just because I've played all the other games in the series. It can be a fun game at times but the open world is just so utterly boring.
Click to expand...

I kind of agree with this. Most of those fantastic stealth gameplay mechanics would've worked much better in smaller/closed environments like in MGS3.
 
D

Dremorak

Banned
After watching that video from Kinda Funny I wonder if any other games have had melee combat where the enemies are actually balanced and you can knock them off balance if you hit them in the right way. Its not just ragdoll, its actually the enemies trying to stabilize themselves. I THINK Force Unleashed might have tried some of this stuff but I dont think it has looked this natural before. I just assumed it was an animation with maybe a bit of code driven directional knockback, but this is fully physics driven. I really hope Digital Foundry does a breakdown of this at some point, as an animator this stuff is really cool.
 
R

RadarScope1

Member
I gotta admit, I hadn't seen many of these videos and this game looks way cooler than I thought (and I did think it looked pretty cool).

Have we seen anything indicating they've scaled back on dungeons either in number or design? If this has dungeons anywhere near TP or OoT and this combat? Wow.
 
K

KooopaKid

Banned
Pif said:
Yes I did. Huge fan. But apart of pulling/hanging things with the ropes, I felt most of my time was spent blowing red shit up. The game was fun, but I felt the devs didn't take full advantage of the mechanics they built. I got really adicted at flying around though, I wish Zelda had a propulsion system while flying.
Click to expand...

Towards the end of the game, Link could acquire a Sheikah jetpack.
 
SinCityAssassin

SinCityAssassin

Member
RadarScope1 said:
I gotta admit, I hadn't seen many of these videos and this game looks way cooler than I thought (and I did think it looked pretty cool).

Have we seen anything indicating they've scaled back on dungeons either in number or design? If this has dungeons anywhere near TP or OoT and this combat? Wow.
Click to expand...

They've shown almost none of the dungeons, probably to keep the surprise.

From the current terminology, we're gonna assume shrines take on the same puzzle-y or platform-y designs of dungeons on a smaller level, but we have confirmed that more traditional dungeons exist (large, labyrinthian, boss at the end). Right now we're just thinking those gigantic guardians (four of them) roaming around the land will act as living main dungeons.

That part's not confirmed of course.
 
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