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[Breakage]

Anyone know what the most recent Switch world wide sales figure is?

 

[DarkConfidant]

I guess this means Sony loses the console warz.

Spoiler

On a serious note, I never thought Sony's stock was worth much anyway. They're mostly a shit company aside from PlayStation, these days. Should have the dumped the rest of the company by now. They'd look more exciting to investors as the PlayStation company instead of the company who used to rule consumer electronics.

Glad Nintendo is getting some extra cash now.

 

[InsaneTiger]

Wow, so many dumb takes on this news. Stick to videogames GAF.

 

[Torokil]

Nintendo should buy Sony, who is doomed.

 

[tenderbrew]

If Sony is going to have a record year and you guys know about it that means its already reflected in Sony share price. Only way a great year would boost Sony is if it beat those expected figures.

 

[UpUpDownDown]

This, even my very very basic understanding of this has me face palming myself reading some of these posts.

Another classic gaf thread.

Would be interesting to know, I always see posts talking about Nintendo stock and want in lol

Rolls eyes.

 

[timberger]

Cringed pretty hard trying to read this thread.

At least there are a few posters in here that understand the market. Wish people actually read their posts though

Can't stop to read when there's wars to be fought, mate!

 

[Vital Tundra]

I expected them to be back above them. And I expect them to stay there as more mobile games come out, as well as their stuff like theme park, movies and possible TV shows and what not begin to come. Nintendos IP are strong, and they haven't leveraged them properly in the last 3 decades when they got scared after shit like Mario Bros movie and CDi stuff.

I can see it blowing up when these long term stuff finally comes to fruition.

 

[Kouriozan]

Iwata did good.

 

[richman555]

I look forward to playing Gran Turismo on the Switch.

 

[spekkeh]

This is honestly not that impressive. Nintendo stock was always going to jump back to their core value of 70 Billion. Investors are starving for options in the stock market and overvalueing Nintendo as a result. By the time FF7 Remake gets out the market cap of Sony will blow Nintendo away. Clearly we need to look at revenue to get a view on a company their financial health. With a dying 3DS and floundering Switch sales with no third party support,, there is noway Nintendo can keep this up

 

[Usobuko]

That Sony drop since 2000....yeesh lol

The most damning of this isn't just the big drop from 100b+ valuation in the 2000.

It's the account of inflation in 15+ years and the emergence of global titans ( the Amazon, Facebook, Google etc ) that successfully benefited from growth of developing countries whereas Sony went the other direction.

Tldr the drop is bigger than it seems.

 

[Caronte]

People going full console warrior in this thread, I see.

After losing money for so many years I guess it'll take time for investors to regain confidence in the company. Sony also needs to get their shit together on their movies division.

 

[spekkeh]

Another classic gaf thread.



Rolls eyes.

It's been pretty consistently in the best performing ten stocks per day for the past weeks. Sure you should get in when it's lower, but it's still a really safe stock. As long as firms keep employing Pachter, even an average GAFfer has a chance.

 

[Spukc]

People going full console warrior in this thread, I see.

After losing money for so many years I guess it'll take time for investors to regain confidence in the company. Sony also needs to get their shit together on their movies division.

First legit post in this thread

 

[Vanille]

Gaf discussing the stock market. What could possibly go wrong.

 

[scamander]

I get what you mean but they do not "make more" though, market cap is something else, I believe it's the perceived value of the company's shares.

In terms of operating income for example, last fiscal year was 288,7 billion yen for Sony Corp (135,6 billion yen for PlayStation) and 29,3 billion yen for Nintendo.

Nintendo still did make more money in the end. Yes, their operating income is way lower, but their net profit is actually higher and that's what's important:

Sony 2016/2017 ~73,3 billion Yen
Nintendo 2016/2017 ~102,6 billion Yen

 

[haveheart]

This is honestly not that impressive. Nintendo stock was always going to jump back to their core value of 70 Billion. Investors are starving for options in the stock market and overvalueing Nintendo as a result. By the time FF7 Remake gets out the market cap of Sony will blow Nintendo away. Clearly we need to look at revenue to get a view on a company their financial health. With a dying 3DS and floundering Switch sales with no third party support,, there is noway Nintendo can keep this up

Where do you get this from? Prognoses say something else...

 

[trixx]

I know Sony's game division is doing really well but man what the hell. That xperia phone and TV division needs some changes because imo they're still charging very high for their products and it doesn't even compare too favourably to the competition. Also give more consumers more options to buy the product

C'mon guys if it's budget let it be nice and the price be nice, if it's high end go all out. But I guess many companies aren't making too much off phones now days save for the big ones and is more interested in selling services.

All of my tvs used to be Sony but the quality and service was crappy so jumped to Samsung for 4k display

 

[Night Hunter]

Nothing they're doing is working except gaming wise and if they fuck that up too then they're gone.

You do know that their Financial Services division has carried the company for years?

I swear some people here still living in the 2007-2012 era..... For example regarding Sony TV division

Sony Corp.'s resurgence in the premium TV market is starting to threaten the lead enjoyed by South Korea's Samsung Electronics Co. and LG Electronics Inc., industry data showed Sunday.

Man that's good to read. They make great TVs and this year looks great, Line-Up wise. They're gonna cut out a nice chunk of the higher mid price segment with the X900, it looks far better than the already good X800. And while they are probably gonna have a hard time catching up with LG and especially Samsung in the low to mid range, they're gonna make a nice chunk of change, considering that the high class segment has pretty nice profit margins.

 

[Apathy]

Wow, so many dumb takes on this news. Stick to videogames GAF.

Even that isn't a 100% rule. Any time business or the stock market comes up we get just the worst post imaginable. And it's not even people that don't know anything about the topic but people that think they know something about it acting like experts. Still good for a laugh but predictable every time.

 

[darkwing]

Nintendo should buy Sony, who is doomed.

technically Nintendo has just more money than Sony, so technically they can buy them I guess

 

[Trup1aya]

This is honestly not that impressive. Nintendo stock was always going to jump back to their core value of 70 Billion. Investors are starving for options in the stock market and overvalueing Nintendo as a result. By the time FF7 Remake gets out the market cap of Sony will blow Nintendo away. Clearly we need to look at revenue to get a view on a company their financial health. With a dying 3DS and floundering Switch sales with no third party support,, there is noway Nintendo can keep this up

The problem I have with these threads is I can never tell who's serious and who's trolling.

 

[Tumle]

They're still making TV's that nobody buys IIRC, and it's quite frankly remarkable that they can still be the tip of the spear in the likes of console VR when they're struggling so badly

How is Sony struggling? I thought they where turning things around? Did they go in the red again?

 

[Q8D3vil]

Sony need to shed of a lot of fat. Gaming division is doing fantastic, but most of the other ones are doing bad.
I wonder how the new spiderman movie will impact them.

 

[gtj1092]

Nintendo still did make more money in the end. Yes, their operating income is way lower, but their net profit is actually higher and that's what's important:

Sony 2016/2017 ~73,3 billion Yen
Nintendo 2016/2017 ~102,6 billion Yen

Operating income is how businesses health is judged.

Also how does Nintendo doing better stock translate to Sony doing bad?

 

[test_account]

technically Nintendo has just more money than Sony, so technically they can buy them I guess

If we go by the market cap numbers only, it would require Nintendo to sell everything and then give that money to Sony (to buy them). Would basically be trading money.

 

[darkwing]

If we go by the market cap numbers only, it would require Nintendo to sell everything and then give that money to Sony (to buy them). Would basically be trading money.

that is why I said technically, in reality though lols

basically technically, MS can buy both Sony and Nintendo lol

 

[Spukc]

technically Nintendo has just more money than Sony, so technically they can buy them I guess

Well i think they should sony is almost going under
So i have heard 🤔

#SAVESONY

 

[Y2Kev]

This is only one metric of valuation. Why do we only look at the value of equity in the two companies? Why not enterprise value?

 

[Y2Kev]

Market cap is how much a company is worth to investors. Having a high market cap indicates that investors believe the company is on a growth trajectory. This is how a company with relatively low revenues can end up with a higher market cap. Investors see a bright future for Nintendo.

The simplicity of Nintendos business is currently a strength for them. Their IP has proven to be incredibly strong, and their hardware is in high demand. The Switch shortage is temporary, and the SNES mini will be a massive hit and priced to reflect its high demand. It's hard not to see Why investors are confident in Nintendo.

A Sony investment is less promising. Sure they've sold a lot of consoles, but margins are shrinking and their operating costs are higher. Not to mention segments of their business is struggling.

This is just completely inaccurate. Market cap is not correlated with growth at all. You may be thinking of p/e, peg, fv/ebitda, or like fifty other things, but you have it precisely backwards. Market caps are typically higher for lower growth companies because they are larger and their capitalizations are different. Which company has a larger market cap: Walmart or Snap? Who is growing faster?

This thread. Yikes.

 

[OrbitalBeard]

Uhm I wonder how many of the ones bothering with a reply have a clear idea of what the market cap, volume and revenue are....
The stock is solid, but to say that Nintendo is worth as much as sony.....

True.

As of right now, Nintendo is worth more.

Spoiler

PlayStation is obviously much healthier right now.

 

[Deleted member 231381]

This is only one metric of valuation. Why do we only look at the value of equity in the two companies? Why not enterprise value?

Wouldn't this be even more Nintendo's favour? Their warchest is staggering.

 

[scamander]

Operating income is how businesses health is judged.

Also how does Nintendo doing better stock translate to Sony doing bad?

I didn't say Sony is doing bad. And a business with an amazing operating income can still be in the reds at the end of day.

 

[tenderbrew]

This is just completely inaccurate. Market cap is not correlated with growth at all. You may be thinking of p/e, peg, fv/ebitda, or like fifty other things, but you have it precisely backwards. Market caps are typically higher for lower growth companies because they are larger and their capitalizations are different. Which company has a larger market cap: Walmart or Snap? Who is growing faster?

This thread. Yikes.

We all credit analysts on GAF.

 

[Trup1aya]

This is only one metric of valuation. Why do we only look at the value of equity in the two companies? Why not enterprise value?

Can't really see current equity w/o annual reports- but since that changes slowly, we can gleen that confidence in Nintendo is likely on the rise at a rate faster than sony's atm.

 

[Fallout-NL]

https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/originals/c9/1f/09/c91f094f47850650ed6d81c7170e0b99.jpg

why the fuck would you use a picture of that guy?

 

[Trup1aya]

This is just completely inaccurate. Market cap is not correlated with growth at all. You may be thinking of p/e, peg, fv/ebitda, or like fifty other things, but you have it precisely backwards. Market caps are typically higher for lower growth companies because they are larger and their capitalizations are different. Which company has a larger market cap: Walmart or Snap? Who is growing faster?

This thread. Yikes.

The rise in market cap is a reflection of investors expectation of future growth. They are investing because they expect to see ROI on their investment. It's pretty simple and inarguable.

No marketcap doesn't equal growth. But a rising market cap means investors are expecting growth.

It doesn't make sense to simple compare two market caps at face value. But you can compare the deltas and note the rising confidence.

 

[Y2Kev]

Wouldn't this be even more Nintendo's favour? Their warchest is staggering.

Net cash is subtracted from equity value to get to enterprise value. But no, their cash stockpile is a fraction of their equity value even if you didn't know how to calculate numbers and were just posting on a message board to irritate bankers.

The rise is stock price is a reflection of investors expectation of future growth. They are investing because they expect to see ROI on their investment. It's pretty simple and inarguable.

No marketcap doesn't equal growth. But a rising market cap means investors are expecting growth.

I mean you can't say this. There are multiple means of growing total shareholder returns without revenue growth. Earnings growth can be manufactured; capital can be returned to shareholders.

 

[R00bot]

This is honestly not that impressive. Nintendo stock was always going to jump back to their core value of 70 Billion. Investors are starving for options in the stock market and overvalueing Nintendo as a result. By the time FF7 Remake gets out the market cap of Sony will blow Nintendo away. Clearly we need to look at revenue to get a view on a company their financial health. With a dying 3DS and floundering Switch sales with no third party support,, there is noway Nintendo can keep this up

ayyyylmao

 

[EmSeta]

Should've invested last year 😭

 

[Trup1aya]

Net cash is subtracted from equity value to get to enterprise value. But no, their cash stockpile is a fraction of their equity value even if you didn't know how to calculate numbers and were just posting on a message board to irritate bankers.



I mean you can't say this. There are multiple means of growing total shareholder returns without revenue growth. Earnings growth can be manufactured; capital can be returned to shareholders.

You ABSOLUTELY can say this. Obviously it's simplified and lacking what would take semesters of nuance, but we aren't having an economy lecture. A gaming forum isn't a a good place for that. It's a very basic overview of market cap fluctuations and comparisons.

Edit:

Market capitalization is the most simplified way to calculate a company's size, value and, consequently, its growth and risk outlook

Read more: What's the difference between enterprise value and market capitalization? | Investopedia http://www.investopedia.com/ask/ans...e-and-market-capitalization.asp#ixzz4kpXnUpcU

I'm not sure why you want to turn this thread into Business 501 when it's a 101 level article. Obviously there is a lot more nuance... but we are in a thread where people see this and think Sony is doomed. Baby steps.

 

[jowell24]

So many misinterpretations of financial data and structure of Nintendo and Sony.

Think before you type GAF. This isn't simply Nintendo > Sony

 

[jroc74]

^lol, you know how it is...all's fair in consoles wars.

can Nintendo buy Sony now?

The Age of Sony is Done.

Stock market loves video game companies. Just completely sky high valuations.

I guess Sony should stop doing so much. So little reward for so much effort.

Ehh, I kind of like companies that have their hands in alot of different markets. Like Samsung.

And honestly I dont think its so much a bad look for Sony but a better look for Nintendo.

 

[hanspampel]

The 3DS and PS4 are in no way comparable. One is significantly more lucrative than the other, and if that isn't the case that's a big problem

that's why Nintendo released the Switch "a handheld" as lucrative as a home console
big reason, why Nintendo is valued so high right now

more expensive games and accessories, dlc and payed online
economy of scale and cheaper development due to just one platform
still the potential for a 100m installbase (combining home console and handheld market)

Switch is just the perfect thing to do for Nintendo

 

[Deleted member 231381]

Net cash is subtracted from equity value to get to enterprise value.

D'oh! Quite right, I wasn't thinking.

 

[sixteen-bit]

the Metroid effect

investors are excited about Prime 4

lol

 

[OrbitalBeard]

that's why Nintendo released the Switch "a handheld" as lucrative as a home console
big reason, why Nintendo is valued so high right now

more expensive games and accessories, dlc and payed online
economy of scale and cheaper development due to just one platform
still the potential for a 100m installbase (combining home console and handheld market)

Switch is just the perfect thing to do for Nintendo

Yeah, pretty much. Switch is the smartest decision Nintendo has made in decades. It's a far better long-term strategy than Wii and DS.

 

[CharminUltra]

Hey GAF, let's buy Sony while they're weak. I can help with $10.

 

[Kilau]

It's interesting, I know they have gone back and forth on this market cap stuff a few times. I don't really know what it means so I just hope both companies are doing well enough to keep doing their thing.