MrTroubleMaker
Member
Poor girl 
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Twitch temporarily bans white streamer after Apex Legends cosplay
- Thread starter Shin
- Start date
DeafTourette
Perpetually Offended
Except lots of black cosplayers don't paint their skin white or "yellow" .... You know who they're cosplaying as without them having to paint their faces or bodies ...
The only time you should paint your skin is when you're cosplaying a fictional alien like the Avatar aliens ...
DeafTourette
Perpetually Offended
WOW! Didn't realize this was 6 pages long!
lukilladog
Member
Wearing fake blonde hair is no different to wearing black makeup, you debunked yourself.
DeafTourette
Perpetually Offended
Umm... Nope. Try again.
Painting your face black is totally different than wearing a wig. One has historical and racial connotations (face paint), the other does not (blond wig).
Xaero Gravity
NEXT LEVEL lame™
Holy shit, are you the real Heisenberg? :O
lukilladog
Member
Blonde hair has racial and historic connotations too, indians came up with all sort of names and attitutes to people with blonde hair, you know that boxer called "Canelo"?. That´s how mexicans name horses of that color, and his parents started calling him like that, but it´s ok, nobody gets artificially offended, it´s not meant to be offensive, that´s what humans do.
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Hero of Spielberg
Member
Except lots of black cosplayers don't paint their skin white or "yellow" .... You know who they're cosplaying as without them having to paint their faces or bodies ...
The only time you should paint your skin is when you're cosplaying a fictional alien like the Avatar aliens ...
The lady doing the Harley Quinn cosplay has definitely used make-up to lighten her face there.
Sqorin Hammerfarf
Banned
That's silly. Black people can't be He-Man. That's racially insensitive. They can only be Clamp Champ. (Maybe Hordak).
Stay within your racial boundaries! Stop appropriating my culture!
Stay within your racial boundaries! Stop appropriating my culture!
Da-Kid
Member
She's light skinned aka yellowbone..........
Hero of Spielberg
Member
She is light skinned, but she's also used make-up to lighten her face. Probably to accentuate the red and black eyeshadow.
Da-Kid
Member
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Red Crayon Aristocrat
Member
It's never going to be not weird for a white person to put black make up on their face, it's impossible to separate it from the history of blackface, that's not entirely fair no, but blame the olden days for forever ruining the idea.
Just dress up like the character, don't put on blackface.
This isn't just the typical SJW outrage, this would make anyone uncomfortable.
Just dress up like the character, don't put on blackface.
This isn't just the typical SJW outrage, this would make anyone uncomfortable.
Da-Kid
Member
That's just the lighting that's making it appear lighter. Jesus...
DeafTourette
Perpetually Offended
And Harley Quinn uses white make-up...
Sqorin Hammerfarf
Banned
I have to ask... do you even know the history of blackface? Or are you saying this based on the presumption of history of blackface?
Because the history of blackface is actually extremely interesting. It's WAY more complicated that most people give it credit, and honestly, it's a fairly important part of Western culture from roughly 1880s-1930s. I mean the first motion picture with sound was the Jazz Singer, for god's sake. That's a landmark in the history of motion pictures!
Blackface was bad, but it was also sometimes good, and often enough, it was associated with something important. We can't be afraid of blackface. We can't be uncomfortable discussing it, and the first and most important way we learn to talk about it is by not vilifying the people who do. Part of celebrating history and culture is not being so god damned terrified of it.
But can you really say that you are dressing up like the character if you are missing one of the most important visual elements?
Does it make me a racist if I say it doesn't make me uncomfortable?
Hero of Spielberg
Member
Go look at her Insta. Her skin tone is darker than that. It doesn't matter. I'm just saying in that particular case she used make-up to lighten her skin tone.
Hero of Spielberg
Member
I'm sure she does, I was just responding to your post where you said ...
"Except lots of black cosplayers don't paint their skin white or "yellow" .... You know who they're cosplaying as without them having to paint their faces or bodies ... "
Then used that post as an example, where she seems to have used make-up to lighten her skin tone on her face. There's nothing wrong with her doing that obviously, it just that particular example doesn;t fit your argument.
DynamiteCop!
Banned
Who cares what some people do? That's not an argument.Except lots of black cosplayers don't paint their skin white or "yellow" .... You know who they're cosplaying as without them having to paint their faces or bodies ...
The only time you should paint your skin is when you're cosplaying a fictional alien like the Avatar aliens ...
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DeafTourette
Perpetually Offended
Ok, I see where you're coming from.
lukilladog
Member
There are black people with naturally blonde hair, and blue eyes.
Of course, at this point we know they are mutations (in europeans too) and nobody should lose their sleep over them (mutations). If I was given the choice I would pick useful ones, like those natives from some Indonesian island that can see perfectly under water lol.
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DynamiteCop!
Banned
What about the actual Joker for a black person, they'd have to make their face white for it to work... That's the stupidity in all of this, it's psychotic virtue signaling.
How could anyone be so depraved and twisted that they could look at something like this and get bent out of shape? Please go outside and experience real life, the internet think tank is melting your brain.
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People will also know what you're cosplaying as if you don't invest dozens of hours into hand crafting costumes, accessories, styling and makeup.
In fact, they'll know just fine who you're cosplaying as if you just glue a post-it with the name of the character to your forehead.
.. But that's not really what most cosplayers will be striving for, isn't it?
ethomaz
Banned
It is not.
You think it is because the racism is already fixed in your mind when it should not be and being fair there is no reason to.
These arguments are pretty lame.
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DynamiteCop!
Banned
DynamiteCop!
Banned
Sooooo I guess I won't cosplay a Na'Vi from Avatar ? Since you know, my skin isn't blue
Too bad, you are missing something awesome
Dontero
Banned
And who are you to say it is allowed ?
In US. Rest of the world doesn't care and watch US like some zoo with retarded people.
Anyone who isn't in US understand that changing your skin color is to represent character they are playing not to degrade people.
Here is polish movie about faraoh. Do you think poles making that great movie changed their skin color because they wanted to degrade people or just accuratly as possible represent subject ?
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Dice
Pokémon Parentage Conspiracy Theorist
Expecting some sensitivity on this issue makes sense for Americans, but does Lithuania have such a history with blackface to be expecting such cultural literacy from her? If a person is legitimately ignorant because their culture never used blackface in those ways and isn't exactly old enough that you could expect them to be deeply informed on the longer history of every country in the world, then you should look to their present intention.
Outrunner
Member
That argument only seems to be valid if it's about killing fetuses.
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Da-Kid
Member
You guys are doing so gymnastics to try to make your point. Joker isn't whiteface. Depends on the origin, Joker uses make up to look that of a clown. His skin isn't naturally that white. Cosplaying as a clown has a traditional look to it.What about the actual Joker for a black person, they'd have to make their face white for it to work... That's the stupidity in all of this, it's psychotic virtue signaling.
How could anyone be so depraved and twisted that they could look at something like this and get bent out of shape? Please go outside and experience real life, the internet think tank is melting your brain.
wordslaughter
Banned
Many people have become over sensitive over the past 5-10 years. And I can't help be think that it was probably 100% young white liberals who were "outraged" by this Lithuanian woman (who isn't racist in the slightest) and probably not a single black person noticed or cares.
What is the difference between cultural appropriation and simply enjoying a different culture? Why has this become a negative?
I feel I'm becoming numb to outrage. Probably for the best.
What is the difference between cultural appropriation and simply enjoying a different culture? Why has this become a negative?
I feel I'm becoming numb to outrage. Probably for the best.
Tehvenom
Member
Throwing a common brain emoticon for you. Well said, this was a portrayal of the character in a celebratory type of way.
EDMIX
Member
Except lots of black cosplayers don't paint their skin white or "yellow" .... You know who they're cosplaying as without them having to paint their faces or bodies ...
The only time you should paint your skin is when you're cosplaying a fictional alien like the Avatar aliens ...
Agreed. Reading about it, It makes sense and I don't really feel sorry for them. When I see POC or really MOST cosplay, they simply dress up or do the hair like the character etc, not LITERALLY putting paint on or anything weird like that. Unless its a fantasy and the person is some weird color, shouldn't be a issue.
I mean....for many of those characters, them being white or black isn't even the main thing or main focus of the character to ever do that. It would be like me saying I'm cosplaying as Mr.Rogers (starts putting paint on) lol I'd just put on dat sweater and them sweet, sweet loafers lol Its like, we get the character, no need to alter your sex or race or anything like that to get the point across.
I've seen some really cool cosplay with females dressing as male characters and they add their own twist, not putting on fake beards and painting themselves and putting on dildos to pretend they are a guy etc as that is basically saying the main concept of ht e character is more their sex or race then it is anything else. I don't know that much characters that fall under that concept lol
EDMIX
Member
What about the actual Joker for a black person, they'd have to make their face white for it to work... That's the stupidity in all of this, it's psychotic virtue signaling.
How could anyone be so depraved and twisted that they could look at something like this and get bent out of shape? Please go outside and experience real life, the internet think tank is melting your brain.
huh? "What about the actual Joker for a black person, they'd have to make their face white for it to work." No, no and no.
Joker has MAKE UP ON!
https://www.pinterest.co.uk/pin/459719074453397763/
So what the person is making white is the paint for being a clown, not making their face WHITE as in white person.....
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EDMIX
Member
I certainly see both sides.
Why is it even necessary to change skin color to reflect a character when dressing up in their garb or acting like them in some way should fully suffice? If it offends individuals who historically have been persecuted based on their skin color specifically, shouldn't we respect them as best as we possibly can? If individuals of a specific race or ethnic background speak out against such an act, shouldn't that be enough?
Then there is the argument of authenticity. While we change our lip, eyebrow, eye, or any other color why must we leave our skin untouched? Why is the subject so sensitive that we can't celebrate others of another race as authentically as possible through cosplay?
Then there is the argument of equality. In recent examples, actors/comedians have changed their skin color to represent the other race in a "humorous" way to much praise by the public majority. These chows/movies are still aired and celebrated on television to this day... Where do we draw the line? Must you be a paid actor to partake in this action? Does that make it okay? Should these shows be removed from our stations and be ridiculed with a new mindset? It's tough to know exactly where we as a society should draw the line. Because ultimately, this is NOT a CosPlay problem. This is a people problem, and the thoughts and feelings of all those involved.
Very thoughtful post and well said. Completely agreed.
As a black male, I have no issue with the examples give. They are satire, the point is poke fun at the situation with a fake character, not to simply make fun of a whole race or something. Its why I never had a issue with his part in Tropical Thunder, I thought it was very well done and very funny. I never felt like the writer was trying to make fun of ALL BLACK people or anything like that.
"Why is it even necessary to change skin color to reflect a character when dressing up in their garb or acting like them in some way should fully suffice?"
This.
I'd argue, in terms of cosplay, the 2 examples if someone cosplayed them down to the skin color, I'd have no issue with it. The character in those examples is someone dressed up like someone else lol Its all in context of how its used I guess.
I think her cosplay is ok too, simply that I saw no reason to darken the skin as it just makes very little sense. I don't buy that the character she dressed up as is legit JUST about that skin color and nothing else.
Necessary? Fully suffice?
What on Earth are you on about?
It's cosplay. It's visual emulation, the higher the fidelity the better, but, ultimately it's up to the cosplayer to determine where the line is drawn.
It's not up to you to decide, unless, of course, you're ready to provide a compelling objective reason why others should conform to your vision of what would "fully suffice".
No, sir. We shouldn't.
If their precious fragile sensibilities are offended by faux skin colour in cosplay, then, evidently, it's their precious fragile sensibilities that need urgent adjustment. The world owes them nothing. Nothing is owed to them just because they are who they are. They are not to be handed a sanitized version of life at the expense of the freedom of others.
No, sir.
No can do.
Pathetic claim.
The idea that a few individuals would be thought to speak for millions is preposterous and tainted with racial bias. You wouldn't even dream of arguing that a few white people would adequately act as spokespersons for the whole of white people, would you? Obviously, there's no single topic about which all white people share one common opinion. So why would you even contemplate the notion all black people hold a consensual opinion on anything? Why is it that you seem to think of black people as one homogenous monolithic group of forty million?
How ironic, isn't it?
This is the fraudulent notion of representation crawling from fiction back to real life.
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Except no matter how many cosplayers from group X hold the personal opinion that's how cosplay should be handled, that in and of itself has no bearing on the personal opinions of other cosplayers on how cosplay should be handled.
Unless you're claiming indeed that's how cosplay ought to be handled. In that case, let's hear you rational reasons.
Still waiting for you to show that's how cosplay ought to be handled. At long last, are you ready to provide compelling objective reasons?
Says you.
Why on Earth should anyone care about your personal opinions on the matter and live according to them, given how you seemingly cannot provide anything approaching a rational case?
Just like authoritarians in the past, contemporary authoritarians seem to think they can dictate from the confines of their keyboards how others should live their lives, and to such minute details, including how they should cosplay.
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DynamiteCop!
Banned
Yeah? And do you think this logic would fly in reverse if the Joker makeup were a darker color and were worn on a white person? That's just an example of how dumb all this is and how easily these dumb things can be misconstrued and leveraged.huh? "What about the actual Joker for a black person, they'd have to make their face white for it to work." No, no and no.
Joker has MAKE UP ON!
https://www.pinterest.co.uk/pin/459719074453397763/
So what the person is making white is the paint for being a clown, not making their face WHITE as in white person.....
Mochilador
Member
Holy fuuuuck.
GreenAlien
Member
Are you saying that context matters? What a revolutionary concept.
EDMIX
Member
? Huh? I don't think anyone would care.....Joker having black paint on instead of white wouldn't make that much of a difference as he is still called THE JOKER ie A CLOWN. The darker paint would just show he is a evil clown. The issue is more so what its being used for vs it being on their face. If he was pretending to be an African American and speak ebonics then many would see an issue. I'm sorry but we need context. I mean....I'm black and I'm telling you such a thing wouldn't bother me.... As its clear if he had black paint, that it would simply mean he was a evil clown or something. I won't just JUMP on this "OH DAS RACIST" or anything remotely like that.
Context my friend.
EDMIX
Member
lol Thank you, this guy gets it.
it honestly amazes me, you have a young lady from Latvia who cosplays a character she looks up to, who happens to be black female, this is totally the opposite of being racist.
She probably doesn't even know what or who blackface is, I for example are older than her and never heard of blackface until recently, this in a western country.
She probably doesn't even know what or who blackface is, I for example are older than her and never heard of blackface until recently, this in a western country.
Terce
Member
I'm not woke lol, I disagree complete with the general media reaction on this. Just trying to explain to some of the NEETs here why this was taken offensively, something that they cannot seemingly comprehend.