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[Aaron]

Of course.

Mortar shells launched from the UNRWA School in Beit Hanoun

Don't show a video from 2007. It's not helping.

 

[Whitechocolatekrispies]

They were a bit late in retaliating then considering that footage is from 7 years ago.

Don't show a video from 2007. It's not helping.

Interesting ... care to explain what this means?

We also know the school has been used in the past by Hamas to fire mortors,

He wanted proof. I gave it.

 

[speculawyer]

At this point both sides are little children who can't be trusted. I can't believe this even has to happen over and over and over again.

 

[funkypie]

if only we handled the IRA in a similar fashion. we should've boxed the entire population into an occupied cork, eroded away at their basic civil rights and flattened a few schools every time a tube bomb went off, then we'd have had america on our side.

at the very least, we'd never have to have suffered richard gere's irish accent.

the ira got a lot of american support because of plastic paddies in the US government.

isreal gets far more US support because a lot of jews in government, lobby groups and other influential positions such as the FED and most of all AIPAC which will ruin your life if you're not pro isreali.

can't say this though because it is anti-semitic

 

[Gemüsepizza]

Of course.

Mortar shells launched from the UNRWA School in Beit Hanoun

Also if you are skeptical of the UN buildings frequently holding Hamas rockets.

They admit it happens.

Uploaded on 22.02.2010

The video is old. And the rockets were found in a VACANT school.

 

[TheContact]

Of course.

Mortar shells launched from the UNRWA School in Beit Hanoun

Also if you are skeptical of the UN buildings frequently holding Hamas rockets.

They admit it happens.

Even if Hamas was shooting rockets out of the school you don't shoot the building, you send in ground troops and clear the building. That's assuming Israel still did it because the UN website doesn't say who did it yet

 

[Maninthemirror]

 

[Air Zombie Meat]

Interesting ... care to explain what this means?

It means it was used in the past, 7 years ago to be precise. How is that a justification for attacking it today?

 

[Aaron]

Interesting ... care to explain what this means?

You really want to go all the way defense force with duplicitous questions too? Going to present an opinion piece as fact for the triple next?

 

[Whitechocolatekrispies]

It means it was used in the past, 7 years ago to be precise. How is that a justification for attacking it today?

I stated the building has been used by Hamas militants in the past. I showed proof.

I also showed proof of Hamas militants using UN buildings to store rockets.

There is no definite proof of either side been responsible. But either side could be. Not just Israel.

 

[Dai101]

Interesting ... care to explain what this means?

That the idf mouthpiece manual needs to be updated?

 

[Maninthemirror]

When discussing Airport closures:

Israel is perfectly safe for all tourists, there is no threat to them


When discussing the conflict:

Israel is under constant threat from Hamas Rockets and lives have been lost to their barrage of rocket fire.

 

[werks]

LOL. You got me. I thought you were actually making a serious argument that the bombing was justified because Hamas used the shelter to mortar Israel.

 

[Kinitari]

Interesting ... care to explain what this means?



He wanted proof. I gave it.

Do you think it's justifiable to use intel from conflicts nearly a decade old to bomb locations that have civilians? How does that make sense to you? What's the statute of limitations on this?

edit: I want to add... I am not trying to win an argument here, because that's what I find a lot of these discussions turn into, and what ends up happening is that completely irrelevant side discussions bloom just to move away from the core points.

Do you think that IF it was the IDF that shot a tank shell at the building, that it is at all justifiable because 7 years ago this same building held munitions, even though there is absolutely no evidence that it was holding munitions, that the IDF was fully aware that members of the UN were using it as a shelter, and no known hamas actions were happening in the building?

 

[RiZ III]

I stated the building has been used by Hamas militants in the past. I showed proof.

I also showed proof of Hamas militants using UN buildings to store rockets.

There is no definite proof of either side been responsible. But either side could be. Not just Israel.

I'm not sure what's being debated here. It's already been confirmed that it was IDF tank shells.

 

[DECK'ARD]

I stated the building has been used by Hamas militants in the past. I showed proof.

I also showed proof of Hamas militants using UN buildings to store rockets.

There is no definite proof of either side been responsible. But either side could be. Not just Israel.

No, he asked you proof of it being in active use.

Rockets have been found in VACANT buildings, and one of the reports wasn't even true.

This shelter was in active use, do you honestly think the UN was sat there watching as a Hamas militant fired off a rocket? Ridiculous. What are you even arguing?

Also all the reports have said tank shells, do Hamas have tanks?

 

[Maninthemirror]

Brazil recalls Ambassador to Israel over Gaza conflict. Israel responds by calling Brazil an 'Irrelevant diplomatic partner'

“The moral relativism behind this move makes Brazil an irrelevant diplomatic partner, one who creates problems rather than contributes to solutions.”

http://www.jpost.com/Operation-Prot...tions-in-protest-of-IDF-Gaza-operation-368715

 

[TheRealTalker]

Brazil recalls Ambassador to Israel over Gaza conflict. Israel responds by calling Brazil an 'Irrelevant diplomatic partner'



http://www.jpost.com/Operation-Prot...tions-in-protest-of-IDF-Gaza-operation-368715

one of the top growing economies is irrelevant?

 

[RiZ III]

Shrapnel being taken out of little girls arm. Courtesy of IDF. A kid there lost his entire family. Mother, step mother, 2 sisters, and a brother.

 

[kess]

Syria lost 1,700 people in one week, Jordan is the middle of a refugee crisis, Iraq is literally fracturing and Egyptian government is purging the state. Everybody is fucked.

 

[Maninthemirror]

Update:

788 Deaths in Gaza
5000 Wounded
32 Israeli Deaths

 

[werks]

I'm not sure what's being debated here. It's already been confirmed that it was IDF tank shells.

No, only the IDF can confirm that. For you reference, the default assumption for all civilian deaths in Gaza are either:

a. Human shields
b. Killed by Hamas

In the extreme case that there is undeniable proof the the IDF killed civilian:

a. They are or were probably going to be terrorists
b. Hamas did it

Any Israeli deaths are automatically:

a. The fault of blood thirsty Palestinian terrorists. Absolute vengeance on everyone including family members required.

 

[nib95]

Brazil recalls Ambassador to Israel over Gaza conflict. Israel responds by calling Brazil an 'Irrelevant diplomatic partner'

http://www.jpost.com/Operation-Prot...tions-in-protest-of-IDF-Gaza-operation-368715

Keep building those bridges Israel. Damn I hope more and more countries join in on sanctions and the like towards Israel. I really want the EU to put sanctions or an outright ban on stocking or trading in goods derived from the illegal settlements.

 

[AstroNut325]

Syria lost 1,700 people in one week, Jordan is the middle of a refugee crisis, Iraq is literally fracturing and Egyptian government is purging the state. Everybody is fucked.

I was thinking this earlier. That whole region is in turmoil. I don't foresee anything good happening for a while.

 

[DrSlek]

It's important to note that there is probably a cultural influence on Jewish wealth, as well. While I can't speak to the remaining European Jews in particular, Jews worldwide are significantly weather statistically, on average.

(Note: this isn't suggesting that there is a Jewish conspiracy, just that something in the Jewish culture clearly promotes hard work. It's simply an observation).

I believe that historically in Europe Jews often worked in the banking industry or as merchants. I believe that this is because in the rennaisance and mediaeval era Jews were often forbidden from owning land in many kingdoms.

That may have some influence.

 

[RiZ III]

Change Arab to Saudi or Emirati. Fixed.

 

[Kinitari]

Brazil recalls Ambassador to Israel over Gaza conflict. Israel responds by calling Brazil an 'Irrelevant diplomatic partner'



http://www.jpost.com/Operation-Prot...tions-in-protest-of-IDF-Gaza-operation-368715

That's pretty dumb. Brazil is a huge and growing economy, writing them off just like that is both childish and short sighted. "I don't need you, you sucked in bed anyway" after someone already dumped you. Bro if you want any chance of being with that girl in that future, chill it with the negging.

 

[zer0blivion]

Brazil recalls Ambassador to Israel over Gaza conflict. Israel responds by calling Brazil an 'Irrelevant diplomatic partner'

“The moral relativism behind this move makes Brazil an irrelevant diplomatic partner, one who creates problems rather than contributes to solutions.”

http://www.jpost.com/Operation-Prot...tions-in-protest-of-IDF-Gaza-operation-368715

From the article:

The Foreign Ministry immediately slammed Brazil for the move.

“This is an unfortunate demonstration of why Brazil, an economic and cultural giant, remains a diplomatic dwarf,” said Foreign Ministry spokesman Yigal Palmor.

 

[Dai101]

one of the top growing economies is irrelevant?

Brazil recalls Ambassador to Israel over Gaza conflict. Israel responds by calling Brazil an 'Irrelevant diplomatic partner'



http://www.jpost.com/Operation-Prot...tions-in-protest-of-IDF-Gaza-operation-368715

That's pretty dumb. Brazil is a huge and growing economy, writing them off just like that is both childish and short sighted. "I don't need you, you sucked in bed anyway" after someone already dumped you. Bro if you want any chance of being with that girl in that future, chill it with the negging.

They also have military and economic ties:

Military cooperation
Col. Hanny Caspi Awarded a Medal by Brazilian Ambassador to Israel, in 2011.

The two nations enjoy a degree of arms cooperation, with Brazil recently announcing that it was going to produce the Israeli-made TAR-21 Assault Rifle under license.[21]

Brazil is a key buyer of Israeli weapons and military technology. In addition to the hundreds of millions of dollars in contracts signed with Israeli manufacturer Elbit since 2000, the Brazilian Air Force signed a $90 million, five-year lease for 12 Kfir aircraft, and Rafael-manufactured Derby missiles were purchased in 2006. Most recently, Israel Aircraft Industries signed a $350 million contract in November 2009 to supply drones to the Brazilian police - the largest such deal ever between Israel and Brazil.[22]

In 2011, the Federative Republic of Brazil awarded a medal to the Head of the Israeli International Military Cooperation Department of the Planning Directorate, Col. Hanny Caspi, for her peace-making efforts. The medal was given to Col. Caspi during a ceremony at the Brazilian Embassy in Tel Aviv, to honor her contribution in promoting the security cooperation between the Israel Defense Forces and the Brazilian Army. The Brazilian Ambassador to Israel, Maria Alicia Bregner also mentioned that she is excited that the head of the department is a woman.[23] Col. Caspi is only the fourth Israeli officer to receive the medal, which is signed by the General of the Brazilian Ground Forces, and is considered as a gesture of respect and appreciation.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brazil–Israel_relations#Military_cooperation

http://stopthewall.org/downloads/pdf/STWbrazil2010.pdf

Economic relations
Israeli Minister of Industry and Trade, Ehud Olmert addressing a group of entrepreneurs in Sao Paulo, Brazil, in 2005.

In December 2007, a Free Trade Zone Agreement between Israel and Mercosur was signed, Brazil being the largest partner of Israel in Latin America. Israel was the first extra-regional partner to set an agreement of this type with the economic bloc. The agreement aims to open the market of goods trade, rules of origin, safekeeping, cooperation in technical and sanitary norms, technological and technical cooperation and customs cooperation.[24]

The president of the Federation of Industries of the State of Sao Paulo, Paulo Skaf said during a 2010 conference in Jerusalem that Brazil will triple trade with Israel by 2015. The conference was attended by Brazilian President Lula da Silva, Israeli President Shimon Peres and a group of Brazilian and Israeli business leaders.[25]

In the context of tourism, 60,000 Brazilians visited Israel in 2012. The number is 20% higher than it was in 2011. Due to that growth, the Israeli Ministry of Tourism aims to bring 140,000 Brazilians to Israel in 2014. The basic strategies are the expansion of the Representative Office of the Ministry of Tourism in Brazil and the facilitation route between Brazil and Israel, with the Israeli airline El Al beginning its operations in the Brazil.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brazil–Israel_relations#Economic_relations

http://en.mercopress.com/2010/03/16/mercosur-israel-free-trade-agreement-becomes-effective-april

http://thebrazilbusiness.com/article/commercial-relations-brazil-and-israel

Cultural and technical Cooperation

Rio de Janeiro is a sister city with Haifa, Tel Aviv (since 2006),[27] and Ramat Gan (since 2010).[28] Sao Paulo and Tel Aviv are sister cities since 2004. There is an important Jewish community in Sao Paulo. According to Raphael Singer, an Israeli diplomat in Brasilia, around 60,000 Jews live in Sao Paulo.[29]

On October 25, 2013 the Israeli foreign ministry stated that Israel will team up with Brazil's Jewish community to deliver medical aid to Africa. The aid project is scheduled to begin in January 2014 in Guinea Bissau and is headed by Claudio Lottenberg, the head of the Confederação Israelita do Brasil (CONIB), an umbrella group of Brazilian Jewry.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brazil–Israel_relations#Cultural_and_technical_Cooperation

http://www.timesofisrael.com/israel-to-join-brazilian-jews-aid-program-in-africa/

I know, wiki links and all that.

 

[enewtabie]

What could the Arabs nations do to cause a ceasefire or stop this? Just curious.
I'm not talking militarily because that doesn't work. Egypt doesn't really care for Hamas.

 

[KillerMan91]

I was thinking this earlier. That whole region is in turmoil. I don't foresee anything good happening for a while.

Weirdly enough big bad Iran seems to be most stable country in middle east (well aside from Israel).

 

[Air Zombie Meat]

edit: nvm, no point in piling on.

 

[theignoramus]

Of course.

Mortar shells launched from the UNRWA School in Beit Hanoun

Also if you are skeptical of the UN buildings frequently holding Hamas rockets.

They admit it happens.

the top link is video footage from 2007. Stop obfuscating.

 

[Maninthemirror]

What could the Arabs nations do to cause a ceasefire or stop this? Just curious.
I'm not talking militarily because that doesn't work. Egypt doesn't really care for Hamas.

Egypt does not care about Hamas because Hamas is Palestinian version of the Muslim Brotherhood, a group that Sisi is targetting in Egypt. They don't want to be associated with Hamas. Hamas is the elected government in Gaza so they cannot deal with the Palestinian civilians there either.

 

[kess]

Change Arab to Saudi or Emirati. Fixed.

Ask Syria how that's worked out for them. It seems like all their money gets siphoned to the wrong people.

 

[CorvoSol]

Not commenting on the content of this post other than to say that in Dark GAF it's practically impossible to read it.

 

[Skyzard]

Fuck yes, Brazil. You know spies are incoming though right?

Deplorable, Israel.

UN officials said that during the course of the day they had been trying to negotiate a window of time with the Israeli army for civilians to leave the area because of the heavy fighting.

Chris Gunness, a spokesman for the UN Relief and Works Agency for Palestine refugees (Unrwa), also said the Israeli army had been formally given the co-ordinates of the shelter in Beit Hanoun.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-28468526

 

[NullPointer]

Syria lost 1,700 people in one week, Jordan is the middle of a refugee crisis, Iraq is literally fracturing and Egyptian government is purging the state. Everybody is fucked.

Mission Accomplished.

 

[commedieu]

They also have military and economic ties:

That all makes it quite insulting.

 

[Dai101]

Mission Accomplished.

 

[kess]

lol at Israel blowing off a country that is 25x more populous and has a fairly large Jewish population, to boot.

 

[Chumly]

I'm not sure what's being debated here. It's already been confirmed that it was IDF tank shells.

.

I don't know why we're talking about this either. Anytime anything Israel does bad it's automatically put out there that it could have been the Hamas.

 

[Maninthemirror]

See some of the 700 Palestinians killed by Israeli attacks on Gaza


http://humanizepalestine.com/

 

[nib95]

See some of the 700 Palestinians killed by Israeli attacks on Gaza


http://humanizepalestine.com/

This one is absolutely tragic. An entire family wiped out.

 

[Freezie KO]

Money. The Jewish exodus from Europe was only affordable to relatively wealthy families, which meant that the Jewish-American population was statistically wealthier and better connected than either the remaining Jewish-European population or the average American. Given America's lack of social mobility and the fact entrenched wealth tends to accumulate, the average Jewish-American is disproportionately wealthy when compared to other ethnic and religious groups - it's the same reason that they're disproportionately represented in the sciences, as wealthier family corresponds to better education. A significant number of the Jewish-American population bought into the Zionist idea of a "Jewish homeland", so the American Zionist Committee for Public Affairs was founded, which later spawned the American Israel Public Affairs Committee - AIPAC, a hugely influential lobbyist group which receives a disproportionately large amount of money from an already wealthy donor base. When you're a politician running for election in the United States, the money AIPAC can provide towards your re-election is not something easily turned aside.

This is also probably why Europe isn't as pro-Israel - the Jewish population in developed European countries is actually somewhat poorer than the general population.

You're making a false connection here. Yes, it took money to escape Europe for America. But upon leaving, the Nazis stole money, property, stores, and homes from the Jews. They took everything they could.

In fact, this aspect of theft is seen by historians as very important to why policies like forced emigration and the Holocaust took place. Ordinary citizens stood to financially gain by persecuting Jews. It's not that everyone was a foaming-at-the-mouth anti-Semite.

So by the time the Jewish population arrived in America, they were far from monied oligarchs. Many gave up everything they had and started anew. They didn't fly their private jets to Ellis Island and immediately franchise their European banks.

As for why Europe is not as pro-Israel, you could say that the Jewish influence is not as large. Conversely, many European nations have to appease an increasing population of Muslim immigrants. Of course there are many other factors, such as European nations pretending to wipe their hands of their colonial past, remaining anti-Semitism, and just a general leaning towards the political left and feelings for "the underdog" (among other reasons.)

 

[Cloudy]

Do rockets usually contain shrapnel?

 

[Trojita]

From the article:

The Foreign Ministry immediately slammed Brazil for the move.

“This is an unfortunate demonstration of why Brazil, an economic and cultural giant, remains a diplomatic dwarf,” said Foreign Ministry spokesman Yigal Palmor.

 

[RiZ III]

What could the Arabs nations do to cause a ceasefire or stop this? Just curious.
I'm not talking militarily because that doesn't work. Egypt doesn't really care for Hamas.

Did you know the UAE and Saudis have a TON of money invested in the stock market. Trade agreements with IS and Israel, contracts in and outside of their countries, etc.. They definitely have to leverage to change policies. They just don't care to.

 

[LNBL]

See some of the 700 Palestinians killed by Israeli attacks on Gaza


http://humanizepalestine.com/

UN Human Rights Council "Israel may be committing war crimes in Gaza"

 

[KingK]

Lol @ this IDF spokesman on CNN. He's going on and on about how this wasn't the IDF.

Ah, so I see they've moved on from the Human Shield defense to the Shaggy Defense.

Retaliation for the UN war crimes investigation? Or just classic Israeli belligerence? In any case, the UN and international community need to step in and step up. I have a feeling that if it were't for the US vetoes, the UN would have done so already long ago.

It's up to American's now to put the pressure on their politicians, media etc to try and change the landscape of it's governments unashamed and unflinching support for Israel.

Unfortunately, most Americans don't have enough interest to do thorough research into the matter, so they'll have no sense of context and only see the absurdly biased news coverage on TV that continues to tell America "Every one of these deaths is the fault of Hamas. Israel is just a beacon of freedom defending themselves."

I'm pretty confident that Americans by and large would not be so supportive of Israel if we were actually educated about the history of this conflict. When I took a class on the topic, most of the students knew nothing of the conflict beforehand, and came in with the popular notion of Israel being a beacon of democracy in the Middle East besieged by religious extremists. It was taught by a Jewish rabbi who did a fantastic job of giving unbiased facts and detailed explanations for the motivations of all parties; starting from Herzl and the creation of Zionism up to modern day. By the end of the course, I didn't know of a single student who had a positive opinion of Israel. Most people were shocked to learn about the settlements and were pretty disgusted that the US continues to support Israel while allowing them to continue expanding.