Support NeoGAF

[Freedom Gate Co.]

It's weird to see people want VR to fail, when it literally doesn't harm the video game's industry at all.

VR market is currently failing outside one big success and a couple other headsets doing moderately well when we used to have more options and higher growth.

Person points this out, is accused of wanting VR to die by a person claiming to be a fan of VR yet thinks that dying competition, declining investment, and only one majorly successful headset is a good thing.

Clown World.

 

[magnumpy]

Theatrics? You said you have official data from the makers and I asked for it. Now you're suddenly saying that such data is not necessary after all because you read somewhere a guestimate that it's only been 10 million units total even though said official data doesn't exist anywhere at all. Learn how to debate and what a "fact" is.

It's that fabled scarcity marketing forum goes believe is a thing in these industries because that one time they couldn't find their favorite amiibo and the nes classic mini in stores, lol.

it's difficult to judge things RIGHT NOW due to the chaos of christmastime/end of year sales. we'll know more once all that has passed. outlook is good, but again we'll just have to wait and see.

there are at least two big companies (sony/facebook) that are in this fight for the long haul. as well as many others, valve notably with hardware and software support. talking about you, half-life: alyx and the valve index vr headset

 

[mckmas8808]

VR market is currently failing outside one big success and a couple other headsets doing moderately well when we used to have more options and higher growth.

Person points this out, is accused of wanting VR to die by a person claiming to be a fan of VR yet thinks that dying competition, declining investment, and only one majorly successful headset is a good thing.

Clown World.

Which headset are you claiming is the "one" big success?

 

[Freedom Gate Co.]

Which headset are you claiming is the "one" big success?

You're joking right? Did you forget the thread you're in?

 

[Shizumapower]

That´s not happening anytime soon:

"Unfortunately, Kiciński proceeded to say that CD Projekt RED is “not moving in that direction right now” because of the challenges it would bring from a game design perspective.

“The issue becomes more challenging when we factor in game design. There are substantial changes which must be taken into account when working on a VR-specific product. Our current focus is on the PC and console editions of Cyberpunk”.
"

CD Projekt RED says VR support for Cyberpunk 2077 isn't "terribly difficult”

The president of CD Projekt RED has said that the inclusion of VR support for Cyberpunk 2077 isn’t an obscenely difficult task. CD Projekt RED...

www.hitc.com

and:

"
"Now I am actually unaware in our conversations with publishers of really pushing hard for VR--perhaps this information has missed me, I genuinely don't know. I know there's a few titles here and there that usually showcase or experience VR, but I have not heard of anybody building an actual solid business on VR.

https://www.tweaktown.com/news/68925/cyberpunk-2077-vr-happen-cdpr-think-worth/index.html
"

 

[Alexios]

What? How does this bit you quote me on (please don't add words I never used either):

You said you have official sales from the makers and I asked to see it

Differ to your post (that I did quote the first time and also put the relevant part in bold, the fact you circle jerk constantly doesn't mean I should also repeat everything every other post as you do even though your bs has been refuted a million times before):

official sales figures from the makers themselves support this

You must be high if you think that misrepresents what you said, it's paraphrased almost exactly. But sure, go all ad hominem/strawman rather than back up anything with those "facts" you're keen on never presenting, other than how you know better than Oculus/Valve/HTC/Sony VR is a dead end.

Nobody other than you made a claim about specific numbers, even if the various guestimates you pretend are official when they aren't turn out to be close enough, they don't necessarily mean what you want them to. Calling you out for claiming to have sources you don't have doesn't mean the rest of your logic is sound. It's anything but. Having a 50% chance to be right or wrong about it doesn't mean you won't be called out when you flat out lie. Anyone can spew bullshit that may or may not be right to pretend they won an argument and tell people how they can come back to it at some arbitrary point in the future when all this will be forgotten by anyone who isn't as petty as you (I guess you will bookmark it to remind us if it turns out to be close enough though, but forget it too if it doesn't). That still won't make the original claim of having official sources true though, duh.

 

[gifgaf]

I haven't made a claim I only made factual statement you don't like so you dismiss them.

Orly?

Quest is doing better than other VR but it'll stabilize soon. It's the fad phase.

Oculus Quest is still not selling well, it's only selling higher than the average number VR headsets usually sell, which is already rock bottom.

We have years of VR sales trends and financial reports proving VR has never done well at any point and official sales figures from the makers themselves support this, that doesn't mean that enough hasn't sold to reach $2.1 billion, you just have to look at the breakdown to realize that's not really impressive. Oculus Quest is doing well on when you compare it to other VR headsets this isn't a sign that VR is thriving when everyone else is looking for breadcrumbs.

VR market is currently failing outside one big success and a couple other headsets doing moderately well when we used to have more options and higher growth.

Lots of claims here but no proof, do you even read your own posts?

I have no further interest debating with you since you have no interest in the facts and only argue to stroke your ego, please keep in mind the date of my first post in the argument so when market data does come out we can come back to it and see my post aligned with the data proving that I am correct on this issue.

"Oh damn my bluff is being called and I have no proof to backup what I'm saying, better try take the high road to make myself look better"

 

[mckmas8808]

You're joking right? Did you forget the thread you're in?

Why is it hard for you to answer the question?

 

[Freedom Gate Co.]

Why is it hard for you to answer the question?

I don't answer stupid questions by people pretending that they can't read the thread title. Seems we got another person who doesn't want to deal with issues they don't agree with. Why is it so hard for you guys to actually consider elements you don't agree with?

This will be an amazing thread to come back to by the end of the year, I'm sure people will come up with all sorts of excuses.

 

[Alexios]

So you came back but not to actually respond to anything.

This will be an amazing thread to come back to by the end of the year, I'm sure people will come up with all sorts of excuses.

What happens in these 13 days we have for the year to end, does VR implode proving your lies about having such and such official data (never mind even if those numbers turn out close enough they don't have to mean what you wan them to, nobody other than you made a numbers claim anyway) true?

And how is Quest doing well independent of VR itself doing well, lol? It just happens to be one of the better choices for people right now (or having the marketing/hype to make people think so, whatever) especially as it's both a PC VR and a stand alone VR set selling to both audiences.

Though Oculus' other product (the S) is just as sold out and back ordered now so surely that means it's also doing well which already goes against your "logic" even if EpicGamer's writer likes focusing on the Quest.

 

[lukilladog]

I wonder why you guys don´t ask facebook to pay for vr ports of games like cyberpunk, if Sony and google can throw money to mainstream devs, facebook can.

 

[Romulus]

The fact that only ONE VR headset is making waves right now and the rest are looking for bread crumbs which usually results in less investment and less choice, Sony being the exception. Some of you are way to defensive to look at the big picture.

Sony can spend all the money they want on PSVR, that doesn't means that PSVR is a major thing, it only means it makes enough money for Sony to keep investment in it, it doesn't have anything to do with where VR as a whole is at the moment.

I just don't understand where you're going with this. I've never seen VR headsets sold out like this almost across the board, and you've admitted one of them is "making waves."
That in itself is unprecedented for VR and so are big budget games, which are coming. This isn't going downhill at all. In fact, I never expected to see a surge like this compared to last year.
If you assume the Quest is some boy wonder for VR, fine. It gives Oculus an idea of where to go forward. They're found a strategy, and the next iterations will only get better, lighter, more powerful, more games.

Then VR will die I guess once they've addressed the complaints lol.

In my opinion, the quest is brilliant because the portability can give more people a taste of VR, that's something I'm convinced of now that most still haven't tried it even now.

 

[DarthBuzzer]

The headline of the article that this thread is about: "Oculus Quest is giving VR the boost it needs for mass adoption".

We're often told things are going to be disruptive technologies by those press, media, influencers, youtubers, that have a vested stake in hyperbole and ad clicks. "VR will change everything!" etc.

The truth is that VR hasn't been the disruptive force that 'they' told us it would be, instead it has been embraced into the folds of gaming and has found its niche in the playground. It hasn't taken over, and I don't believe it is likely ever to. It's another type of gaming, like handheld gaming, that coexists peacefully.

If anything VR has been forgotten about and replaced by the new cause celebre. Streaming is the new VR, the new disruptor that the click hungry mobs are shouting "will change everything!".

People need to back off the hyperbole and calm down a little. Gaming is more enjoyable when you just allow it to be mellow and fun - not everything needs to be hyped like its life and death.

FYI, the people who overhyped VR are not the people within the VR industry. Case in point: https://www.roadtovr.com/what-vr-he...-have-actually-said-about-sales-expectations/

VR has followed the gartner hype cycle as all technologies do which is why it appears on the surface that streaming has taken it's spot as the next big thing. This happens with nearly every tech regardless of success or failure.

VR will become mainstream, but it will take some time to happen, as expected.

 

[Liljagare]

I still think VR's biggest problem is, you cant really explain how good it is with a good setup, its not until you get a person in it that they might get it.

I never got it, until I tried the cheapest main set on the PS4.

Now I am hooked forever, its only going to get better.

But I have issues, I dont play the games the same anymore. Skyrim is a good example, I keep climbing hills to see the sunset, and keep the fights going with the Dragond since its a whole new level of awesome. The size of them doesn't translate on a flat screen at all imho.

Hoping we get wireless soonish.

 

[Romulus]

I still think VR's biggest problem is, you cant really explain how good it is with a good setup, its not until you get a person in it that they might get it.

So many first time VR demos I've done over the years. They always they bring up much more immersive it is inside headset than they ever imagined. I guess VR haters convinced people the technology is just a screen close to your face, which couldn't be further from the truth.

 

[Ar¢tos]

Your damaging your brain with these strawmans, I haven't made a claim I only made factual statement you don't like so you dismiss them.

So when you said that bluray kills people, it was a factual statement too?

Sony isn't making a Vita 2, but seems invested in making a PSVR2, I guess they just like to lose money and don't do any market research...

 

[Romulus]

Another thing that's interesting, when was the last time any accessory or handheld got a AAA exclusive on the level of Half Life?

 

[Alexios]

Another thing that's interesting, when was the last time any accessory or handheld got a AAA exclusive on the level of Half Life?

What do you mean? Nintendo handhelds always had a ton of heavy hitting exclusives, it's why they generally sell gazillions every time. PSP had cool stuff too. Nintendo also made some flagship games of theirs require accessories on Wii and it's probably happened elsewhere too. Not sure what that has to do with anything.

 

[Romulus]

What do you mean? Nintendo handhelds always had a ton of heavy hitting exclusives, it's why they generally sell gazillions every time. PSP had cool stuff too. Nintendo also made some flagship games of theirs require accessories on Wii and it's probably happened elsewhere too. Not sure what that has to do with anything.

Everyone knows Nintendo, even sony has always had their flagship exclusives on handhelds. Of course. But not a AAA game like Half life that was ported to most platforms, now suddenly on an accessory(vr) exclusive.

 

[Alexios]

So if you already knew it's a common thing why ask anyway. Like Nintendo clearly wanted to support its own portables and accessories and made games for them (Ubisoft also had Red Steel 2 motion plus exclusive like Skyward Sword was on Wii btw) Valve wants to obviously support VR, they just don't only limit Alyx to their own Index product as they'd rather VR as a whole pushes forward (and they fight for that regardless of hardware with SteamVR/OpenVR and their general attitude). Or for an even closer comparison the Oculus funded VR-only games, including the coming Medal of Honor VR, which (officially) only work on Oculus VR kits. Companies support the hardware they gain from or have an interest in as always. Sony has PSVR exclusives too. Now if some random third party without a financial interest (so not getting funded by one of the VR proponents for it) beyond the potential sales of their project makes an (actual) AAA VR-only sequel to an established IP that'd be something newer and a big day showing how far VR has come in terms of mainstream appeal for sure. Not that it matters to me when that happens as long as we get cool VR games regardless before then, it's not a day I await for or anything, there's tons of good stuff to play whether it ever happens or not.

 

[Romulus]

So if you already knew it's a common thing why ask anyway. Like Nintendo clearly wanted to support its own portables and accessories and made games for them (Ubisoft also had Red Steel 2 motion plus exclusive like Skyward Sword was on Wii btw) Valve wants to support VR, they just don't only limit Alyx to their own Index product as they'd rather VR as a whole pushes forward. Or for an even closer comparison the Oculus funded VR-only games, including the coming Medal of Honor VR, which (officially) only work on Oculus VR kits. Companies support the hardware they gain from or have an interest in as always. Sony has PSVR exclusives too.

What's up with you not quoting people you're talking to? Are that lazy, like with your thought process? You really thought I was comparing a genre pushing technology marvel like half life to mario or red steel? Lmao.

More and more I see you arguing in various threats just for the sake of arguing.

 

[Alexios]

Well you didn't qualify any of that in your original question, maybe write what you mean next time rather than get aggravated when people answer perfectly fine? You just asked for big game/name exclusives on portables and accessories, how does Zelda/Mario/a ton of other huge sellers on portables not qualify as such? Same for Zelda and motion plus. Then you kept adding more and more qualifications about what does count and what doesn't count until these didn't actually fit, and finally succeeded by adding this novel technology deal. If you asked if there has been any accessory/development as awesome as VR in gaming's past in the first place I'd say not that I can think of, duh. 3D itself I guess is even more important if we go for more general technology developments but yeah, not exactly what you're talking about now that you've actually explained some of what you actually mean. To what end I have no idea but whatever I guess.

 

[Romulus]

Well you didn't qualify any of that in your question, maybe write what you mean next time? You just asked for big game exclusives on portables and accessories, how does Zelda/Mario not qualify as such? If you asked me if there has been any accessory as awesome as VR in the past I'd say no, duh.

I clearly said "on the level of half life." To you that means mario and red steel. One of which is super obviously an exclusive for decades and the other doesn't compare. Anyway, I'm blocking you, you're a lazy, senselessly combative poster at times.

If you thought I was soooooo far off base, why even take the time to reply? I wouldnt even waste my time on a gaming forum with someone who didnt know mario was exclusive. But you're so lazy you just start typing, the same way you don't bother quoting people. And only recently did you discover what a paragraph was instead endless walls of text.

 

[Alexios]

Mario and Zelda don't count like big games like Half-Life because you say so and want to lol @ them. Okay then? You're the one being combative when people answer perfectly fine because you apparently wanted to make completely different points to the ones you actually made and it pisses you off you failed but can't self reflect and blame me for not knowing you meant completely different things to what you said, some of which you still can't explain several posts later, never mind with the original questions, but no, I should have totally known all of that beforehand. What are you even going on about, who doesn't know Mario is (generally) exclusive?

[Hurr, what big game sequels ever got on portables and accessories as exclusives? Zelda & Mario as examples? Oh, those don't count you lazy combative little shit! Nintendo supporting their platforms doesn't count, it's obvious they would! But Valve supporting VR that they helped give birth to from the start? That counts because it's uh, not obvious they would support it (and ther Index)? Or something? And you should have known what I meant without me saying it! Even though I've yet to even explain where the fuck I'm going with all this. Blocked!]

Lol?

 

[mckmas8808]

Mario and Zelda don't count like big games like Half-Life because you say so and want to lol @ them. Okay then? You're the one being combative when people answer perfectly fine because you apparently wanted to make completely different points to the ones you actually made and it pisses you off you failed but can't self reflect and blame me for not knowing you meant completely different things to what you said, some of which you still can't explain several posts later, never mind with the original questions, but no, I should have totally known all of that beforehand. What are you even going on about, who doesn't know Mario is (generally) exclusive?

[Hurr, what big game sequels ever got on portables and accessories as exclusives? Zelda & Mario as examples? Oh, those don't count you lazy combative little shit! Nintendo supporting their platforms doesn't count, it's obvious they would! But Valve supporting VR that they helped give birth to from the start? That counts because it's uh, not obvious they would support it (and ther Index)? Or something? And you should have known what I meant without me saying it! Even though I've yet to even explain where the fuck I'm going with all this. Blocked!]

Lol?

What Mario game came out with a peripheral? You counting Wii Sports?

 

[Alexios]

What Mario game came out with a peripheral? You counting Wii Sports?

Mario was my answer for the portables part (I guess Switch won't count since it's also a home system, but 3DS had great mainline titles for various IP including that). For third party there were the pre-World Monster Hunter games among others, jumping from PS2 to PSP to 3DS.

For the peripheral part my answer was Zelda as Skyward Sword required Motion Plus on the Wii. Since we got that Saturn Capcom thread today there were also all those awesome fighting games using the 1MB or 4MB RAM cartridges (from SNK too)!

Idk what all this has to do with VR, I was just answering to the questions he posed.

 

[CloudNull]

I thought VR was dead?

Facebook: $100 Million+ Spent On Quest Apps In One Year & More Than 10 Titles Generated $2M+

Facebook revealed new sales figures regarding content sold through its Oculus store for Quest to mark the one-year anniversary of the standalone headset going on sale. According to the company, people spent more than $100 million on Quest content since the headset first shipped in May 2019...

uploadvr.com

Man the Quest is coming in strong during this Pandemic. I am down 20lbs and my wife is down 15. Now with the passthru feature and finger less tracking coming..... shit is going to get wild. Version 2 is going to be unreal.

 

[rofif]

You can see that quest is their baby. Constant updates, link now works with any usb2 cable, hand tracking etc.
While S got outed to lenovo and they don't care about it. I am getting myself a quest I guess then since my S headphones jack was damaged and I refunded it (oculus support is great)

 

[Romulus]

Imagine if they could have keep the Quest in stock the last 5 months.

 

[John117]

My next device is Oculus Quest.

 

[Romulus]

Its past the point of dying now. 2 years ago I think it was at a critical crossroads, but that's over. Sony, Valve, and FB are committed to VR, even xbox is swaying back to it being an option rather than not after recent success.

Developers can make real money at it too. There are already a few games that sold over 2 million copies. HL Alyx was over a million at launch. To be fair, some hyped console exclusives don't hit that mark with 20x the userbase. It punches well above its weight in the software attach rate. The only issue was the very slow hardware growth, which has improved.

 

[LittleBusters]

Wow $2 billion! That's a rounding error in the tech industry.

 

[Romulus]

Wow $2 billion! That's a rounding error in the tech industry.

Is it? 2018 total for all software and subscriptions was 35 billion. And that's considering the install base on those devices was magnitudes higher. Something like a ps4 alone probably had around a 30x higher install base, not counting PC, Switch, etc etc.

Not to mention, the top VR headsets were sold out for much of that time.

Significant.