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White girl attacked for getting box braids

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Jado

Banned
I went to a school mixed with ethnicities and never saw anyone bitch, gossip, complain or anything really, when a white, light skinned hispanic or any non-black person had a "black" hairstyle. This is stupid and only serves to distract from legitimate problems and dilute the "black lives matter" message.

I'm waiting for a major publication to pen a highly damning piece about aggressively petty Internet culture run amok. Something with a title like "The Age of Being Offended."
 

Lucumo

Member
I'm saying do you understand that we're in agreement about the nature of the tweets but the main argument is the cultural appropriation going on in America and some may say she is unknowingly contributing to it. Nobody in here is saying she shouldn't wear it.

No, as I only read what I mentioned and that seemed mostly in favor of the girl but lacked proper critique of the people typing the tweets.
Hm, "cultural appropriation" seems kinda messed up as in, how do you differentiate between people making fun of said culture and people just liking specific things. If one culture would identify themself with black jeans and I thought that they would look good on me, I would just wear them. I wouldn't care about said culture. It's the same with this girl.
On the other hand, if someone takes something to make himself look funny/stupid, then they are idiots and deserve a slap across the face. It still doesn't require hatred because even then he didn't do it with the intention to make someone else look bad.
It's sad to see these racist people on Twitter telling someone young who can easily be influenced that dressing like you want because you like it is a bad thing and deserves chastising. Doing it like that only makes the rift grow further and both "sides" are responsible for it.
 

appaws

Banned
Would this hurt your head when you sleep?

I always wondered that....

I also always wondered about the beads that some little black girls have in their hair. I think it looks very cute, but again I wondered if it hurt to sleep on it...?
 

Figboy79

Aftershock LA
This is stupid.

I'm at work, so I can't fully weigh in, but appropriation is most certainly an issue and concern of blacks that should be considered and respected, and open for discussion.

This, however, is fucking stupid. A hair style is a hair style. While it may certainly originate from certain cultures or ethnic backgrounds, I don't feel it "belongs" to them to the point where other people are banned from ever experiencing that style. Let the little girl get her hair done in a way she likes. There are genuine, severe racial issues in the world, and in America that we should focus our energies on, not some girls hair style.
 

Samara

Member
Black women are on a whole other level when it comes to hair. Reminds of that Gabby Douglas incident at the London Olympics. She won the gold medal but all the black women could do was hate on her hair.

Insecurities will do that. I understand that our hair is not perceived as kept or pretty unless its the smoother kind or else be damned. Decades of not being able to not even know what to do to our own hair will do that. And also trying to look like a person closer to the european race

Would this hurt your head when you sleep?

I always wondered that....

I also always wondered about the beads that some little black girls have in their hair. I think it looks very cute, but again I wondered if it hurt to sleep on it...?

It hurts if its too tight, and its somewhat heavy if they are as big as hers. Goes away in a day or two.
 
After doing a small bit of research, I can see why cultural appropriation ticks people off. Like musicians not getting the recognition they deserve or taking ideas that are prominent somewhere else, and claiming that you created them yourself.

But braids? Hairstyles aren't an I.P. She isn't wearing Blackface, and she didn't say or do anything regarding race. She didn't claim she invented braids. I don't understand the outrage over this.
 
I was wondering what specifically makes cultural appropriation harmful. It's not just borrowing from another culture right? I think that borrowing has to be done in conjunction with or have been preceded by looking down on the culture?

For example, I can the see the point about black hair being looked down on for a time, so that when it's suddenly fashionable then that could sting. The twerking example is a weird one, because like others have said, it's still seen as trashy. It's just that some white people want to be trashy? Is that as bad?

To bring it back to the hair thing, would it have been ok is no one made fun of black hair in the past? Or is it still bad because even if in this hypothetical situation, black hair wasn't looked down on, but black culture as a whole still was and therefore taking anything that is rooted in the black experience is a bad thing?
 

vwnut13

Member
Seems like something I would have seen in the '23 Times America Failed Black People in 2014' article.

White girl gets braids!
 

Rest

All these years later I still chuckle at what a fucking moron that guy is.
Those twitter quotes are insane. Black people in America didn't invent plaits, they're probably as old as time.
 

ISOM

Member
After doing a small bit of research, I can see why cultural appropriation ticks people off. Like musicians not getting the recognition they deserve or taking ideas that are prominent somewhere else, and claiming that you created them yourself.

But braids? Hairstyles aren't an I.P. She isn't wearing Blackface, and she didn't say or do anything regarding race. She didn't claim she invented braids. I don't understand the outrage over this.

You can attribute it to just some people being ignorant and misguided. That's why no one should be over-analyzing tweets like this. It's just a small micro of ignorant people.
 
Cultural appropriation definitely is a thing.

This isn't a case of it though. How did this user's hair photo get out there to be commented on like that anyway? Who is this user - is she a regular person like me, or is she a celebrity or celebrity kid or something, or what? I'm curious what would make her a flashpoint for discussion on cultural appropriation aside from literally being a white girl with braids.

Stuff like this sucks; it's the noise of things like this that obscures the signal of actual irksome/annoying issues in this arena (like twerk queen Cyrus, swag princess Perry and GOAT rapper Azalea).
 
No one educates better than the uneducated.
tumblr_lpll35gB5v1qfy8rj.gif
 

Trey

Member
After doing a small bit of research, I can see why cultural appropriation ticks people off. Like musicians not getting the recognition they deserve or taking ideas that are prominent somewhere else, and claiming that you created them yourself.

But braids? Hairstyles aren't an I.P. She isn't wearing Blackface, and she didn't say or do anything regarding race. She didn't claim she invented braids. I don't understand the outrage over this.

I was wondering what specifically makes cultural appropriation harmful. It's not just borrowing from another culture right? I think that borrowing has to be done in conjunction with or have been preceded by looking down on the culture?

To bring it back to the hair thing, would it have been ok is no one made fun of black hair in the past? Or is it still bad because even if in this hypothetical situation, black hair wasn't looked down on, but black culture as a whole still was and therefore taking anything that is rooted in the black experience is a bad thing?

Here:

the black community is sensitive to white folks doing particularly "black things," because black people are generally derided for it while the whites who borrow or steal from the culture make a buck off it and are given praise. Rapping is only cool when Macklemore does it. Twerking was trashy until it was a thing Miley Cyrus did.

It contributes to a feeling that black people are tolkenized and not honestly accepted in the wider media and/or American culture, so it leads to defensiveness any time someone white does something most associated with black people. Mostly the criticism is levied toward institutions (magazines, television shows, celebrities) but some individuals catch shit for it as well.

And again, I'm not talking about the little girl anymore, she can shave her head for all I care. I'm speaking WHY people complain about cultural appropriation. The answer while obvious to me is apparently lost on many people in this thread, as they write about these fictious utopias in which all groups are treated equal and complaining about cultural appropriation is stupid.

The MAIN reason any group ever complains about culture appropriation is because that group feels oppressed. If people want minority groups to stop crying about cultural appropriation the answer is simple. Stop being complacent on how America treats minority groups. If said groups were treated nearly as well as so many people's utopic visions...I doubt this thread would even exist.

The little girl did nothing wrong, the argument of hair being exclusive to one group is dumb. Now divorcing ourselves from this little girl, I'm going to explain to people why some people draw issues with something as insignificant as hairstyles. In America the metric standard of beauty has and still is straight luscious hair. It's the standard that all women are measured at. This is doubly damining toward black females as straight hair is not the natural state of black female hair. The various methods to achieve said hair is scarring and expensive. Every day that idea is reinforced to black women by TV, Music, movies, photos and all other avenues. They're often told their natural hair is "ugly and unkempt", "nappy headed" and that they would look better if they straightened it.

Many black women started embracing hair styles more suitable to their hair, and again are greeted with the same negative attitudes towards it. And for just as long as these women have been ridiculed for their hairstyles; magazines and other avenues pour on accolades when the fairer skinned females do the same thing (Bo Derek as an exampled was lauded for it and many found the style refreshing and new, despite the fact at the same time many establishments and news/media were flat out calling black women who had this hairstyle "ghetto" or "unattractive". Or a better example would be Kylie Jenner or whatever her name is when she rocked half braids or whatever and Vogue or whoever stated it was "brand new, bold, and innovative hair style" rightfully black people, females especially were upset with the statements and the magazine and much less Kylie, in fact most people gave two fucks about Kylie.

The issue shouldn't be with this little girl, the issue should be and is with how American media views the two groups when they do the same thing and the effect it has on members of each group in how they perceive themselves and how they perceive themselves relative to the other group. Much like you and others don't want people judging this little girl for simply doing box braids, don't assume and think every

Or to make it relatable to anyone with a drop of empathy. Imagine have two sons/daughters; and they both do the same thing. You constantly praise one for it and insult/demean the other for doing the same thing...what is the expected outcome? How do you think it'll affect how they view not only his/herself and you but also the sibling who has done absolutely nothing wrong. Then you have the mother who doesn't care that this is happening. Obviously in my analogy the sibling in question would most likely realize that father is an asshole and would probably try to shine light on their sibling. This too is done in our society you see those people all the time throughout history, whites who rallied with MLK and did the million man march, those who take part in the #BlackLivesMatter movement. You also have the equivalents of mothers in our society, you know these as the "I don't see race" or "It's not happening to me so who cares" type people. And much like in society, mom and dad's voice and influence is so much more powerful than your siblings and will mark you much more deeply.

At this point, most of us aren't talking about the little girl anymore and we're now talking about American society at large (tends to happen with these threads). We've already had a number of people with the usual "Cultural appropriation is stupid because here is my utopia dream of how we treat each other in the US". and other such nonsense that really should be dismissed but we can't help but respond to such nonsense.

Again, divorce yourself from the little girl because it's no longer about her. I'm no longer talking about her, she is an anchor to none of my posts anymore. She doesn't speak for America at large much like any one black person doesn't speak for African Americans at large.

The girl can do with what she wants with her hair, no one should draw issue with that. People should redirect their anger to the massive cog that is American news, media, employment and how they they view and treat the different groups of people when they do the same thing. It is because of that different treatment that we have the cries of cultural appropriation.

A few posters have made the suggestion that blacks are segregating themselves and that they should be trying to assimilate and this is the best way...these people (bless their hearts) clearly speak from a place of either privilege (trigger word!) or ignorance (double trigger!). Black people have been trying to "assimilate" since they were brought here. Blacks are simply responding to the segregation being afflicted upon them, in order for blacks to segregate themselves you have to put forward the argument that segregation has ended....it really hasn't. Segregation end when racism ends.

I went on a craaaazy bit of tagents but meh.

TL;DR - No one is talking about the little girl at this point, divorce yourself from her.

As for this:

For example, I can the see the point about black hair being looked down on for a time, so that when it's suddenly fashionable then that could sting. The twerking example is a weird one, because like others have said, it's still seen as trashy. It's just that some white people want to be trashy? Is that as bad?

.

We weren't getting "dawn of booty" articles or "how to twerk" blogs and classes until it was white girls shaking their asses on TV. Sure, people in general might still see the act itself as trashy, but twerking has permeated culture like it never has before around the actions of white women, when black women have been popping that ass since they realized what they had back there.



Iggy Azalea is the "face" of culture appropriation at the moment. Twitter goes in on her daily. If you can understand the circumstances surrounding her situation with black criticism, it will inform you on situations like these rather well.

---

Eminem should stop appropriating rap culture and should stick to playing acoustic guitar!

This is a simplification. He's been accepted as a rapper because he's actually really talented and does not debase the culture it represents. There's a lot of white rappers in fact who get along just fine.

People get upset at musicians like Iggy Azalea because she disrespects what rap means and is generally ignorant to the culture in which she profits from.
 

GYODX

Member
I personally do not like the way they look on her, but I think people should be allowed to style their hair however the hell they want and not give a damn what people who choose to be offended by that have to say.

I find the whole concept of "cultural appropriation" to be utterly stupid, and I shudder to think that it is slowly becoming a part of mainstream political-correctness. I just wish this shit would stay relegated to places like Tumblr. It's frustrating to see more and more young people around me adopting the same sort of rhetoric and attitudes--here in fucking Puerto Rico where race relations don't function anything at all like they do in mainland USA.

Sorry, but Tumblr's idea of 'social progressivism' requires a certain degree of mental gymnastics, double think and just general intellectual dishonesty that I just don't feel comfortable engaging in. I think I'll just stick to evaluating things on a case by case basis and not being a bigot.
 

Dr.Acula

Banned
Black people started it when they stole white people's relaxer! I mean, our hair is naturally straight! Oh God, I've said too much!
 

Fink

Member
One of her parents could have been black... people jumping on it based on the image alone is troublesome.
 
So...


I don't understand the commenters.

I'm sure most of them grew up in the U.S.

That's called growing up in a desegregated American culture. Are they really advocating for a return to segregation? Where we have two distinct cultures that are not allowed overlap?
 

Rembrandt

Banned
So...


I don't understand the commenters.

I'm sure most of them grew up in the U.S.

That's called growing up in a desegregated American culture. Are they really advocating for a return to segregation? Where we have two distinct cultures that are no allowed overlap?

Read that long post too far above yours. The one with all those long quotes that explain everything.

Also lmao @ America being completely desegregated
 
Culture is like oxygen. It is not and should not be fragmented or isolated to only certain groups to use, personalize and reinvent certain parts of it.
 
So...


I don't understand the commenters.

I'm sure most of them grew up in the U.S.

That's called growing up in a desegregated American culture. Are they really advocating for a return to segregation? Where we have two distinct cultures that are not allowed overlap?

This is severely ignorant of the point being made, and really offensive to compare saying that it's not okay for white people to do "black stuff" to saying that black people can't attend the same schools or eat at the same restaurants as white people. It's not about overlapping - it's about the idea that black people's hairstyles are mocked or otherwise insulted by white people, but then when it becomes stylish to white people, white people talk about how much they love it, and eventually, something created in black culture is homogenized and its history is erased in a way that doesn't happen with white culture.

Culture is like oxygen. It is not and should not be fragmented or isolated to only certain groups to use, personalize and reinvent certain parts of it.

Culture can, in theory, be controlled in a way oxygen cannot (or should not) be controlled, and it should definitely not be up to others to tell people in a certain culture that the culture no longer belongs to them. In a perfect world, we would have a cultureless world, because that perfect world wouldn't erase non-white accomplishments or ideas by forcefully adopting them. The cultures get taken while the people who made them are left in the dust. People remember the accomplishments of white people, but the only thing people remember about black people is peanuts (and I don't even know if kids these days even know this anymore).
 

Trey

Member
That's called growing up in a desegregated American culture. Are they really advocating for a return to segregation? Where we have two distinct cultures that are not allowed overlap?

That's not at all what people are implying when they bring up cultural appropriation.

There are some minorities who do want a form of segregation, but it's a vanishingly small sect, and not really relevant to the topic at hand. And the two ideas are not inherently linked.
 

Rembrandt

Banned
Culture is like oxygen. It is not and should not be fragmented or isolated to only certain groups to use, personalize and reinvent certain parts of it.

Exactly, it should be appreciated, but if a black woman had this hair style it wouldn't be. It's literally that fucking simple.
 
tumblr_m9ca8lT5gE1r0p9wno7_250.gif


Whaddya know, its a treat for the eyes, and the ears.

That episode seemed to have subtle racist to me. Once she tried a black hairstyle the dude was being sarcastic and immediately wanted her to take them out.

Also, oddly I just came back from Food Lion where I saw one of the white employees rocking these braids.
 
Exactly, it should be appreciated, but if a black woman had this hair style it wouldn't be. It's literally that fucking simple.

Imo the problem comes from disgusting racism not from a person from another ethnicity appreciating and trying to replicate (out of admiration) that certain part of another culture.
 
Imo the problem comes from disgusting racism not from a person from another ethnicity appreciating and trying to replicate (out of admiration) that certain part of another culture.

Are they doing it because they admire the person, or think that they have neat things/styles that they want to have?
 
Here:

the black community is sensitive to white folks doing particularly "black things," because black people are generally derided for it while the whites who borrow or steal from the culture make a buck off it and are given praise. Rapping is only cool when Macklemore does it. Twerking was trashy until it was a thing Miley Cyrus did.

It contributes to a feeling that black people are tolkenized and not honestly accepted in the wider media and/or American culture, so it leads to defensiveness any time someone white does something most associated with black people. Mostly the criticism is levied toward institutions (magazines, television shows, celebrities) but some individuals catch shit for it as well.

...

We weren't getting "dawn of booty" articles or "how to twerk" blogs and classes until it was white girls shaking their asses on TV. Sure, people in general might still see the act itself as trashy, but twerking has permeated culture like it never has before around the actions of white women, when black women have been popping that ass since they realized what they had back there.

Iggy Azalea is the "face" of culture appropriation at the moment. Twitter goes in on her daily. If you can understand the circumstances surrounding her situation with black criticism, it will inform you on situations like these rather well.

Thanks, I did read your previous comments and hoped for more clarification.

I can understand being defensive because there is a history taking from black culture while actively hiding and/or dismissing its roots. Do you think that this sort of conscious, racist appropriation is as prevalent today? For example, the twerking thing. Do you think people consciously thought that this would be the next big thing for white people and wanted to hide the fact that black people have been doing it for years? Or do you think that ignorance and carelessness is to blame?

Is people liking Macklemore or Iggy Azalea because they're white, despite them putting out the same type of music that blacks have, a conscious effort to keep black culture hidden (honestly don't know because I don't really know who those two are). It seems to me that it's more a subconscious desire to embrace ideas that come from non-threatening/ideal/representative figures AKA white people. That in itself is also a battle to be fought, but I think it's hard to get angry at individuals for this.
 

Dr.Acula

Banned
My takeaway is that young people don't really care. This tween saw a hair style, thought it'd be cool to try and it didn't even enter her mind that is was "black." She's only ever known America as a place where the you have mainstream musicians who are black rappers, prominent athletes in ads who are black, where the president is black, etc. etc.

My grandparents would probably not have been allowed to date Italians, my Mum got a sideways look for dating a Jew, I know the stigma around my generation dating blacks, but for kids growing up now it's not something that ever enters their mind. I mean, who gets upset about Italians any more?

If you're 30 you can't see past race, or homosexuality the way a tween can. In the 90s, a gay couple going to prom was practically national news. Now? She probably knows lots of gay couples.
 

appaws

Banned
This has been happening forever right? Didn't Alanis Morisette have that hair a long time ago...?

African Americans invent cool shit, like jazz and rock and hip hop music or wearing your pants falling off your ass and exposing your underwear...and somewhat less cool white people like Elvis and Eminem mainstream it for suburban whites.

I remember when white kids started saying "fo shizzle my nizzle, lets go the the hizzouse. Snoop had to drop that shit right away when that happened.

I've done it myself now that I think about it. When I was in high school we always drank beer. After seeing Boyz N the Hood, we stopped buying regular cans and started buying 40s of St. Ides or Olde English. Cause we wanted to be like Ice Cube, he was so fucking cool.

My grandparents would probably not have been allowed to date Italians, my Mum got a sideways look for dating a Jew, I know the stigma around my generation dating blacks, but for kids growing up now it's not something that ever enters their mind. I mean, who gets upset about Italians any more?

There are some. I am Italian and I live in Kentucky. There are very few of us down here. The only Italians they like are named Pitino and Calipari.
 

Rembrandt

Banned
Imo the problem comes from disgusting racism not from a person from another ethnicity appreciating and trying to replicate (out of admiration) that certain part of another culture.

Okay, whatever, it's black people's fault. I'm done with this topic because we'll go in circles and I'm not going to debate this topic with someone unwilling to understand.
 

Kinyou

Member
Are they doing it because they admire the person, or think that they have neat things/styles that they want to have?
Doesn't that come from a similar place? I doubt this girl would say this hairstyle is ugly when she sees a black girl with it. It would seem logical to me that she appreciated it and didn't shame anyone who has it.
 

Rktk

Member
Eminem came from poverty and has his own style of rapping. But keep going, watching ignorant people run their mouth is amusing.

Either you missed sarcasm, which isn't amusing, or you're forgetting that plenty of people, the kind getting mad at this kid, were and are mad that Eminem is white.
 
This is severely ignorant of the point being made, and really offensive to compare saying that it's not okay for white people to do "black stuff" to saying that black people can't attend the same schools or eat at the same restaurants as white people. It's not about overlapping - it's about the idea that black people's hairstyles are mocked or otherwise insulted by white people, but then when it becomes stylish to white people, white people talk about how much they love it, and eventually, something created in black culture is homogenized and its history is erased in a way that doesn't happen with white culture.



Culture can, in theory, be controlled in a way oxygen cannot (or should not) be controlled, and it should definitely not be up to others to tell people in a certain culture that the culture no longer belongs to them. In a perfect world, we would have a cultureless world, because that perfect world wouldn't erase non-white accomplishments or ideas by forcefully adopting them. The cultures get taken while the people who made them are left in the dust. People remember the accomplishments of white people, but the only thing people remember about black people is peanuts (and I don't even know if kids these days even know this anymore).

I'll ask a very simple question. How can a desegregated society exist if cultures cannot merge? By your logic black women who straighten their hair should be looked down upon. Black men who wear jeans should be looked down upon. Anyone who does anything that was created and made popular by another culture should be looked down upon. So call me ignorant, but how can desegregation actually happen when people carry this attitude toward culture?


That's not at all what people are implying when they bring up cultural appropriation.

There are some minorities who do want a form of segregation, but it's a vanishingly small sect, and not really relevant to the topic at hand. And the two ideas are not inherently linked.
Thanks for the non retaliatory response. Creating imaginary lines that cannot be crossed by people of another race is a form of segregation.
 
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