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Why Some People Hate TLOU2?

Jedeye Sniv

Banned
I loved the shit out of this game, but IMO one reason people took against it was it was so damn long. You think it's over and then bam, you have the same length again to play. I remember thinking when playing it, it's like the game contained its own DLC. And because the second half was a secret spoiler, we just had no idea how long it was going for. It was fatiguing.

I can't respect the anti-SJW opinions because they're for the most part a bit pathetic and poorly thought out. Ellie and Dinah was probably the most realistically loving couple I've ever seen in a game. Abby getting hench as a reaction to her trauma was subtle and her journey from total rage prick to utterly humbled was painful and affecting. Having the balls to make you play as someone you hate is very brave and feeds into the themes of forgiveness and seeing-the-other-side that the game keeps just out of reach for almost the entire runtime. Loved how they killed Joel like a chump, because it made me so upset.

But for me, this was it. We thought it was over, then it had a whole other game.
 

StreetsofBeige

Gold Member
You don't seem to have a problem with anyone saying the game has bad writing.


Do you say to them, "Many people like this game. They enjoy the writing and the story"? You don't. I'm just discussing the story. People are free to hate it.
It does have bad writing. The part of the game which Joel and Tommy get gangtackled is a ridiculous scene.

As people have said, how/why would such a seasoned survival vet who is supposed to be this resourceful, stealthy, outdoorsy guy who doesn't trust anyone in a shitty world suddenly enters a house, spill the beans what to do like he's suddenly a gossip queen, and stand in the middle of a living room allowing himself to get surrounded by like 6 thugs.

The average real life person in present day wouldn't even do that if they were near a bunch of random weird people who might jump them.

Yet Super Joel who is supposed to be expert survivalist does it so the plot can move along to Abby.
 
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ksdixon

Member
  • identical gameplay with more polish

the gameplay under default settings was actually a slight step backwards.
  • you can't swap a brick and bottle, you must now destroy one in order to pick up the other.

  • I had to go into the admittedly very good customizability options and accessibility options, to make it to where I could press [] to melee, when aiming my gun, like it was in TLOU1.

  • this one might be personal choice, but I dislike TLOU2's workbench upgrade and backpack crafting menu's. I prefer TLOU1's layout for sure.
 

NinjaBoiX

Member
All this talk of politics and pushing an agenda is crazy talk to me. They just wrote a story with some taboo subject matter, maybe it was trying to be a little too progressive to the point that you may argue it comes across as try hard but there are worse things in the world.

Again, it’s the sheer vitriol I don’t get.
 

begotten

Member
The real problem with TLOU2, which I don't see ANYONE ever talk about or mention is that Naughty Dog grossly misunderstood what the fans thought made the first game.

So since we had all these fucking virgins playing the first game, who were in love with a 14 year old and kept harping on about how "they related" to Ellie, literally due to lack of real life social experience - Ellie became wrongfully shoehorned into the star of the game. She had fan-art everywhere and had permas' on social media representing her in every way possible, so of course Naughty Dog noticed this and their perception of their own fucking work became distorted. They fed the hunger for this little girl in their only DLC for the first installment, and for the second installment to be central to Ellies' development.

Meanwhile, most people with a brain, knew that JOEL was CLEARLY what made the first game special.

So if you want to know the real reason why people hate 2, it's because the soul of the first game became disposable in the second, and then we ended up being stuck with this character from the first game who became exposed and most finally realised "What, what the fuck is this idiot of a character"

Oh yeah, and don't forget you have to play as he-man for half the game and watch it get pounded in the ass.

So there you have it. If you ever cosplayed as Ellie or you had her as your PSN Avatar, then YOU were the reason why Naughty Dog dished up stage 4 cancer in a video game.

Have a nice day :messenger_winking_tongue:
 

ksdixon

Member
It does have bad writing. The part of the game which Joel and Tommy get gangtackled is a ridiculous scene.

As people have said, how/why would such a seasoned survival vet who is supposed to be this resourceful, stealthy, outdoorsy guy who doesn't trust anyone in a shitty world suddenly enters a house, spill the beans what to do like he's suddenly a gossip queen, and stand in the middle of a living room allowing himself to get surrounded by like 6 thugs.

The average real life person in present day wouldn't even do that if they were near a bunch of random weird people who might jump them.

Yet Super Joel who is supposed to be expert survivalist does it so the plot can move along to Abby.

This is what pisses me off. Joel can die. That's a pretty standard revenge trope. I don't like it, but fine.
The "way" he died like a bitch to a gold club, and the "way in which he got into the situation" by not acting like experienced survivalist Joel... is just too rediculous to accept. The whole setup is just non-sensical.

And that's besides getting into other stupid things like false marketing showing Joel alive, Manny spitting on Joel's corpse, players having to play as Abbey for most of the game, playing as Abby and hurting Ellie, Ellie letting Abby go at the end of the game, Dina being a selfish, self-centered cow, Jessie getting cheated-on and then fridged... It's all a fucking trainwreck.
 

StreetsofBeige

Gold Member
The real problem with TLOU2, which I don't see ANYONE ever talk about or mention is that Naughty Dog grossly misunderstood what the fans thought made the first game.

So since we had all these fucking virgins playing the first game, who were in love with a 14 year old and kept harping on about how "they related" to Ellie, literally due to lack of real life social experience - Ellie became wrongfully shoehorned into the star of the game. She had fan-art everywhere and had permas' on social media representing her in every way possible, so of course Naughty Dog noticed this and their perception of their own fucking work became distorted. They fed the hunger for this little girl in their only DLC for the first installment, and for the second installment to be central to Ellies' development.

Meanwhile, most people with a brain, knew that JOEL was CLEARLY what made the first game special.

So if you want to know the real reason why people hate 2, it's because the soul of the first game became disposable in the second, and then we ended up being stuck with this character from the first game who became exposed and most finally realised "What, what the fuck is this idiot of a character"

Oh yeah, and don't forget you have to play as he-man for half the game and watch it get pounded in the ass.

So there you have it. If you ever cosplayed as Ellie or you had her as your PSN Avatar, then YOU were the reason why Naughty Dog dished up stage 4 cancer in a video game.

Have a nice day :messenger_winking_tongue:
LOL. Nicely said.

Oh yeah, and don't forget you have to play as he-man for half the game and watch it get pounded in the ass.
And who the hell wanted to see that in LoU2? lol
 

Tiptop10

Neo Member
I lost interest half way through when control switched from Ellie to Abby.
Honestly, don't know why, but I never picked the game up again after playable Abby's opening cutscene in the headquarters place.

You're really missing out, general consensus is that's when the gameplay really took a leap and everything got a lot more intense and (imo) fun and interesting. Of course it's probably contingent on just how much you hated the abby character.
 

ksdixon

Member
The real problem with TLOU2, which I don't see ANYONE ever talk about or mention is that Naughty Dog grossly misunderstood what the fans thought made the first game.

So since we had all these fucking virgins playing the first game, who were in love with a 14 year old and kept harping on about how "they related" to Ellie, literally due to lack of real life social experience - Ellie became wrongfully shoehorned into the star of the game. She had fan-art everywhere and had permas' on social media representing her in every way possible, so of course Naughty Dog noticed this and their perception of their own fucking work became distorted. They fed the hunger for this little girl in their only DLC for the first installment, and for the second installment to be central to Ellies' development.

Meanwhile, most people with a brain, knew that JOEL was CLEARLY what made the first game special.

So if you want to know the real reason why people hate 2, it's because the soul of the first game became disposable in the second, and then we ended up being stuck with this character from the first game who became exposed and most finally realised "What, what the fuck is this idiot of a character"

Oh yeah, and don't forget you have to play as he-man for half the game and watch it get pounded in the ass.

So there you have it. If you ever cosplayed as Ellie or you had her as your PSN Avatar, then YOU were the reason why Naughty Dog dished up stage 4 cancer in a video game.

Have a nice day :messenger_winking_tongue:

Respectfully, I don't think this is true at all.

TLOU1 Ellie didn't go around spouting bigot sandwitches. She also didn't (literally) fuck around on patrols, because she knew the importance of losing friends and family to the virus. TLOU1 Ellie had a range of emotions, she could be serious, pissed off, hurt, and somewhat niave about the old world, or childish with the joke books. TLOU2 Ellie was just an unlikeable bint, and takes herself down a peg from TLOU1 Ellie. But that's not fans doing that, that's Neil.
 

DForce

NaughtyDog Defense Force
It does have bad writing. The part of the game which Joel and Tommy get gangtackled is a ridiculous scene.

As people have said, how/why would such a seasoned survival vet who is supposed to be this resourceful, stealthy, outdoorsy guy who doesn't trust anyone in a shitty world suddenly enters a house, spill the beans what to do like he's suddenly a gossip queen, and stand in the middle of a living room allowing himself to get surrounded by like 6 thugs.

The average real life person in present day wouldn't even do that if they were near a bunch of random weird people who might jump them.

Yet Super Joel who is supposed to be expert survivalist does it so the plot can move along to Abby.


The same guy who agreed to follow Henry to meet up with his friends? A group of people he didn't know?

The average person wouldn't think twice running for safety while being chased by a horde of infected. We have already seen Abby, Tommy and Joel struggle to fend off a the infected by themselves, they needed help.


But lets take this a step further.


David and Ellie didn't trust each other when they first met. Ellie made David give up his gun while "buddy boy" left to get Medicine for Joel. When the horde showed up, they worked together. David could've killed Ellie or captured Ellie at any given moment, but he decided to spare her because he wanted to find Joel.

But there's more.

Henry didn't truth Joel with Sam. It was only until they were running from an infected. Henry had no choice but to let Joel guard Sam.


In the Last of Us Part II, Joel and Tommy didn't have many options. They only had seconds to decide where to go, and the safest route was to follow Abby.


This is why the excuse of "Joel, the expert survivalist" narrative doesn't work. If any person was being chased a group of infected, they're not going to be selective on where they go. They couldn't fight off the infected at two locations, so they had to settle for a third.
 

StreetsofBeige

Gold Member
This is what pisses me off. Joel can die. That's a pretty standard revenge trope. I don't like it, but fine.
The "way" he died like a bitch to a gold club, and the "way in which he got into the situation" by not acting like experienced survivalist Joel... is just too rediculous to accept. The whole setup is just non-sensical.

And that's besides getting into other stupid things like false marketing showing Joel alive, Manny spitting on Joel's corpse, players having to play as Abbey for most of the game, playing as Abby and hurting Ellie, Ellie letting Abby go at the end of the game, Dina being a selfish, self-centered cow, Jessie getting cheated-on and then fridged... It's all a fucking trainwreck.
ND tried to be clever with the story. Kind of going for that plot twist Memento movie thing.

If you exclude the leaked footage and that Reddit/4Chan guy who literally listed the scenarios he did in a focus group and strictly didn't know anything about LoU2 except for the handful of trailers, every gamer expected it would be Joel and Ellie kicking ass beat the bad guy at the end.

Turns out one dies fast and the game morphs into a double plotline of back and forth gameplay where they meet at the end, where one side evolved from a dead person nobody thought about from the first game.

Ok, any game or movie can go for a twist. Some times it works, sometimes it doesn't.

It's like watching season one of Broadchurch. It doesn't. If anyone wants to waste their time in an episodic whodunit drama, skip season one. I don't know, maybe seasons 2 and 3 are better.
 
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StreetsofBeige

Gold Member
The same guy who agreed to follow Henry to meet up with his friends? A group of people he didn't know?

The average person wouldn't think twice running for safety while being chased by a horde of infected. We have already seen Abby, Tommy and Joel struggle to fend off a the infected by themselves, they needed help.


But lets take this a step further.


David and Ellie didn't trust each other when they first met. Ellie made David give up his gun while "buddy boy" left to get Medicine for Joel. When the horde showed up, they worked together. David could've killed Ellie or captured Ellie at any given moment, but he decided to spare her because he wanted to find Joel.

But there's more.

Henry didn't truth Joel with Sam. It was only until they were running from an infected. Henry had no choice but to let Joel guard Sam.


In the Last of Us Part II, Joel and Tommy didn't have many options. They only had seconds to decide where to go, and the safest route was to follow Abby.


This is why the excuse of "Joel, the expert survivalist" narrative doesn't work. If any person was being chased a group of infected, they're not going to be selective on where they go. They couldn't fight off the infected at two locations, so they had to settle for a third.
Got to hand to you.

Anytime someone doesn't like something Sony, you sure know how to defend the roost, even though you just mentioned before "people are free to hate the game".
 

MagnesG

Banned
Respectfully, I don't think this is true at all.

TLOU1 Ellie didn't go around spouting bigot sandwitches. She also didn't (literally) fuck around on patrols, because she knew the importance of losing friends and family to the virus. TLOU1 Ellie had a range of emotions, she could be serious, pissed off, hurt, and somewhat niave about the old world, or childish with the joke books. TLOU2 Ellie was just an unlikeable bint, and takes herself down a peg from TLOU1 Ellie. But that's not fans doing that, that's Neil.
Yeah. Apparently a more mature Ellie is much more of a retard than the child one.
 
HERES MY REASON FOR NOT BUYING IT

-you play most of the game as abby, we dont know shit about her
-you push your agenda so hard, you forget why so many got attached to the first one
 

DForce

NaughtyDog Defense Force
Got to hand to you.

Anytime someone doesn't like something Sony, you sure know how to defend the roost, even though you just mentioned before "people are free to hate the game".
It's not about Sony, it's about stories that I like. I will discuss any of my favorite movies in the same manner.

I also write stories as a hobby, so every bit of small details about a story intrigues me.
 
The story they went with is totally ridiculous. Having the roided-up daughter of a random doctor Joel killed on the way to saving Ellie take center stage makes the whole story seem like a sad, stupid joke. The whole thing just descends into comic absurdity, it doesn't add any depth whatsoever.

Can you imagine playing both these games in a row to take in the whole story? While you're playing TLOU1 you'd be thinking 'Boy I can't wait till Joel gets brained by a golf club by Steroid Woman in the second game, it really enriches everything happening now. From losing his daughter, to gaining Ellie, to a nine iron. If only games could get Oscars right?'

Also, the whole controversy over Joel saving Ellie's life is dumb too. 'Sorry I didn't let these weirdos kill you without your consent, new surrogate daughter, after everything we've been through.' And Ellie's angry because she wanted to be Jesus I guess. She should have been angry at her dad for like a day or two for lying to her about it and then gotten over it like any kid because of course you would. You're still alive. Self-preservation is awfully strong with any living being. None of it is even half as deep as it likes to think it is.

Also, just having really bad and awful things happen all the time isn't deep or meaningful either. It's just a godless, nihilistic game made by identity politics-obsessed elitists who think they are way smarter than they actually are. Their shitty world view infects the story like a cancer.
 
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ksdixon

Member
Ellie's body count is massive but she realizes the folly of revenge at the end to spare Abby? That didn't work for me at all.

Quoted For Truth.

On a related note, what's with all the forced-emotions in the cutscenes?
This is Ellie, she's killed lots of people throughout the first game, it's DLC, and TLOU2. That's just apocalypse life.

But the game tells us she's oh so distraught over it all? Like she salughters thousands of people who're innocent, on her journey to Abbey, but has feelings about killing the group of people whom have ''actually'' wronged her and were apart of Joel's death? What the hell ''is'' that? OOC it's manipulative, but that disconnect between game Ellie and cutscene Ellie isn't addressed in the game, I don't think.

It's like where the game chastizes us the player for killing the dog, when the game didn't give us a way around it? Kind of like how TLOU2 tells us ''Joel Bad Man, He Kill Doctor'', when, once again, TLOU1 gave us no option to not kill the doctor.

Just... Fuck off, Neil.

Do the MP mode, and then fuck off.
 

ksdixon

Member
The hate is Because of Joels tragic death and the focusing on his murder Abby

That's only part of it, man.

  • It's the personality changes for TLOU1 characters.
  • It's the jumping back and forth to past and presant.
  • It's the pacing issues (I'm on a revenge mission, but lemme just sing to my gf in a music shop right quick).
  • It's the delaying of Factions MP.
  • It's the disconnect between game Ellie and cutscene Ellie (feel bad, player! look at what you did!)
  • It's the throwning-out of TLOU1 established lore (those bank vault Runners should have evolved into Bloaters after 20 years, or at least been mushroom-fungused onto the wall by now).
  • ...., ...., .....
 

Ulysses 31

Member
It's like where the game chastizes us the player for killing the dog, when the game didn't give us a way around it? Kind of like how TLOU2 tells us ''Joel Bad Man, He Kill Doctor'', when, once again, TLOU1 gave us no option to not kill the doctor.
There's also something to be said about the doctor willing to kill without informed consent and pulling a scalpel on someone head-on who clearly outguns him and not getting out of his way... 👀 👀 👀
 
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ZywyPL

Banned
Hate brings nothing but hate in return (which is where I totally agree with Druckmann), so I think most if not all of the hate towards the game comes solely from the fact that people just needed to abreact over the rabbid fanboys who desperately defended the game by calling everyone -phobes, XB fanboys, too dumb to understand the game and what's not. The game's director himself adding gasoline to the fire by calling anyone who didn't like his personal vision/agenda a dumb hater etc. didn't help either.

The game simply is not a continuation of Ellie's and Joe's journey through post-apocalyptic world and the father-daughter relationship between them, which is what made the original so great in the very first place, and was exactly what many fans of the original wanted to experience once again, and that would've even been fine if it wasn't for the false marketing that hid the sudden direction spin the series took, and Sony striking down everyone on the internet who actually tried to warn people. So whoever bought the game hoping for that journey to continent has all the rights to feel fooled, betrayed, whatever you want to call it, and calling those people dumb, fanboys, haters, retards etc. just amps their frustration.
 

Bramble

Member
I welcome you to the arcane knowledge of the fact that not everyone has the same taste in games.

What am I reading? There a HUGE difference between not liking a game and moving on to something you do like and profoundly hating a game to the point you harass the people that worked on it and vote for another game so it doesn't win an award. I have never seen anything like it.

So everyone globally, must like the game, otherwise they are a troll? What kinda retarded logic is that?

See above.
 
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I really liked TLOU2, for the game play and even the story.
Not happy with everything in it, but I didn't go in expecting feel-good nostalgia masturbation session with my fav game characters.
There are some moments in the game that make you feel bad maybe even sickened by what is happening while you're "forced" to play through it.
There is no happy endings for anyone in this game.
 
What am I reading? There a HUGE difference between not liking a game and moving on to something you do like and profoundly hating a game to the point you harass the people that worked on it and vote for another game so it doesn't win an award. I have never seen anything like it.



See above.
I don't think that's how it went with this game. Some liked the game, while some hated what the game became, and some just don't care for the game. The game actually caused some people who absolutely loved the first game, to hate the sequel. That's why this game has so many mixed feelings. The people who didn't vote for the game, weren't going to vote for it anyways. No conspiracy there. People need to just accept the fact that the game isn't as great as some claim it to be. I could say the same with cyberpunk. Great fucking game so far, yet not everyone will enjoy it the same. Different strokes for different folks.
 

jadedm17

Member
Because they don’t like good games, or they are trolls.

Or just found it painfully boring? Ans a waste of time ans effort?

Loved the first game. Beat several times. Lots of multiplayer.

Gave up on TLOU2 the second time it made me play that other girl everyone hates. I had no interest in her story and then realized I had little interest in Ellies story. So i moved on.

Waste of $60.
 

Bramble

Member
I don't think that's how it went with this game. Some liked the game, while some hated what the game became, and some just don't care for the game. The game actually caused some people who absolutely loved the first game, to hate the sequel. That's why this game has so many mixed feelings. The people who didn't vote for the game, weren't going to vote for it anyways. No conspiracy there. People need to just accept the fact that the game isn't as great as some claim it to be. I could say the same with cyberpunk. Great fucking game so far, yet not everyone will enjoy it the same. Different strokes for different folks.

Bro, there were dedicate 4chan/reddit pages committed to not letting the game win TGA Players Choice award. Most of these people voting for Ghost of Tsushima, did not even play that game, most likely (and I highly doubt they played TLoU2).
 
Bro, there were dedicate 4chan/reddit pages committed to not letting the game win TGA Players Choice award. Most of these people voting for Ghost of Tsushima, did not even play that game, most likely (and I highly doubt they played TLoU2).
If it won an award, would that make the game better for you, or for anyone? I'm not understanding your logic on this one honestly. If the game was as amazing as you claim, it would have won the award. But these awards are won by votes, and since the majority didn't vote for the game....
 

Saruhashi

Banned
Bro, there were dedicate 4chan/reddit pages committed to not letting the game win TGA Players Choice award. Most of these people voting for Ghost of Tsushima, did not even play that game, most likely (and I highly doubt they played TLoU2).

You frequently visit 4chan? Big yikes.

Ghost of Tsushima is a better game and deserves its win.

Hades probably deserves game of the year and it would be nice to see indie games getting some real love at awards shows instead of the usual AAA stuff.

Maybe you should just get over the fact that people just hated the game. Instead of cooking up wild conspiracies about shadowy groups on 4 chan etc to try and pretend that the only people who hated it must be trolls or just bad people.

Its a game. Many loved it. Some hated it. Deal with it.
 
I enjoyed the game. Although it did have its flaws.

I get the never ending cycle of revenge theme but it did get tiresome. For all they hate Abby gets I think Ellie was the more annoying character. I don't want revenge, I do want it, I don't want it, I do want it, I don't want it, I do want it. I get that ND was going for a revenge theme but it did drag out towards the end. I didn't like the ending, because the theme means Ellie could potentially change her mind yet again and want to kill her.....

The Joel thing didn't bother me. He was still in the game even after he died at moments.

I didn't mind paying as Abby. A lot of snowflakes were bothered because she was a bit masculine (like it's impossible for a woman in a post apoloclytic harsh world environment to be muscley). Its not like all the women were muscly. The game also never felt preachy. I think a lot of those complaints are from people tha lt havnt even played the game.

I'd get this game a 8/10 max though. Just because it was getting tedious in the end and the story wasn't as good. Wasn't a fan of the crafting upgrade table mechanics either.
 
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DonJimbo

Member
That's only part of it, man.

  • It's the personality changes for TLOU1 characters.
  • It's the jumping back and forth to past and presant.
  • It's the pacing issues (I'm on a revenge mission, but lemme just sing to my gf in a music shop right quick).
  • It's the delaying of Factions MP.
  • It's the disconnect between game Ellie and cutscene Ellie (feel bad, player! look at what you did!)
  • It's the throwning-out of TLOU1 established lore (those bank vault Runners should have evolved into Bloaters after 20 years, or at least been mushroom-fungused onto the wall by now).
  • ...., ...., .....
From graphical point it was a masterpiece
And we got disappointed because of the lies ND told us about the game before release and ruined the success of the best game of the seventh generation by making the story a mishmash hell I cried when I saw that bad killing with the golf and I was disgusted by that sex scene that was really unnecessary and the death of the dog made me rage aswell
Neill made the game a Hollywood disaster not a success
 

Bramble

Member
If it won an award, would that make the game better for you, or for anyone? I'm not understanding your logic on this one honestly. If the game was as amazing as you claim, it would have won the award. But these awards are won by votes, and since the majority didn't vote for the game....

Nope, it's one of the best games I ever played. I'm fine with it winning absolutely no awards. Just something I notice and cannot understand. Imagine hating something so much, while people poor their heart and soul into making it, just to entertain you.

I see you never heard of poll highjacking? This is meant to make sure a not so obvious choice wins. It can be done with bots or just by making as much people possible vote on other stuff.

You frequently visit 4chan? Big yikes.

Ghost of Tsushima is a better game and deserves its win.

Hades probably deserves game of the year and it would be nice to see indie games getting some real love at awards shows instead of the usual AAA stuff.

Maybe you should just get over the fact that people just hated the game. Instead of cooking up wild conspiracies about shadowy groups on 4 chan etc to try and pretend that the only people who hated it must be trolls or just bad people.

Its a game. Many loved it. Some hated it. Deal with it.

No, I don't even know the URL to 4chan, but I can read and other sites reported about it (Twitter amongst them).

That's your opinion. I love GoT very much, but I like TLoU2's story more and technically it's absolutely superior to GoT in every way. Which is fine, because SP is not as big as ND is as of yet.

I love Hades too, but more as a game I play on my Switch while taking a dump. Not AAA GOTY material if you ask me. Indie of the year? Most definitely.
 

Phobos Base

Member
It did expose Sony's hypocrisy when it comes to sex as well. They censor Dead or Alive Xtreme, which whilst highly sexulised has no actual nudity or explicit acts, but a graphic rough sex scene in this game is perfectly acceptable.
 

Dunki

Member
There's also something to be said about the doctor willing to kill without informed consent and pulling a scalpel on someone head-on who clearly outguns him and not getting out of his way... 👀 👀 👀
Even more funny is that in the Flashback in the Hospital. When they talk about Joel and Ellie he would have done exactly the same as Joel. Save his Daughter. He never really says it but when he got asked if you would let your child die for the sake of humanity he stays totally silent. But hey Joel was the bad Person^^
 

JediMind

Neo Member
Anybody that played the game (and it has the best completion rate of any game in PlayStation 4) can see:

  • The revenge cycle theme is fantastic.
  • The story is deep and keep you engaged to know what it will happen next.
  • Characters are great with it own complications with amazing development (I can't find one to be bad).
  • The gameplay is again flawless... it is perfection.
  • The enemy variety is now way better.
  • The weapons and craft items are way better than original.
  • The world and environment are fantastic.
  • Side activities are great.
  • It humanizes all sides... it is impactful and emotionally driven.

The game is everything a sequel should be.
It is a must to play even if you get down due violence.

So I really can't understand the hate some GAFers has with one of the best games ever created.

PS. I really can't even understand the political controversy... I really can't see politics in the game... maybe because I'm not American? I don't know.

Edit - Making this thread just me miss even more Factions MP... I blamed ND for that and I will continue doing that because that decision was utter shit.
This is exactly how I feel about this game. Masterpiece :)
 

Barnabot

Member
It's simple. They're homophobes/transphobes.
euvdkaW.gif
 

oagboghi2

Member
The same guy who agreed to follow Henry to meet up with his friends? A group of people he didn't know?

The average person wouldn't think twice running for safety while being chased by a horde of infected. We have already seen Abby, Tommy and Joel struggle to fend off a the infected by themselves, they needed help.


But lets take this a step further.


David and Ellie didn't trust each other when they first met. Ellie made David give up his gun while "buddy boy" left to get Medicine for Joel. When the horde showed up, they worked together. David could've killed Ellie or captured Ellie at any given moment, but he decided to spare her because he wanted to find Joel.

But there's more.

Henry didn't truth Joel with Sam. It was only until they were running from an infected. Henry had no choice but to let Joel guard Sam.


In the Last of Us Part II, Joel and Tommy didn't have many options. They only had seconds to decide where to go, and the safest route was to follow Abby.


This is why the excuse of "Joel, the expert survivalist" narrative doesn't work. If any person was being chased a group of infected, they're not going to be selective on where they go. They couldn't fight off the infected at two locations, so they had to settle for a third.
And he couldn’t just lie about his name?
 

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CliffyB's Cock Holster
It did expose Sony's hypocrisy when it comes to sex as well. They censor Dead or Alive Xtreme, which whilst highly sexulised has no actual nudity or explicit acts, but a graphic rough sex scene in this game is perfectly acceptable.

Yes its perfectly acceptable because its a character moment, not a spank-fest. Big difference.

Personally I wouldn't censor either, but your examples are polar opposites in terms of intent and function.
 

StreetsofBeige

Gold Member
It did expose Sony's hypocrisy when it comes to sex as well. They censor Dead or Alive Xtreme, which whilst highly sexulised has no actual nudity or explicit acts, but a graphic rough sex scene in this game is perfectly acceptable.
Ya. Sony censored DMC for showing an ass.

Yet, LoU2 shows tits and a dude doing doggystyle with full on grunts and groans.
 

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CliffyB's Cock Holster
Coming to the conclusion that this is the new "what is the best Final Fantasy" topic.

Consensus is literally impossible!
 

sainraja

Member
Quoted For Truth.

On a related note, what's with all the forced-emotions in the cutscenes?
This is Ellie, she's killed lots of people throughout the first game, it's DLC, and TLOU2. That's just apocalypse life.

But the game tells us she's oh so distraught over it all? Like she salughters thousands of people who're innocent, on her journey to Abbey, but has feelings about killing the group of people whom have ''actually'' wronged her and were apart of Joel's death? What the hell ''is'' that? OOC it's manipulative, but that disconnect between game Ellie and cutscene Ellie isn't addressed in the game, I don't think.

It's like where the game chastizes us the player for killing the dog, when the game didn't give us a way around it? Kind of like how TLOU2 tells us ''Joel Bad Man, He Kill Doctor'', when, once again, TLOU1 gave us no option to not kill the doctor.

Just... Fuck off, Neil.

Do the MP mode, and then fuck off.

Yup. If they really wanted to show Ellie being affected by it so much then on her journey to Abby it should have been the infected slowing her down instead of "groups of people" that she encounters. What was the point of introducing other 'branded' groups? Made me think they were trying to be The Walking Dead of video games.
 
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CliffyB's Cock Holster
Yup. If they really wanted to show Ellie being affected by it so much then on her journey to Abby it should have been the infected slowing her down instead of "groups of people" that she encounters.

What? This is so dumb.

Killing infected is normal in the game world for everyone, and less stressful for Ellie because she's immune to bites and spore inhalation.

Infected don't speak, don't cry out when hurt or when they see a comrade or pet killed. They don't organize, don't attack tactically, don't hold grudges, and most of all they don't shoot back.

Its like the daft assertion that all the male characters in the game who get killed are shown as being weak and/or inferior to the female characters. The difference if you are actually paying attention is that they die as a result of sudden ambushes that give them no time to react. Things that you can't have happen to playable characters as its basically unfair in a gameplay sense.
 
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Its the greatest game of all time.

But they killed joel, after an amazing TLOU1, it just seems rushed, they could have made a trilogy and have him die for a greater reason later on. I get it, life doesnt need great reasons for a person to die...but this is still a videogame, and killing one of the most beloved characters in gaming in the past decade left a sour taste.
 

sainraja

Member
What? This is so dumb.

Killing infected is normal in the game world for everyone, and less stressful for Ellie because she's immune to bites and spore inhalation.

Infected don't speak, don't cry out when hurt or when they see a comrade or pet killed. They don't organize, don't attack tactically, don't hold grudges, and most of all they don't shoot back.

Its like the daft assertion that all the male characters in the game who get killed are shown as being weak and/or inferior to the female characters. The difference if you are actually paying attention is that they die as a result of sudden ambushes that give them no time to react. Things that you can't have happen to playable characters as its basically unfair in a gameplay sense.

You should also try to account for what I was saying that in response to. Regardless, the revenge story in this world doesn't really fit given how many people have had to kill each other and the countless lives both Ellie & Abby took on their journeys and in Abby's case, her 5 year quest for revenge; if they wanted to make some sense of it, it would have been better if Ellie faced the infected (and it doesn't just have to be 'clickers') so it doesn't come off as odd when she decides or realizes that revenge is "folly" and let's Abby go. Yes, she's immune. But she isn't invulnerable.

Its the greatest game of all time.

But they killed joel, after an amazing TLOU1, it just seems rushed, they could have made a trilogy and have him die for a greater reason later on. I get it, life doesnt need great reasons for a person to die...but this is still a videogame, and killing one of the most beloved characters in gaming in the past decade left a sour taste.

I think killing of Joel was a risky/gutsy move. They just didn't pull it off well. I really think that the Walking Dead shock factor affected decision making for The Last of Us: Part 2.
 
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CliffyB's Cock Holster
You should also try to account for what I was saying that in response to. Regardless, the revenge story in this world doesn't really fit given how many people have had to kill each other and the countless lives both Ellie & Abby took on their journeys and in Abby's case, her 5 year quest for revenge; if they wanted to make some sense of it, it would have been better if Ellie faced the infected (and it doesn't just have to be 'clickers') so it doesn't come off as odd when she decides or realizes that revenge is "folly" and let's Abby go. Yes, she's immune. But she isn't invulnerable.

You're grossly simplifying the reasons why the end of the game plays out like it does. Killing Mel is pretty much Ellie's breaking point; accidental or not killing a pregnant woman is unconscionable. Doubly so because of Ellie's personal situation (escorting Dina) and the presupposition that her quest for revenge has a moral justification as its basis.

Moving beyond that point and continuing to hunt Abby requires complete submission to rage over reason.

As things pan out, she doesn't get the chance to back out cleanly because Abby and Lev show up; at which point the similarities between them come into sharp focus. She knows why Abby came for Joel. She is somewhat "humanized" by her hurt at the loss of her friends, and the fact that she is swayed by Lev into sparing Dina and her unknown child as well as herself. Abby offers Ellie a glimpse of what awaits her down the road should she survive.

The reason for the about-face and deciding to pursue Abby and Lev to California is not a matter of choice for Ellie. She is suffering from PTSD and is functionally broken by the forgoing. She needs to confront her fear, her failure in order to move on. Abby is the focus but its not about her at all, its really about Ellie herself, her unresolved guilt over her estrangement for Joel, her inability to protect her friends and loved ones, and above all else her failure to confront her own fear.

Deep down, Abby is no longer the "other". She's not a mystery or some kind of quasi mythical "Moby Dick"; she is an externalized manifestation of Ellie's (and Joel's) inner darkness and turmoil.

This is why confronting and subduing her is enough to finish it, and why killing her is effectively an act of suicide.

I think killing of Joel was a risky/gutsy move. They just didn't pull it off well. I really think that the Walking Dead shock factor affected decision making for The Last of Us: Part 2.

I'm not disagreeing with you entirely, especially as I found the pacing issues to be most damaging in the first third of the game. It is kinda lumpy, but to a large extent that's a product of how the needs of the narrative bump hard against the needs of it being a game. Its the deep issue that anyone trying to craft a cinematic-style action game inevitably has to face up to; interactivity demands tutorialization and exposition for its systems and mechanics, which requires a different flow and cadence to that which communicates the narrative and characterization to its best effect.

Its quite a head-scratcher, and I know this from experience.

Similarly, considering this underlying issue, I find that organizing the story structure differently would lead to potentially worse problems for both gameplay and narrative. Its an old complaint of mine, lay people tend not to consider the consequences of their "obvious" fixes. They see a problem, mentally decide what they'd do differently, but don't think through how that change impacts everything thereafter.

In the long-run, that's been a major reason for why I've spent so much time arguing/defending the game, because as someone with familiarity with the process I can see a clear pattern of thought in their decision making process. Which isn't to say that I agree with every creative choice, just that I can imagine being in the room and hearing the arguments made for and against particular approaches.
 
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