-
Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.
Wii will cost less than 25,000 yen / $250
- Thread starter Jonnyram
- Start date
Drinky Crow
Banned
no, it brought the nostalgia and the waggle, which equates to fun only for those folks what stopped liking games some time ago. for most of the "waggle = fun" set that was when the n64 bomba, but for a certain old fogie crowd, it was when they tried to buy every game last gen not realizing that they weren't gonna recapture their childhood yet remained determined to try again this gen and hope that the change of parameters -- specifically, adding waggle and a childhood brand name -- will fix their ennui.
truth of the matter is, waggle and last-gen hardware will only tire you out more. buy a ps2!
drohne said:
I could list quite a few, but there's really no point because many here would start saying stuff like "Oh, but those games don't interest me" and such. Which is funny because it's something that only Nintendo can't get away with. Funny how that works out.
chrysostom
Member
Matt C. always comes off as a whiney McCrybaby.
Matt really should go to business school first before he starts playing armchair general. He's basically implying Nintendo release the Wii at $99 or $150, that just isn't going to work. There's no room for Nintendo to cut prices later on and secondly, it conveys the wrong signal to the market about the worth of the console.
It would certianly please certain people here to see it at $99 for their own reasons, but it's not going to happen. I call the $250 price ages ago, and it looks like Nintendo is going for that range. In anycase, expect 2 controllers and a pack in game if its that price and a casual can play right out of the box without the need to buy anything extra.
I don't consider balooning console prices and giving the consumer less and less gear to play with an advancement either. After all the adonns are done, the prices would be closer to $700
It would certianly please certain people here to see it at $99 for their own reasons, but it's not going to happen. I call the $250 price ages ago, and it looks like Nintendo is going for that range. In anycase, expect 2 controllers and a pack in game if its that price and a casual can play right out of the box without the need to buy anything extra.
I don't consider balooning console prices and giving the consumer less and less gear to play with an advancement either. After all the adonns are done, the prices would be closer to $700
Deku said:
Do they really need to cut the price ever? I always thought price cuts were to move a particular product more into the mass market-range as far as price goes. If it is already there, why cut it?
And the cost of Wifi is a little overstated. My PDA has wifi and it's a piece of shit. How much does it really cost to add onto a motherboard nowadays?
AniHawk said:
True. MS is seriously raping people hard on that though-- but it is external as opposed to part of the motherboard, so the cost probably increases slightly.
With the DS, PSP, PS3 "Premium," and "Wii" all having Wifi, I think it is probably pretty cheap. I don't know specifics though. I am more interested in the mechanism that will accept small and large size discs...that's something I haven't seen before.
Japan proved that price isn't always everything with the DS. The DS and Lite are selling extremely well there, but it hasn't gone below 10,000 Yen yet. For the Wii, starting at a higher price and allowing for price drops makes a lot of sense in terms of keeping the system on the public's radar in the future.
It's an interesting case with the DS being the success it is in Japan. I'm pretty sure it would take Nintendo only releasing pedophile-simulator games to take that machine out of the public consciousness. Even then it might be questionable.
But I understand what you mean. I see pros and cons to both. If the Wii were to come out at 99, just hypothetically (it won't), it could theoretically become the American Japanese DS. At that rate, you wouldn't even need to bother with keeping it in the public consciousness because...well, it is a cultural phenomenon like the iPod.
But I understand what you mean. I see pros and cons to both. If the Wii were to come out at 99, just hypothetically (it won't), it could theoretically become the American Japanese DS. At that rate, you wouldn't even need to bother with keeping it in the public consciousness because...well, it is a cultural phenomenon like the iPod.
As Deku said, putting it in the same price range, or even CHEAPER than a handheld with N64 graphics will make the market question its value. Whether or not you guys think it should be priced at something you feel for last gen. graphics doesn't really matter from a business point of view.
you don't really need to cut the price on this type of product though. i really doubt the graphics will improve drastically over the wii's lifespan and most of the system's best ideas will probably be tapped out in a year or two. nintendo could also debut at $150 and cut it down to $100 when ZELDA X MARIO or some insane bat shit releases three years down the road. Though, even within that realm of possibility you have to wonder how long nintendo even plans to have the (first generation) system around for.Deku said:
Spike said:
Damn right it's not his problem, and apparently it's not 360 or PS3s problem either since they're the one with the upper hand in software
sp0rsk said:
Of course the word itself is an exaggeration, but it's NOT an exaggeration to say I can barely stand this gens graphics anymore. To me, it IS quite bad. When I saw Wii graphics, I thought the same thing: oh no, not another system like this. Not another one. I force myself through many PS2, Gamecube and Xbox games because they are the systems I happen to own at the moment and the gameplay is still great in many titles, but it's getting to the point where I often rather play on my friends 360 just so I can experience the visual jump.
PS2 is of course the worst of the bunch, on my HDTV games look so awful that I can barely even stand to play the best of the bunch graphically - games like Kingdom Hearts II still hurt my eyes by the end.
sp0rsk said:
This is something we'll never agree on. Having experienced the thing, and its many features, it just transforms the experience with a console. It is pretty much the greatest thing to happen to consoles since analog control, in my view. For fuller thoughts, you can read this... but yeah, there's no convincing me I'm 'overblowing' it. I guess when I get a Xbox 360 of my own and don't just experience it from my friends home I might think differently, but atm I'm thinkin'... I hope to God Sony and Nintendo can even approach it.
DCharlie said:
Yeah, PS3 and 360 have taxform sims. Everything else is made for boredom, as opposed to being insanely awesome.
DjangoReinhardt said:
?
Lost Planet
Cry On
Blue Dragon
Lost Odyssey
Gears of War
Bioshock
Alan Wake
Stanglehold
Haze
Heavenly Sword
Resistance: Fall of Man
Assassin's Creed
Lair
Afrika
Of course, I could also be snarky like drohne and list sequels for Wii. Clearly, 360 and PS3 have more sequels... but that's more of an indication that they have superior software support than anything else. If devs are supporting you greater, you'll tend to get their biggest franchises as well as anything else.
soul creator
Member
Deku said:
but isn't the whole point of the Wii is that it isn't going after the traditional video game market? If the Wii is $99-$150, the market Nintendo is supposedly after won't see the "wrong signal"...they don't know how game console prices work in the first place, so why would they care?
thetrin
Hail, peons, for I have come as ambassador from the great and bountiful Blueberry Butt Explosion
soul creator said:
Because those people aren`t stupid. They buy tvs, phones, ipods and dvd players. They have a fake scale in their head that the Wii will throw out of whack if the price is too low. If they lower the price later, it`s looked at as a discount, which is different from an initially low price.
TheTrin said:They look quite bad? Really? You must have a terribly high bar for graphics. I still think SNES is good looking.
SNES has plenty of good looking games. 2D, however, is quite a different bar for me. 3D has a much higher bar to meet for me before they look good; all the possible flaws are just so much worse in 3D.
I really dont understand this thinking. After three years of owning a current gen system, I was still able to go back and replay Ocarina of Time. And I still play games of the DC era and earlier as well. 3D or not.
Kingdom Hearts II is gorgeous. Final Fantasy XII is gorgeous. Okami is gorgeous. Twilight Princess is gorgeous. What makes them, all of a sudden, suck?
I havent seen too great a leap with next gen. Certainly not the way we've seen it with the jump from last to current. Then again, I don't own an HDTV, surround sound system, or any of that extra shit that's supposed to make it "worth it." Nor do I plan to.
thetrin
Hail, peons, for I have come as ambassador from the great and bountiful Blueberry Butt Explosion
Amir0x said:
Well, if we`re talking 3D, then I still don`t agree. Imo, Vagrant Story is still a beautiful game. I don`t really care about fidelity, as much as I think about style and art direction. Jaggies and such really don`t matter that much to me, as long as what they have is used in a manner that really shows off a beautiful art style.
In that way, games like KH2 look absolutely awesome to me. I like you amirox, but after that post, I`m very very glad I`m not you. I wouldn`t enjoy half the games I enjoy now.
AniHawk said:
I have an HDTV, but it`s not terribly large, and it only does 480p. I`m not an audiophile or a graphics whore, and for me, it`s art direction that really makes or breaks the visual aspect of any game for me.
TheTrin said:
The point isn't to agree with me: If you can stand getting your eyes poked out by jaggies or the pixelation in Vagrant Story, that's fine. I'm just stating that from my perspective, this is no longer acceptable. And I imagine if you started releasing a new console (read: not a handheld) with graphics that just looked like Vagrant Story, the market would agree as well.
Yeah, I dont wanna come off sounding as the guy that would *rather* be playing games with Dreamcast visuals in the next gen
but for the small leap forward this next gen has taken visually, I don't really care to spend the money for that sort of jump.
Now when the technology makes something truly revolutionary (like what happened with the PS2 and GTA III), then I'll pay attention.
lol wii lol
Now when the technology makes something truly revolutionary (like what happened with the PS2 and GTA III), then I'll pay attention.
soul creator
Member
TheTrin said:
if they aren't stupid, they should be able to pick up on an existing game system without being "intimidated" by supposedly complex controls, lol
thetrin
Hail, peons, for I have come as ambassador from the great and bountiful Blueberry Butt Explosion
soul creator said:
Do you actually know people who aren`t gamers? Your post indicates that it`s possible you don`t. If you did, you wouldn`t say something so ridiculous.
Not everyone finds it fun to memorize what 12 different buttons do. My father is an incredibly intelligent and knowledgable person, but he finds operating a controller really frustrating. It`s not something he`S been using for years and years, and hasn`T become accustomed to all the additional buttons and changes. Unlike a remote control, which does the same thing for every dvd movie, a controller`S setup changes with every game, making it even harder for non gamers. If you`re not a gamer, that`s overwhelming.
As my father sometimes says, ``I love games, but games now days feel more like work than fun sometimes. I just wanna do something cool.``
TheTrin said:
Again, that's fine. I think it's quite the opposite - graphics should be emphasized MORE among the hardcore. Games are a visual medium, and there's no way I could deny that aspect or not give it the sort of focus it deserves. We view what we see on the screen and depending on what it is, it is part of how we connect to the title. People try to de-emphasize that because they must, because they want to seem hardcore, because they want to read a company line OR because they genuinely just don't care... but why would you find it sad for those who DO emphasize it?
Certainly it's nothing to find sad... I'm not exactly searching the world for the sort of visceral experiences I desire. If anything, it's sad to even care the sort of importance someone puts on visuals in VIDEOgames. Is it any wonder people connect more with things that approximate their dreams or their reality? I don't think so, in my view that's part of the ultimate vision of games from the start. And don't fool yourself either - Wii is an extension of this. Controlling movement in a 3D space is a natural evolution. Why? Because it more closely relates to how we interact in reality. The next step will be, once again, for Nintendo to pimp out better graphics.
Until such time for virtual reality.
Beezy said:
No, this is one of the only that I don't find overtly ugly for Wii. Naturally, that might change when they got the full product out.
TheTrin said:
I dunno, I think it could be equally sad that Nintendo is offering a gimped hardware package with a new controller just to attempt to make a point about technology. Advances in technology are *not* a bad thing, yet Nintendo refuses to evolve the Gamecube Turbo at all beyond the control scheme. Once we reach a graphical peak I may agree, but we are far from it. Nintendo is trying so hard to push the diminishing returns angle that the only system which isn't reaching a higher graphical fidelity is there own.
soul creator
Member
TheTrin said:
I know people who don't play games because they find the idea of controlling characters on screen silly, or because they may find gaming subject matter silly, or they'd just rather sit back and passively watch a movie instead of actively controlling a game.
I'm not saying that making controls more accessible is a bad thing, but I just don't think it's the primary reason for why non-gamers...non game. It's not as if my parents have this urge to play Ninja Gaiden but are intimidated by the controller S...they wouldn't play Ninja Gaiden regardless of how it controlled.
And it's just weird to me to be intimidated by any game controller, especially when some of those same people can drive cars, operate computers, play musical instruments, etc. And when people talk about game complexity, it generally refers to software interface design, not necessarily just the controller (of course, it's still a factor). Just because you have a dual analog controller with 12 buttons doesn't mean you have to use every single one.
edit: if he doesn't like the idea of remembering 12 different buttons for games, then simply play games that don't require you to remember 12 different buttons. They already exist, even with "standard" controllers. Problem solved, lol
Mrbob said:
Hate to bring out "diminishing returns" again, but when will we see a graphical peak? We've just experienced the shortest jump in visuals between any gen post-crash.
The Sony conference was the perfect example of what a lot of people are simply bored by. Better visuals (slightly so or otherwise) restricting actual gameplay enhancements. The animations in FFXIII and Heavenly Sword were lovely, but I doubt they couldn't exist on current systems or slightly upgraded ones.
But then, I'm huge on price. $400 and $600 video game consoles are fucking ridiculous as are $60 games. And I just don't see the reason why.
Why, in 1999 and 2000 and 2001, we paid half that for new video game consoles that offered far better visuals than the previous gen, with games that were equal and sometimes (such as with Nintendo), less the price.
Yikes at the number of people jumping on Matt's comments. I don't think you'll be too kind to most of the other editor's comments. :lol
I actually agree with Matt on the price point. $199, to me, is the perfect balance between being attractive to mass consumers as well as giving leeway for Nintendo to maneuver with the competition.
I actually agree with Matt on the price point. $199, to me, is the perfect balance between being attractive to mass consumers as well as giving leeway for Nintendo to maneuver with the competition.
AniHawk said:
Shortest jump? Hell no. Do we all forget the PS2 launch? It had games that barely looked better than DC games, and most of them worse. The only big jump PS2 had at launch was filtered polygons. The jump from Xbox to 360 has been just as big, and looks bigger with a HDTV set. The jump in quality of graphics has been astounding early in the 360 lifecycle. It has hit a higher curve quicker than the PS2 has, and developers have yet to tap the system.
Mrbob said:
The DC was current gen. It featured far more detailed characters and environments than the one before it. It had online play out of the box for free, and the discs could also hold far more than anything else on the market.
If the PS3 and 360 were $300 (and the games were $50), I'd have no problems. I know it sounds outrageous, but that's what happens when you let the insanity of it all sink in. Even sometimes I start thinking, "well, $600 isn't so bad"
Mrbob said:
There's a jump but its not really that impressive. I think the overuse of certain special effects tend to hide the underlying limitations, budgetary or otherwise of really exploiting the theoretic power of these machines.
We already had this discussion before. Next-gen in really is about next-generaiton of experiences and improving on graphics alone is fast becoming a dead end. We had the lead from 2-D to 3-D 10 years ago, and that was justifabily based mostly around graphics technology although the introduction of a controller to go along with it was also pivotal.
Wii will provide next-gen experiences insofar as have a new way to control games, and its on-line capabilities, which wasn't explored enough in the last generation.
soundwave05
Member
I think we're hitting diminishing returns due to economics.
Games like Perfect Dark 0, Madden NFL 2007, Dead or Alive 4, Kameo, Ridge Racer VI, etc. look good sure ... but they're just souped-up XBox level games in a pretty dress running at high def.
And I think the majority of PS3/360 games will be like that ... simply because it costs too much money to go beyond that in terms of graphics.
Where's the money/resources to generate these life-like/near-CGI graphics going to come from?
Is it magically going to pop up out of nowhere?
Even the big studios will not be able to make more than a few projects absolutely high end.
I think that's the reality. A lot of developers are already saying the $10 premium on games doesn't come close to covering the additional costs of developing on these new platforms.
It will cost a lot of money IMO to even make a game that pushes the Wii 100%.
Games like Perfect Dark 0, Madden NFL 2007, Dead or Alive 4, Kameo, Ridge Racer VI, etc. look good sure ... but they're just souped-up XBox level games in a pretty dress running at high def.
And I think the majority of PS3/360 games will be like that ... simply because it costs too much money to go beyond that in terms of graphics.
Where's the money/resources to generate these life-like/near-CGI graphics going to come from?
Is it magically going to pop up out of nowhere?
Even the big studios will not be able to make more than a few projects absolutely high end.
I think that's the reality. A lot of developers are already saying the $10 premium on games doesn't come close to covering the additional costs of developing on these new platforms.
It will cost a lot of money IMO to even make a game that pushes the Wii 100%.
$250 starts seeming plausible when you think about it like this. if the remote technology is only worth $50, then we might have seen titles that look more like 360 games (as opposed to GCN ones) at E3.Amir0x said:
then you have the argument that people won't pay $300~ for a video game system - which is bullshit imo, because im sure a huge number of households owned at least one of systems last generation (along with ipods, highspeed internet, etc)
i'm basing this on nothing at all