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[freenudemacusers]

Mass refunds should have happened with ps3 skyrim as well

yeah, that experience soured me on day one purchases for good. at least with games on platforms whose issues can't readily be addressed by the community.

 

[Petrae]

does anyone in here want a discussion?

any time someone has offered an opinion contrary to the idea that people should have unlimited time with a game but still be eligible to refund it they have been accused of being a "corporate shill", among other things.

Except it wasn't "unlimited time"; the primary case discussed in this thread is 50 hours-- including trudging through multiple errors-- before the user decided to give up.

If the game experience is broken, and the user can generate concrete evidence of such, then yeah. Refunds should come. Consumers should not be forced to wait for developers to fix fheir shit; funds in exchange for a good/service have changed hands.

As to whether consumers are "taking advantage" of No Man's Sky in this instance? It's possible-- but it also comes after a parade of games that have been broken in their launch windows have finally taken a toll on consumers to where they jump through this hoop. Some consumers have had enough of the lies, empty promises, and broken experiences.

Maybe this means that consumers shouldn't preorder and/or shouldn't buy on Day One? Perhaps. There's an argument to be made that consumers should do a better job of researching games before they drop $60 on them on launch day.

At some point, though, consumers are going to tire of the bullshit. $60 is not an insignificant amount of money to many people. They expect their games to work as advertised when they're purchased. No Man's Sky did not in many individual cases. If it wasn't the crashes, it was the realization that at least some of what Sean Murray and company claimed would be in the game was missing. It wasn't the product that was expected.

Maybe that's the consumer's fault in some ways-- but Hello Games has at least some culpability here, too.

And once a former Sony exec/indie champion starts leveling accusations of thievery because he's "too emotionally invested"? It gets ugly. There are no discussions to be had. Battle lines are drawn, and people take sides.

 

[7threst]

Shadi blocked me because I replied saying "60 dollars game that barely works, who are the thieves."

lmao

The guy has been an embarrassment over this whole thing. A damn shame to see go down.

 

[TheChamp]

Wonder how many times this has been refunded for Steam to add this on the NMS Store page

 

[Trojan]

I love this thread. It's turned into such a great cathartic payoff. Before these mass refunds the defenders of NMS/HG/Sean shrugged off the deceptive marketing and were blaming the disappointed players for "getting too hyped" and not appreciating this under-delivered masterpiece. There was nothing you could do about it so of course they're the ones in the right.

But now that many more people are able to get their money back these defenders have turned the argument into an ethical debate about whether you "deserve" a refund or if it's "right" to request a refund that's available to you. I cannot laugh harder at their reasoning. Eat shit you dumb fuckers and take a plate of it in a to-go box for Sean. You have no argument to support a developer that lies so blatantly so if you all the sudden want to get started with this ethical bullshit then you better be tweeting it at Sean.

This will go down in history as an instance where a game was so wantonly misleading that sellers had to actually step in and offer their consumers some additional recourse far and beyond what a game normally gets. Hello Games and Sean are done in the big video game business. I'm sure they'll release something else and collaborate on other things but this fiasco isn't a bruise to their reputation, it's a tattoo, they'll never be able to shake it. Molyneux didn't deliver on all his promises for Fable, BUT he still delivered Fable which had near-universal critical acclaim. Kojima sold Metal Gear Solid 2 on a demo that exclusively featured Snake and then switched to Raiden for most of the game, BUT he still delivered Metal Gear Solid 2 which had near-universal critical acclaim. Now Sean Murray didn't deliver on anything close to all of his promises for No Man's Sky and instead he delivered.... No Man's Sky, a 5/10 empty husk of a game.

I have no sympathy for the dev here. But you know what? I'm still interested in the game, just to see how much of a mess this game I was once hyped for turned out to be. So I'll buy it in a few months, but mark my words- I refuse to pay more than $10 for it. Also I'll make sure to buy used, that way Hello Games doesn't get a cent.

That's some serious schaedenfraude going on with you. Painting the entire dissenting opinion as "jaded" is one of the worst generalizations I've read on GAF in a while.

 

[fritzo]

But now that many more people are able to get their money back these defenders have turned the argument into an ethical debate about whether you "deserve" a refund or if it's "right" to request a refund that's available to you. I cannot laugh harder at their reasoning. Eat shit you dumb fuckers and take a plate of it in a to-go box for Sean. You have no argument to support a developer that lies so blatantly so if you all the sudden want to get started with this ethical bullshit then you better be tweeting it at Sean.

Yeah I defended the game a little, bought it right before release, played for a long time, and I realized I can get a refund, and got one from Sony. I do feel kinda bad about it, but only because I got a full refund really. I would be okay with a $40 credit to my PSN or something. It's not my fault that Sony wants to bite the bullet and give me $60 back. They could've easily said NO and be done with it; I wouldn't cry about it honestly. Only reason I know about the refund is from Gaf and reddit. I wonder what casuals are doing? Are they going back to gamestop/best buy/target/walmart and "demanding" refunds? I'd love to about hear real world scenarios.

 

[Hero_of_the_Day]

Wonder how many times this has been refunded for Steam to add this on the NMS Store page

Crazy. How long has that been there? Wonder if they're clamping down on this.

 

[Mad Season]

So ones a purchase is made does hello games keep the funds forever or do returns get money pulled from them?

 

[Petrae]

The guy has been an embarrassment over this whole thing. A damn shame to see go down.

That's some hill for his reputation to die on. I respected what he did before today. No more.

 

[LostDonkey]

Wonder how many times this has been refunded for Steam to add this on the NMS Store page

There are special exemptions in the UK though. Steams policy does not over rule UK Trading laws.

 

[Tony Iron Man Stark]

Anyone got a refund from GoG? Just curious.

Do it and come back with results.

 

[Nerix]

Also, for people who live in the EU try attaching this along with your request. http://www.which.co.uk/consumer-rights/regulation/consumer-rights-act

Isn't that UK legislation? UK <> EU (in a few years even more).

Other EU countries probably have similar legislation though.

 

[NoFaceNico]

That's some serious schaedenfraude going on with you. Painting the entire dissenting opinion as "jaded because couldn't get a refund" is one of the worst generalizations I've read on GAF in a while.

Great reading comprehension. I give it a 5/10. No refund.

If you don't think people weren't pissed off but then relieved when they found out they could get a refund outside of the typical return period then you must have posted in the wrong thread. Look at the title of this one alone.

 

[Rapscallion74]

They have like a 30 day money back guarentee IIRC so shouldn't be a problem.

GoG doesn't offer refunds unless there are technical issues they cannot resolve.

GoG refund policy

1. What is the Money Back Guarantee?
At GOG.com, we're confident in the quality of the games we sell and the work that we put into getting them ready for you to play them. If a game that you've bought on GOG.com doesn't work and our team of expert Support staff can't solve the problem for you, we will give you back your money.

 

[Hero_of_the_Day]

So ones a purchase is made does hello games keep the funds forever or do returns get money pulled from them?

Don't companies get paid once a month from Stream? So, they probably haven't received any money from Valve yet.

 

[SomTervo]

defense force

Really hate this phrase

 

[Air Zombie Meat]

no. What a stupid thing to say. One is wholly different than the other.

After that post I quoted I'm the stupid one, sure. My point is that digital buyers can't sell or trade so if they feel cheated or the game has broken for them what else can they do? You wouldn't shit on someone for selling the game, why do it when they get a refund? They obviously don't want to play it.

 

[LookAtMeGo]

Got denied another refund. I give up. You win Sony. Anyways. I threw the game back on to see if the new patch made the crashes any better and so far I have not had any when they were frequent before. So it looks like an improvement for sure. Thats good at least. Only played about 20 min tho but hey thats better than before.

 

[Lagamorph]

Anyone got a refund from GoG? Just curious.

I asked for one earlier today, but I've not had any response yet. It is Sunday though.

 

[freenudemacusers]

Really hate this word.

well the alternative was 'mindless corporate teat-sucking drones with no perspective or spine'

 

[QisTopTier]

Really hate this word.

Hey just like like people hate being ripped off, dealing with broken products, and being lied too!

 

[heliosRAzi]

Really hate this word.

Good thing it's two.

 

[VlaudTheImpaler]

Isn't that UK legislation? UK <> EU (in a few years even more).

Other EU countries probably have similar legislation though.

Dang, I'm in the states and haven't been following that whole situation so I don't know... but maybe they don't either so still give it a try? lol.

 

[7threst]

That's some hill for his reputation to die on. I respected what he did before today. No more.

Yeah, I kinda want to feel bad for him, but his arrogance and dismisiveness on twitter towards people with, which I think are legitimiate, complaints is just painful to read almost.

 

[Landford]

Wonder how many times this has been refunded for Steam to add this on the NMS Store page

Wow.

 

[Dynamite Shikoku]

Yeah, I kinda want tot feel bad for him, but his arrogance and dismisiveness on twitter towards people with, which I think are legitimiate, complaints is just painful to read almost.

Who is it?

 

[Stone Ocean]

There's no warranty on games. You're not entitled to any refund because you feel like it. Live with the choices you make rather than expecting other people to pay for them. It's a good life lesson. Being forced to swallow your $60 loss so you finally learn not to pre-order/overhype a game is a good thing. If the game NEVER worked for you, sure. Get your money back because you bought a broken product. But playing 30 hours with a few crashes or watching a YouTube rant about the game and then saying "yeah, I think I'm done with this, gimme back what I paid you" is about the lowest thing I can think of. Our culture of entitlement is unreal and frankly, some of you ought to be ashamed of yourselves.

Then there should be one. Devs keep sending out unpolished turds with no repercussion, its about time they start getting some meaningful repercussions from it.

You know whats shameful? The culture of corporate licking that has always been a part of gaming.

 

[Emperor_Uriel]

Wonder how many times this has been refunded for Steam to add this on the NMS Store page

Love it. They're feeling the heat.

Don't stop now. The more it gets reported on, the more refund requests will pile up, and the more likely they'll cave.

 

[Lagamorph]

Wonder how many times this has been refunded for Steam to add this on the NMS Store page

That would probably only apply to people who purchase after that notice was posted though, the special circumstances will still likely apply to people who purchased before.

 

[Got the Shakes]

I happened to lock in a $67 Amazon trade in price last week for my limited edition (got lucky because the next day it dropped to like $45). I paid $64 for it with the Prime member price. I somehow made $3 and I'm not stuck with a game full of broken promises anymore.

 

[VlaudTheImpaler]

Got denied another refund. I give up. You win Sony. Anyways. I threw the game back on to see if the new patch made the crashes any better and so far I have not had any when they were frequent before. So it looks like an improvement for sure. Thats good at least. Only played about 20 min tho but hey thats better than before.

Did you try through live chat? Where do you live?

That would probably only apply to people who purchase after that notice was posted though, the special circumstances will still likely apply to people who purchased before.

This is what I was thinking.

Love it. They're feeling the heat.

Don't stop now. The more it gets reported on, the more refund requests will pile up, and the more likely they'll cave.

But also this.

 

[Patchy]

There are special exemptions in the UK though. Steams policy does not over rule UK Trading laws.

Same in Australia.

 

[Tranqueris]

I'm still waiting on the steam to do something about the support ticket I opened yesterday. I would say that people should keep trying to get a refund on Steam even if they keep getting rejected. Hopefully enough people make some noise so that they just decide to give refunds to anyone who wants one.

I think this game shows what a worthless bandaid the 2 hour Steam refund really is, it mostly just gives them a technicality or a blanket statement to point to so that enough people give up until the usual case of internet outrage convinces them to give out refunds to people who want them.

 

[FutbolBat]

This saga just keeps getting better (worse) and better (worse).

 

[benzopil]

Wonder how many times this has been refunded for Steam to add this on the NMS Store page

That's like a giant "don't buy this game' warning lol.

 

[samoset]

Does anyone else think that the generous refund policy for No Man's Sky might be because the claims of false advertisement might be legitimate? Could Sony or Steam just be covering their butts by saying they offered refunds or am I overthinking it in that a claim like that wouldn't even affect Sony or Steam in the first place, just Hello Games?

 

[freenudemacusers]

This saga just keeps getting better (worse) and better (worse).

if you think about it, the community is adding a lot of great content to the no man's sky experience.

 

[Effect]

Wonder how many times this has been refunded for Steam to add this on the NMS Store page

I don't think that was there yesterday afternoon.

 

[LookAtMeGo]

Did you try through live chat? Where do you live?

Im in Canada. Tried the live chat. No luck. They sent me that copy paste all sales final TOS crap.

 

[Whales]

Wonder how many times this has been refunded for Steam to add this on the NMS Store page

god damn. Hello games and Sean can get fucked

this is what you get when you lie to your consumers

 

[Pooya]

Wonder how many times this has been refunded for Steam to add this on the NMS Store page

holy shit, CS must have been busy whole weekend.

 

[Moon_frogger]

people are actually trying to shame other people for getting refunds on this game? BAHAHAHAHAHA.

lets tally.

releases without the vast majority of it's actual content besides the randomly generated stuff - check.

releases with crashes that are still not fixed for many people. only gets worse as time goes on - check.
terrible PC port that is poorly optimized with awful UI. - check.

dev goes radio silent except for 'wow so many people bought the game' & 'patches are comin'! - check.

-nomansgaf goes apeshit because people want their money back - check.

about it?

oh shit just saw the refund warning on the steam page. bahahaha that is not good for hello games. at all.

 

[cleveridea]

So I guess steam reviews can be altered just by sheer numbers of low quality review scores?

Its a "mixed" review score (i.e. not mostly negative) yet every single "most helpful" review is negative, and those most helpful reviews are actually intelligently written with justified complaints.

 

[moltonasty]

I love this thread. It's turned into such a great cathartic payoff. Before these mass refunds the defenders of NMS/HG/Sean shrugged off the deceptive marketing and were blaming the disappointed players for "getting too hyped" and not appreciating this under-delivered masterpiece. There was nothing you could do about it so of course they're the ones in the right.

But now that many more people are able to get their money back these defenders have turned the argument into an ethical debate about whether you "deserve" a refund or if it's "right" to request a refund that's available to you. I cannot laugh harder at their reasoning. Eat shit you dumb fuckers and take a plate of it in a to-go box for Sean. You have no argument to support a developer that lies so blatantly so if you all the sudden want to get started with this ethical bullshit then you better be tweeting it at Sean.

This will go down in history as an instance where a game was so wantonly misleading that sellers had to actually step in and offer their consumers some additional recourse far and beyond what a game normally gets. Hello Games and Sean are done in the big video game business. I'm sure they'll release something else and collaborate on other things but this fiasco isn't a bruise to their reputation, it's a tattoo, they'll never be able to shake it. Molyneux didn't deliver on all his promises for Fable, BUT he still delivered Fable which had near-universal critical acclaim. Kojima sold Metal Gear Solid 2 on a demo that exclusively featured Snake and then switched to Raiden for most of the game, BUT he still delivered Metal Gear Solid 2 which had near-universal critical acclaim. Now Sean Murray didn't deliver on anything close to all of his promises for No Man's Sky and instead he delivered.... No Man's Sky, a 5/10 empty husk of a game.

I have no sympathy for the dev here. But you know what? I'm still interested in the game, just to see how much of a mess this game I was once hyped for turned out to be. So I'll buy it in a few months, but mark my words- I refuse to pay more than $10 for it. Also I'll make sure to buy used, that way Hello Games doesn't get a cent.

absolutely savage

 

[Tony Iron Man Stark]

Wonder how many times this has been refunded for Steam to add this on the NMS Store page

Has anyone gotten refunds from Steam even with this restriction currently in place?

 

[Petrae]

Yeah, I kinda want tot feel bad for him, but his arrogance and dismisiveness on twitter towards people with, which I think are legitimiate, complaints is just painful to read almost.

It's not right that things escalated to where offensive slurs/insults were leveled at Shahid. It should never get to that point, and those who used such language should be ashamed.

Shahid did, however, begin this chapter of the controversy by making the charge of thievery. It doesn't matter how he attempted to qualify his charge after the fact... and, after inviting criticism to his charge, he ran and hid by blocking those who dared to disagree.

I hope it was worth it for him to ride to Sean Murray's aid, because his reputation has been permanently tarnished. It's not quite Phil Fish levels of ridiculousness, but the outcome may be just the same.

 

[Maximo]

Same in Australia.

Thank Christ for proper consumer laws.

 

[Stone Ocean]

does anyone in here want a discussion?

any time someone has offered an opinion contrary to the idea that people should have unlimited time with a game but still be eligible to refund it they have been accused of being a "corporate shill", among other things.

Because time has nothing to do with a game working or not. You might give the game inumerous chances to stop shitting itself, you might wait a few weeks for hopefully a patch to sort things out. if neither happens why the hell would the amount of time you spent trying to make something broken work matter? That's like saying if you buy a faulty physical copy of a movie that simply stops working at the end and want a refund that is your problem because you watched most of it.

Getting a refund many hours in because you got bored of the game is one thing, getting a refund because it's broken is another, and that is Sony/Valve's problem to sort out

 

[Corpekata]

Does anyone else think that the generous refund policy for No Man's Sky might be because the claims of false advertisement might be legitimate? Could Sony or Steam just be covering their butts by saying they offered refunds or am I overthinking it in that a claim like that wouldn't even affect Sony or Steam in the first place, just Hello Games?

You're overthinking it. Nobody is actually saying or advertising they are giving refunds or exceptions, with Steam putting that disclaimer on their page today.

If they were trying to overtly court attention it would have been like Arkham Knight PC where it was removed from sale and many outlets publically talked about refunding it. Not to mention that all the services have been fairly inconsistent with the refunds.

 

[7threst]

Who is it?

https://twitter.com/shahidkamal

This guy acts almost like he inveted videogames and shrugs off critisicm because of it. Really annoying to read. I really liked what this guy was doing but the way he is handling this has me shaking my head.

It's not right that things escalated to where offensive slurs/insults were leveled at Shahid. It should never get to that point, and those who used such language should be ashamed.

Shahid did, however, begin this chapter of the controversy by making the charge of thievery. It doesn't matter how he attempted to qualify his charge after the fact... and, after inviting criticism to his charge, he ran and hid by blocking those who dared to disagree.

I hope it was worth it for him to ride to Sean Murray's aid, because his reputation has been permanently tarnished. It's not quite Phil Fish levels of ridiculousness, but the outcome may be just the same.

Yeah, I hate the vile shit he gets thrown at him, but he is no stranger to social media, how should know better but keeps posting know-it-all tweets. That's almost asking for hatefull comments.