I must have because all I can come up with is that is what an attempt to expose a man as being the very man we thought him to be, but in the least professional and productive way possible.
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The Trial Of Peter Molyneux by RockPaperShotgun
- Thread starter Pie and Beans
- Start date
I must have because all I can come up with is that is what an attempt to expose a man as being the very man we thought him to be, but in the least professional and productive way possible.
Weird I learned that also
If i did shit like this in my job i would be fired within a week...even for a creative position, especially when you take money directly from consumers, you have to put up or shut up
This only happened because I think Molyneux was expecting this to happen. Most other developers or their PR handlers would of shut it down after that first question.
This!
Molyneux did not deserve this kind of treatment, just because someone has a history of over promising he deserves to be treated like crap?
People are acting like those lofty promises of his really physically hurt them or something.
All he did was promise some stuff that never made it into his video games, do people really feel that hurt over that?
People on this forum where calling him that pre-interview. Asking him that gives himself a chance to defend against it.
He is a pathological liar. Its not an insult to the man.
Well said.
Hot Coldman
Banned
This makes those GameCentral/Jim Ryan interviews look like exchanging pleasantries. Wow.
Totally necessary, of course. And Molyneux's deflecting is some politician-level shit.
Totally necessary, of course. And Molyneux's deflecting is some politician-level shit.
We are all suckers for it. There is no way in hell the industry can just make games and gamers not get crazy hype for something. NeoGAF would be empty!
Imp the Dimp
Member
Well, there goes my RPS bookmark.
Freeman
Banned
I think its the fact the guy makes video games, I wouldn't care if he was a dictator or had somehow killed people by over promising, clearly that is not what he did.
Not 'someone', Peter Molyneux.
kitschbeam
Member
Yeah I really hope that after this trial he'd wise up and think before he says about any of his projects or ideas.
2 Slice Toaster
Member
Yeah, I can't believe he was rattled by someone asking if he thought he had some form of mental illness.
That the majority here knew from a jpeg that he is not to be trusted, long before RPS appeared. The just vocalised it in a more directed and acidic manner. Liar or not, degrading someone like that is not really good for him.
I learned that Peter Molyneux is most definitely a pathological liar
Look at his responses to questions...he says he's not a liar and then lies about what he has said a few lines later. His first response is to tell a lie, which to him is not a lie...which is insane
EDIT: its rather unfortunate that the "pathological liar" line had to be in the interview though...it has coloured the rest of it
Morrigan Stark
Arrogant Smirk
Well, he's either a pathological liar, or a manipulative, malicious liar.
Take your pick. If anything, RPS showed good faith by picking the less nasty possibility.
Take your pick. If anything, RPS showed good faith by picking the less nasty possibility.
Zoloft Sonic
Member
Wow. This dude shovels double-talk with both hands. I only have a cursory knowledge of his career, but his comments, deflections, fan treatment, and ego make him look like a massive narcissist.
This is how I would have conducted the interview.
Alienous, getting to the heart of the matter, seeking the truth. I should be a games journalist.
Woo-Fu
Banned
You're entirely missing the point. If he is a pathological liar it doesn't matter how you ask the questions, you're going to get lies.
Instead you ask the questions so that the lies become obvious to your readers.
What were the answers to all the questions? More evasions, more excuses, more outright lies.
Then he starts acting like a victim---and he is a victim---but he's a victim of his own actions. RPS didn't dig the hole, they just pointed out that Peter is standing in a hole of his own creation.
ProfessorLobo
Banned
Pretty much. Brings me back to watching Bill O Reilly with my parents.
I think you have a bright future ahead of you.
ProfessorLobo
Banned
We learned that when asked if he's a pathological liar, Peter Molyneux will say "No, I am not". Which is essentially what the rest of the interview boiled down to as well. Riveting.
Lmao at people talking about a "lack of respect" like this is Carson asking Lord fucking Downton to shine his shoes.
Grow up. This is actual journalism. Would you people object to Enron or Lehman Bros execs being questioned the same way? Sure, it's "just" vidja games but like he said, it's people's hard earned money being dicked around with.
Grow up. This is actual journalism. Would you people object to Enron or Lehman Bros execs being questioned the same way? Sure, it's "just" vidja games but like he said, it's people's hard earned money being dicked around with.
I think the interviewer was being overly harsh.
While I do think GODUS and Molyneux's modus operandi is flawed, it is definitely true that nothing is "fixed" and nothing is a 100% certainty in game development.
Molyneux should take that into account more, but I think the interviewer should also realise that's just the way it is a little as well.
Still, an interesting read!
While I do think GODUS and Molyneux's modus operandi is flawed, it is definitely true that nothing is "fixed" and nothing is a 100% certainty in game development.
Molyneux should take that into account more, but I think the interviewer should also realise that's just the way it is a little as well.
Still, an interesting read!
Molyneux thinks he has the license to stretch the truth if it gets people excited about his project. If his predictions fall through well that is part of game development to him. Rather than fix this he will just ignore the press altogether.
I dunno about american journalism but I guess you guys are a little "too much" politically correct over there, we get pieces like this one and even some much harsher here.
ginger ninja
Banned
Actual game journalism ?
aspiegamer
Member
You can work to that, even! As a follow-up after other things are said, perhaps, and the pattern of lying has been established by the interviewer.
That's just not how you open. This is my only gripe with the entire interview. I'm not even saying it's disrespectful to open this way!
Molyneux is a weird dude. I like his older games and he seems like a nice guy, but he'll piss people off one too many times someday. Like despite enjoying some of his games, I didn't give him any money on Kickstarter. Simply didn't have faith that he would deliver. Which is sad since he seems like a creative guy who is passionate about games.
RPS continues to be the worst, though. Sort of a crummy interview.
RPS continues to be the worst, though. Sort of a crummy interview.
We learned that he doesn't really believe he is responsible for anything that has happened with the project. He also doesn't believe that his extreme exaggeration and over promising is wrong or incorrect.
That was just the first question. The rest of the interview demonstrated that he is, indeed, a pathological liar.
The only way this would work is if John has a huge following already. Angry Joe got to do interviews despite his "unconventional" questions only due to his huge audience. Developers and PR personnel know that his questions will be to the point, but they go with it anyways because they gain access to a large audience that might be convinced of their answers.
John does not have that going for him. If his gig indeed go South, nobody will be his interviewee. The risk simply outweighs the benefits for developers. They rather sit with Geoff Keighley and discuss Mountain Dew rather than defend their broken games and undelivered promises.
gunstarhero
Member
I hope RPS goes to interview Watermelon Games next.
Ingueferroque
Banned
Video game development ≠ snake oil. There is more than one ingredient.
It is also about timing, context. If he waxes lyrical about trees growing and scar tissue in Fable, YEARS before the game releases... and it doesn't end up in the game? OK, shame. I'm sure at one point he hoped that would be a realistic goal.
But it is something else when he makes the game, releases it, and THEN claims it has feature X or Y. The latter I do not think he is guilty of.
so we all complain about what certain devs do with games and how people still lap it up (buggy, unfinished, under delivering, etc)....someone finally calls one of them out on it and they're the bad guys?
isn't this pretty much what Jon Stewart has been doing for years on the daily show? using quotes and showing how fucked up politicians and the like can be....
isn't this pretty much what Jon Stewart has been doing for years on the daily show? using quotes and showing how fucked up politicians and the like can be....
Pretty much this, I think the overall American media has really twisted people's perceptions on what the press should be and ask. First off, that person should never be consulted at all because they're a freaking Loon. Secondly, if someone were consulted and started spouting something so nonsensical, they should straight up be called out on being a Loon, not pandered to. Calling a spade a spade is not wrong in any way, no matter how much it might hurt that person's feelings.
If you believe that dinosaurs existed 3000 years ago you're a Loon. If you have blatantly lied to the world every single year for the past 30 years you're a Liar. Pretty simple.
As I said, PR people don't just block out tough interviewers just because they're tough.
Think about it from their perspective. They'll only bow out if it's not worth their time. But if it's a big name with big influence, you can bet they're going to jump at the opportunity and prepare. They seek to strike a balance between clout and risk and act accordingly.
That Twitter post you linked? If this was a Paxman interview, for examplesomeone with huge influence, reputation, and attention, she wouldn't be saying that.
Again, it's a balance of risk and reward. RPS doesn't have enough prestige, clearly in the eyes of Deep Silver, to command an interview like this, with them. But Molyneux is (or was) different. I doubt strategic decision making influences his media work to the degree that a big publisher does to theirs.
2 Slice Toaster
Member
Because mental illness has a pretty negative stigma surrounding it, so someone asking you if you think that you might have something like that going on is a bit of a shock?
I was kind of taken aback that someone like John Walker who has talked about his struggles with SAD would pose a question like that so casually. Peter Molyneux needed to be taken to task, and he was perfectly capable of doing so without asking such a toxic question right off the bat. He's better than that.
This basically. He lies over and over and over and then calls his lies not lies
Kotaku will be calling you shortly.
Yeh, a lot of people in here jumping to a quick defense without reading what Peter actually responds with to the harsh questions. He dancers around a lot and basically says he's not lying because he believes in himself and his team. What a load of horse shit. Also has multiple answers for the same question throughout the interview, he can't make up his mind as what his best excuse is then devolves into some pathetic "my life is really hard" excuse.
benicillin
Banned
And now we move into the "American journalism is bad and that's why some people don't like the way this interview was conducted" portion of the argument, which quite frankly is BS. There are way more examples of excellent journalism done every day than what you see on television.
Pie and Beans
Look for me on the local news, I'll be the guy arrested for trying to burn down a Nintendo exec's house.
Whew, busy day so could only read not reply. I feel theres a lot of culture shock here for US and no Euro board-members in what an aggressive interview this was. Here in the UK, if you fuck up publicly to this extent (and for an extended period so as to become notorious for it), this what you get faced with and rightfully so.
I'm not surprised a lot of the dev community is quivering at the lip and rabble rowsing to the tune of "too harsh, unprofessional!" because 1) you've got your typical human tribal instinct where one of the tribe in GAME DEV markings is being 'attacked', and the deep instinctual urge is defend 2) Theres the fact a lot of the game industry is founded upon pathological liars. That ranges from there being little budget for a projects development; Unpaid overtime, lie to the underlings or lying to consumers to their faces over things like "this content will never see re-release!" and so on. A huge percentage of the industry runs on a sort of locomotive "its too big to stop now" principle rather than one of tight, fiscally responsible project management. So when these big 'orrible mean questions are being fielded at someone perceived as "one of the untouchable old greats", pants begin to fill.
Thats the core of it as well. Peter Molyneux could have continued to drain EA or Microsofts coffers until someone figured things out, and its "oh well, theyre big boys, they'll deal". But the second Molyneux stepped into the Kickstarter/crowdfunding/goodwill space, that changes entirely. This is no longer a situation of something being funded by the well-to-do of the world, you're now doffing your cap to anyone in the world with access to electronic funds. People that may be living paycheque to paycheque, people that had the money then down the line fall afoul of some hideous financial emergency, so on and so forth. But they either recognised your name as one to trust, or a lot of positive PR and outreach got your project infront of them and they said "yeah why not". Fans pledging for $200 books they're no closer to getting to, a kid promised a life changing sum of money left to hang (good thing he's not terminally ill eh or living in a dangerous part of the world), and even individuals passionate yet perhaps silly enough to work for a year for free to help dig Molyneux out of his mess because of his legacy. These people don't have a name though, they're nor celebs, a figure you're supposed to protect. They're just the legion of people its okay to step on because... what they gonna do?
This article is the equal and opposing force to the good-will people like Molyneux have been cashing in to with the Kickstarter gold-rush. After a straight decade or more of lying, and yes it is lying to this point, thats when the kid gloves should come off and tough questions are asked. RPS has no doubt covered GODUS themselves, and some small part of John is perhaps acting on a touch of guilt for being one of many others propping up Molyneux's promises and letting him run with it. Thats got to end in a spectacular fashion. What we read today was accountability, and theres a great lack of it in day to day life until things get leaked or brought to the public eye through other means (journalism!).
There are several points in the article that stand out to me. The perpetuation on Peter's part of trying to paint himself as a naive thinker of our time, and how could he possibly be expected to know things like "7 months or 3 years", that simply by being a creative person he is above such trifling matters. Its here, at its zenith, that I can feel him straining to throw the muddy workers under the bus for not achieving things faster and letting him down. An ex-employee that was responsible for contacting Bryan is left as the reason for that breaking down. Shedding staff isn't a good look either, and the assertion that a fair few have "left the industry" after their time with Molyneux is damning in and of itself.
Where he gets the most evasive though is on the matter of just what money Bryan is going to be accruing and making any notion of coming to a compromise despite the bullshit contract they forced him to sign. Thats when the childlike demeanour drops and suddenly Molyneux remembers complex things like legal ramifications and "do not make money promises". Funny that. He'll quote from three months to a year or anything regarding Godus development, features to entice and bedazzle, but when it counts to his bottom line, some self preservation is kicking in and preventing him from making any concessions whatsoever.
The very first question of the article is perfect because it is, with laser precision, the root of it all. Molyneux should never lead a studio or be the one calling the shots, because he is incapable of doing so. Thats why he and people like Dyack fell onto hard times. Businesses outside of infinite money reserves like MS need to run on Reality, and not fiction or they get into trouble fast. When Molyneux makes promises pertaining to game design, he's doing so almost entirely at the cost of other people's hard work and ability regarding code, art, animation, and so on. Even the simplest of us can just say out loud "I want to make a game with 'best things ever' in", but its realising that talk is cheap and management and planning are the true requirement to such an end goal is what makes someone a great leader of development. Molyneux quite simply is not and hasn't been for a damn long time. Tough love occurred, and its up to him how he reshuffles.
I'm not surprised a lot of the dev community is quivering at the lip and rabble rowsing to the tune of "too harsh, unprofessional!" because 1) you've got your typical human tribal instinct where one of the tribe in GAME DEV markings is being 'attacked', and the deep instinctual urge is defend 2) Theres the fact a lot of the game industry is founded upon pathological liars. That ranges from there being little budget for a projects development; Unpaid overtime, lie to the underlings or lying to consumers to their faces over things like "this content will never see re-release!" and so on. A huge percentage of the industry runs on a sort of locomotive "its too big to stop now" principle rather than one of tight, fiscally responsible project management. So when these big 'orrible mean questions are being fielded at someone perceived as "one of the untouchable old greats", pants begin to fill.
Thats the core of it as well. Peter Molyneux could have continued to drain EA or Microsofts coffers until someone figured things out, and its "oh well, theyre big boys, they'll deal". But the second Molyneux stepped into the Kickstarter/crowdfunding/goodwill space, that changes entirely. This is no longer a situation of something being funded by the well-to-do of the world, you're now doffing your cap to anyone in the world with access to electronic funds. People that may be living paycheque to paycheque, people that had the money then down the line fall afoul of some hideous financial emergency, so on and so forth. But they either recognised your name as one to trust, or a lot of positive PR and outreach got your project infront of them and they said "yeah why not". Fans pledging for $200 books they're no closer to getting to, a kid promised a life changing sum of money left to hang (good thing he's not terminally ill eh or living in a dangerous part of the world), and even individuals passionate yet perhaps silly enough to work for a year for free to help dig Molyneux out of his mess because of his legacy. These people don't have a name though, they're nor celebs, a figure you're supposed to protect. They're just the legion of people its okay to step on because... what they gonna do?
This article is the equal and opposing force to the good-will people like Molyneux have been cashing in to with the Kickstarter gold-rush. After a straight decade or more of lying, and yes it is lying to this point, thats when the kid gloves should come off and tough questions are asked. RPS has no doubt covered GODUS themselves, and some small part of John is perhaps acting on a touch of guilt for being one of many others propping up Molyneux's promises and letting him run with it. Thats got to end in a spectacular fashion. What we read today was accountability, and theres a great lack of it in day to day life until things get leaked or brought to the public eye through other means (journalism!).
There are several points in the article that stand out to me. The perpetuation on Peter's part of trying to paint himself as a naive thinker of our time, and how could he possibly be expected to know things like "7 months or 3 years", that simply by being a creative person he is above such trifling matters. Its here, at its zenith, that I can feel him straining to throw the muddy workers under the bus for not achieving things faster and letting him down. An ex-employee that was responsible for contacting Bryan is left as the reason for that breaking down. Shedding staff isn't a good look either, and the assertion that a fair few have "left the industry" after their time with Molyneux is damning in and of itself.
Where he gets the most evasive though is on the matter of just what money Bryan is going to be accruing and making any notion of coming to a compromise despite the bullshit contract they forced him to sign. Thats when the childlike demeanour drops and suddenly Molyneux remembers complex things like legal ramifications and "do not make money promises". Funny that. He'll quote from three months to a year or anything regarding Godus development, features to entice and bedazzle, but when it counts to his bottom line, some self preservation is kicking in and preventing him from making any concessions whatsoever.
The very first question of the article is perfect because it is, with laser precision, the root of it all. Molyneux should never lead a studio or be the one calling the shots, because he is incapable of doing so. Thats why he and people like Dyack fell onto hard times. Businesses outside of infinite money reserves like MS need to run on Reality, and not fiction or they get into trouble fast. When Molyneux makes promises pertaining to game design, he's doing so almost entirely at the cost of other people's hard work and ability regarding code, art, animation, and so on. Even the simplest of us can just say out loud "I want to make a game with 'best things ever' in", but its realising that talk is cheap and management and planning are the true requirement to such an end goal is what makes someone a great leader of development. Molyneux quite simply is not and hasn't been for a damn long time. Tough love occurred, and its up to him how he reshuffles.
old manatee
Banned
A lot of people only read the first question before posting, for sure.
oh jesus christ all I meant was that we have bigger problems than aggressive/rude game journalists.
Honestly the discussion seems very civil so far in this thread, I think that maybe it's you who's getting a little too emotional and a little less logical here. Populous is one of my favourite games, I was playig Dungeon Keeper just today, that doesn't mean I can't see what's in front of my nose. He lies through his teeth, almost always.
Relaxed Muscle
Member
Calling someone a pathalogical liar dosn't really mean something malicious, just that the person in question can't really stop lying, even if there's no evil intent behind it. Is a mental illness.
"Pathological lying can be described as a habituation of lying. It is when an individual consistently lies for no personal gain. The lies are commonly transparent and often seem rather pointless."