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Legend of Zelda Wii U Gameplay Demo

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B

banofypie

Banned
Twilight Princess is probably the best launch game any console could ever have, so I'm glad they made that call. I was only 13 at the time, but my Dad promised me a launch day Wii because he got my sister a car, and that day was probably one of the best days I've ever had with videogames.

I could have a car now, but instead I got TP on launch day. Good trade off, all in all.
 
E

Easy_D

never left the stone age
banofypie said:
Twilight Princess is probably the best launch game any console could ever have, so I'm glad they made that call. I was only 13 at the time, but my Dad promised me a launch day Wii because he got my sister a car, and that day was probably one of the best days I've ever had with videogames.

I could have a car now, but instead I got TP on launch day. Good trade off, all in all.
Click to expand...

I lucked out so hard on the Wii launch. Had pre-ordered it 6 months before launch and I was apparently first in line for the second shipment of Wiis. Then magic happened 2 days before Christmas eve and someone canned their pre-order. It was so fucking awesome to go pick the Wii up and get back home and play Zelda.
 
N

NathanS

Member
Mael said:
Again Skyrim and other games manage to be way more arcane than your usual Zelda and they do better.
The issue is not making them more accessible,.
Click to expand...

Are you using Skyrim as an example for not making a series more accessible for better sales? ....Okay.
 
M

Mael

Member
foxuzamaki said:
Stop, TP was not meant to save the gamecube, do you know how game development works, even without the delays the game had, it was too late in the GCN's life to "save" it.
Twilght Princess was a game made to benefit the gamers that were already there on the system, not to suddenly get new ones.
Click to expand...

Go read the Iwata ask :
http://iwataasks.nintendo.com/interviews/#/wii/twilight_princess/0/8

Aonuma

Well, I'm sure some people felt that way. We were continuing to do what we've always done in the midst of a change of direction within Nintendo, so I would be lying if I said that no one was worried about being left behind. When we missed our window of opportunity to help the GameCube go out in style and it was decided to also make a Wii version, things got a little chaotic. But despite that, no one ever said anything like: "We shouldn't be spending time on making Zelda anymore." No matter how much trends in the industry were changing, we had absolute and unwavering confidence in what we were making.
Click to expand...

Something as expensive as Zelda is not meant to simply milk the existing fanbase who already got the system.
TP was announced in 2004 and was meant to be released way earlier than it eventually did, it was absolutely made to be a big tentpole game for the GC.
At the release of game of this magnitude, hardware sales are up.
Are you seriously telling me that it's just repeat customers considering stacking another console on top of their previous one?
Do you think MSFT made Halo Collection for the Halo fans who already have a xbone?
Do you think Sony pushed tLoU on ps4 only to satisfy people who liked it on ps3 and already got a ps4?
Heck what's the reason it was pushed on Wii to begin with?
To sell more Wiis (which was actually unnecessary as Wiisports was clearly enough).
NathanS said:
Are you using Skyrim as an example for not making a series more accessible for better sales? ....Okay.
Click to expand...
Compared to the shit Nintendo tried to pulled off during the GC and DS/Wii era? Absolutely.
Have you played their games when they try to make it easier for accessibility?
We get stuffs like Fi constant nagging, touchscreen control in Zelda and removing camera control out of 3D Mario.
 
J

jimi_dini

Member
Mael said:
Compared to the shit Nintendo tried to pulled off during the GC and DS/Wii era? Absolutely.
Have you played their games when they try to make it easier for accessibility?
We get stuffs like Fi constant nagging, touchscreen control in Zelda and removing camera control out of 3D Mario.
Click to expand...

What was the problem with the touchscreen controls of the DS Zeldas?

I personally found Spirit Tracks to be quite enjoyable. Is touchscreen control automatically "easier for accessibility"? I found Kirby's Mass Attack to be quite difficult to get 100% on despite it being touchscreen controlled.

And how would you do camera control with a nunchuck + Wiimote control scheme? The auto-camera of both Mario Galaxy games was almost perfection and the games themselves were anything but easy.

You get a point for Fi though. A simple solution would have been to include an option for that.
Normally Nintendo actually solves this accessibility problem in a great manner see Super Guide. That way they can design challenging and difficult levels and a good video game player should actually feel bad to see those powerups / auto-play options at all. In Super Mario 3D World that "cheating" power up simply makes it easier to complete a level, but using it won't mark the level as being actually completed. The player is simply able to get past it and has to get back to it at some point.
 
Astral Dog

Astral Dog

Member
Are you trying to say Nintendo innovates too much on Zelda!?

Well, it could be true, they certainly like to experiment with the controls(and artstyle) on Zelda, seen by Skyward Sword, and the DS games.
More exploration and focus on action can be nice, the Wii U can make it easier to do that.
 
M

Mael

Member
jimi_dini said:
What was the problem with the touchscreen controls of the DS Zeldas?

I personally found Spirit Tracks to be quite enjoyable. Is touchscreen control automatically "easier for accessibility"? I found Kirby's Mass Attack to be quite difficult to get 100% on despite it being touchscreen controlled.

And how would you do camera control with a nunchuck + Wiimote control scheme? The auto-camera of both Mario Galaxy games was almost perfection and the games themselves were anything but easy.

You get a point for Fi though. A simple solution would have been to include an option for that.
Normally Nintendo actually solves this accessibility problem in a great manner see Super Guide. That way they can design challenging and difficult levels and a good video game player should actually feel bad to see those powerups / auto-play options at all. In Super Mario 3D World that "cheating" power up simply makes it easier to complete a level, but using it won't mark the level as being actually completed. The player is simply able to get past it and has to get back to it at some point.
Click to expand...

Sub Boss said:
Are you trying to say Nintendo innovates too much on Zelda!?

Well, it could be true, they certainly like to experiment with the controls(and artstyle) on Zelda, seen by Skyward Sword, and the DS games.
More exploration and focus on action can be nice, the Wii U can make it easier to do that.
Click to expand...

My point is really that Nintendo saw a problem of accessibility with their 3D games (Mario and Zelda really) and tried to solve this issue by mainly dumbing down their games.
It's really why their 3D Zelda games are so easy after MM or why 3D Mario after Sunshine usually makes compromise to the level design instead of going on more expansive designs for the courses.
The issue was never experimentation, that's pretty much what their games so unique and work so well.
If anything the direction they're going with this one is full of experimentation, we'll see if it works or not but I wouldn't worry too much there.
Fi is even more disappointing as the super guide really solved most of the problem Fi created (and considering how they actually patented the super guide on a Zelda example...)

BY2K said:
Yes it is.

Yes. it. is.
Click to expand...

I don't think anyone disagreed here
 
ReyVGM

ReyVGM

Member
Mael said:
It's really why their 3D Zelda games are so easy after MM or why 3D Mario after Sunshine usually makes compromise to the level design instead of going on more expansive designs for the courses.

I don't think anyone disagreed here
Click to expand...

A Link to the Past, Links Awakening and Ocarina of Time were really easy too. Maybe not Wind Waker easy, but they were really easy aside from a few things here and there.
 
M

Mael

Member
ReyVGM said:
A Link to the Past, Links Awakening and Ocarina of Time were really easy too. Maybe not Wind Waker easy, but they were really easy aside from a few things here and there.
Click to expand...

They're downright hard compared to the later Zelda games,
Alttp you can actually die in the field,
same goes for LA.
OoT is actually on the easy side but some fights are rather tough.
Nothing like the cakewalks that were WW, TP or any of the DS Zelda were death was as common as a game over in a recent Mario game.
 
M

Myriadis

Member
ReyVGM said:
A Link to the Past, Links Awakening and Ocarina of Time were really easy too. Maybe not Wind Waker easy, but they were really easy aside from a few things here and there.
Click to expand...

This. Wind Waker is the easiest Zelda and Twilight Princess is fairly close to that, but Links Awakening has to be the easiest Zelda games I ever played, especially the bosses who are mostly just as "hard" as normal enemies. And I recently played through Majoras Mask and wasn't even close to dying once. Come to think about it, does that game even have a game over screen considering the time element?

At least A Link Between Worlds and especially Skyward Sword moved towards the right direction. Still too easy, but much more challenging than the previous games.
 
TheMoon

TheMoon

Member
I laugh every time when someone wants to sell the nonsense that ALTTP was a hard game, even just compared to other Zeldas. Just no.
 
B

BY2K

Membero Americo
TheMoon said:
I laugh every time when someone wants to sell the nonsense that ALTTP was a hard game, even just compared to other Zeldas. Just no.
Click to expand...

It was hard.

When I was 10.

Turtle Rock is still a bit of a bitch.

Majora's Mask is hard, imo.
 
L

Lunar15

Member
TheMoon said:
I laugh every time when someone wants to sell the nonsense that ALTTP was a hard game, even just compared to other Zeldas. Just no.
Click to expand...

Not only is it not hard, there was a cave that gave you infinite money, and then you fill up on blue potions and fairies and literally never die.

One thing this series could do is just unlock "hero mode" from the start. No idea why it's closed off.
 
M

Mael

Member
Myriadis said:
This. Wind Waker is the easiest Zelda and Twilight Princess is fairly close to that, but Links Awakening has to be the easiest Zelda games I ever played, especially the bosses who are mostly just as "hard" as normal enemies. And I recently played through Majoras Mask and wasn't even close to dying once. Come to think about it, does that game even have a game over screen considering the time element?

At least A Link Between Worlds and especially Skyward Sword moved towards the right direction. Still too easy, but much more challenging than the previous games.
Click to expand...
Wut? It's even easier than the DS games!
No Zelda this side of Zelda III is even hard to begin with, but at least you could lose some energy if you weren't paying attention.
There's no threat at all in most 3D Zelda, the closest being SS with some foes.
Link's Awakening is really like the Oracle games in that regard and while not being hard at all they're not brain dead either.

If you manage your playthrough well, even Zelda 1 proves to be surprisingly easy that doesn't mean it doesn't shit on every other Zelda (bar Zelda 2) from great height in that regard.
 
T

Tookay

Member
I kind of feel like the talk about difficulty in Zelda is an argument that's really one-sided. Yes, to people familiar with Zelda logic, they've been easy for quite a while, but that's precisely because they're familiar with the mechanics. To people outside our hardcore Zelda/gaming forum bubble, they are still daunting, because they aren't as commonplace as the FPS genre's tropes. And considering the infrequent serialization of those tropes (a Zelda-like game comes along only every once and a while), they need to reintroduce the concepts and ease people into it with every title.

Could there be better difficulty options in Zelda? Yeah probably. But anybody asking for some true headscratcher puzzles or devious enemies have to realize that's not what Zelda is. Zelda is the quintessential Nintendo game: it presents you with a concept, iterates on it, and then twists that understanding in new ways. The fact that it isn't "challenging" represents that they presented the mechanics in a logical way that you could adapt to.

EDIT: Also this talk about TP saving the GC doesn't really strike me as true. I don't think Nintendo sees Zelda that way. They see it as a prestige series, the way Hollywood sees an Oscar film that may or may not make it big. That's why they give it a more flexible development than most of their other series.
 
O

Orniletter

Banned
TheMoon said:
I laugh every time when someone wants to sell the nonsense that ALTTP was a hard game, even just compared to other Zeldas. Just no.
Click to expand...

It is so frustrating to argue against people who say that modern Zeldas have become so incredibly easy compared to the earlier games, because you ....very often....essentially argue against rose tinted nostalgia goggles (which is a common theme when you are dealing with the Zeldafanbase tbh)

Zelda 1&2 are hard games. Especially Zelda 2 . The rest not.

ALTTP and Link´s Awakening are cakewalks and have always been difficulty wise. I played ALTTP and ALBW back to back in 2013 and I´d say they are rougly about the same (with ALBW a tiny bit on the easier side, but nowhere close to where the internet wants you to think it is).
 
T

takriel

Member
Tookay said:
I kind of feel like the talk about difficulty in Zelda is an argument that's really one-sided. Yes, to people familiar with Zelda logic, they've been easy for quite a while, but that's precisely because they're familiar with the mechanics. To people outside our hardcore Zelda/gaming forum bubble, they are still daunting, because they aren't as commonplace as the FPS genre's tropes. And considering the infrequent serialization of those tropes (a Zelda-like game comes along only every once and a while), they need to reintroduce the concepts and ease people into it with every title.

Could there be better difficulty options in Zelda? Yeah probably. But anybody asking for some true headscratcher puzzles or devious enemies have to realize that's not what Zelda is. Zelda is the quintessential Nintendo game: it presents you with a concept, iterates on it, and then twists that understanding in new ways. The fact that it isn't "challenging" represents that they presented the mechanics in a logical way that you could adapt to.

EDIT: Also this talk about TP saving the GC doesn't really strike me as true. I don't think Nintendo sees Zelda that way. They see it as a prestige series, the way Hollywood sees an Oscar film that may or may not make it big. That's why they give it a more flexible development than most of their other series.
Click to expand...
This is a very well-put post and I agree with you.
 
G

Gotdatmoney

Member
TheMoon said:
I laugh every time when someone wants to sell the nonsense that ALTTP was a hard game, even just compared to other Zeldas. Just no.
Click to expand...

I don't think it's a particularly difficult game by any stretch but I don't think the game is embarrassingly easy either. Enemies can actually take away a decent amount of life in the dark world and the dungeons are have a good feeling of progression and searching to them. It's not a hard game per say but I don't feel like it's embarrassingly easy either.
 
I

ibyea

Banned
Tookay said:
I kind of feel like the talk about difficulty in Zelda is an argument that's really one-sided. Yes, to people familiar with Zelda logic, they've been easy for quite a while, but that's precisely because they're familiar with the mechanics. To people outside our hardcore Zelda/gaming forum bubble, they are still daunting, because they aren't as commonplace as the FPS genre's tropes. And considering the infrequent serialization of those tropes (a Zelda-like game comes along only every once and a while), they need to reintroduce the concepts and ease people into it with every title.

Could there be better difficulty options in Zelda? Yeah probably. But anybody asking for some true headscratcher puzzles or devious enemies have to realize that's not what Zelda is. Zelda is the quintessential Nintendo game: it presents you with a concept, iterates on it, and then twists that understanding in new ways. The fact that it isn't "challenging" represents that they presented the mechanics in a logical way that you could adapt to.

EDIT: Also this talk about TP saving the GC doesn't really strike me as true. I don't think Nintendo sees Zelda that way. They see it as a prestige series, the way Hollywood sees an Oscar film that may or may not make it big. That's why they give it a more flexible development than most of their other series.
Click to expand...

Yeah, I didn't realize that until I saw my sister play a Zelda game for the first time. Now she can do it, but she really struggled with TP during her first time.
 
M

maxcriden

Member
TheMoon said:
I laugh every time when someone wants to sell the nonsense that ALTTP was a hard game, even just compared to other Zeldas. Just no.
Click to expand...

I don't think I ever beat that one scorpion face tail guy. I never went back to it either. I dunno. That was a few years ago when my wife was playing it, I know she did beat it. I think I might've beat it as a kid (GBA version both times).
 
D

deltatheta

Member
maxcriden said:
I don't think I ever beat that one scorpion face tail guy. I never went back to it either. I dunno. That was a few years ago when my wife was playing it, I know she did beat it. I think I might've beat it as a kid (GBA version both times).
Click to expand...

I remember the ice dungeon being really hard.

Yeah, it was easier than the first two games, but I still think it was pretty hard. At least harder than all the games that followed.
 
I

ibyea

Banned
For me, ALttP is harder than all the games that followed except for the Oracle games. That said, I found some of the things in ALttP pretty cheap. Like putting a conveyor belt in the giant moth boss room, which was honestly annoying and not enjoyable.
 
ReyVGM

ReyVGM

Member
ibyea said:
For me, ALttP is harder than all the games that followed except for the Oracle games. That said, I found some of the things in ALttP pretty cheap. Like putting a conveyor belt in the giant moth boss room, which was honestly annoying and not enjoyable.
Click to expand...

Was that your first Zelda? Because I think that's the only reason you would find ALttP to be hard.
 
TheMoon

TheMoon

Member
maxcriden said:
I don't think I ever beat that one scorpion face tail guy. I never went back to it either. I dunno. That was a few years ago when my wife was playing it, I know she did beat it. I think I might've beat it as a kid (GBA version both times).
Click to expand...

Max, what is this! I am disappoint! Do you mean the first boss in the dark world? The Helmasaur? I think you must've played this with your hands tied behind your back. Go try it again now. I'll wait here. :)
 
O

onipex

Member
Have to say the most annoying thing about Zelda threads are the malstrom talking points. Makes me miss the stupid timeline and Zelda cycle posts.
 
T

The Boat

Member
Tookay said:
I kind of feel like the talk about difficulty in Zelda is an argument that's really one-sided. Yes, to people familiar with Zelda logic, they've been easy for quite a while, but that's precisely because they're familiar with the mechanics. To people outside our hardcore Zelda/gaming forum bubble, they are still daunting, because they aren't as commonplace as the FPS genre's tropes. And considering the infrequent serialization of those tropes (a Zelda-like game comes along only every once and a while), they need to reintroduce the concepts and ease people into it with every title.

Could there be better difficulty options in Zelda? Yeah probably. But anybody asking for some true headscratcher puzzles or devious enemies have to realize that's not what Zelda is. Zelda is the quintessential Nintendo game: it presents you with a concept, iterates on it, and then twists that understanding in new ways. The fact that it isn't "challenging" represents that they presented the mechanics in a logical way that you could adapt to.

EDIT: Also this talk about TP saving the GC doesn't really strike me as true. I don't think Nintendo sees Zelda that way. They see it as a prestige series, the way Hollywood sees an Oscar film that may or may not make it big. That's why they give it a more flexible development than most of their other series.
Click to expand...
Plenty of people here have a tremendous disconnect between their skills and the skills of regular players (not to mention casual players), you see this very often here when people call some games "insultingly easy". Especially in the case of Nintendo games, they're not supposed to be ridiculously hard all the time, they're supposed to appeal to a large audience and that means very experienced players won't be sweating bullets to finish the main game.

The problem is, for some people a game needs to have you die all the time or be stuck for hours, otherwise their poor hardcore egos are being insulted, it's like there's no middle ground between super easy and psuper hard. Which is why I've learned to mostly ignore some opinions when it comes to difficulty, namely on Zelda and Mario games.

For the record, I find that TP and WW's combat was way too easy, but SS was spot-on difficulty wise, althought the controls clearly are too difficult for many.
 
TheMoon

TheMoon

Member
The Boat said:
For the record, I find that TP and WW's combat was way too easy, but SS was spot-on difficulty wise, althought the controls clearly are too difficult for many.
Click to expand...

Word. SS made combat actually interesting. In WW and TP you had all these cool moves (esp. in TP, where they refined the WW system) but you have almost no use for them outside of a few Dark Nut fights at the end of the game.
 
I

ibyea

Banned
ReyVGM said:
Was that your first Zelda? Because I think that's the only reason you would find ALttP to be hard.
Click to expand...

Nope, OoT was my first Zelda. ALttP is a harder Zelda because of the use of cheap obstacles like conveyor belts and asshole placement of beamos, holes, fireball shooting things, etc. There is no quarter heart damage except for one exception. It is also very easy to get trapped between an enemy's body and a wall, and your health drops really fast while they violate your personal space. Furthermore, unless you find something accidentally beforehand, getting to the swamp dungeon will take forever because you just have no idea what you have to do to get to it. Finally, the bosses hit really hard or have overwhelming amount of things to dodge.
 
Z

zeldablue

Member
ibyea said:
Nope, OoT was my first Zelda. ALttP is a harder Zelda because of the use of cheap obstacles like conveyor belts and asshole placement of beamos, holes, fireball shooting things, etc. There is no quarter heart damage except for one exception. It is also very easy to get trapped between an enemy's body and a wall, and your health drops really fast while they violate your personal space. Furthermore, unless you find something accidentally beforehand, getting to the swamp dungeon will take forever because you just have no idea what you have to do to get to it. Finally, the bosses hit really hard or have overwhelming amount of things to dodge.
Click to expand...
Yeah. It also had trap rooms with nothing in them besides monsters and conveyor belts. I always felt stupid for reentering a room like that multiple times.

The game was more cruel compared to most. xP
 
E

Easy_D

never left the stone age
BY2K said:
It was hard.

When I was 10.

Turtle Rock is still a bit of a bitch.

Majora's Mask is hard, imo.
Click to expand...

Turtle Rock is just an awful awful dungeon. It's plain bad. It's not legit hard, it's ass hard.

Edit: And add me to the list of people who enjoyed ALBW more than ALTTP.
 
I

ibyea

Banned
zeldablue said:
Yeah. It also had trap rooms with nothing in them besides monsters and conveyor belts. I always felt stupid for reentering a room like that multiple times.

The game was more cruel compared to most. xP
Click to expand...

Yeah on the cruelty, I don't think anything that has happened ever since compares to the third boss, a horrible, cruel, freaking annoying boss whose health resets every time you fall to the floor below. In Skull Woods, there was a room locked with a key that was literally there just to waste your time. There was an extra key that was not needed. Oh and guess what the boss room had in that dungeon? Freaking conveyor belts and slidey metal things lining up the wall! And that conveyor belt would change direction all the freaking time. GAH!
 
B

brandonh83

Banned
ALTTP is fairly easy but I think Ganon's Tower is the biggest bitch of the series.

I liked ALBW a lot but I don't think its nearly as good as its direct predecessor.
 
B

banofypie

Banned
CentroXer said:
how isn't LTTP top10 when ALBW mimics the LTTP world? Bullshit.
Click to expand...

Because LTTP doesn't have very good dungeons and a few of the bosses are stupid. There's more to a Zelda game than just the overworld, but it's nice to see you're so passionately against me having opinions.
 
Z

zeldablue

Member
Turtle Rock is the worst dungeon ever.

But I love ALttP, so besides the frustration, I think it's great. I just think LA is much better.

ALBW was too similar and too short for me to rate it that highly. Though I thought it was really fun.
 
I

ibyea

Banned
banofypie said:
Because LTTP doesn't have very good dungeons and a few of the bosses are stupid. There's more to a Zelda game than just the overworld, but it's nice to see you're so passionately against me having opinions.
Click to expand...

I agree, some of the bosses and obstacles are stupid. That said, I thought there were some creativity in the dungeons. Not the best dungeons in the Zelda series, but some of them were pretty good.
 
D

deltatheta

Member
ibyea said:
I agree, some of the bosses and obstacles are stupid. That said, I thought there were some creativity in the dungeons. Not the best dungeons in the Zelda series, but some of them were pretty good.
Click to expand...

Blind's Hideout is probably one of my favorite dungeons in all of Zelda.

But I'm on the side that LA is better than ALttP. ALttP had a great overworld, opening, and music, but LA is just fantastic throughout the entire game with no low points.
 
I

ibyea

Banned
There are two things in ALttP I hate with a passion: Conveyor belts and bouncy things. Screw those mechanics so much. Some of the firepower and beamos placement may have been unreasonable, but I felt like I could have some control over my fate. Those two things? Freaking impossible.
 
I

ibyea

Banned
For me, my favorite 2D Zelda were the Oracle games. They were difficult without the BS (except the final bosses). The dungeons were really creative, it has some great puzzles that I felt like matches the complexity of the 3D Zelda ones. Great overworld, and it was a ton of fun overall. Narratively, I have to give it to LA, it was actually amazing even with the simple presentation.
 
M

maxcriden

Member
TheMoon said:
Max, what is this! I am disappoint! Do you mean the first boss in the dark world? The Helmasaur? I think you must've played this with your hands tied behind your back. Go try it again now. I'll wait here. :)
Click to expand...

I just looked it up; hopefully it was Trinexx:

http://zeldawiki.org/images/thumb/c/ca/Trinexx.png/120px-Trinexx.png[/img[[/QUOTE]

I mean, it could've been Helmasaur but I dunno. I remember multiple beams or rays being shot at me. I'm sure I'll replay it one day regardless; in the meantime I sold my GBA cart ages ago. (Is the Wii U VC of it as good as that port?)
Click to expand...
 
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