These posts sum up how I feel about Banksy. Whatever its initial intentions and goals, it's now just another form of shallow consumption for an audience that thinks itself to be subversive and wiser than they Disney themepark-attending crowd. Banksy is the thoroughly commercialized counter-culture's Disney and I'm sure the person or group behind it knows this and has embraced it while he/she/they rake in the money.
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Banksy Opens Disneyland-Inspired Amusement Park, Welcome to Dismalland
- Thread starter FantasticMrFoxdie
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These posts sum up how I feel about Banksy. Whatever its initial intentions and goals, it's now just another form of shallow consumption for an audience that thinks itself to be subversive and wiser than they Disney themepark-attending crowd. Banksy is the thoroughly commercialized counter-culture's Disney and I'm sure the person or group behind it knows this and has embraced it while he/she/they rake in the money.
I haven't been paying too close attention. Has anyone in this thread invoked "hipster" yet?
Anyway, informed art criticism isn't something you can really expect in most places. (Of course, it can tip equally the other way, with pretentious art dipshits.)
Not everything needs to be profound.
Banksy contributed to and helped form this century's zeitgeist, and now he's profiting off of it. Can't say I blame him. I know how many artists are fucking broke.
One one level, he "sold out", but on another level, you can't walk into a Walmart and buy a "Banksy" shirt. There hasn't been any "Banksy: Brought to you by Microsoft." He's still doing it on his own, and on his own terms. (Or they're doing it on their own. Whatever.)
Yep.
I mean, good on him for following through with his ambitions and making it. It's visually interesting and seems well done.
But as any sort of commentary it's extremely lazy and hackneyed.
LAUGHTREY
Modesty becomes a woman
Deep.
Snarfington
Member
God damnit, I thought of this earlier and it just made me laugh. All the people involved in this big project and not one of them realised this would have worked better?
PezDispenser
Banned
The only reason to drive-by post with something like "2 deep 4 me such art so banksy lol" is to try to publicly posture yourself as being too cool or too smart to enjoy something that the filthy masses might enjoy in the most pathetic, try hard and unoriginal way imaginable. Sound familiar you vapid whiners? You're the ones trying to out-banksy banksy, the only difference being you've put literally no thought, work or effort into your attempt whatsoever.
Lol, Dismayland would've been so much better
peanutbutterlatte
Member
... Did you work on the twisted Cinderella castle or something? Did we hurt you?
Or they just don't think it's very good.
But in the end, it doesn't even matter.
Ahahhaaha
LAUGHTREY
Modesty becomes a woman
My critique style is minimalistic, you just don't get it.
Haunted
Member
Hot damn, I don't think that subreddit would be particularly popular on tumblr.
Doctor Ironic
Member
Oh my God it's the fucking Destiny of art installations. It's what happens when you have a massive budget and absolutely nothing else. It's Banksy screaming "LOOK HOW MUCH MONEY I CAN THROW AT MY OWN AESTHETIC"
Seductivpancakes
Member
The best thing to come out of this banksy piece.
Discotheque
Banned
I say this a lot but 'edgy' is thrown around way too often around this forum. Anything even remotely against the grain gets accused of this blanket word.
In this case it's just being dismissive. Some of this exhibit is corny but there's some great pieces in there too imo. Love that cinderella paparazzi one.
In this case it's just being dismissive. Some of this exhibit is corny but there's some great pieces in there too imo. Love that cinderella paparazzi one.
fuzzylogic
Member
This is fantastic.
If this speaks to ya'll, you should watch Nightcrawler on Netflix.
DICKS AHOY
Banned
I mean I think it looks really cool as far as installation/interactive art pieces go, but I'm not seeing anything here 'meaning' wise that isn't already wall-worn territory.
Also I still stand by thinking this entire thing being so high-budget and with press-releases makes Banksy's underground artist status incredibly suspect.
D.Lo
Member
I have no idea how he/they have maintained anonymity, but what 'underground' status?
He started as a street artist. He is now world famous.
It's like saying any established movie/music star's 'best new talent' status is suspect - it's no longer relevant or possible for Banksy to be 'underground' after having long term success.
DICKS AHOY
Banned
I've absolutely seen a ton of people still act like Banksy is this top-secret (which is true given the public doesn't really know who he or the group of people under that name are, I guess), underground artist fighting the man when stuff like this makes it obvious that status doesn't really apply to him anymore. By comparison I can't think of any actors or musicians who regularly bank on being 'the hot new talent' for the entirety of their careers, but for Banksy I always feel like it's a big part of their appeal so they intentionally try to cultivate that reputation.
You can be anti-authority and everything regardless of who you are as a ton of different media shows. Yet after a certain point when you create bigger works people street artists obviously would never be able to with a team of your own PR people like this, you can't fault people for getting cynical over the image of this lone renegade fighting against the man Banksy tries to keep.
You can be anti-authority and everything regardless of who you are as a ton of different media shows. Yet after a certain point when you create bigger works people street artists obviously would never be able to with a team of your own PR people like this, you can't fault people for getting cynical over the image of this lone renegade fighting against the man Banksy tries to keep.
I should watch Parks and Rec
Rabbi_Vole
Banned
EXACTLY
Strangelove77
Member
Maybe this is supposed to be extremely predictable. Maybe that's the thing.
I always wonder after the below story if Banksy realized the futility in some of his work and as an act of performance art sold his image to a group of artists to watch people follow his "work" blindly while he does nothing.
Or if banksy was always a collection of artists to begin with.
Or if banksy was always a collection of artists to begin with.
2deep4us I guess.
Fine Ham Abounds
Member
Actually when you put it that way, this might work as a pot shot at himself and his popularity
Maybe he's trying to make a comment about people who think he's a genius and it's so ironic it went right over everyone's heads
The Real Abed
Perma-Junior
Yes. You should. You should be another sheep and watch Parks and Rec like all the other sheep.
Moo.
phisheep
NeoGAF's Chief Barrister
Here's a fuller review. Bear in mind there were about 1000 people there yesterday - that's half the number allowed in from today onwards, so when particular displays were busy today they'll be hellishly busy from now on in.
The venue
It's been 15 years since any of us were allowed into the Tropicana. It feels like progress to get in there at all - so, much credit to Banksy for that from grateful locals. It is in dreadful condition though.
Entrance and first impressions
I liked the fake security checkpoint. Everyone kept in character throughout and it was silly fun. I liked the always morose/depressed/miserable/moaning staff - it really worked on the contrary spirit in me, had a big broad smile on my face the whole way round. As you get out of security and into the main arena there's a van in the way selling souvenir programmes, and it all gets rather clogged up. Best to take a sharp right as soon as you are out of the security doors to avoid the crush. Once you've done that the overwhelming impression is that the whole thing is a load of tat.
That's deliberate of course (as can be seen by the sharp contrast with the indoor display space, which has been very well presented, but more of that later).
The central castle aside, though, it really doesn't feel like it is merely a Disney slag-off. Rather, it's a slag-off of theme parks/fairgrounds etc in general.
Bits that are difficult to get into:
- the museum of cruel things (or something like that) at the back right got massive queues very early on (and I was about the 200th person in) - I never did get in there, as I had to get back to the shop for the afternoon
- same goes for the circus tent thing at the far left. Didn't get in there either
- the bar. Not that it was particularly busy, but because it is on the roof. To find it turn sharp right from the entrance, follow signs for the toilets ("BOGS") and go up the stairs on the right. There's a good view from up there too.
General atmosphere of the exhibits: it's all very protest-y - anti establishment, anti-government, anti-tory anti an awful lot of things - with very little that's new or interesting from that point of view. Very late 1960s feel to much of it. That is, I gather, the in thing now - though it does come across rather extremely and irritatingly self-importantly preachy.
General atmosphere of the crowds: a lot of people having rather a lot of fun! There's lots to do and see and ride on and in and trip over and suchlike. A grand day out. It is warming to be with so many people enjoying themselves amidst such a gloomy atmosphere (which I suspect is a riff on Weston-super-Mare and decayed seaside resorts in general).
Odd things about the opening day particularly: There were a lot of TV crews around, and it was sometimes quite difficult to avoid getting in someone's shot by accident (that's how I accidentally reversed into a giant killer whale, which was something of a surprise).
Stuff in the outdoor arena
Working roughly anticlockwise from the entrance. I'm doing this from memory so I might miss some stuff out
- some tatty wooden constructions that aren't even nice to look at and I couldn't see the point of until later on I discovered the rooftop bar that you can work the puppets from - so I spent some time up there entertaining the folks below
- the pocket money payday loans thing. One of the few exhibits that made a relatively topical point in a fresh and interesting way. It is tiny though, you can only fit about 4 people inside. Contains the best poster in the whole exhibition, but I'm not telling you which one.
- Crazy golf. There might be some point to this other than just being a crazy golf course, but I'm not sure what it is. Spent some time trying to wind up the attendant. Failed dismally, but did par a few holes.
- big-ass sandcastle with windmill on top. Silly and fun. Also a sandpit for playing in, so go play in it like I did! Pointless just looking at it, it’s a sandpit.
- a tent containing an anarchist bookshop, some questionable statistics about deaths in police custody and a whole lot of posters for flyposting on the wall behind. I flyposted my own instead because, hey, it's not real flyposting if you only post what they say you can post.
- a giant scaffolding horse that you don't really notice from ground level. It's rather impressive if you climb up the steps at the back so you can see it properly.
- the museum of cruel things that I didn't get to see because of being too crowded.
- A fun-looking ferris wheel going round at about four times the usual speed. They wouldn't let me on it being as there is only one of me and I would apparently have unbalanced it and made it fall over.
- a little library with comfy chairs outside, good for a rest
- Punch and Judy with added Jimmy Savile. This *could* have been excellent but badly let down by the execution as (a) Julie Burchill has no sense of theatre or timing and (b) the performer was crap. Give that one a miss. Thank me afterwards.
- Video theatre (back left). Absolutely excellent video installations, and no better place to see them than sitting on deckchairs in the sun. Enjoyed v much.
- spoof fairground booths. A bit hit-and-miss – for example the catch the oil-stained-duck thing would have been pointed and relevant in 1968 but waste of space now. On the other hand, it is surprisingly good uninhibited fun trying to knock over an anvil with ping pong balls.
- that Ariel statue is very effective and weird. Catches your eye from all around and just meddles with the reality enough that you are drawn back to it.
- Cinderella coach crash is surprisingly effective. Given all the publicity I’d expected no more than a passing look, but the way the whole thing is laid out really adds to the experience, it is *very* well done and effective, but I won’t describe it any more here because spoilers.
- Killer whale/toilet/hoop meh, except it took me by surprise when I backed into it.
Plus, *lots* of places to just sit and enjoy, feed and water and so on.
Forgot to mention the sculptures. Brilliant picnic tables. The big truck thing is too damn big.
Indoor exhibition
Too much to do it all in detail, so highlights only. Maybe 80% of it didn’t do anything for me (but then, 80% of the Louvre doesn’t either). Too much is trite (ohh yeah, lets paint the cut ends of trees red so it looks like they are bleeding – that sort of trite, though a lot of it is very well executed.)
Death on a dodgem is fun and silly.
Damien fucking Hirst utterly spoils the second room. That rotating beach ball over knives looks nice enough, but the fan used to keep it up is too fucking loud.
Of the paintings, I got caught up in front of two big ones by Laura Lancaster. Wow. Chances are you’ll get caught up in front of something too, but it’ll be something different. There’s a *lot* of variety in there. Honourable mentions to Lee Madgwick and Caroline McCarthy and Joanna Pollonais and Jani Leinonen, thumbs down to a few others.
Don’t go out of the exit when you get to it or you will miss something special. Instead go through the unmarked door ahead of you to see Jimmy Cauty’s miraculous cityscape. I could have spent four or five hours in this room alone.
That’s all I can remember for now.
I’ll be going back again for sure. Probably a few times. Definitely at night.
Sure. PM me your name and address and I will mail you the souvenir programme.
The venue
It's been 15 years since any of us were allowed into the Tropicana. It feels like progress to get in there at all - so, much credit to Banksy for that from grateful locals. It is in dreadful condition though.
Entrance and first impressions
I liked the fake security checkpoint. Everyone kept in character throughout and it was silly fun. I liked the always morose/depressed/miserable/moaning staff - it really worked on the contrary spirit in me, had a big broad smile on my face the whole way round. As you get out of security and into the main arena there's a van in the way selling souvenir programmes, and it all gets rather clogged up. Best to take a sharp right as soon as you are out of the security doors to avoid the crush. Once you've done that the overwhelming impression is that the whole thing is a load of tat.
That's deliberate of course (as can be seen by the sharp contrast with the indoor display space, which has been very well presented, but more of that later).
The central castle aside, though, it really doesn't feel like it is merely a Disney slag-off. Rather, it's a slag-off of theme parks/fairgrounds etc in general.
Bits that are difficult to get into:
- the museum of cruel things (or something like that) at the back right got massive queues very early on (and I was about the 200th person in) - I never did get in there, as I had to get back to the shop for the afternoon
- same goes for the circus tent thing at the far left. Didn't get in there either
- the bar. Not that it was particularly busy, but because it is on the roof. To find it turn sharp right from the entrance, follow signs for the toilets ("BOGS") and go up the stairs on the right. There's a good view from up there too.
General atmosphere of the exhibits: it's all very protest-y - anti establishment, anti-government, anti-tory anti an awful lot of things - with very little that's new or interesting from that point of view. Very late 1960s feel to much of it. That is, I gather, the in thing now - though it does come across rather extremely and irritatingly self-importantly preachy.
General atmosphere of the crowds: a lot of people having rather a lot of fun! There's lots to do and see and ride on and in and trip over and suchlike. A grand day out. It is warming to be with so many people enjoying themselves amidst such a gloomy atmosphere (which I suspect is a riff on Weston-super-Mare and decayed seaside resorts in general).
Odd things about the opening day particularly: There were a lot of TV crews around, and it was sometimes quite difficult to avoid getting in someone's shot by accident (that's how I accidentally reversed into a giant killer whale, which was something of a surprise).
Stuff in the outdoor arena
Working roughly anticlockwise from the entrance. I'm doing this from memory so I might miss some stuff out
- some tatty wooden constructions that aren't even nice to look at and I couldn't see the point of until later on I discovered the rooftop bar that you can work the puppets from - so I spent some time up there entertaining the folks below
- the pocket money payday loans thing. One of the few exhibits that made a relatively topical point in a fresh and interesting way. It is tiny though, you can only fit about 4 people inside. Contains the best poster in the whole exhibition, but I'm not telling you which one.
- Crazy golf. There might be some point to this other than just being a crazy golf course, but I'm not sure what it is. Spent some time trying to wind up the attendant. Failed dismally, but did par a few holes.
- big-ass sandcastle with windmill on top. Silly and fun. Also a sandpit for playing in, so go play in it like I did! Pointless just looking at it, it’s a sandpit.
- a tent containing an anarchist bookshop, some questionable statistics about deaths in police custody and a whole lot of posters for flyposting on the wall behind. I flyposted my own instead because, hey, it's not real flyposting if you only post what they say you can post.
- a giant scaffolding horse that you don't really notice from ground level. It's rather impressive if you climb up the steps at the back so you can see it properly.
- the museum of cruel things that I didn't get to see because of being too crowded.
- A fun-looking ferris wheel going round at about four times the usual speed. They wouldn't let me on it being as there is only one of me and I would apparently have unbalanced it and made it fall over.
- a little library with comfy chairs outside, good for a rest
- Punch and Judy with added Jimmy Savile. This *could* have been excellent but badly let down by the execution as (a) Julie Burchill has no sense of theatre or timing and (b) the performer was crap. Give that one a miss. Thank me afterwards.
- Video theatre (back left). Absolutely excellent video installations, and no better place to see them than sitting on deckchairs in the sun. Enjoyed v much.
- spoof fairground booths. A bit hit-and-miss – for example the catch the oil-stained-duck thing would have been pointed and relevant in 1968 but waste of space now. On the other hand, it is surprisingly good uninhibited fun trying to knock over an anvil with ping pong balls.
- that Ariel statue is very effective and weird. Catches your eye from all around and just meddles with the reality enough that you are drawn back to it.
- Cinderella coach crash is surprisingly effective. Given all the publicity I’d expected no more than a passing look, but the way the whole thing is laid out really adds to the experience, it is *very* well done and effective, but I won’t describe it any more here because spoilers.
- Killer whale/toilet/hoop meh, except it took me by surprise when I backed into it.
Plus, *lots* of places to just sit and enjoy, feed and water and so on.
Forgot to mention the sculptures. Brilliant picnic tables. The big truck thing is too damn big.
Indoor exhibition
Too much to do it all in detail, so highlights only. Maybe 80% of it didn’t do anything for me (but then, 80% of the Louvre doesn’t either). Too much is trite (ohh yeah, lets paint the cut ends of trees red so it looks like they are bleeding – that sort of trite, though a lot of it is very well executed.)
Death on a dodgem is fun and silly.
Damien fucking Hirst utterly spoils the second room. That rotating beach ball over knives looks nice enough, but the fan used to keep it up is too fucking loud.
Of the paintings, I got caught up in front of two big ones by Laura Lancaster. Wow. Chances are you’ll get caught up in front of something too, but it’ll be something different. There’s a *lot* of variety in there. Honourable mentions to Lee Madgwick and Caroline McCarthy and Joanna Pollonais and Jani Leinonen, thumbs down to a few others.
Don’t go out of the exit when you get to it or you will miss something special. Instead go through the unmarked door ahead of you to see Jimmy Cauty’s miraculous cityscape. I could have spent four or five hours in this room alone.
That’s all I can remember for now.
I’ll be going back again for sure. Probably a few times. Definitely at night.
Sure. PM me your name and address and I will mail you the souvenir programme.
phisheep
NeoGAF's Chief Barrister
We've been open just over three years now. On St James Street - that's the one that runs behind T J Hughes between Marks & Spencers and what used to be Dolphin Square.
Purple Cheeto
Member
I dunno, I kind of think Banksy hit the same wall Eminem hit. He's too famous, rich and culturally acceptable at this point. He's a shock artist who has lost his shock value.
maniac-kun
Member
Actualy its pretty awesome.
Oh noes! An artist is making more money than you!
Dude toiled in the shadows for years, and now he has money. I still don't see the big deal.
Was the world supposed to up and ignore Andy Warhol the moment he started having big parties with celebrities?
What about Keith Haring? I personally can't stand his style, but lots of people did and his stuff was everywhere, including t-shirts.
Also, since he's anonymous, how do you know he doesn't donate to worthwhile causes?
It's true. He's lost his impact, and mostly retreads what he's done before. He probably should take a break.
But I do like the idea of him pulling-off a large scale installation like this. It's quite a feat.
Knit Your Own Porridge
Member
Aha, I moved back to Bristol about three years ago, so I have an excuse! I'll see if I can pop in next time I'm around.
deltatheta
Member
Seems like it would be disrespectful to Banksy's work to entertain such a non-cynical thought.
Banksy is so played out. This is him/her coasting. I get that they feel they're over stencils and regular streetart, but at this point, if they're not going to contribute to meaningful change in the subjects they choose to frame in satire, they're just punks whinging over problems they won't actually do anything to fix. Shit or get off the pot, Banksy.
Chinese Cartoons
Banned
We can see who on here visits 4chains.
Knit Your Own Porridge
Member
Was Banksy ever trying to "contribute to meaningful change"?
If they do, I'll care again. Until then, I'm bored.
Mercury Fred
Banned
Oh lawd at people getting hung up and defensive about this. He's an art prankster. This is what he does-- pithy, amusing commentary on the current culture. Some really insecure seeming posts here.
Knit Your Own Porridge
Member
Yup, complaining that it's not deep enough or that it won't catalyse social change is kinda missing the point. Banksy has never done that - he's always done cheeky pranks.
If that's not your cup of tea then that's fair enough, but it seems like a fair few people had misplaced expectations.
Rabbi_Vole
Banned
Freeza Under The Shower
Member
That was sort of my impression too.
I just love how defeated he is at the end of that movie though. 'Yes, art has no meaning, and you helped prove that' must have been going through his mind. Or so I hope.
Trying too hard? This is like a haunted house type deal or a holiday castle which is probably more common over in europe. They're like those springup carnivals, but maybe a little more reputable and less deathtrappy? I dunno. But this is a cool idea, I think. I'm not digging for deep depths, and I don't think it's pretension, it's just fun, irreverent deconstruction. you guys act like he's taking himself too seriously, but this thing will all be taken down in a few months, more than likely.
maybe you guys are just too cool. or maybe you're not the intended target >_>
maybe you guys are just too cool. or maybe you're not the intended target >_>
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