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[Clockwork5]

See how it turns out then make your decision accordingly.

But rest assured plastic surgery most likely won't to do a damn thing regarding her parental self esteem issues.

 

[besada]

Tell her how you feel. Tell her you understand that it's totally her choice, but you think she's beautiful the way she is. Explain why you feel the way you do. If you can't be honest with her, or she can't take the honesty, you're probably fucked anyway. Hopefully it's not something you'd consider leaving her over, and if that's the case, reassure her that whatever she decides, you'll still feel the same about her.

 

[MsKrisp]

OP phrases it as concern. But really I get the feeling that the cosmetic surgery makes him insecure that she'll become more attractive and trade him up for a better looking guy.

Dont become more attractive because I cant compete.

Or maybe he feels like she's fine without it? Why would you infer this?

 

[the_batman]

just wondering, OP, would you be complaining if she was getting a boob job

sounds like she's got big self esteem issues if she's willing to go under the knife to change her looks. there's gotta be a way to show her that her natural born looks are beautiful.

 

[Zoe]

Yes.

Real shame you think that way.

 

[Two Words]

OP phrases it as concern. But really I get the feeling that the cosmetic surgery makes him insecure that she'll become more attractive and trade him up for a better looking guy.

Dont become more attractive because I cant compete.

That is quite a reach.

Yes.

It figures that you are projecting.

 

[always crazy bacon]

That is quite a reach.

Not really at all, if you know Chinese culture.

 

[always crazy bacon]

It figures that you are projecting.

Please do tell me what IM projecting. As because the refect back a point of view as a counter in discussion is really weak.

 

[Tetra-9]

You should tell her how you feel. It's important to realize that it's her decision. But maybe she should re-evaluate this with some psychological help because it's a big decision.

When it comes to how you would feel afterward... That's hard because if you're just not into that look then that's completely okay, yet she will still be the same person and think she's more attractive. I'm not into tattoos much but if someone I loved got a really bad one I would have to re-evaluate my time spent/experience with that person.

If in the end something bothers you enough in a relationship just be upfront and move on if necessary.

 

[Xe4]

Not really at all, if you know Chinese culture.

The OP isn't Chinese though. Non-Chinese people don't see it as making the person more attractive at all (from my experience).

 

[keuja]

I've always wondered why those north Asian women all want those double eyes lid. The eyes are fine as they are. Brainwashed by the media?

 

[Horse Detective]

I find the backlash on cosmetic surgery completely bizarre.

The moral/ethical issues people have with it are arbitrary and seem to never have anything to do with health risk.

edit: for the love of fuck, please don't just assume I mean getting it over and over again. I really don't feel like being someone's hyperbole punching bag tonight

 

[the_batman]

I find the backlash on cosmetic surgery completely bizarre.

The moral/ethical issues people have with it are arbitrary and seem to never have anything to do with health risk.

other than cosmetic surgery addiction?

 

[Zoe]

I've always wondered why those north Asian women all want those double eyes lid. The eyes are fine as they are. Brainwashed by the media?

Big eyes = expressive is something that spans cultures. Asians happen to have a hack to achieve that.

Double eyelids do occur naturally among Asians though.

 

[Horse Detective]

other than cosmetic surgery addiction?

I suppose I should specify I am referring to someone wanting to change one or two aspects of themselves they are unhappy with, but I don't think that will matter to anyone.

 

[always crazy bacon]

The OP isn't Chinese though. Non-Chinese people don't see it as making the person more attractive at all (from my experience).

I know that. SHE is Chinese though, which is why shes making herself more attractive.

 

[Cagey]

I find the backlash on cosmetic surgery completely bizarre.

The moral/ethical issues people have with it are arbitrary and seem to never have anything to do with health risk.

edit: for the love of fuck, please don't just assume I mean getting it over and over again. I really don't feel like being someone's hyperbole punching bag tonight

Agreed. It always goes back to calling a person's self esteem and self worth into question as if they're deficient, which comes off as insulting in a patronizing way.

 

[Keri]

I find the backlash on cosmetic surgery completely bizarre.

The moral/ethical issues people have with it are arbitrary and seem to never have anything to do with health risk.

Honestly, I just think there's something depressing about it, especially when it's motivated by external pressures (which is almost always the case). And I find something hypocritical about us, as a society, perpetuating these beauty standards and creating those pressures and then turning around after someone has capitulated to them, to say: "It's their body and their choice!" It's like we're deliberately blinding ourselves to the role we all play in these decisions.

 

[Takuan]

Her mom's emotional abuse seems to be the issue here.

 

[Kitsunebaby]

I find the backlash on cosmetic surgery completely bizarre.

The moral/ethical issues people have with it are arbitrary and seem to never have anything to do with health risk.

I've had self esteem issues at various points in my life and have considered cosmetic surgery. When looking up reviews of various procedures you'll find examples where the procedure went extremely well and the person was happy with the results, which is wonderful. But when you see people with distorted ideas of beauty who keep chasing an idea of "perfection" but never achieving it (and sometimes ending up with bad results and even worse self esteem than when they began) it can be pretty heartbreaking.

I don't want to demonize cosmetic surgery at all, but with the stress it can put on a person's body and wallet I don't think it's a bad idea to encourage people to appreciate their own natural appearances before resorting to that.

 

[Briarios]

You should really be careful about telling her how you feel ... That's not really different than the mother telling the daughter how she feels. When it comes to someone else's self-esteem, how you feel is irrelevant. Ask her how she feels. Let her talk about her decisions and let her come to her own conclusions. Try to understand why this is important to her ... Her talking about these things may illuminate issues for herself.

 

[Horse Detective]

Honestly, I just think there's something depressing about it, especially when it's motivated by external pressures (which is almost always the case). And I find something hypocritical about us, as a society, perpetuating these beauty standards and creating those pressures and then turning around after someone has capitulated to them, to say: "It's their body and their choice!" It's like we're deliberately blinding ourselves to the role we all play in these decisions.

What does it really matter though.

Like I could message my friend right now and tell her not to get her nose changed, because her feelings regarding her face are irrelevant now that I, the admirable alpha fedora have declared her attractive by my standards.

Unless standards of beauty are completely eradicated from human culture, we are just perpetuating the notion that because someone is unhappy with an aspect of their body, they should just accept it while other people are born with the features they idealize.

I've had self esteem issues at various points in my life and have considered cosmetic surgery. When looking up reviews of various procedures you'll find examples where the procedure went extremely well and the person was happy with the results, which is wonderful. But when you see people with distorted ideas of beauty who keep chasing an idea of "perfection" but never achieving it (and sometimes ending up with bad results and even worse self esteem than when they began) it can be pretty heartbreaking.

I don't want to demonize cosmetic surgery at all, but with the stress it can put on a person's body and wallet I don't think it's a bad idea to encourage people to appreciate their own natural appearances before resorting to that.

I agree that chasing perfection would have health risks, I don't debate that in the slightest.

 

[GKnight]

I don't like plastic surgery, and in all honesty think the world would be better off if it only existed for victims of tragic accidents.
But as it is available if she wants to have it you can't really stop her, her decision to make, and possibly one day regret.
Although I'm sure some people don't regret it, I've met lots of people who have.

 

[Keri]

What does it really matter though.

Like I could message my friend right now and tell her not to get her nose changed, because her feelings regarding her face are irrelevant now that I, the admirable alpha fedora have declared her attractive by my standards.

Unless standards of beauty are completely eradicated from human culture, we are just perpetuating the notion that because someone is unhappy with an aspect of their body, they should just accept it while other people are born with the features they idealize.

I don't know man. As a woman who grew up under the weight of these standards, I feel like it matters and, I'd hope, we can all try to be better going forward. I get what you're saying, that right this moment, the OP's girlfriend feels this way and there's little that can be said to her, to undo that now. But, maybe we can at least learn from it and try to change the way we approach beauty, for the next generation.

 

[Two Words]

Please do tell me what IM projecting. As because the refect back a point of view as a counter in discussion is really weak.

You're projecting your views on this into him and his motives.

 

[Dice//]

I went under the knife. And it's definitely helped my self-esteem.

 

[Turok_TTZ]

Looking to get some opinions from others on this since I think don't really have an especially well founded position, it's more of a gut feeling that I just don't like plastic surgery on principle. But I think it's possible that this is merely down to been from a western culture (she's chinese) where we seem to place a lot of emphasis on "natural" beauty, perhaps unnecessarily, and maybe I should be being more open minded about it.

It's a self esteem issue for her. I have to be a little careful with how I word this because she probably will read it but her mother is....well in my opinion she's an awful mum, partly because she has been telling my gf her whole life that she if not pretty enough to find a husband, talking shit about her dad for giving her bad genes, etc. Objectively speaking she may not have supermodel good looks but she's beautiful to me and I don't need her to change a thing about herself.

I wish she could feel good about the way she looks now, but I can totally understand why she is insecure because of her mum, and if it is gonna be a help to her then maybe I should just be supportive? Then again I have the worry I could be a slippery slope where once you change one thing there'll always be something else you don't like and wanna change. Plus there is the chance of it going bad, but I really have no idea how common an occurrence that is.

Without knowing the context of your relationship, I think you should have a sit down with her. ask her whether she truly wants this or is it her mom influencing her and not something she decided on her own? How old is your GF? based on what little info regarding your GF's relationship with her mom, one would think it is a rather unhealthy relationship. but, I only see your take, so one cannot get the full picture.

I would say support her, but only if this is a desire of her own will. if influenced by her mom in any way, I'd suggest time set aside to improve her self esteem and independence. time for reflection is also good. It is no good for her to be influenced by her mom in this way.

challenge her if you must. ask her why she wants this. get to the bottom of why she wants plastic surgery.

Personally I don't see a problem (get a good surgeon) but the variable that is an emotionally, potentially controlling mom is what concerns me in all of this.

 

[Horse Detective]

I don't know man. As a woman who grew up under the weight of these standards, I feel like it matters and, I'd hope, we can all try to be better going forward. I get what you're saying, that right this moment, the OP's girlfriend feels this way and there's little that can be said to her, to undo that now. But, maybe we can at least learn from it and try to change the way we approach beauty, for the next generation.

I feel like there is a chance that I am implying people shouldn't conquer their preferences with better self esteem.

I'm not.

I think it is fantastic that some people can overcome their personal issues. That does not mean that the same mindset can be applied to every person. We all face different issues, and if someone can make a personal change that allows them to feel good every time they look in the mirror, I say go for it. That is, if their life or mental state is not in danger.

I went under the knife. And it's definitely helped my self-esteem.

Would you share your story?

If not, no pressure. I just find this stuff very fascinating.

 

[Deepwater]

people should be allowed to feel comfortable in their skin, and if surgery helps them do that, then let them.

 

[always crazy bacon]

You're projecting your views on this into him and his motives.

Your projecting how you discuss things onto me.

 

[Feep]

I've had cosmetic surgery (hair replacement) and it was *nothing* but a positive. You can post all the dumb motivational poster quotes in the world, but in reality, *people treat you differently* based on your appearance. Romance, business, friendship, everything.

It *shouldn't* be that way, but it is, and your looks were based off of a dumb genetic lottery. If you can improve your confidence and your appearance without significant health risk or financial strain, then do it.

 

[NervousXtian]

Pretty minor thing, and if help's her self-esteem than more power to her.

 

[Messofanego]

I don't know women's opinions on plastic surgery in relation to fixing their self-esteem issues, is there a documentary or some article exploring the process from their perspective and how it was effective in sorting out their self-esteem or not?

In the grand scheme of things, I guess I regret that it won't change the status quo of beauty standards that have been bullied by the girlfriend's mom. Moms often transfer their own body image issues onto their daughters, even unconsciously, like I've noticed with my own mom and sister, so it's just something to keep in mind which should be sorted out too after the plastic surgery is done.

 

[perfectchaos007]

You are right.



This is silly though; you don't have to support all of your significant other's decisions. You aren't, after all, their property.

Bam!

people should be allowed to feel comfortable in their skin, and if surgery helps them do that, then let them.

What if the surgery they want puts their health in grave danger, like the woman who had her ribs removed to look like Barbie. She is "happier" now, but at the cost of her physical health. She gained happiness and mental health but subbed it for her physical health.

 

[Gordon Shumway]

If it bothers you, leave her. It's her choice end of the day.

 

[Deepwater]

Bam!



What if the surgery they want puts their health in grave danger, like the woman who had her ribs removed to look like Barbie. She is "happier" now, but at the cost of her physical health. She gained happiness and mental health but subbed it for her physical health.

thats her choice.

you gotta let grown ass adults have agency for their own decisions even if you think they're worse off for it

 

[Horse Detective]

I feel like there is something to be said about the freedom to leave someone based on their desire to get cosmetic surgery.

Sure, it is certainly your right. But what are the consequences of that? I don't think it's out of the question that this sort of reasoning could lead a girl (or guy) to believe their personal emotional struggles with physicality are irrelevant next to their partner's ethics.

I feel as though this can make someone feel like their opinions are worthless. I really don't think this should be seen as admirable.

 

[BadAss2961]

Don't be passive about it, just tell her how you feel. There's nothing wrong with encouraging your girlfriend NOT to get plastic surgery. If she's serious and you want to support her decision, then do so. If it's that big a problem for you, then don't... Doesn't mean you have to break up with her.

Should get past this either way if the relationship is strong.

 

[Dazza]

A bunch of people I knew in college went on trip to South Korea for the surgery. On the one hand, they were happy with it so fuck what I think.

On the other, I couldn't help but feel they were caving in to white/Western standards of beauty and they looked fine before the surgery. It's like they were really unhappy that they looked Korean, and that's kinda fucked up.

I'm not sure if this one is from western standards. East Asians can naturally have double eye lids. Even the desire for untanned pale skin is pre western influence

 

[Keri]

I feel like there is a chance that I am implying people shouldn't conquer their preferences with better self esteem.

I'm not.

I think it is fantastic that some people can overcome their personal issues. That does not mean that the same mindset can be applied to every person. We all face different issues, and if someone can make a personal change that allows them to feel good every time they look in the mirror, I say go for it. That is, if their life or mental state is not in danger.

I get that. And, to be clear, I'm not judging people who chose to have plastic surgery. If anything, I'm judging the society that encouraged them to feel badly in the first place and created the problem they felt they needed to solve. If you have one physical trait that you are constantly being judged for and that trait is affecting the quality of your life, choosing to change it can be the logical and rational choice. It's just super fucked up how these standards develop.

Take the situation in the OP, for example. The OP's girlfriend is Chinese and the double eye lid surgery she wants is apparently really common there...despite the fact the surgery "corrects" a physical trait that is incredibly prevalent in China . How does a physical characteristic that is so common in a country, get stigmatized so much, to the point that changing it almost becomes a requirement, just to feel OK? To the point where a mother is nagging her daughter to have the surgery done, so she can live an OK life? It's just mind boggling and sad, all at once.

 

[Staccat0]

It's not your decision, but people with deep seeded self a esteem issues would probably be wise to see a therapist before permanently changing their appearance.

If she wants to do it for her, that's fine. If she wants to do it for her mom to stop bullying her that's another thing.

Ultimately, all you can do is voice your concerns and hope she is making the decision for herself and not her mom.

OP phrases it as concern. But really I get the feeling that the cosmetic surgery makes him insecure that she'll become more attractive and trade him up for a better looking guy.

Dont become more attractive because I cant compete.

This is a joke right?

 

[Messofanego]

I'm not sure if this one is from western standards. East Asians can naturally have double eye lids. Even the desire for untanned pale skin is pre western influence

Before colonialism? Certainly not the case for India's obsession for skin-lightening. Then there's the caste system, where the upper castes are thought of lighter skinned and so they're superior to the darker skinned lower castes. It's come down to even whitening your vagina, in ads.

Clean and Dry "Intimate" Wash

 

[flintstryker]

Personally if I didn't like it I would just break up with her

 

[Boogs31]

I feel like there is something to be said about the freedom to leave someone based on their desire to get cosmetic surgery.

Sure, it is certainly your right. But what are the consequences of that? I don't think it's out of the question that this sort of reasoning could lead a girl (or guy) to believe their personal emotional struggles with physicality are irrelevant next to their partner's ethics.

I feel as though this can make someone feel like their opinions are worthless. I really don't think this should be seen as admirable.

I don't think a person who chooses to leave someone because they had cosmetic surgery is doing it to be admired or looked at as the better man/woman. If it were me (and this is purely hypothetical because I've never been in this scenario), I value someone who is comfortable in their own skin, both from a physical and emotional perspective. So it would be a deal breaker. Now I do believe in proper communication and making sure your partner knows how you feel beforehand, as opposed to just bolting after the fact. Does that make me a horrible person?

 

[One Eyed Willy]

Somewhere right now there is another future guy who won't pester her about this, he's closing in as you consider trying to stop her.

Your options are to

a) Support her, her decision and stay together
b) Try and convince her otherwise, which will ultimately lead you down a dark path.

Either way this thread will be something you get to look back on and see if you made the right decision. The rest of us will move on with our lives, you .. have to live with your options. Nothing we say or do in this thread affects you, but you. Choose wisely.

Best of luck

 

[meltingparappa]

I know that. SHE is Chinese though, which is why shes making herself more attractive.

Is she Chinese or Chinese american? Was she born here or abroad? I'd the latter, how long has she been in the states? Is she or her family Cantonese, or from the mainland? Is she the oldest daughter? How old is she?


These seem like answers you'd need, to even begin making so definite a statement.

 

[Servbot24]

You're allowed to dislike the idea of it and tell her that you dislike the idea of it. She's her own person and doesn't need you to agree with every single thing she does. Of course once she goes through with it you should support her and make the best of it so she feels good.

 

[Staccat0]

Somewhere right now there is another future guy who won't pester her about this, he's closing in as you consider trying to stop her.

Your options are to

a) Support her, her decision and stay together
b) Try and convince her otherwise, which will ultimately lead you down a dark path.

Either way this thread will be something you get to look back on and see if you made the right decision. The rest of us will move on with our lives, you .. have to live with your options. Nothing we say or do in this thread affects you, but you. Choose wisely.

Best of luck

Dear internet,

This schtick is gross. Please stop.

 

[ironmang]

Sucks about her mother being that way but in a normal situation I don't find cosmetic surgery to be a bad thing as long as it's not extreme. We do all kinds of stuff to improve our appearance temporarily and permanently so why does the line need to be drawn at the knife?

You're allowed to dislike the idea of it and tell her that you dislike the idea of it. She's her own person and doesn't need you to agree with every single thing she does. Of course once she goes through with it you should support her and make the best of it so she feels good.

OP isn't really under any obligation to do this though if it bothers him that much. Walking away is always an option.

 

[Servbot24]

OP isn't really under any obligation to do this though if it bothers him that much. Walking away is always an option.

True, I'm making the assumption he loves her for who she is but that's obviously not the case in all relationships