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[Dude Abides]

My last job we were not allowed to physically touch anybody unless told to do so by the proper authorities or unless we can honestly say we can use our rights to a citizens arrest. Which basically means we only intervene in crimes that are felonies in progress that may cause death or serious bodily harm.

In this case from what i can see in the video as a security guard all I would is contact the authority and verbally command the girls to stop. Since I dont have the proprer training or authority to physically touch them.

An assault of this nature is assault in the second degree under Washington law, a class A felony, so you would have been authorized to physically intervene.

Edited to reflect this assault is probably in the second degree rather than the first. Still a felony.

 

[Devin Olsen]

I am almost blind with rage at this point.

I watched the video and was disgusted with how EVERYONE acted. Not just the security guards, the bystanders are guilty as well.

I HOPED I would come into this thread to see pretty much everyone with the same opinion, but instead I see lots of people defending the guards and their decision to do nothing.

Fuck that shit.

I don't care if in my job description it told me to just observe and report. If I saw a little girl having her head kicked in I would do whatever I could to stop it. I cannot believe it isn't illegal to just WATCH and do next to nothing. They are practically an accomplice to the crime that is being committed.

Such bullshit. I am shocked to hear that this is common practice, it actually frightens me. There have been plenty of times that I have been out late and felt a certain sense of calm knowing that there are security guards close by. But now seeing this it seems like it makes no difference at all. If all they do is observe and report why don't we just set up camera's. That is essentially all a camera does is 'observe and report'.

What makes this all unbearable is I imagine this rule is in effect because IF a security guard did do something they would likely be sued for 'abuse' or whatever else bullshit they could think of.

/rant

 

[Rorschach]

Guards were probably scared of being sued or fired if they stepped in, but what is the excuse of the rest of the crowd?

 

[selig]

The "bystanders-effect" is an explanation...NOT an excuse. Just wanted to say that.

 

[ColonelColon]

Don't blame the security guards. Blame society. imo. Why would they intervene when they've been forbidden from taking that sort of action? They could get killed and/or punished severely for trying to do the "right thing". It's unfortunate, but it's not entirely their fault.

 

[Medalion]

The crowd don't want to risk self-injury protecting someone they don't know, it could be a trap and they saw the guards do nothing, they won't do anything. Kids will be kids. ANd are probably scared to butt in.

 

[Days like these...]

If I've learned anything from my many years on GAF is that gaffers will defend anything. Sad really. Having said that I would have definitely helped that girl out even if it meant losing my job.

 

[A Link to the Past]

It may be their job to observe and report, but any single human being capable of intervening who does not should be ashamed and scrutinized nonetheless. To call them security guards if they can't do anything in the capacity of guards is silly.

 

[purnoman3000]

What's funny is that Washington is one of only 8 states to have a duty to rescue law, so in fact, the security guards and every person around were breaking the law, though it rarely is ever applied by lawmakers. This "Observe and report" bullshit, what's the point, any bystander can call the cops. Seeing things like this really bother me because I stuck my neck out once to help a person I didn't know. It was at a bus terminal as well and this guy was yelling at his gf and was about to beat her until I stepped in. He tried to hit me with a metal trash bin that was nearby but me and my buddy tackled him and held him until the police came. We did it because it was the goddamn decent thing to do, everyone just looks out for themselves these days, don't care at all for other people. It's alright though, when you're getting beat down, i'll be sure just to observe and report.

 

[speedpop]

I would have headbutted everyone within the vicinity, including the guards and the unconscious girl.

 

[Days like these...]

To all the people arguing bu bu but their jerbs be in jeoperdy!!!! Seriously, how hard could it be to find another similarly paying job?

 

[adamsappel]

I refuse to watch videos like that, but do the guards even yell at them to stop?

 

[Mudkips]

The guards are not allowed to intervene. If they had, they may have lost their jobs. Sort of a Catch-22.

This sums it up:

No, they would have lost their jobs and been sued into oblivion.

 

[jonezer4]

The name "security GUARD" would appear to be somewhat of a misnomer if it's explicitly in their job description to not protect anyone. Maybe they should change their title to "Security Observer" to avoid further confusion.

 

[BastardTrees]

the bystanders are guilty as well

/rant

very easy to say all of that when you behind the internet.

say I'm just walking by and I'm like across the street with a gyro in my hand am I supposed to just toss that gyro aside and morph into the BATMAN?

 

[Medalion]

Security Guard means they guard their store, or the people that hired them, not the general public.

 

[MiniKelly]

I was hoping this wasn't in the usa when I entered this thread. sad news.

 

[JoeBoy101]

very easy to say all of that when you behind the internet.

say I'm just walking by and I'm like across the street with a gyro in my hand am I supposed to just toss that gyro aside and morph into the BATMAN?

 

[Zenith]

If you want them to act like cops, pay them like cops, and give them the authority of cops.

How about acting like humans? How much does that cost?

 

[BastardTrees]

How about acting like humans? How much does that cost?

it all happened so fast, what was anyone going to do logically speaking?

before the bite of gyro was over, I've already walked away.

Idk shop online next time.

 

[selig]

How about acting like humans? How much does that cost?

?

But they acted like humans.


*is sock of "human" being referred to as something positive all the time*

 

[element]

I know that area quite well (Westlake Station), you could easily just go upstairs to a corner where a actual police officer would be posted, or right into Macy's.

My brother is a security guard in Seattle and most have rules of no intervention in situations. It opens up a huge amount of liability for the company providing security sadly.

 

[Hari Seldon]

You guys are raging at the wrong people. Blame the management who sets the policies.

Personally, I will never help anyone I don't know. Unless it is like a dude raping a girl or someone hitting a child, not my fucking problem. Fucking kill each other for all the fuck I care.

 

[Desi]

I remember a story my instructor told me a guy robbed a jewelery story the security guard chased him down and got the jewelery back. the owner fired the security guard on the spot. The security guard to the employer to court. The employer said I don't need a guy like that, insurance covered the loss. I could of gotten $1500 for a stolen $500 item, I could claimed the loss on my taxes. One thing I cant do is pay millions of dollars of damages to his family if he was killed in stopping the criminal. The jeweler store owner won the case.

I remember when that guy who got on top of a car in a flood to rescue the people inside was sued. Or a robber breaking into a house and getting hurt.


the problem is criminals know the law better than civilians. A lot of people have no idea that a Security Guard can not put there hands on people or break up conflicts with anything other than words. But since criminals know what security can and cannot do, they get away with it. Security has the same authority I have as a retail worker.

 

[Vlightray]

This type of shit has been happening for centuries in different places and different ways now we have the internet so we can see it and discuss it no difference really, can we make a change? we should but will anybody? nope.

 

[Jenga]

I would have headbutted everyone within the vicinity, including the guards and the unconscious girl.

the only reasonable reaction in this entire thread

 

[aoi tsuki]

To all the people arguing bu bu but their jerbs be in jeoperdy!!!! Seriously, how hard could it be to find another similarly paying job?

You mean another job that anyone can do and thus apply for? Probably pretty hard.

 

[Barrett2]

No, they would have lost their jobs and been sued into oblivion.

This makes no sense.

An employer would honestly fire a security guard for stopping a vicious attack on company property? Really?

Secondly, the guards wouldn't be liable, the employer would. Intervening in an attack is a natural consequence of this type of job, therefore the employer would be liable for the torts of the employee. Even if the guard was sued, they wouldn't ultimately be liable for the damages, which there wouldn't be any, because its not unlawful to stop a vicious beating.

 

[Ducarmel]

An assault of this nature is assault in the second degree under Washington law, a class A felony, so you would have been authorized to physically intervene.

Edited to reflect this assault is probably in the second degree rather than the first. Still a felony.

well im in nyc maybe we have similar laws but it more in line with "we can only stop them when its really bad like we honestly believe that the guy will get killed". And of course there is company policy which is not above the law but I bet most if not all will want to protect their job then help anybody.

The bullshit being a security guard is frustrating we can't do anything without fear of being fired and or sued. The stories I've heard on the job is crazy there was a former employer at a maycs who was sued for slander when he caught somebody stealing and confronted the man.

 

[BastardTrees]

wouldn't be liable, the employer would

pretty much means you're fired.

 

[Ducarmel]

But in many cases you can sue the individual (for whatever rights they violated) and the company the individual works for hiring said individual.

 

[Count Dookkake]

Why did this not surprise me that the victim was black?

Did the race of the attackers surprise you?

 

[projekt84]

God forbid you're fired from your crappy merchandise security job for helping someone in need.

 

[out0v0rder]

You can all blame Johnny Knoxville and the rest of the Jackass crew for this.

People think shit happening in public is fake nowadays. Nobody wants to help if dumb shit happening is most likely a prank.

God forbid you're fired from your crappy merchandise security job for helping someone in need.

or getting your face blasted off because you didnt know they have guns and you dont....

 

[Sanjuro]

Threads like this make me proud to say I've knocked out a woman.

The event went by quickly. Second guessing and double standards are running through the guards heads. I don't want to drag them through hell, but they should have done more to get in between the individuals. However they did do their job correctly.

 

[Dude Abides]

This makes no sense.

An employer would honestly fire a security guard for stopping a vicious attack on company property? Really?

Secondly, the guards wouldn't be liable, the employer would. Intervening in an attack is a natural consequence of this type of job, therefore the employer would be liable for the torts of the employee. Even if the guard was sued, they wouldn't ultimately be liable for the damages, which there wouldn't be any, because its not unlawful to stop a vicious beating.

Yes. The people saying the "guards" would be sued appear to know nothing about tort law. Anyone suing the guards would lose at summary judgment, at the latest, and might get Rule 11ed as well.

 

[.GqueB.]

This makes no sense.

An employer would honestly fire a security guard for stopping a vicious attack on company property? Really?

Secondly, the guards wouldn't be liable, the employer would. Intervening in an attack is a natural consequence of this type of job, therefore the employer would be liable for the torts of the employee. Even if the guard was sued, they wouldn't ultimately be liable for the damages, which there wouldn't be any, because its not unlawful to stop a vicious beating.

Youre ignoring the other side of it. If the guard were to get hurt while trying to step in, the employer could be responsible for that injury.

When I was working at Urban Outfitters, a security guard was told not to chase after someone who had just ran out with a pair of jeans. They never said why but it was pretty obvious. Those $50 jeans could easily turn into hundreds of thousands of dollars in some way shape or form if something were to go wrong.

 

[Xeke]

...and I am reminded of this holy day of the sad story of Kitty Geneviese. This poor soul cried out time and time again for help but no person answered her calls. Though many saw, not one so much as called. Her assailant wiped the bloody knife off on her lifeless little body. They watched as he simply walked away. Nobody wanted to get involved. Nobody wanted to take a stand... We must fear evil men and deal with them accordingly but what we must truly guard against, what we must fear most

Is the indifference of good men.

 

[Kronotech]

Nice reporting, "security" guards!

 

[mcrae]

Perhaps, but the chances of the pack turning on them are excellent, practically guaranteed. The kicker at University of Oregon was recently beaten until unconscious (critical condition) for trying to break up a fight.

Getting shot: a possibility. I don't blame them for staying out of the way.

you know nothing about the nature of the 'pack;' the article itself states that the chances of the group of people getting involved was unlikely

 

[OpinionatedCyborg]

I'd be cool if this girl was getting attacked by a pack of big dudes and you were heavily outnumbered. After all, you lack the training necessary to stop them and you aren't paid enough to risk your life. Your job is to deter and observe and report. Or help out in the case of emergencies like fires. Or notice dangerous situations like potential bomb threats and the like. In most cases, security guards are not supposed to be armed muscle.

But there were several security guards and only one or two attackers. I saw no weapons either. It's not a black or white situation as some in this thread believe, but I think they should've taken action. I can't believe they were literally standing next to the girl as she was beaten... if they had attempted to help the girl but were repelled by a gang of people, OK... I'd be fine if they ran off to save their asses. But they did nothing while this was happening right in front of them. pretty messed up,.

 

[BigJonsson]

The girls werent very big, but you have to be careful you don't try and break it up and get jumped by the rest of the people in their crew.........

Their job is to keep other people out of the fight until the cops get there, they are unarmed security, they'd get killed if other people jumped them from behind

 

[-viper-]

Ah, lovely story. Fucking idiots.

The fact the so-called security did absolutely nothing but watch is pretty sad.

 

[Silent Death]

Some people here more likely to join the people beating down the 15 year old than helping her. This is GAF.

My thoughts exactly, people are hypocrites who spout off about morals and right and wrong in the company of others, but when no one else is looking and they can get away with it they have all the morals and righteousness of a pack of wild animals.

 

[MNC]

Carefully agreeing with the non-intervening part if it isn't in your job description... But why the fuck is this not in a security guard's job description in the first place?

 

[zedge]

I think the biggest reason these so called "security" guards and even the bystanders themselves are affraid to intervien is fear of being sued. Especially in the US, people are so sue happy its rediculous. The security company is affraid of being sued and the bystanders are also.

 

[Bluemercury]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r2EirLJqghA
:lol :lol

 

[EzLink]

My thoughts exactly, people are hypocrites who spout off about morals and right and wrong in the company of others, but when no one else is looking and they can get away with it they have all the morals and righteousness of a pack of wild animals.

I judge the validity of what people say online, HURRR

Sure this is the type of thing where its easier said than done. But don't assume that everyone who is expressing outrage is just blatantly lying to look like they have morals on NeoGAF

 

[Silent Death]

I judge the validity of what people say online, HURRR

Sure this is the type of thing where its easier said than done. But don't assume that everyone who is expressing outrage is just blatantly lying to look like they have morals on NeoGAF

I wasn't basing my comments on anything that people said in this thread but from my observation of people in RL.

 

[K.Jack]

Okay, don't intervene. But if you aren't going to do shit, don't stand within feet of the vicious beating.

That's what pisses me off.