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[Brazil]

"Alongside Monster Hunter and Sengoku Basara"?

Yeah, the West is never seeing another Dragon's Dogma game ever again.

 

[Boney]

"Alongside Monster Hunter and Sengoku Basara"?

Yeah, the West is never seeing another Dragon's Dogma game ever again.

sigh

 

[KO Traveling Hobo]

"Alongside Monster Hunter and Sengoku Basara"?

Yeah, the West is never seeing another Dragon's Dogma game ever again.

debbiedowner.jpg

 

[King Boo]

waiting for pc version

 

[catabarez]

Word. MT Framework is an incredible engine, so it's a real shame to see it with framerate problems and tearing. 1080p60, though? Yes, please.

Once you have that 1008p60 goodness you can't go back. Mostly.

 

[mollipen]

They've said they intend to make it a franchise, so the only question now really is what platform it will be on.

It really is going to be interesting to see what they would do with a follow-up game, especially given the mindset Capcom is under now. Create a franchise in Japan, toss it to Westerners to continue. While I have to be fair and say I didn't play a lot of it at E3, what I did play of Lost Planet 3 made me really depressed—it's not at all the direction I want to see the series go in. I could totally see Capcom thinking "we need to make this more like Skyrim, give it to some gaijin to further develop!"

There's a lot of ways they could take Dragon's Dogma, and I'm not sure I like a lot of the options. As much as I love my handhelds, I just don't think that is where this series belongs. Watch them turn it into some sort of multiplayer game on the Vita to make up for Monster Hunter being on the 3DS. *heh*

What's so terrible about the pawn system? Could it be implemented better? Sure, but I don't think there was anything so wrong with it that it warrants a removal of it (which I assume is what you're saying for a sequel).

I don't want the removal of the pawn system—I just don't want my party to be 50% comprised of throw-away nobodies I don't care about. I know some like what was done with the game, but I find it to be one of the stupidest examples of Japanese developers making wacky gameplay aspects for no reason in a long time. RPGs should be about creating attachment to your party, no rotating half of it in and out constantly like they were armor or weapons.

 

[PepsimanVsJoe]

I don't want the removal of the pawn system—I just don't want my party to be 50% comprised of throw-away nobodies I don't care about. I know some like what was done with the game, but I find it to be one of the stupidest examples of Japanese developers making wacky gameplay aspects for no reason in a long time. RPGs should be about creating attachment to your party, no rotating half of it in and out constantly like they were armor or weapons.

I always took pictures.
Memories that last a lifetime. *shrug*

Besides how attached could you get to someone who reminded you that "wolves hunt in packs" thirty-seven times a day?

 

[ShockingAlberto]

I thought the other pawns being disposable strengthened the bond I had with my pawn.

Everyone else may come and go, but my Andre the Giant lookalike was going to be by my side through thick and thin.

 

[Auto_aim1]

I don't want the removal of the pawn system—I just don't want my party to be 50% comprised of throw-away nobodies I don't care about. I know some like what was done with the game, but I find it to be one of the stupidest examples of Japanese developers making wacky gameplay aspects for no reason in a long time. RPGs should be about creating attachment to your party, no rotating half of it in and out constantly like they were armor or weapons.

You don't even have to hire them, though. You always have a main pawn by your side. It feels good when someone hires your pawn and they come back with a lot of Rift Crystals and area/quest knowledge. What I would like Capcom to do is to improve the bloody AI, so that they aren't completely useless.

 

[mollipen]

I thought the other pawns being disposable strengthened the bond I had with my pawn.

Everyone else may come and go, but my Andre the Giant lookalike was going to be by my side through thick and thin.

Going back to try to finally beat Mass Effect 3, I hate the whole pawn idea more than ever. How awesome would it be to adventure in Dragon's Dogma with three other characters I care about! Characters I can actually customize! And, you know, actually be worth something to me because I've grown them into the kind of support characters I want backing me up on my adventures!

Urgh.

You don't even have to hire them, though. You always have a main pawn by your side. It feels good when someone hires your pawn and they come back with a lot of Rift Crystals and area/quest knowledge. What I would like Capcom to do is to improve the bloody AI, so that they aren't completely useless.

I love the idea of having three teammates, and I don't even mind the game's AI. (Well, mostly.) The pawn system is just an idea to make the game stand out when it could have totally stood out for all of the good reasons it offers.

I also hate my pawns having quest knowledge before I do—it go against the joy I get from exploration and learning things. Though I do sort of strangely enjoy the ridiculousness of rent-a-pawns having no problem running off and leaving you when they have quest knowledge about a place you've never been to before. Some team! *heh*

 

[Roland Deschain]

They've said they intend to make it a franchise, so the only question now really is what platform it will be on.

The 3DS or cellphones might make more sense since the series really only seems to only have sold well in Japan, but its budget is way too high for a title that is targeted solely at that market.

That said, given the nature of the game, it might be hard to port that over, but they did take an approach like E.X Troopers to Lost Planet in Japan following Lost Planet 2's success there.

The other option is to just pour more money in and hope it catches on globally the second time.

Maybe we have to assume that, with the groundwork being done on the first game, that production on a sequel would be much cheaper?

 

[PepsimanVsJoe]

If they improved the AI even a little I could get away with putting the controller down and having my pawns handle everything like FFXII.

They do their part well enough, which is summoning huge fuck-off meteors that demolish everything.

Also there are enough RPGs where you can create your own party and outfit them however you like...aren't there?

 

[Anteater]

The main pawn and support pawn system is fine, the problem is just that you could easily out level the support pawns you rent, you could add them to favorite and rent them again next time, I love renting the right pawns other people raise, I spent most of the game using this short hair mage character that just fits in with my group, it was pretty awesome, but problem is that next time you rent them, they might be a lot higher level than you.

A level sync or some kind of scaling system would be nice so you could keep renting the ones you really liked.

 

[Angelus Errare]

Going back to try to finally beat Mass Effect 3, I hate the whole pawn idea more than ever. How awesome would it be to adventure in Dragon's Dogma with three other characters I care about! Characters I can actually customize! And, you know, actually be worth something to me because I've grown them into the kind of support characters I want backing me up on my adventures!

Flip side is you get characters you don't actually give a damn about but the game forces them on you.
No thank you

That and the great thing about the pawn system is I can grab pawns who I like. As an example, my current team is all red heads.

 

[mollipen]

Flip side is you get characters you don't actually give a damn about but the game forces them on you.
No thank you

That and the great thing about the pawn system is I can grab pawns who I like. As an example, my current team is all red heads.

What I'm arguing is for giving the player full creative control over all three pawns, as they do the main one in the current game. So, really, we want the same thing! And you could then even keep the idea of rent-a-pawns for those who like such wackiness. I always prefer the idea of choice when it comes to giving players the option to play a game in the way they want to.

My mention of Mass Effect 3 was more in how much it means to me when an RPG gives me teammates which I care about, versus those who are seen as disposable equipment.

 

[Anteater]

What I'm arguing is for giving the player full creative control over all three pawns, as they do the main one in the current game. So, really, we want the same thing!

But then I wouldn't be able to rent your pawn and see what kind of pawn you like

edit: oh just saw your edit

 

[JustAnotherOtaku]

I would have no problems with this. It's a fantastic game with some rough edges that could easily be polished for a sequel. A Vita version would also be nice if they want to move beyond consoles.

 

[SparksterMeta0]

This is good news.

If they do make a sequel, I hope it shows many improvements. I'll have to continue playing it soon...

 

[Pie and Beans]

Monster Hunter this shit: Azure Drakes, pink griffons, Obsidian Trolls, and all the armour sets that can be crafted from their materials only. Add in slicing off tails. 4 player co-op. Millions.

 

[IdreamofHIME]

Quote for clarity;

"It's difficult, because we really want this game to sell 10 million units worldwide. We want to sell a lot, and that's just something that we think we can do. We're not positive [it will be a success]. Of course it's a risk, but that's what we want - a challenge."

Yup, so many people took that out of context.
I'm almost 100% sure that every developer would like their games to sell 10million, doesn't mean they expect those sales....they'd just love it.

Capcom's financial forecast of 1.5 million worldwide was how they realistically saw the game doing, and it seems to be pretty much near on track for that.

 

[Anteater]

Speaking of options, it would be nice to let me dismiss my pawn without throwing her off the cliff next game

 

[Angelus Errare]

Monster Hunter this shit: Azure Drakes, pink griffons, Obsidian Trolls, and all the armour sets that can be crafted from their materials only. Add in slicing off tails. 4 player co-op. Millions.

On second thought, nah.

 

[Raide]

Will buy DD2 when it has co-op. At least is sold enough to maybe warrant a sequel.

Monster Hunter this shit: Azure Drakes, pink griffons, Obsidian Trolls, and all the armour sets that can be crafted from their materials only. Add in slicing off tails. 4 player co-op. Millions.

If they planned on doing that they should just bring over Monster Hunter, which is the better choice.

 

[PepsimanVsJoe]

Monster Hunter this shit: Azure Drakes, pink griffons, Obsidian Trolls, and all the armour sets that can be crafted from their materials only. Add in slicing off tails. 4 player co-op. Millions.

If I wanted to play Monster Hunter I'd roundhouse-kick myself in the nuts.

Capcom pulling an MH with DD would ruin the game IMO. In forty hours I can either have a grand adventure where I fight all sorts of beasts and make all kinds of neat discoveries, or those same forty hours can be spent picking at some dinky garden and fighting the same monster over and over again for a piece of armor I'll use .002 times. I don't want to see a zillion reskins, I want to see new monsters, new types of monsters, and they should be inventive and awesome to fight, not yet another asshole that can kitty-cart me in 1.5 hits.

(and no I haven't played a MH since Freedom 2 and I don't intend to.)


Leave things the way they are, iron out the technical issues, add more stuff, and I'm cool with it.

 

[Anteater]

Leave it as it is, but adding in coop as an option would be great for some. However I don't trust them to do a good job at it, DD while being open world isn't really that huge and lacked the boss fights you really need the party members for, there are already difficulty balancing issues with the game without the online portion, it's pretty much playable on solo and everything were designed similar to their other action games.

I didn't think it's a good party-based rpg, it's actually a lot more fun playing alone without party members, only flaws are that you lack certain abilities required to beat certain enemy types which there aren't a lot of them.

 

[Pie and Beans]

New giant sized adventure costs new giant game budget. A Dragons Dogma Portable escapade in the vein I suggest has more cash to effort potential, and this is Capcom after all.

That aside, it definitely needed a few more different Monster types, since Drakes, Wyrms and Wyverns were sort of the same thing, Hydra was massively underused, and Trolls, Cyclops and Golems all come from the same lumbering biped cloth, and Griffons and the also underused Cockatrice are pretty similar.

DD certainly felt like a game held back by this generations RAM, since they were trying to squeeze the attack animations of a DMC game into a Skyrim, no small task. Just do not let the drunkard responsible for plotting out the quest system and game design be allowed behind the wheel again. Fucking hell, about 2/3rds of the game's content feels entirely missable not by any player's fault.

 

[Bruno MB]

Nice PR spin Capcom.

Unfortunately Dragon's Dogma has bombed in the West even harder than I previously though. They've only managed to ship 500,000 units there and the data we have (NPD and GFK) suggest that Dragon's Dogma sell-through is terribly low. There is no way Capcom will ship more units. In Japan the game has performed extremely well for a new IP, it will end up selling over 500,000 units, with an eventual budget release with DLC included it can sell even more. The problem is that for a game of the caliber of Dragon's Dogma (huge development costs) that's simply not enough to make a profit, it needs to be internationally big.

At this point the best case scenario would be around 1.2M - 1.3M worldwide sales so it won't meet Capcom's target of 1.5M.

If they can lower its development cost so that the game is viable only with its Japanese sales we can't discard a new entry. On the contrary if they feel that it being successful in just one region is not sustainable, the future of Dragon's Dogma is very uncertain.

Regarding turning it into a portable series I just can't see it. It cannot be a PS Vita exclusive since that's simply not sustainable, and 3DS can't move this game unless they make a huge downgrade. On top of it, the simply existence of Monster Hunter defies the logic of turning Dragon's Dogma into a portable series, it's not rewarding enough.

 

[hed]

I hoped they would make a DLC where you get a new type of boss/enemy & notice board quest. Bud I guess it's lots of work to do. Any of that happening?

And personally I love the pawn system - it's a nice use of online mode. Not every game has to have a deep back story on the AI helpers. Especially when you get an ending like the one in Dragon's Dogma.

It's great that Dogma's doing fine in Japan. Still, we need more western gamers to buy it. I highly recommend it for any action RPGs fans.

 

[Glass Rebel]

It really is a shame that I won't be able to play this game since it looks really fun. Wasn't it developed, among others, by the DMC team at Capcom? I would buy it on PC but I won't beg for it.

 

[Anteater]

It really is a shame that I won't be able to play this game since it looks really fun. Wasn't it developed, among others, by the DMC team at Capcom? I would buy it on PC but I won't beg for it.

Yeah, dmc4 team, same director and producer. Hopefully they will release a PC version and also tweak the game a bit/add new contents.

 

[ijed]

How's it done compared to other first IP's from capcom in the same amount of time: Lost Planet, Dead Rising, MonHun? Probably a lot better ... And also does the dev time include time spent expanding MT Framework for open world games? This will no doubt deliver in the long run (Open world Monster Hunter!!!111!11!)

I hoped they would make a DLC where you get a new type of boss/enemy & notice board quest..

I love this game but haven't bought any of the quest dlc packs since they're all just fetch quests which there's more than enough of already in the game - gimme some new monsters.

Also portable version of the Everfall would be nice

 

[golem]

This really is quite a fun game. It just needs a PC version (and with tuned difficulty and a RMAH I bet Capcom would be cashing in right now).

As a side note, our current sell through data is:

92K NPD
Unknown Europe (maybe BKK can help here)
437,248 in Japan

I would guess it's at least 65-75%.

That 437,248 in Japan is only for the PS3 version, correct? Up to the last Media Create that gave numbers the 360 JP version was at 33,397 which isn't too shabby at all and has still been charting

 

[Takao]

Why would they do that? They've built the audience on consoles, and offering it on a handheld that not that many people have will hurt them.

Plus, a sequel will be easier for them to make now. Since they've already gotten the framework down.

They kind of did the exact same thing with Monster Hunter on PSP. Besides that, a port to Vita with co-op is a lot easier and cheaper than making a new game. Will it happen? Probably not given Capcom seemingly hates the platform.

 

[Lach]

Makes me happy. Loved the hell out of DD, and there have been hints here and there that Gransys is only an island and that there is a "mainland" somewhere.

 

[CadetMahoney]

They've only managed to ship 500,000 units there and the data we have (NPD and GFK) suggest that Dragon's Dogma sell-through is terribly low.

There is no way Capcom will ship more units. In Japan the game has performed extremely well for a new IP, it will end up selling over 500,000 units, with an eventual budget release with DLC included it can sell even more. The problem is that for a game of the caliber of Dragon's Dogma (huge development costs) that's simply not enough to make a profit, it needs to be internationally big.

This. ppl wiping the sweat from their brow believing Capcom are happy with sales.

 

[AHA-Lambda]

Well, it was Capcom's largest ever development team outside of Resident Evil 6, and was in development for about 3-4 years...

So why are they making sequels? O__o

 

[MoogleWizard]

It deserves much more than that. Best combat in an open world game ever.
If they do make a sequel though they need to work more on the story, it was basically non-existant.

 

[Takao]

So why are they making sequels? O__o

Capcom follows the three "Rs"

Reduce - the amount of MegaMan games
Reuse - old content to make new games
Recycle - rerelease old games

Dragon Dogma's sequels are probably going to fall squarely with the second "R".

 

[Clear]

The reality is that they can take a hit on this in order to establish a franchise going forward; shipments aren't great outside of Japan, but its such an extensible framework they can push a lot of DLC in order to jack up their ARPU. Remember $20 of DLC is worth as much to them in revenue as a $60 package at retail.

Push DLC heavy for a year, release a GOTY edition 12 months hence, and be ready with a sequel on the NG platforms in 18... Then see what the situation is.

 

[Bruno MB]

The reality is that they can take a hit on this in order to establish a franchise going forward; shipments aren't great outside of Japan, but its such an extensible framework they can push a lot of DLC in order to jack up their ARPU. Remember $20 of DLC is worth as much to them in revenue as a $60 package at retail.

Push DLC heavy for a year, release a GOTY edition 12 months hence, and be ready with a sequel on the NG platforms in 18... Then see what the situation is.

They sell 15,000 Rift Crystals for $4.99.

 

[slaughterking]

I guess a potential sequel also depends on the reception of the game and how much people actually liked it. I mean I like DD, there's definitely very cool stuff about it, but it was not good enough for me to want a sequel. I thought the game was very flawed in pretty much everything but the core combat mechanics and a couple of striking visual elements. If they don't completely overhaul presentation, story, enemy variety, difficulty/progression, quest design and certain UI elements I have no interest in a sequel. I don't need a Dragon's Dogma G.
In some ways it is actually kind of baffling that Capcom spent so much time and money developing this game. The scope and polish of it didn't impress me.

 

[SAB CA]

For all the complaints we give in the Sega threads about "lack of an ad campaign" and "Game would have solid if you advertised it!", Capcom really seemed to try with this game. Commericials on TV, Motion comics and stream events, net ads, and info in major retailers... I would love to see this game sell better in the West, has been one of the most enjoyable non-fighter games for me in a good while...

---

What I'm arguing is for giving the player full creative control over all three pawns, as they do the main one in the current game.

After playing through the game, I can't say I'd want this. At all.

Part of the fun of the game is that the "NPCs" (pawns) are actually "alive" in this game. They can change classes, personalities, and actions on you, even level up when you're not there.

I started my pawn as a Defensive, aggro-drawing Fighter, and now, she's become a very useful, dragon-grounding Strider. She's maintained a constant care for the safety of others around her, and helps and aids the rest of the pawns selflessly.

My brother made his pawn into a proud, whispy Strider-turned-Ranger. She's a bit cocky, which totally goes aganist her size and frame. Yet she jumps into battle like a crazed animal. Though I've used 10s of other pawns, and seen many with her voice setup, I've rarely seen any that act like her, saying some of the things she says ("Danger is Part-and-Parcel of Adventure!"). Comparing his adventures with her, aganist my own, has built her up as a character to us both, same with my pawn and his use of her.

Our seperate pawns have become "characters" to us, just as much as Tina or Celes in FFVI, in a way. I think the game system is well set-up to make this possible for any who play it, if you search for it.

I've fought alongside scrawny old men who fight better than their years, loli-like quite mages who lack in self-confidence, and big, burly, powerful Magic dudes who look like Raoh from Hokuto No Ken. In the right light, the variety of pawns cand be almost just as rewarding as any NPCs (maybe even more so), and I think that's one of the strengths of this games pawn system.

Letting a player bypass the need for others pawns (created without your control), would really water this element of it down.

And you could then even keep the idea of rent-a-pawns for those who like such wackiness. I always prefer the idea of choice when it comes to giving players the option to play a game in the way they want to.

It could happen in a sequel (since they always grow a games features), but I think the need to choose 2 other pawns constantly really helps the games community-like aspect. You always need to look out for a new build; Or someone who knows new info or spells.

What would be added to that aspect, if lonely-types could just make 2 others, and never get pushed into looking at the others? It'd devalue all the work they've put into pawn sharing, by giving people an "out" to using it.

The way it is now nurtures the gameworld, also. And I thought the fact that player created pawns actually walk around randomly in the game world, was a very nice touch. I think it did a good job at making me feel "This character is more than just a forgotten NPC, but is living in this adventure, with me."

I was impressed with how central the "character and their pawn" relationship turns out to be for the whole game, and think strengthening that would be much more benifical to a sequel, rather than falling into making the "party" systems more generic.

For example, you mention not feeling connected to the other pawn characters. As an alternative response, I'd love to see them implement either a way for the pawns to take place in the story (making decisions that agree with their AI types), throughout the whole game, or let the pawns take over key-positions in the game world.

For examples:

- A pawn betrays the fact you made forgeries to the one you gave them to, because they can't stand to watch injustice.

- An assassin-like pawn choose to kill someone you decided to let go, because their master taught them (Though quest knowledge and choices) that evil should *never* go unpunished.

- A pawn you bring along for a particularly solid quest of item finding, falls in love with TEH SHINEY, and decides to take over the weapon shop in your world. Since they adventure alongside you, they know your preferences, and prioritize your favorite types for new stock first.

-Pawns you are nice to, start to offer to take on quest for you. Afterwards, they describe the details to you in "FFTactics-style" play-by-plays ("I had a good feeling!" "This IS THE WAY!"), and bring back items.

- You purposely rate a pawn low, and toss him off a cliff to "dismiss" him. You make use of him, but continue to treat him bad, giving him low ratings, ignoring his advice, etc. He grows to have a vendetta aganist you. This would allow the pawn to actually be rented out by other in-game Arisen, who send him after *YOU*!​

I just think there's much more potential to be had from growing this systems strengths, rather than diverting attention from it, by adding options that detract from what it was created to do. Options are good, but unfocused options that detract from the overall world lore / gameplay systems / focus would be less welcomed.

 

[intheinbetween]

waiting for pc version

THIS!

great news by the way

 

[Gloam]

Deserves more sales. Happy to see the series continue, will be interested to see what they do with a sequel. Wonder if the series will make the jump to portables.

 

[Wolfgunblood Garopa]

waiting for pc version

It's really a console game, though. If you're a pc gamer and you expect the standards of games tailored for the pc, this isn't going to set your world on fire. Not that it isn't a really good game, it's just not a pc game.

Same with Dark Souls pc, I just don't get the appeal. It's too much of a console game.

 

[Zaptruder]

I think this game will have long legs. It'll hopefully pick up steam through word of mouth and continue selling for a long time - in a manner similar to demon souls and dark souls. Indeed, this game sits at a pretty ideal intersection between demon/dark souls and Skyrim.

The pawn system is all good and well... but I think the element they're missing to really spark the imagination of the western crowd is multiplayer.

The system is already kinda there - so if you could step into the shoes of a 'pawn' spot for a session it'd be fun as hell.

Of course, you can pick up everything, but keep the same pawn/loot system - i.e. master of world gets dibs, but you can be gifted things, to remove contentiousness. Also, you get warped to the master automatically if you try to run off too far. Basically stop you from trolling someone's game too much.

Even blend in a bit of phantom trolling system from Dark Souls/Demon Souls just to crank up the danger factor that kinda fizzles out in this game.

Maybe in the second half of the game, have it so that players warp in and out between their own realms - you can either engage them, ignore them, or even cooperate with them.

 

[Rygar 8 Bit]

deserves more sales

 

[TheThunder]

It's really a console game, though. If you're a pc gamer and you expect the standards of games tailored for the pc, this isn't going to set your world on fire. Not that it isn't a really good game, it's just not a pc game.

Same with Dark Souls pc, I just don't get the appeal. It's too much of a console game.

You know that you can plug in a controller on your PC and it's pretty much a console with 10 times the horse power right ?

 

[Glass Rebel]

It's really a console game, though. If you're a pc gamer and you expect the standards of games tailored for the pc, this isn't going to set your world on fire. Not that it isn't a really good game, it's just not a pc game.

Same with Dark Souls pc, I just don't get the appeal. It's too much of a console game.

wut

 

[Lafiel]

maybe I'm reading too much into this, but putting DD next to MonHun and Sengoku Basara as "another pillar" doesn't bode well for the future of the series outside of Japan. This tells me future of the series would be Japan centric and they might won't bother with the rest of the world.

Good thing whatever sequel they make will probably be very import-friendly. (if it's japan-only).