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[call_kotaku]

What do you think of the Dota 2 International? Based on current figures and if I'm not mistaken, Valve has made about 1.5 million from selling the related item alone, whilst throwing an additional 0.5 million into the prize pool.

That's just an extension of Valve's revenue model for the game, though, and I argue that it doesn't really serve the overall aim of esports. It crowdfunds events from the playerpool, essentially, just on a different level than charging them a registration fee like Evo does. However, what I see as the ultimate aim of esports is to monetize spectators who don't play the game, which is why Brood War was successful in Korea. What Valve did was clever but we have to see what's going to happen the next time they go for it, or if they do it more than once a year. Their whole revenue model is interesting, though, even outside of the esports discussion, but it's never going to be viable for fighting games. Imagine buying a special "evo gem" from Capcom for SFxT... yeah.

I think you're making great points man. Again - I'm not trying to reduce your argument, only going after the parts I think can be gone after. If I'm not addressing every specific aspect of it, I think it's because you've made a really good case.



But again - it's the cheapest aspect. I'm not SOLELY arguing that the "cleaning up" happen so they look spit-shined on the first day of school when teacher comes with sponsor checks. I'm just arguing that it's not necessarily a bad thing, and it can't fuckin HURT. Also, it's hard to argue there isn't a stigma. There is. Are there instances with DOTA, or LOL, or Starcraft where players/viewers have done some foul shit? Of course there are - I wouldn't argue otherwise. But they don't get the shorthand/stereotype that fighting games do. Is that fair? Probably not. But I feel like you kinda forfeit the right to complain about that unfairness when you actively argue against attempts to change that stigma.

It's not, though, because you'd be asking for people to make two communities, one for people being who they are and one for whenever there's a recording device present. The stuff that you find offensive is going to prevent some people from interacting with the community, nobody is arguing that, but ultimately that stuff is offensive off-stream and in private as well. "Pretend to be a mature, functional adult" isn't particularly effective, almost as bad as "pretend to be a mature, functional adult and we'll pay you money". How people behave on stream is secondary to the main problem, and it's a problem with game communities and videogaming in general, not something specific to the FGC, so twitch telling Aris to get off the mic is just silly. It's applying the general mechanics of American FCC regulations and censorship to a problem that doesn't require that sort of treatment, and there's a general kneejerk response to get offended for the sake of other people, when really what we should care about is how to make sure that everyone gets along because we just all love videogames.

It's sponsored by Things From Another World, a comics retailer, and a couple other businesses locally, including an arcade. I haven't asked how many sales the event has directly led to, but the sponsors seem happy with the value the event has so far as getting people inside their stores and shopping online, especially since a lot of the people who come to the event aren't necessarily people who shop at comics retailers. There's some overlap, of course (It's a trivia night) but the exposure to new potential customers leads to enough new customers at the stores (and the arcade, etc) that continuing to kick down prizes and advertisements is advantageous.

That's not particularly viable on a large scale with larger entities, though, and relying on good will is only going to get you so far. Running small local events and interacting with local businesses is what the FGC sort of is, though, or atleast it was before stream monsters.

 

[A Pretty Panda]

Fatboy you don't look that fat.

 

[Bobby Roberts]

You have a lot of solid insight in general, which is why it's frustrating when you're also so consistently condescending. Most of the friends and connections I've made since I moved to the south have been specifically through fighting game events, and the more I work on the production side of things at the local/regional scale the more I appreciate the lengths to which individuals contribute in all sorts of ways. That you always dismiss that because of (legitimate) image issues (that I agree with you on) is just insulting on some level.

I know, I know. It's a problem with me - always has been.

On the other hand (and I just PM'd Call Kotaku the same thing) if there IS a positive to come from my being so goddamned bullheaded and strident about this shit, it's that really smart people are often there to provide really good counterarguments, that hopefully people reading the thread might not have read otherwise.

I guess it'd just be nicer if I could prompt/engage in those discussions without rubbing people the wrong way like a sandpaper necktie.

Fatboy you don't look that fat.

It's a high-school nickname that stuck around far too long. I'd change it if I could, actually (I'm Bobby basically EVERYWHERE else on the internet)

That's not particularly viable on a large scale with larger entities, though, and relying on good will is only going to get you so far. Running small local events and interacting with local businesses is what the FGC sort of is, though, or atleast it was before stream monsters.

Well, I wasn't quite arguing that it WAS, just answering your question. I'm also not relying on goodwill. We DO get results - I just don't ask what they are. I don't need the extra pressure.

The reason I brought it up was to provide a personal example in which fighting games became a vital part of an entertainment experience that is neither aimed at, nor dependent on, a fighting game community, as an example (albeit a smaller one) that there is a means to get people who don't play fighting games to be excited over the prospect of just watching them.

 

[Parallax Scroll]

Jan vs Alukard on bum's stream. Jan is using Ghost Rider / Haggar/ Raccoon. Alukard has Jill / Iron Man / Sent.

 

[enzo_gt]

Lmao @ Jill landing RIGHT onto the spring super.

EDIT: Lol @ Flux making fun of Jago's Zero.

 

[Sixfortyfive]

The reason I brought it up was to provide a personal example in which fighting games became a vital part of an entertainment experience that is neither aimed at, nor dependent on, a fighting game community, as a means to prove that there is a means to get people who don't play fighting games to be excited over the prospect of just watching them.

This is part of what I think the disconnect is. I'm not at all interested in fighting games as a spectator event, nor am I interested in making them financially viable for any party involved. I'm just interested in playing fighting games and hanging out with people who play fighting games. If TvC or MvC3 were actually enjoyable online I might not have ever started driving to tournaments in the first place. The primary purpose for my stream is to boost my local scene (secondary purpose being that I'm a tech head who just enjoys this A/V stuff as a general hobby), just as one of the main reasons I started getting involved as a player was because of the exposure Level-Up and Spooky brought for the events that they stream. ("These players suck. Why am I not in Vegas?") I think this is the prevalent attitude for most people on the production side of things, be they TOs, streamers, or whatever. They're doing things primarily for the people there in the room.

So, while I'll cringe at things like Cross Assault and speak my mind when I feel like people are partaking in counterproductive behavior, I'm just not going to expend a lot of effort catering to people who have either no interest or no drive to partake in the hobby in the first place. There's no benefit in it for me.

 

[call_kotaku]

Well, I wasn't quite arguing that it WAS, just answering your question. I'm also not relying on goodwill. We DO get results - I just don't ask what they are. I don't need the extra pressure.

The reason I brought it up was to provide a personal example in which fighting games became a vital part of an entertainment experience that is neither aimed at, nor dependent on, a fighting game community, as an example (albeit a smaller one) that there is a means to get people who don't play fighting games to be excited over the prospect of just watching them.

If you're organizing a group of people together to play fighting games, that is a fighting game community -- the misogyny, racism, money matches, body odor, and harassing TOs on twitter are completely optional, believe it or not. Moreover, you're not behaving nicely (I assume you are) because someone told you to on the internet, it's just how mature people interact in a social setting. I remember at a panel a couple years back about Level Up (I think at the last UFGT) where someone asked Valle what he should do about players in his community not wanting to improve or take the game seriously, and he just said that you have to be aware that players play games for different reasons and everyone needs to realize that. Most of the intimidation doesn't come from crassness but the hyper-competitiveness of it all.

People having fun playing and watching games has nothing to do with esports, Esports is the marketization of competitive gaming to a mass audience and it's actually a very specific thing. People are pretending is some sort of grassroots evolution of gaming which it really isn't.

 

[Chindogg]

Hey guys.

UFGT9 so far is awesome. Almost everyone's here. Hope you guys watch this weekend!

 

[Stabby McSter]

i want to go to a UFGT

next year i'm going to try since i should be graduamacated and unemployed

 

[Face it Tiger..]

Huge post incoming:


So the founder of Twitch did a AMA, and Honzo asked:" Why do you hate the fgc?"

Fuzzy Otter Balls replied:

"We're a company with a product, like any other. We actively sponsor a significant number of FGC events and broadcasters because we recognize the hard work your community puts into its events. Unfortunately, there are certain expectations for brand representation and protection, no different from all sponsors, that are not currently being respected by some FGC event organizers.
I see prominent FGC leaders disparaging our product and brand, and going as far as personally attacking our employees on social media and forums. I don't expect every single person to praise the ground we walk on just because we throw dollars into the FGC, but if any other sponsor received the same treatment they would pull their investment immediately.
I don't think these actions reflect the opinion of every single person in the FGC, nor do I think the LoL, Dota, and SC2 ranks are devoid of such behavior. Our spend in the FGC rivals that of the major eSports and we continue to support the FGC because we think that, given time and cooperation, we'll help each other grow and succeed.
I hope these revelations don't undermine the progress we have made within the FGC. We enjoy excellent relationships with many event organizers and professional players, and we do see a positive return on our investments (otherwise we'd be crazy to keep them going). In time, we hope to build trust and truly unlock the potential of the FGC."

and Fishstix also added input:

"Some facts about Twitch and the FGC:
Twitch has sponsored the following FGC events in the last 2 years: Seasons Beatings, NorCal Regionals, SoCal Regionals, BarFights, CEO, LG Cup Qualifiers (US, Korea, Japan), CrossAssault, and various others.
Twitch has made a strong effort to promote nearly every single FGC major and event via the Twitch front page and social media. There have been a few that we've missed, but that's mainly because the TO/streamers did not send us promotion assets (despite me asking in many cases).
Every single week WNF, TRB, NLBC, FFF, UltraChenTV, & The Rushdown Live get front page features promotion.
LevelUp was one of the first channels on Twitch to receive a Subscription button, ever.
Many FGC streamers (including you, Honzogonzo), were partnered and/or given Sub buttons far before they met the criteria stated on Twitch. We did this because we believe in the FGC's ability to grow.
Multiple Twitch staff do, indeed, love fighting games. I personally have traveled and attended nearly a dozen events in the past 2 years. Many Twitch staff attended EVO, and plan to attend again this year. It's a common occurrence to see AE or King of Fighters being played after work hours.
Despite at times overwhelming amounts of criticism, hatred, and even threats of physical violence, I will continue to support the FGC as best as I can with the means I have available.
PS: see you at UFGT9 this weekend in Chicago! Feel free to ask me any questions there as well : )"

TL;DR: Twitch's opinion on FGC they will try their best to funnel money into the nicer parts of the FGC.


mock if moldy

 

[toddhunter]

Huge post incoming:

Dahbomb laughs at your pitiful huge post

I see prominent FGC leaders disparaging our product and brand, and going as far as personally attacking our employees on social media and forums. I don't expect every single person to praise the ground we walk on just because we throw dollars into the FGC, but if any other sponsor received the same treatment they would pull their investment immediately.

Who/What does he mean by that? I've seen people calling the twitch app shit, which it is, but can't remember anything else negative?

 

[Passive Assassin]

jared

 

[Professor Beef]

Who/What does he mean by that? I've seen people calling the twitch app shit, which it is, but can't remember anything else negative?

Probably making fun of Jared and the staff in general for what they think are slights against the FGC when really they're just moderating a bunch of bullshit that the FGC thinks "isn't harming anyone."

 

[Infinite]

Dahbomb laughs at your pitiful huge post



Who/What does he mean by that? I've seen people calling the twitch app shit, which it is, but can't remember anything else negative?

Yeah that seems like a load of shit

 

[Stabby McSter]

EMPJared

fixed

 

[Passive Assassin]

DON'T SAY HIS REAL NAME!

 

[Face it Tiger..]

Stream trolls: EMPJared "I will shut you down FGC, if it's the last thing I do"


not to mention stream trolls using OMGScoots.

 

[toddhunter]

jared

Well fair enough for random stream viewers, but fgc leaders? Come on.

 

[call_kotaku]

Well fair enough for random stream viewers, but fgc leaders? Come on.

I think Mike Watson called him a faggot or something because he cosplays as Bridget

 

[toddhunter]

I think Mike Watson called him something because he cosplays as Bridget

Would be sad if that was true. Maybe Markman can clear this u...

oh

 

[A Pretty Panda]

I wonder if the twitch CEO ever watched OBS. I'm sure he'd love it.

 

[The Last Emperor]

I think Mike Watson called him a faggot or something because he cosplays as Bridget

Lmao wow

 

[Professor Beef]

It's like Royal Flush never saw the Frutsy vs. ChrisG matches.

 

[sibarraz]

I don't get where you're coming from here. LoL and DOTA's online communities have a reputation for being some of the worst, most immature online communities. The only big ESports title I watch streams for is DOTA and I find way homophobia (namely calling things gay) from the GD Studio crew on their smaller shows than I do any of the mainstream FGC streamers, yet Valve just let them host the qualifiers for the largest E-Sports event in existence.

As for the chat, go watch view any stream that features Soe and it's inevitable that at some point 20% of the chat will be dedicated to posting a a picture of her/someone that looks like her giving somebody a blowjob. Do the people running the show take measures like Sp00ky and enable subscriber only mode for big events? No they don't, mods just delete the links as fast as they came which gives people more than enough time to post/click them.

I think it's pretty crazy for people to think viewing figures don't blow up due to the community. Fighters don't blow up because there's no game out the with a consistent user-base anywhere near the size the LoL or DOTA and it's as simple of that. As for the twitch chat mess you simply can't expect there not to be a large amount of twats on the internet, it's up to Twitch to place barriers to the chat access however they won't because they're afraid of losing viewers.

And that was my idea, people don't care for those things, but sponsors are sensitive with that, if the FGC cleans up, the sponsors could be more generous, but the community will not gain followers just for that

 

[Toski]

Huge post incoming:


So the founder of Twitch did a AMA, and Honzo asked:" Why do you hate the fgc?"

Fuzzy Otter Balls replied:

"We're a company with a product, like any other. We actively sponsor a significant number of FGC events and broadcasters because we recognize the hard work your community puts into its events. Unfortunately, there are certain expectations for brand representation and protection, no different from all sponsors, that are not currently being respected by some FGC event organizers.
I see prominent FGC leaders disparaging our product and brand, and going as far as personally attacking our employees on social media and forums. I don't expect every single person to praise the ground we walk on just because we throw dollars into the FGC, but if any other sponsor received the same treatment they would pull their investment immediately.
I don't think these actions reflect the opinion of every single person in the FGC, nor do I think the LoL, Dota, and SC2 ranks are devoid of such behavior. Our spend in the FGC rivals that of the major eSports and we continue to support the FGC because we think that, given time and cooperation, we'll help each other grow and succeed.
I hope these revelations don't undermine the progress we have made within the FGC. We enjoy excellent relationships with many event organizers and professional players, and we do see a positive return on our investments (otherwise we'd be crazy to keep them going). In time, we hope to build trust and truly unlock the potential of the FGC."

and Fishstix also added input:

"Some facts about Twitch and the FGC:
Twitch has sponsored the following FGC events in the last 2 years: Seasons Beatings, NorCal Regionals, SoCal Regionals, BarFights, CEO, LG Cup Qualifiers (US, Korea, Japan), CrossAssault, and various others.
Twitch has made a strong effort to promote nearly every single FGC major and event via the Twitch front page and social media. There have been a few that we've missed, but that's mainly because the TO/streamers did not send us promotion assets (despite me asking in many cases).
Every single week WNF, TRB, NLBC, FFF, UltraChenTV, & The Rushdown Live get front page features promotion.
LevelUp was one of the first channels on Twitch to receive a Subscription button, ever.
Many FGC streamers (including you, Honzogonzo), were partnered and/or given Sub buttons far before they met the criteria stated on Twitch. We did this because we believe in the FGC's ability to grow.
Multiple Twitch staff do, indeed, love fighting games. I personally have traveled and attended nearly a dozen events in the past 2 years. Many Twitch staff attended EVO, and plan to attend again this year. It's a common occurrence to see AE or King of Fighters being played after work hours.
Despite at times overwhelming amounts of criticism, hatred, and even threats of physical violence, I will continue to support the FGC as best as I can with the means I have available.
PS: see you at UFGT9 this weekend in Chicago! Feel free to ask me any questions there as well : )"

TL;DR: Twitch's opinion on FGC they will try their best to funnel money into the nicer parts of the FGC.


mock if moldy

Actually, I think the FGC should embrace a Two-Faced nature. Be professional during majors and EVO, and have things like OBS & LIJoe for those who want the nitty gritty. Fortunately or Unfortunately, the scene is heading toward this model IMO. The only way to get rid of the underground is to bring it to the surface, and the FGC is split between the two.

 

[A Pretty Panda]

It's like Royal Flush never saw the Frutsy vs. ChrisG matches.

I don't think Royal Flush watches Chris G matches like you do.

I don't think anyone watches Chris G matches like you do.

 

[Stabby McSter]

stream calling senor ass taxi a zombie ricky ortiz

am i dead

 

[enzo_gt]

OP updated, FGC Pros, Stream Viewer and Multiviewer are now at the top.

I don't think Royal Flush watches Chris G matches like you do.

I don't think anyone watches Chris G matches like you do.

I giggled.

 

[Professor Beef]

GENIUS move by Miniboss. As soon as I saw him stand still, I was hoping he'd use the counter-super.

 

[A Pretty Panda]

And by that I mean without any pants on.

 

[Wallach]

We're supposed to wear pants...?

 

[alstein]

I think Mike Watson called him a faggot or something because he cosplays as Bridget

That should be a CEO bet match: have a bet match and a costumer there Friday morning, loser has to cosplay as Bridget for the event. kinda like a Weasel Suit match.

you could raise mad charity with such a thing.

 

[Slamtastic]

We're supposed to wear pants...?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eGQEAiZJMco

 

[Professor Beef]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eGQEAiZJMco

Now I'm sad that Grundy doesn't have this voice in Injustice.

 

[Kadey]

Hey guys.

UFGT9 so far is awesome. Almost everyone's here. Hope you guys watch this weekend!

Can somebody stream you and Tuboware in a wrestling match in only speedos?

 

[Stabby McSter]

clockw0k vs. papa wong

 

[Gambit61]

Godlike Strange combo. I missed it the first time so I checked the archive. So sick.

www.twitch.tv/leveluplive/b/407488514?t=113m12s

 

[Spirit of Jazz]

Fatboy I'm going to skip out directly responding to you in depth because SixFourtyFive responded to you fare more succinctly than I could with similar sentiments. Your main goals a noble one, however the community should seek to better itself simply for the sake of bettering itself, not to appeal to wider audiences (which I've mentioned many times here I don't believe exist in any meaningful capacity).

And that was my idea, people don't care for those things, but sponsors are sensitive with that, if the FGC cleans up, the sponsors could be more generous, but the community will not gain followers just for that

That's why majors have been cleaned up.

I think Mike Watson called him a faggot or something because he cosplays as Bridget

I think the drama between him and Haunts (a FGC leader) probably resulted in a lot of the FGC figureheads (and the FGC in general) rallying against him. That whole situation was such a hot mess on all sides though, both men were obviously good friends who were understandably upset at each other. So what better thing to do than stream the conflict at the bastion of high quality FGC content that was Cross Assault? The whole thing sucked because something that should have strengthen the relationship between Twitch and the FGC only soured it.

 

[Lost Fragment]

Huge post incoming:


So the founder of Twitch did a AMA, and Honzo asked:" Why do you hate the fgc?"

Fuzzy Otter Balls replied:

"We're a company with a product, like any other. We actively sponsor a significant number of FGC events and broadcasters because we recognize the hard work your community puts into its events. Unfortunately, there are certain expectations for brand representation and protection, no different from all sponsors, that are not currently being respected by some FGC event organizers.
I see prominent FGC leaders disparaging our product and brand, and going as far as personally attacking our employees on social media and forums. I don't expect every single person to praise the ground we walk on just because we throw dollars into the FGC, but if any other sponsor received the same treatment they would pull their investment immediately.
I don't think these actions reflect the opinion of every single person in the FGC, nor do I think the LoL, Dota, and SC2 ranks are devoid of such behavior. Our spend in the FGC rivals that of the major eSports and we continue to support the FGC because we think that, given time and cooperation, we'll help each other grow and succeed.
I hope these revelations don't undermine the progress we have made within the FGC. We enjoy excellent relationships with many event organizers and professional players, and we do see a positive return on our investments (otherwise we'd be crazy to keep them going). In time, we hope to build trust and truly unlock the potential of the FGC."

and Fishstix also added input:

"Some facts about Twitch and the FGC:
Twitch has sponsored the following FGC events in the last 2 years: Seasons Beatings, NorCal Regionals, SoCal Regionals, BarFights, CEO, LG Cup Qualifiers (US, Korea, Japan), CrossAssault, and various others.
Twitch has made a strong effort to promote nearly every single FGC major and event via the Twitch front page and social media. There have been a few that we've missed, but that's mainly because the TO/streamers did not send us promotion assets (despite me asking in many cases).
Every single week WNF, TRB, NLBC, FFF, UltraChenTV, & The Rushdown Live get front page features promotion.
LevelUp was one of the first channels on Twitch to receive a Subscription button, ever.
Many FGC streamers (including you, Honzogonzo), were partnered and/or given Sub buttons far before they met the criteria stated on Twitch. We did this because we believe in the FGC's ability to grow.
Multiple Twitch staff do, indeed, love fighting games. I personally have traveled and attended nearly a dozen events in the past 2 years. Many Twitch staff attended EVO, and plan to attend again this year. It's a common occurrence to see AE or King of Fighters being played after work hours.
Despite at times overwhelming amounts of criticism, hatred, and even threats of physical violence, I will continue to support the FGC as best as I can with the means I have available.
PS: see you at UFGT9 this weekend in Chicago! Feel free to ask me any questions there as well : )"

TL;DR: Twitch's opinion on FGC they will try their best to funnel money into the nicer parts of the FGC.


mock if moldy

Man, these cats got trolled hard by Honzo.

Maybe I just don't pay enough attention, but I don't think there are many people who don't realize that Twitch is a huge supporter of the FGC. As far as the "I see prominent FGC leaders disparaging our product and brand" stuff goes, Watson called Jared a faggot, and that sucks and there's no excuse for it, but is there anything besides that and stream monsters being stream monsters?

Twitch invests money into the FGC that, in the end, it probably doesn't need to invest, and that's great, but that doesn't give the CEO a license to say whatever he wants, expecting people to just take it. People want to talk about accountability when people in the FGC/eSports do something dumb, but I guess that doesn't apply when the Twitch CEO says some stupid, antagonistic shit. It would be nice to just hear "What I said was dumb and I'm sorry" or something along those lines instead of all the rationalization going on.

 

[Warpticon]

You embellish. It turned out that he actually wasn't a "bitch" after all, just like he said.

You have a lot of solid insight in general, which is why it's frustrating when you're also so consistently condescending. Most of the friends and connections I've made since I moved to the south have been specifically through fighting game events, and the more I work on the production side of things at the local/regional scale the more I appreciate the lengths to which individuals contribute in all sorts of ways. That you always dismiss that because of (legitimate) image issues (that I agree with you on) is just insulting on some level.

This was pretty much exactly my position.

 

[Warpticon]

This is part of what I think the disconnect is. I'm not at all interested in fighting games as a spectator event, nor am I interested in making them financially viable for any party involved. I'm just interested in playing fighting games and hanging out with people who play fighting games. If TvC or MvC3 were actually enjoyable online I might not have ever started driving to tournaments in the first place. The primary purpose for my stream is to boost my local scene (secondary purpose being that I'm a tech head who just enjoys this A/V stuff as a general hobby), just as one of the main reasons I started getting involved as a player was because of the exposure Level-Up and Spooky brought for the events that they stream. ("These players suck. Why am I not in Vegas?") I think this is the prevalent attitude for most people on the production side of things, be they TOs, streamers, or whatever. They're doing things primarily for the people there in the room.

So, while I'll cringe at things like Cross Assault and speak my mind when I feel like people are partaking in counterproductive behavior, I'm just not going to expend a lot of effort catering to people who have either no interest or no drive to partake in the hobby in the first place. There's no benefit in it for me.

And this is the other thing. When people talk about "growth" they often are talking about bigger pots, bigger stages, bigger audiences. When I think of growth, I'm thinking of, how can i find more people who want to play to improve and have more fun playing these fun games? I don't do Justin Wong's taxes and could give a damn how much money he makes. What I do care about is not having to drive 15 hours just to play somebody in a game I like, or the risk of one person quitting destroying a whole scene, or go back to 2009 when, even with SF4 out, I busted my ass trying to get people to come to meetups and couldn't get more than 3 or 4 to show up. If people want to watch, that's great. If people can make money from things related to fighting games, that's great, as long as doing so doesn't step on the greater community's toes. But that's all bonus stuff. Hell, if all the extra exposure results in more people not playing because they can just sit at home and watch instead, that's worse for me.

But yeah, considering all the work I and others have put into community building, you'll excuse me if I don't take kindly to some guy saying it's not a community because he doesn't like what some people on a stream said at some point in time.

 

[livestOne]

..

what, you dont want curleh mustache sponsored by pepboys and fueled by gatorade?

 

[toddhunter]

And this is the other thing. When people talk about "growth" they often are talking about bigger pots, bigger stages, bigger audiences. When I think of growth, I'm thinking of, how can i find more people who want to play to improve and have more fun playing these fun games?

It doesn't have to be one or the other. When I think of growth, I think of both of those cases, complementing each other.

 

[SloaneRisette]

I don't think Royal Flush watches Chris G matches like you do.

I don't think anyone watches Chris G matches like you do.

I totally do. ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)

 

[Warpticon]

It doesn't have to be one or the other. When I think of growth, I think of both of those cases, complementing each other.

Did you read the rest of my post?

If people want to watch, that's great. If people can make money from things related to fighting games, that's great, as long as doing so doesn't step on the greater community's toes. But that's all bonus stuff.

I'm certainly not implying they're mutually exclusive.

 

[darkblade77]

I don't think there is enough of a base audience at the competitive or spectator level for FGC events to court mainstream attention. I think streams can help those numbers and have been, but I don't think trying to "spruce up the image" will specifically help this.

At the end of the day, if the potential market looks big enough someone, *will* make a serious attempt to package and distribute it for mainstream consumption. And regardless of image, attempts like that will continue to happen as long as the base value is there. There is no need to preemptively cater with this--if anything, doing so IMO is just a tacit acknowledgement that the value *isn't* there.

If people want to invest knowing they won't see returns without a lot of time, energy, and money invested, that's OK. But I'd also say those people are already here, and have been for a while.

The one major thing all the other high-profile e-sport events have in common, is that their base active playerbases were/are enormous relative to fighting games before streams entered the picture. And while I think maybe it could be possible that this genre of game could really broaden its audience with the right combination of exposure and production, I can't imagine it looking anything more than a really expensive long shot to those interested in making money.

Tldr; numbers are the problem, not image. also "why can't fighting games get e-sports numbers" and "why can't Skullgirls get tournament numbers" are the same question, lol

 

[Revven]

M2K, Cactuar, Salem, Hax, and more are training SSBM for a week long or so on www.twitch.tv/pbnj23

They've had the stream on for the past two days. Tune in if you like and want to see how some of the top players of Melee train up etc.

 

[Bobby Roberts]

Kuchera himself with another article about fighting games, this time, on how in-joke filled Divekick is.

http://penny-arcade.com/report/arti...vekick-turned-community-trolls-into-an-actual

 

[oneida]

Sorry if repost...

But PSN guys, VF5FS is $5 right now.

https://store.sonyentertainmentnetw...ames-virtua-fighter-5-final-showdown-ps3.html

The complete version with all the costumes is $15.

https://store.sonyentertainmentnetw...ames-virtua-fighter-5-final-showdown-ps3.html

 

[Lost Fragment]

Mortal Kombat Arcade Kollection is $2.50 on Amazon. Keys activate on Steam.

I hear the netcode is pretty shitty but it's still a real good price if you're into the classic MKs.