The Jason
Member
Sounds good to me, my current PC cant run this at decent settings.
Also, I know this is a screenshot thread but this BGM has me hyped
http://youtu.be/A0jNsGOMheA
So nice
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Final Fantasy XIV: A Realm Reborn - New Screenshots
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Sounds good to me, my current PC cant run this at decent settings.
Also, I know this is a screenshot thread but this BGM has me hyped
http://youtu.be/A0jNsGOMheA
So nice
Well nothing specifically was 'pulled' from the Luminous engine, its a sister engine made in tandem with the Luminous engine built specifically for an MMO environment using the same key staff members. 1.0 used Crystal Tools which was... decidedly 'not' very well tuned for MMO environment (and likely just about any environment
). So it might utilize some rendering techniques from Luminous engine, but that is merely because the same staff worked on this new engine at the same time. Also this is just the Directx 9.0 version of the MMO engine, they have already mentioned an 11.0 version will come out sometime after release for PC only (and likely for any 'next-gen' ports down the line.As for combat/jobs/classes. Classes are basic templates derived from your weapon, it can also utilize any subbable ability from the other now 8 base classes. Jobs are the more advanced form of your classes that requires completing a series of quests to fully unlock. It grants unique equipment to wear (including armor and weapons) and specialized abilities designed for party play. The trade off is you can only sub two specific class abiliities (the two you need to level to a certain point to even unlock the job) so key survival abilities might not be available that you might have had on your base class (For instance the job BLM won't have access to raise or cure, but the base class THM will have access to it).
In regards to the Global cool down, its being tuned for end game purposes and there are specific stats to speed up the effect. Early on it feels like its in the way, but in the higher levels it honestly feels like something closer to the ATB, a small breath of air to decide your next action among your many situational abilities, but not long enough to hinder you from using abilities over a long period of time. I actually thoroughly enjoyed the new GC once I got into working on dungeons
. It does need to be better balanced but that's what beta is for.Did you read the description on the actual skills? They gain various added effects or damage bonuses for being used in a particular order. For example on a Lancer:
Feint is used after you miss an attack
Some of this stuff might not be super relevant while fighting regular mobs, but it starts to matter in dungeon parties and against bosses. Then again, in most MMOs, you can basically physical attack your way through regular mobs for quite a while. It also helps when you are trying to do quests at higher difficulties while solo-ing, for the exp benefits.
If you stand there and just spam whichever one reads the highest damage output, you are not being efficient at fighting and purposely making the game more boring for yourself. Considering the concept of the combos, I think a single cooldown for skills that connect like that makes sense.
More traditional, with some emphasis on positioning for attacking enemies from back/side for certain skills (though this is common in lots of traditional MMOs too, I just mean you can't quite stand there all the time, like in FFXI for example).
Looks nice visually as usual but I dunno, FFXIV has never really drawn me in like FFXI had, maybe its because of use of tp for everything and I missed weapon skills in general as opposed to the stuff you do in xiv and many of them lacked any "oomph" (not saying all the ws in XI were perfect) also Archer can become Bard, kinda weird as I think Archer should have become Ranger and have a new class, minstrel that can upgrade to the Bard job(they can all use bows though but Rangers can use guns too).
There are also positional elements in the field like traps or unique AOE on enemies and adds that require players to be aware of the environment, although this is mostly a caution needed in the instance dungeons and less on the mobs in the field. Judging by some of the comments recently from Yoshida in interviews the 'knowledge' of a how dungeon works is going to be a requirement to just survive getting to a boss encounter, much less survive boss itself who will likely use his own trap mechanisms and specialized AOE.
So, the complaints about the combat confuse me. I only played one weekend, and low level stuff, so maybe it becomes worse later on? But I didn't see the issue when I played.
From a ~10 glad/lanc perspective... the abilities you typically use in a fight are minimal. You basically use your main attack and combo it with the combo attack. Then you have a few situational abilities on longer cooldowns you can use. That's not really different from any other MMO I've played. If it stays like this into the higher levels, I can understand the issue, but as of right now it isn't bothering me.
From a ~10 glad/lanc perspective... the abilities you typically use in a fight are minimal. You basically use your main attack and combo it with the combo attack. Then you have a few situational abilities on longer cooldowns you can use. That's not really different from any other MMO I've played. If it stays like this into the higher levels, I can understand the issue, but as of right now it isn't bothering me.
demosthenes
Member
This is all it ever should have been.
Did you read the description on the actual skills? They gain various added effects or damage bonuses for being used in a particular order. For example on a Lancer:
Feint is used after you miss an attack
Some of this stuff might not be super relevant while fighting regular mobs, but it starts to matter in dungeon parties and against bosses. Then again, in most MMOs, you can basically physical attack your way through regular mobs for quite a while. It also helps when you are trying to do quests at higher difficulties while solo-ing, for the exp benefits.
If you stand there and just spam whichever one reads the highest damage output, you are not being efficient at fighting and purposely making the game more boring for yourself. Considering the concept of the combos, I think a single cooldown for skills that connect like that makes sense.
Yes I have. But I haven't done any dungeons yet.
With regular mobs all you have to do is spam the strongest move, that's currently the way I find the combat to be tailored. I don't see the point of using other skills. For example there is a skill which does average damage but it slows the attack speed down (forgot the name), making you take less damage as result. The problem is I won't be taking much damage regardless, because I can just spam my strongest ability, making me take less damage and dish out more damage.
You're right, I have made the combat more boring than it is.
Definitely more traditional.
It gets better later on, not worse. Archer is the biggest problem atm (no combos and skills aren't great), though it is the class that the devs said will change the most in phase 3.
That's... still not the fastest way to take care of mobs though. You can spam a single move in any MMO, if they had separate cool downs, you'd probably go for whatever you can use most often. This argument is only valid if spamming like that was most efficient, which it isn't, and if it was relevant against tougher mobs, which, again, it isn't.
I thought it was efficient? because of the global cool downs (it's like 2 seconds or something), when I use a skill, all skills go in a global cool down state (aside for a handful which have their own cool downs), shouldn't I only use my strongest move?
I think I need to play this game some more.
I would have preferred if all abilities had their own dedicated cool downs.
I'm not going to get too into this, but in the higher levels on a 'certain' class you will need to prepare your ability rotation based on the circumstances of both the type of damage, and the support function. For instance say there is an AOE ability you need for large groups, it doesn't do as much damage as a single target, but it does a lot more as an AOE in groups (Note damage can be swapped out for enmity, buffs etc.
NDA and all), but this AOE requires MP instead of TP, now lets say you had a combo skill that merges off of a starter weaponskill that also has a more damaging variation that gives MP back based on the amount of damage you do. In order to get MP back for your AOE, you need to do the less damaging single target move to get MP back, either for the AOE move or hell to heal yourself if you are solo. Thus there is a calculated usage of your ability based on the encounter. Say a boss is by himself but then calls adds, you switch from single target rotation to AOE, or you stop fighting the boss and do mass damage single target to the adds to preserve MP. On top of this all classes have a single target, instant cast range weaponskill/spell (the water spell you mentioned) which have other usages such as sending mobs into traps or even springing traps from a distance, this too is on the global cool down. Basically in the field and fighting single target mobs solo, you won't see too many of these situational abilities used, but they become a dynamic requirement in bosses and dungeons, and are honestly really fun when you get in the flow of things.
skill 1 has 100 dmg
skill 2 has 75 dmg, but if you use after skill 1 you combo for 150dmg
so spamming skill 1 = 100+100 = 200
comboing both is = 100+150 = 250
I'm not going to get too into this, but in the higher levels on a 'certain' class you will need to prepare your ability rotation based on the circumstances of both the type of damage, and the support function. For instance say there is an AOE ability you need for large groups, it doesn't do as much damage as a single target, but it does a lot more as an AOE in groups (Note damage can be swapped out for enmity, buffs etc.
On top of this all classes have a single target, instant cast range weaponskill/spell (the water spell you mentioned) which have other usages such as sending mobs into traps or even springing traps from a distance, this too is on the global cool down. Basically in the field and fighting single target mobs solo, you won't see too many of these situational abilities used, but they become a dynamic requirement in bosses and dungeons, and are honestly really fun when you get in the flow of things.
Ah I see, thanks for that. Pretty much answers my biggest issue with the combat, I'm too low level I guess. But that sounds good, I had a feeling it would get better later on in the game.
Now to patiently wait for Friday.
distantmantra
Member
Why can't SE make an offline Final Fantasy title that looks like this?
Scythian Empire
Member
What's the chance of this game being free to play?
RPGCrazied
Member
Wonder what the PS3 version looks like. I'm going to guess lots of pop-in textures and screen tearing. Don't think my PC can run this game at ultra graphics.
Never.
Signed up for the beta about a month ago. Hoping to be in for Phase 3 to try this out. Going WHM all the way, just like in FFXI.
Debating on whether I will pick my character back up from where I left off from FXIV or just start clean. Only made it to the mid 20s and quit after about 2-3 months.
Debating on whether I will pick my character back up from where I left off from FXIV or just start clean. Only made it to the mid 20s and quit after about 2-3 months.
Spamming you'r strongest skill(s) whenever the cooldown is ready isn't the rule of, like, every mmo out there or close to, at least at low level & in solo pex ?
Ugh, give me Valley of Sorrows flashbacks
Window in 30 sneak/invis up.
Took me 8 months to finish Black Belt >.<
If I remember correctly, Elvaan (w/e they are called now) were supposed to be best for WHM due to base MND as they leveled. Tarus just trumped them purely on base MP. Since I'm not seeing any other pure tank classes yet other than Guardian and Paladin for higher level groups, the large mana pool might be needed depending on how combat plays out.
I'll still be sticking to my Taru this time around.
They were way too underrated and seems to always be eclipsed by either RNG or THF even after the huge RNG nerf that pissed a ton of people off.
i'll just be leveling every melee to fill the void until samurai comes out anyway.
thetrin
Hail, peons, for I have come as ambassador from the great and bountiful Blueberry Butt Explosion
traditional, with positioning and an incentive to chain skills for additional effects.
I know that feeling. I loved my SAM in FFXI.
They ( we ) had quite a good time with TAoU aka the Colibri era; thought limited to pexing not end game.
I mostly miss pupetmaster. ( well i say that but only played ffxiv v1 for like a month )
My favorite job in ffxi being pup ( healer ? check, DD ? check, nuker ? check. soloer ? check; all that with the personnalisation aspect and the fact you always had something to do ( rotate maneuver, avoid overload ) > rng ( sidewinder is The thing, I never had a single xp pty post lvl~50 with ranger where i could spam the auto attack at full speed because i would end up tanking, and using sidewinder before it was enough to finish the mob would mean the tank would never get the aggro back, and all that was years after the rng nerf, loved the job enough to camp and drop the Vali's bow ) > sam ( with soboro and /dnc it was just too much fun ).
I really hope Archer will get a more DD oriented job Advancement than bard; and Marauder get Samurai. ^ ^ For the time being I'm mostly interested in Paladin for the Realm Reborn release.
I feel like traditional combat is becoming a dated design for MMO. It's like not being able to move and shoot like RE5. To me it just reeks laziness. When other games such as GW2 and TERA implement active and dynamic combat, why haven't other games adopted more interesting combat systems? Seems to me like FF14 in this aspect is still playing catch up. I don't think it's a matter of traditional vs dynamic and it's a choice of the dev to see which they want.
Yeah, I missed pretty much everything after CoP and really only played RoZ (NA vanilla). It was probably a good thing they did nerf RNG because other DD would get dropped instantly for an ok RNG at the time. Seriously being able to tp build quickly and drop a 3k+ sidewinder well before a SAM or DRK was kind of crazy. Getting in a RNG party and going to Sky was always fun for getting 30+ chains was fun though.
It sounds like PUP had a bit more versatility than most other classes. I know you could get some of that out of RDM/NIN and BLM/RDM for better debuffs, but I missed out on a lot of the newer classes. Did you stick around for the bump to lvl 99 and if so, did WHM ever get snubbed for other classes? It was something people talked about with the 75 cap. RDM replacement for refresh, they just lacked the MP and a few higher level WHM spells.
I kind of wished I did play something more than WHM and BLM back then to high level. I just always liked the mage classes except RDM for some reason. Maybe I'll branch out much more this time around and stray away from those classes after I max WHM.
I fully believe it is simply a design choice that entirely holds up on either end and I've managed to get bored of GW2 and TERA just fine with their 'action' combat systems. The only action 'online' game as of late that feels like it legitimately uses 'action' combat for me is Phantasy Star Online 2, since you can die pretty fast if you don't utilize blocking/dodging/etc but I played about 25 hours of TERA where I managed to fight multiple mobs at once while standing there and going step by step through my skill combos. The 'action MMO' is not better by default. It's entirely possible to have a complex and engaging MMO with traditional combat.
I mean I can understand someone preferring action combat, but I don't like the idea that one is a natural progression of the other, just like action RPGs are not a progression of turn-based RPGs but a different sub-genre.
LowParry
Member
Beta isn't even in Phase 3 yet and people are already down on the game. We'll know fully how combat is going to be with the 1.0 folk when they get to play their characters. Right now it's too early to judge early levels of the game when we have a fraction of the system and content.
That sounds downright depressing. I really hope they fix this up for the actual release. I see absolutely no reason for either of these being in the final game. GCD makes literally zero sense to me, especially for this game.
I would really surprised if they didn't remove these things.
Unknown Soldier
Member
The beta testers have not in general been happy with the actual combat mechanics from what I've heard. I would go so far as to say people are pretty pissed about it. We're not far from the last phases though so everyone will be able to see soon enough how this game actually PLAYS. God knows Squenix has had more second chances than any other MMO publisher, most MMOs die after the first failure. If they find a way to blow it now it will be an unprecedented level of failure.
That's the whole point of the beta, test the systems, remove things that don't work. People who are playing the beta should be down on the game, because mechanics that can potentially ruin an already "traditional" combat system should be amended before the final game is released.
Phase 3 should be where we see the big changes, yes, GCD seems to have been added to 2.0. It wasn't a feature at all in 1.0 and is being added to be more like other popular MMOs instead of doing its own thing with some of the combat features.
I wasn't around for the late-game 1.0, but there were some major changes to the combat system before it was shut down. Why they wouldn't fine tune the combat system from 1.0 after the changes that were made and build a brand new one doesn't seem like a move in the right direction. Especially after all the good things I did hear about it from the few people I knew who stuck with it.
Platinumstorm
Member
There have always been people upset with FFXIV's original combat because it wasn't FFXI-2. Maybe the same applies for the newest version.
People are unhappy with it mainly because:
a) It's not FFXI
b) It's not FFXIV 1.23
c) It's not FFXIV 1.0 (yes, really)
d) It's not TERA/GW2/Some other MMO they really like
e) It's too much like WoW (supposedly)
f) It's not enough like WoW
There are more than 100,000 Beta testers, and I'm pretty sure all of them can find something to complain about.
You pick one of eight classes at the beginning of the game. At level 10, you can unlock any of the other other classes by talking to the appropriate NPC. At level 30, with a particular other class at 15 (at least, in 1.23), you can do quests for certain NPCs to unlock the corresponding Job for your class.
Eventually, there may be more than one job per class, but right now it's just a single job.
Eh... GW2's combat is fun for what it is, but I wouldn't say it improved on traditional MMO combat. It offered something different that worked alright for solo and pvp content, but it didn't work that well for group content, and group content is what makes or breaks an MMO imo.