Elfforkusu
Member
That's clever.
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Laura Dale: Nintendo Switchs Right Joy-Con Offers IR Pointer Functionality
- Thread starter bomblord1
- Start date
JoshuaJSlone
Member
If it's supposed to be the alternative to touch when it's docked... however many games use touch.ryan-ts said:
But how many sticks and buttons is a hand using touch likely to be using at the same time? If this upside down pointer thing is legit, I'd guess it mostly needs one button, to be the equivalent of your finger contacting the screen.Shin-Ra said:
The rumorers have already talked about the controllers having full motion before. This pointer stuff is new.Saint Gregory said:
There's only so much room on devices a few centimeters thick, though. Wiimote manages its camera and one trigger, but is also pretty thick compared to Switch.gafneo said:
If this is accurate I imagine they'd provide an optional sensor bar. And if they don't, any number of third parties will.Pif said:
If it's specifically meant to mirror touch, it's by design a more limited use than on Wii. If you're pointing at the screen and not using a touch button, it could be like not touching the screen there. If it's really a thing that requires the controller to be held upside down, I think that would be an admission that it's not meant to be used as a major control method unfortunately.ShadowFox08 said:
Refreshment.01
Member
im afraid not. The rumor is very specific about this been a touch screen substitute and not a Wii Remote equivalent.
A real shame they couldn't get the IR to play nice with the more functional way to hold the Joycon. i wonder if Nintendo is not opting to use a gyroscope for pointing and emulate touch screen functionality because it would be a relative poiting method instead of a more absolute one like the IR is.
Edit: Due to the completely oddball nature of how the buttons will be in the right Joycon after is flipped and that this is mainly a substitue for touch screen only games, one could totally see the left Joycon buttons used to be the "Touch" and the Right Joycon controlling cursor postioning mainly.
I'm hoping that they release a larger remote and nunchuck equivalent, but for now it's good to know that we'll have that functionality. I hope games use it, because I would buy Skyrim day one if that functionality is in. Still, even flipping it around will still open up the analog stick and the buttons. We'll miss the triggers, but I can live with that.
Refreshment.01
Member
Is good that you posted this because it warrants clarification, maybe my post above wasn't clear enough in regards to why the IR even exists.
Let's take your Skyrim example. If you wanted to aim the bow with more accuracy than a thumbstick, then gyroscopic aiming can be used and you would be holding each Joycon in their normal orientation. So we dont need to panic as more exact aiming can be an option to more standard and complex games.
Now let's talk about touch screen only games and IR which was what i posted above. Maybe Nintendo did some experiments and reached the conclusion that the "relative" nature of Gyro controls and it's potential drifting issues wasn't as reliable as the more absolute one of the IR, as it never drifts as long as you are within the boundries of the view cone. It instantly orients itself and the gyro can still be used to mainting orientation awareness when the LED's get out of the IR sensor's view.
So again, like the rumor clearly says, it's mainly to emulate touch controls when the device is docked.
Edit: Maybe Nintendo should' ve embraced more traditional trackpads in their controllers? Versatile, more precise than a thumbstick maybe less so than IR pointing but free of this invert the Joycon nonesense.
Glendemonium
Member
Now that you mention it, I wouldn't be surprised if Mario Maker gets a port... it makes sense. It feels so short lived on the Wii U.
CharminUltra
Member
Where's my dentist game!??!
Refreshment.01
Member
JoshuaJslone in post #254 (in this very page) has an exellent and detailed explanation for those that couldn't fully grasp the information Madame Laura obtained from her sources. It's all in the first post:
As a little hint, it doesn't bode well for fans of IR poiting First Person Shooters but the prognosis looks good for Fruit Ninja fans.
EDIT: SINCE THE POINT IS NOT GETTING ACROSS STILL. Pay attention to the highlighted part of Madame Laura's article.
http://letsplayvideogames.com/2016/...ight-joy-con-offers-ir-pointer-functionality/
There's nothing about this that stops it from being used as a remote replacement. In my opinion, I don't care if I have to flip it or not. I just want to play Call of Duty with a pointer. I don't care how they get it done. Since this device is capable of doing it, then I'm fine with it.
Sammy Samusu
Member
Da-Kid
Member
Doesn't mean the dock won't have a Sensor Bar port.
Look at this picture:
All of the buttons are way down at the bottom, with the stick roughly in the middle. That would be the equivalent of having a Wiimote, but then the only buttons you can press are 1 and 2, with the D-pad around where the Home button is now. Just seems uncomfortable. Next, the grip / curvature on the JoyCons might feel strange. Again, hold a Wiimote upside down and it feels weird. Lastly, having the buttons marked upside down would be weird, like a "Press B to jump" or whatever prompt would really go against muscle memory and you'd have to remember that B is the topmost button, not bottom. I suppose that's the case with the sideways configuration too, though.
I just don't feel like this would be a comfortable Wiimote clone for, say, Wii VC. It's probably just for replicating a touch screen when docked like the article says. Who knows, though, just not getting my hopes up.
That's why I didn't pick that game up. This disappointed me greatly.
Refreshment.01
Member
i quoted you in a previous post explaining why it doesn't work as you imagine. The curvature and hyphottecial R and L buttons wouldn't be in that position if you are flipping the right Joycon. The hypothetical R and L would be for the thumb to press not the index and the palm of your hand will grip the flat part, not the curved one.This is how it would look while holding the right joycon upside down for motion.
To achieve the result in your picture, i alreaddy explained that it would require 2 flips: 1 for the IR sensor to face up and another to get the curvature to the palm of your right hand. Yet this cause that your thumbstick and face buttons are facing down and the Trigger is facing up.
My apologies good sir, you know i like to make mock ups and pictures to accompain my overly long explanations, but sadly i don't always have the means accesible to do that. im just flipping the controller in my head. XD
Hopefully someone else can interpret what im saying and provide a picture or a better explanation with words.
EDIT: Maybe this will help. To have the Right Joycon with the curvature and "hidden R and L" buttons in that position you would need to hold it with your left hand, instead of the right hand in your picture..
Maybe you can give a visual on this?
Maybe if you're an infantThis is how it would look while holding the right joycon upside down for motion.
or Trump
This is how it would look while holding the right joycon upside down for motion.
The connecting side should be on the right side, facing the palm, assuming you hold it flat, which might not be the case, as Refreshment has suggested.
oh, duh. Kinda of obvious too
Haha well it is sort of understandable since you want it to be on the left for access to the (supposed) L and R buttons on the inside of the controller.
jungomitis
Member
Hardware design is done at this point. There is very little you could change in the hardware minus firmware tuning if Nintendo wants to manufacture these in time for March.
The design, embedded sensors, etc. are certainly done I would think.
I'm more surprised by the lack of leaks.
The Super Scope looked for the electron beam from the CRT - which is also why it doesn't work with LCD's, projection TV's, or plasmas.
It had a sensor behind a filter and a really small opening that only let it see a tiny part of the outside world. It would notify the console whenever it saw a pixel being drawn on screen (remember, the electron beam in a CRT races across the screen in lines and lights up pixels as it passes them). The console would look at what part of the screen it was currently outputting to the TV and thus know where you aimed at.
The "sensor bar thing" was just for transmission of the signal to the console.
I'm surprised whenever I've seen this rumor discussed online, everyone uses the picture in the OP when there is actually a better angle in the video.
I doubted it before but this looks a lot like the camera/sensor found on the Wii Remote.
There even seems to be another circle shaped sensor (IR blaster?) or something right next to it as well.
If you watch that scene, you can briefly see the sun's glare reflecting off the surface of the bottom as it moves around when she hands the Joycon to her friend, so it appears it may be a reflective surface.
It still seems awkward, especially since it doesn't seem to seamlessly co-opt the Wii remote's control scheme, nor does it really provide a new intuitive input since you have to completely flip it over and it seems even more uncomfortable than holding it sideways as a mini controller.
I would be okay with a Wii remote successor built in but not like this. It feels like the potential of a touch screen where it is so close to being capable of some good backwards compatibility and then something about the way it is implemented makes it seem like it's not really a suitable replacement. Almost makes me wonder why they would bother, but I guess we'll have to wait and see.
I doubted it before but this looks a lot like the camera/sensor found on the Wii Remote.
There even seems to be another circle shaped sensor (IR blaster?) or something right next to it as well.
If you watch that scene, you can briefly see the sun's glare reflecting off the surface of the bottom as it moves around when she hands the Joycon to her friend, so it appears it may be a reflective surface.
It still seems awkward, especially since it doesn't seem to seamlessly co-opt the Wii remote's control scheme, nor does it really provide a new intuitive input since you have to completely flip it over and it seems even more uncomfortable than holding it sideways as a mini controller.
I would be okay with a Wii remote successor built in but not like this. It feels like the potential of a touch screen where it is so close to being capable of some good backwards compatibility and then something about the way it is implemented makes it seem like it's not really a suitable replacement. Almost makes me wonder why they would bother, but I guess we'll have to wait and see.
fabricated backlash
Member
I would love IR aiming to make a comeback. Seriously, I enjoy FPS games on PC with mouse, but nothing compares to the fun I had with Wii and WiiU COD and Goldeneye.
If it's just for touch simulation, that's fine too, since it will make Apps like Netflix and browsing much more intutitive than using a standard controller.
If it's just for touch simulation, that's fine too, since it will make Apps like Netflix and browsing much more intutitive than using a standard controller.
Yeah, it's at 2:31 in the video and surely looks like the top of a wiimote.
Graphics Horse
Member
Those three tracking lights look like a good step up from just two horizontal ones, should get more accuracy from that pattern.
Not sure about this, but the WiiU gamepad can function as screen and sensor bar when in Wii mode and I can´t remember it displaying any extra lights or anything to position the Wii Mote. Can someone clarify this?
The Switch might come with a sensor bar to place under/over the TV, or just have a connector so you can plug the Wii´s one (like the WiiU, which I also can´t remember if it already had the sensor back packed). Being as it may, the sensor bar only displays some infrarred lights (it does not processing or anything), you could even set 2 candles under your TV and the WiiMote will work correctly, so maybe there are more solutions we haven´t thought about.
The Switch might come with a sensor bar to place under/over the TV, or just have a connector so you can plug the Wii´s one (like the WiiU, which I also can´t remember if it already had the sensor back packed). Being as it may, the sensor bar only displays some infrarred lights (it does not processing or anything), you could even set 2 candles under your TV and the WiiMote will work correctly, so maybe there are more solutions we haven´t thought about.
Graphics Horse
Member
They're in the black bar above the screen.
Enhance!
Right, I had only used the gamepad as screen for Wii games once or twice and couldn´t remember that, thanks for clearing it up!
Candles ja-
While I was enhancing on the bottom of the Joy-Con in that scene Cuburt posted. Something else grabbed my attention that is annoying me.
This was probably already posted.
Does anyone else see two shoulder buttons on each side of the Joy-Con?
The weird part is that it looks smooth so it makes me think it's not the side that slides into the dock. It's doing my head in.
This looks like a plastic indentation to create a loop for a wristband, not an IR camera sensor.
Wonder if my idea about the joycon grip wasn't too far off
Starchasing
Member
That makes much more sense
Emperor Bohe
Member
Man if this means we have to position the console in a certain way, then I am not happy. Usually have a couple consoles hooked up at a time and having the console stand up with the long side facing me will take up more space than needed
Okami Haundo
Member
That stands out as clear as day thanks to your picture! I'm almost willing to bet that those buttons are disabled when the joy-cons are attached to the Grip or the console. That definitely makes multiplayer on just one Switch console much more practical than I thought it would be!
Maybe those buttons are the answer to the question of how the joy-con controllers detach. They obviously attach via some form of locking mechanism, but I've been wondering where they would place the button that detaches said mechanism.
Dee Dah Dave
Member
That would seem really dumb to have to turn the Joycon around for pointing. I can't see it being like that, but you never know!
Smiles and Cries
Member
not sure if people are expecting it but the real reason to have detachable JoyCons would be to sell customized types separately
you want one with traditional + dpads just buy it
I'm kinda scared to think how far this goes
you want one with traditional + dpads just buy it
I'm kinda scared to think how far this goes