Penguin raised a similar concern in the TV cancellation thread, and I agreed that the Live +7 numbers for the broadcast network shows might be a more accurate comparison with Netflix and Amazon shows. I responded thusly...
All ratings and viewers are live + 7 in the 18-to-49 demo for the most recently aired episode of each show for which live + 7 data are available:
Agents of SHIELD: 2.2 (3.19 million)
Gotham: 2.6 (3.77 million)
Supergirl: 2.3 (3.34 million) oh, and let's add in The Flash: 2.2 (3.19 million) and also Arrow: 1.6 (2.32 million) and for lols iZombie: 0.8 (1.16 million)
As a reminder, that Symphony tech firm reported these numbers in the demo for streaming shows:
Jessica Jones: 3.3 (4.8 million)
Master of None: 2.7 (3.9 million)
Narcos: 2.2 (3.2 million)
Man in the High Castle: 1.4 (2.1 million)
Orange Is the New Black: 0.4 (644,000, several months after the newest season debuted)
So either way, Jessica Jones looks pretty popular compared to any other comic book-based show airing this season.
I finally finished the show the other day. I started watching it just after Christmas and averaged about 1 episode a night. Anyways, here are my thoughts before I go and read this thread to see what others thought:
Pros:
Kilgrave - Loved the actor and the character too. It was nice to see a villain who was just an asshole instead of having some grand scheme like most villains
Acting - I thought the main cast did a great job
First 4 episodes - Intense and ominous. My GF usually watches the first 2 or 3 episodes of a comic series with me and this is now the second one that she stayed interested in (first was The Flash).
Cons:
Pacing - This show could have been great with 8 episodes or so... it just felt they were dragging their feet.
Final episodes - It really fell apart largely due to some of the supporting characters (see below). I said above my GF liked the show at first but towards the end she often said "this is just getting stupid now".
Brother / sister and enhanced cop guy - These characters were okay at first but once they took a bigger role, I couldn't stand every scene that they were in... especially the sister.
Ending Kilgrave - How many times can a guy get captured and escape or just turn a corner and disappear?!?! This goes with pacing a bit as I know they were trying to spread the show over 13 episodes but his constant escaping just got ridiculous. Also Jessica's reasons for not killing him earlier were dumb too. Also how could no one think of the headphone thing until the final episode!
From my pros and cons, it seems like I'm more down on the show than I really am. It wasn't as great as Daredevil or even some seasons of Arrow and The Flash, but it was still better than AoS or Agent Carter. If it was the same story with 8 or 10 episodes and they had cut out the brother / sister stuff and the cop going crazy, it would have been a great show instead of just a good one.
Watched episode 11 last night. Felt a little like filler but I liked the confrontation between crazy cop dude and the women. I kept expecting Jessica to jump out the window to find that bottle of blue pills thrown out of it just a couple minutes before her sister stopped being able to breathe.
Came to share my experience of the show, which I saw as soon as it was released...
So... The show is good, but is far from great (at least after the first 2-3 episodes). Daredevil raised the bar quite high the last year, and I was hoping that Jessica Jones could deliver some more quality (not a fan or even a reader of these characters, but I was sold on the premise of the show).
I felt like the show began to drag on with its plot and narration by the the start of the second half of the season (which as a few highlights but even more dull or even dumb moments) and it started to missing that dark and "thrillerish" atmosphere set by the pilot. When it comes to the characters, we are fed more character moments (still they tend get less as the sho goes on) than having actually good perfomances, with Tennant's over the rest of the cast, but still not on par with D'Onofrio's Kingpin. Still, I blame this one on the director (Jessica's drinking problem is portrayed hilariously bad). The highlights of the series include the first bunch of episodes plus some scenes like the police station one and "the 1000 cuts", but they are the shining dots of a show filled with "the fockin' Simpson guy", bad visual effects (Jessica's super jumps as an example), bad plot decision (Jessica, smart as she is, decides to frame herself to stop Killgrave but doesn't even grasp Killgrave's blatant motive.)
It may sound like a garbage if you only look at this short post, but I had my fun with it and it doesn't screw up in its depiction of sex (I thought Cage showcasing his power to Jessica in that sexiest way possible was pretty fun to watch)
I dunno, whenever a show or movie depicts people having sex with sheets over themselves, it always pulls me out of it. Nobody does it like that. They should just shoot angles that don't show the actors below their waists if they don't want us to see real nudity.
I dunno, whenever a show or movie depicts people having sex with sheets over themselves, it always pulls me out of it. Nobody does it like that. They should just shoot angles that don't show the actors below their wastes if they don't want us to see real nudity.
You got a point but they probably can do much about it due to target audience and not being the HBO . I'll rectify myself by saying that I enjoyed how the sexual tension was portrayed (Not the whole relationship)
yeah i saw her instagram post, not surprising really. Really good show.
Question for the comic book readers, is she gonna wear that white "suit" on the show ? i dont really care but wouldnt it make her stand out in Hells Kitchen? I liked the idea of the everyday streetclothes fighter
yeah i saw her instagram post, not surprising really. Really good show.
Question for the comic book readers, is she gonna wear that white "suit" on the show ? i dont really care but wouldnt it make her stand out in Hells Kitchen? I liked the idea of the everyday streetclothes fighter
In terms of timing for season two, which will consist of 13 episodes, Netflix has not yet announced when it will premiere. When asked Sunday, Netflix chief content officer Ted Sarandos said, "The Defenders production will really determine" season start dates for other Marvel series like Jessica Jones as well as Daredevil, which launches its second season on March 18.
Finished this last night and will echo some of the sentiments I've been reading: started *really* strong and kinda petered off towards the end.
I really enjoyed how minimized her powers were in the first half--in the second, the more we "learned" about them, or saw, the more a lot of the conflicts fell apart.
Like, if she can jump so fast *carrying Kilgrave* that the soldiers think she can fly--there are so many moments where she is in a standoff with Kilgrave (after knowing he can't control her) like 10 yards away and she lets him do this thing and run away! Drove me fucking nuts.
I'm sure I'm not the first to say it but I really didn't like the season overall. There were several episodes where basically nothing happens or he gets away yet again. The first two and last two episodes were pretty good though.
Does anyone else think that Jessica teaming up with Kilgrave and training him to be a 'good guy', like when she lived in that house with him, could have been a fun watch? I mean, more than what they did already.
Like, if she can jump so fast *carrying Kilgrave* that the soldiers think she can fly--there are so many moments where she is in a standoff with Kilgrave (after knowing he can't control her) like 10 yards away and she lets him do this thing and run away! Drove me fucking nuts.
My explanation for taht is that she's terrified of him. She knows his powers no longer work on her, but she's still a victim of him (mind and body rape), so in a way he's still got control over her.
My explanation for taht is that she's terrified of him. She knows his powers no longer work on her, but she's still a victim of him (mind and body rape), so in a way he's still got control over her.
Other parts just had me scratching my head--like her plan meeting him in the church? So she has Trish walk in disguise, then once they realize it...she pops out from her hiding place even *farther* away from Kilgrave?
I literally exclaimed "WHAT WAS YOUR PLAN" when that happened.
There were also several times that he hinted at or flat out told JJ that he had a failsafe set up - if he hurt her he'd kill several innocent bystanders.
There were also several times that he hinted at or flat out told JJ that he had a failsafe set up - if he hurt her he'd kill several innocent bystanders.
I mean, there are *multiple* times where she knocks him out with a single punch. Which is why it was frustrating when she wouldn't just leap across the bar room (the nooses and Hope) and punch him in the face. I mean, the hangees didn't even die immediately from it--a simple leap would have been more than enough time even if he yelled "KILL YOURSELVES" or whatever.
By the final episode, when he told all the people at the dock to kill themselves, I was thinking, "Jessica, jesus christ, don't try to save them--just knock out/kill that asshole"
I just want consistency in the use of their powers. Latter parts of this series had lots of Prequel Trilogy-level inconsistency when it came to powers and bone-headed decisions.
I really liked the reveal that Cage's entire return was just a long con by Kilgrave. And again, there is a lot I absolutely LOVE about the show--but it frustrated the hell out of me at the end.
By the final episode, when he told all the people at the dock to kill themselves, I was thinking, "Jessica, jesus christ, don't try to save them--just knock out/kill that asshole"
You'll have to forgive me if I'm tired of Jessica letting Kilgrave get away (usually to kill more civilians, like garden-scissors head or the gay couple) because she inexplicably forgets to use her powers.
You'll have to forgive me if I'm tired of Jessica letting Kilgrave get away (usually to kill more civilians, like garden-scissors head or the gay couple) because she inexplicably forgets to use her powers.
And you'll have to forgive me for being exasperated that someone watching a superhero show is all 'let civilians die, kill the villain.' Especially given Jessica's recklessness got so many people killed already - and the show's ending all but confirms that even if Jessica had killed Kilgrave earlier, it wouldn't solve anything.
I mean, there are *multiple* times where she knocks him out with a single punch. Which is why it was frustrating when she wouldn't just leap across the bar room (the nooses and Hope) and punch him in the face. I mean, the hangees didn't even die immediately from it--a simple leap would have been more than enough time even if he yelled "KILL YOURSELVES" or whatever.
He doesn't have to be conscious for that to work. His commands stay for 48 hours or so before they wear off.
So even if she leaps across the room to kill him, it's not fast enough, since he already preprogrammed the commands in before she showed up.
In fact that's how the whole Hope situation even happened. His command to her was probably something like "Lie here. Then pretend to be rescued by Jessica, and then whenever she's able to see but can't stop you, kill your parents with this gun. Oh, and don't tell anyone about this gun or these commands."
It's too bad they didn't keep the way Purple Man's powers work a mystery... season two could have seen Jessica walk through a metaphorical mine field of nasty surprises left by him. He could have remained the primary antagonist from beyond the grave.
It's too bad they didn't keep the way Purple Man's powers work a mystery... season two could have seen Jessica walk through a metaphorical mine field of nasty surprises left by him. He could have remained the primary antagonist from beyond the grave.
Just finished season 1. Pretty good, but the finish could have been done better.
I'm not really a fan of TV with ongoing storylines. Too often I end up thinking it's a 2 hour movie stretched into a 10 hour TV show with all sorts of useless filler and meaningless dialogue. But I gotta admit this Jessica Jones series was done really well.
I'm liking Agent Carter too. I'm thinking Marvel is doing TV better than DC right now, even though Legends is a nice surprise.
My wife and I finished this last night. We enjoyed it overall, with major caveats. Loved the performances, from all the leads. Jessica, Trish and Kilgrave (can't remember the actor's names) all crushed it, as did most of the smaller roles. Loved the overall noir-light feel of the series.
The plotting was very uneven. We're not familiar with the comics at all, which probably helped in terms of the overall arcs being surprising, but I also felt they spent far too much time setting up the plot of next season. In hindsight
all that time devoted to the cop turned super soldier was one giant setup for next season, and felt like wasted screen time here.
It didn't help that I just straight up hated his character from the get go.
Overall I really enjoyed the first six or so episodes - the entire first act, really - and then it kind of went off the rails when (around ep. 7)
Jessica went to be with Kilgrave in her old house.
Around that time it felt like everyone started acting out of character in order to move the chess pieces into a particular position for the endgame of the season, and it was really frustrating.
I did enjoy the brief look at what Kilgrave would have been like (around episode 8-9)
had he used his powers for good, when Jessica took him to defuse a hostage crisis. It also led to my favorite Kilgrave moment, when he came home and bellows "I want cake!" His character was such that it was clear he never really grew up emotionally given his powers, getting everything he wanted at any time. In that moment he was a little kid again yelling for a party because he feels good. It was perfect and shed some great insight on his personality. The actor playing him was relentlessly brilliant.
I remain super pissed about what happened to (around episode 10-11)
Hope. I get the brutal metaphor with Hope literally killing herself, but I hated how they treated her character. It was really mean spirited. And the entire set up, with the awful neighbor leading this improbable band of 2x4 wielding idiots to attack Jessica came out of nowhere and was incredibly contrived. I think the show was at its lowest point then, all the contrivances of the plot coming to a head in a badly staged showdown scene with Killgrave and Hope. Jessica's constant refusal to kill Kilgrave was maddening and the show failed to establish plausible reason why she didn't take the many opportunities to end it. (She couldn't kill him because he had fail safes...but she'd knock him out and keep him there overnight. There's no difference to his fail safes if he's just dead!)
The show recovered nicely in the last couple episodes, with some enjoyable (and refreshingly plausible, after the prior few episodes) twists. The final confrontation was satisfying.
I'm looking forward to season 2 much more than my wife is. For me the show recovered enough by the end, but I think it still left a bad taste in her mouth due to the character and plotting issues in the latter half.
Jessica's constant refusal to kill Kilgrave was maddening and the show failed to establish plausible reason why she didn't take the many opportunities to end it. (She couldn't kill him because he had fail safes...but she'd knock him out and keep him there overnight. There's no difference to his fail safes if he's just dead!)
She didn't want to kill him because she needed to prove he can do what he does to free Hope. That was the entire point of Hope killing herself. Hope knew if she was dead, Jessica would have no reason to hold back and that's exactly when Jessica decides to kill him.
She didn't want to kill him because she needed to prove he can do what he does to free Hope. That was the entire point of Hope killing herself. Hope knew if she was dead, Jessica would have no reason to hold back and that's exactly when Jessica decides to kill him.
True, however the collateral damage that decision caused was hard to ignore. How many people died while Jessica was trying to clear Hope's name? It didn't help that Hope was off screen for almost the entire time making it harder and harder to continue empathizing with her.
True, however the collateral damage that decision caused was hard to ignore. How many people died while Jessica was trying to clear Hope's name? It didn't help that Hope was off screen for almost the entire time making it harder and harder to continue empathizing with her.
And people make that argument to her in the show, but she's personally invested in Hope (which is kind of a big deal because her whole attitude up until then was "Not my problem") so she can't let it go. You can also make this argument for any no-kill policy superheroes really even if the situations aren't exactly the same. How many times has the argument been made that Batman should just kill the Joker since he keeps escaping and killing more people?
She didn't want to kill him because she needed to prove he can do what he does to free Hope. That was the entire point of Hope killing herself. Hope knew if she was dead, Jessica would have no reason to hold back and that's exactly when Jessica decides to kill him.
Early in the season, Jessica uses Trish's show to try and find more people who have been affected by Kilgrave, to testify as witnesses. That generates a bunch of people who can do so. But instead of going that route, they form a counseling group. By the time Jessica has Kilgrave tied up in her apartment, she has a small army of people in the city that could testify, including an entire police department.
A few episodes later, she offs Kilgrave, and falls back on a small army of people than can testify on her behalf - including a bunch of cops. There's no reason they couldn't have done that a lot earlier in the season, but she just waited until Hope was dead to do it. It was really contrived, IMO.
Early in the season, Jessica uses Trish's show to try and find more people who have been affected by Kilgrave, to testify as witnesses. That generates a bunch of people who can do so. But instead of going that route, they form a counseling group. By the time Jessica has Kilgrave tied up in her apartment, she has a small army of people in the city that could testify, including an entire police department.
A few episodes later, she offs Kilgrave, and falls back on a small army of people than can testify on her behalf - including a bunch of cops. There's no reason they couldn't have done that a lot earlier in the season, but she just waited until Hope was dead to do it. It was really contrived, IMO.
The people they gathered help built up a case, but it was by no means a slam dunk to the point where she could be like "Ok cool. Case is solid. Now I can kill him and free Hope.". The entire police force involved are outright in denial just like the other victims were originally (the detective says as much and even after that experience, he's not 100% sold on Killgrave). Maybe those witnesses are enough, maybe not, but I can see how Jessica wouldn't feel confident enough about it to kill him. To me, that doesn't feel forced. It's just a circumstance of Jessica finally giving enough of a shit to want to help this girl that went through an almost exact version of the worst days of her life.
I feel stupid for asking this, but why exactly did Hope stab herself in the restaurant. Simply so Jessica could kill Kilgrave? Really?
Also kind of odd how the female lawyer's secretary all of a sudden arrived at her ex's house. Or did I miss something?
And I really did not like that support group going at Jessica. That part felt rushed where the sister of the dead guy decided to blame it all on Jessica and.... Come on let's raid her office and attack her. Sigh.
It took a few episodes for me to really get into it, but this is quite a nice show. I really like the much more mature approach that Marvel is taking with their shows like Daredevil and this. And not like the almost family friendly movies.
. I'll rectify myself by saying that I enjoyed how the sexual tension was portrayed (Not the whole relationship)
