Alx
Member
But it's the basis of most martial arts : attacking means opening yourself to the opponent. If there was no risk in attacking, there would be no point in defending...
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New Dead or Alive 5 footage. (Update 2: Releasing Worldwide In September)
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But it's the basis of most martial arts : attacking means opening yourself to the opponent. If there was no risk in attacking, there would be no point in defending...
Interesting..
Maybe someone else can check around and see if this is official or a fanart. The articles doesn't mention anything about her.
Looks like stifflers mom.
Alx
Member
I can't see why, attacking a defending opponent will obviously be less rewarding than countering an attacking one. That way, winning is more about outsmarting your opponent than overpowering him. After all, you could be the one waiting for him to attack and open his defense...
Oh there will be rants. Especially, on the casual side of things, if DOA continues the trend of giving out less unlockable costumes with every DOA since DOA2U.
I'm expecting complaints, hate mail, death threats and general weaboo disparagement once the OT is written and the DOA5 is out. It's the name of the game.
Hell, it's going to hit next week when the demo drops!
ShockingAlberto
Member
Honestly, I would be kind of bummed if the costume number is dropped again.
I really expect some hardcore DLC thrusting here.
That's something I can imagine Team Ninja doing that just wasn't prevalent almost seven years ago when DOA4 came out: DLC costumes. I imagine that we'll get a decent bit of unlockable costumes and such even if it's no where near the numbers DOA2U has. I mean, didn't Ayane have 20 costumes in that one?
No, DOA5 will almost certainly have DLC packs or individual costumes for download at $1.00 - $2.50 apiece in addition to unlockables. I hope I'm wrong, and if so I'll tip my hat to Team Ninja for keeping business cordial.
But if the mechanics are as sound as they seem to be rounding out to be and the online features are as solid and varied as DOA4 I'll be a happy camper and cosmetic complaints regarding costumes will play second fiddle to anything else DOA5 has in store for me.
I hope more non-DOA fans take note, too, since it seems like DOA5 is grabbing people's attention to the series much unlike any previous iteration did.
DLC costumes would be one thing. But what I would honestly like to see? As long as DOA5 seems to be reestablishing the connection between VF and DOA, feel free to cite VF and just give us a bevvy of costume parts to unlock, with more to come through DLC.
I mean, to me, it's unrealistic to expect the kind of costume layout we had last generation, anyway. Plus, as long as there's going to be some people that will want to have a customization feature in their fighting games, let them create their own costumes.
I mean, to me, it's unrealistic to expect the kind of costume layout we had last generation, anyway. Plus, as long as there's going to be some people that will want to have a customization feature in their fighting games, let them create their own costumes.
Yeah I think the game looks amazing so far, for me this will be my return to DOA as I haven't played the series since DOA2 because Tecmo released all the following games on consoles I don't own - I'll be there on day one on PS3.
DOA2 is one of my all-time favourite games and one that I always returned to year after year on PS2 so personally DOA5 can't come soon enough.
From a competitive standpoint it's not exciting at all.
The problem with previous DOA titles is that guessing is the best tool in the game. I do a 9-frame jab that leads to nothing and you guess a high counterhold so you get 40% damage? I open you up and connect with an attack that stuns, but then you guess what my next attack is going to be and I take 30% damage?
When I make a proper read on my opponent, or put them in a frame trap, I expect to be rewarded for my efforts, not put into a guessing game where the opponent usually has a better chance of inflicting damage than I do.
If DOA5 remains a guessing game that caters more toward the clueless defensive player, you'll rarely see it in tournament or on streams. That may not mean anything to you, but to the competitive players, we'd be VERY unhappy. No other competitive fighting game rewards guessing as much as DOA has in the past.
Master Thespian
Member
I get that some people are casual and all, but why would anyone want a game that gets significantly worse the better you get/more you play it?
This happens all the time in fighters.
This applies to many fighting games.
Alx
Member
Of course they don't. Few people know what a "9-frame jab" or a "frame trap" are. As far as I'm concerned, I'm guessing what they are but don't want to bother with them. I've been playing all 3D fighters since VF1, and always played "by the seat of my pants". I'm sure I would suck in a tournament, but I still have fun and hold my own online against many players.
Please state an example in another fighting game of a single move that does 30-50% damage when you have been put in to hitstun, is active from 0 frames, and sometimes recovers faster than any attack the person on offense can do if you whiff.
It's like having an Ultra/Counter move that you can do the moment you get hit with a jab.
And players like that won't even realize there's a change. Players like that read that counters are harder to do in DoA4 on IGN and believe it, even though the timing hasn't changed since DoA2. Changes that competitive players are asking for will serve to make the game better for competitive play and would go largely unnoticed by casual players. Most people don't even know what stun threshold is in DoA4, but it's one of the worst thing to happen to the series.
R_thanatos
Member
They can drop 10+ dlc costumes per character, as long as there are costumes to unlock ( by playing ) on the disc i don't care much.
Fredrik
Member
Yup.
Personally I think unlockables is extremely important in fighting games. I generally don't care much about the look of the costumes, and I would never buy them as dlc, I just want some stuff to unlock so that there is some challenge and meaning to play single player too. I hope they have some unlockable characters too.
riceandbeans
Member
I'd love to see a ton of unlockables like DoA:U had, but at this point in the generation it's hard to get excited for them. When you look at the bullshittery that's been going on with Capcom and Street Fighter x Tekken unlockables and even DoAX2's unlocking crap, the amount of potential DoA has for DLC and locking away on-disc content is showing it's just not gonna happen. I'm expecting maybe one or two unlockable outfits, but everything else is going to be at a price. That said, I'm sure it's gonna be a great game but not with the extra fluff that came with the Xbox games.
Master Thespian
Member
I'm talking about customers advocating for the very things that make those games worse rather than them being foisted upon us by the developers. Of course, I hate critical stun counters, step G in all it's forms, Rage, Ultras, and X-Factor and play the games that have them in spite of their inclusion rather than because of them.
Uh huh. The jab is the best weapon in boxing for a reason. It's safe and lets you set up your offense while controlling your opponent. Bruce Lee told everyone almost half a century ago a guy with six months of boxing and wrestling training could whip a martial arts master with a half life of training. That concept is just as bad in real life as it is in fighting games.
Diablohead
Member
4-6 each or so depending, doau had like 28 for kasumi and ayane each, most girls had over 10 in that game.
Dynamite Ringo Matsuri
Member
HNNNNNNGGGG!!! A million times yes... oh god yes... in my wildest dreams yes...
This is going to be the first DOA game I've been looking forward to playing since DOA2 on Dreamcast. I love the dynamic environments and the character overhaul, and it most importantly looks like a lot of fun to play. Can't wait for this to drop
Well, if it means anything, reportedly, Hayashi does NOT like on-disc DLC...
- http://venturebeat.com/2011/12/09/t...lks-dlc-costumes-and-tekken-vs-dead-or-alive/
So, time will tell what will actually happen. But assuming there is a DLC schedule in store for DOA5, perhaps it won't be a fighting game that follow the "Capcom" pattern.
Because no one would attack first when the expected return so heavily favors defense. DOA could shift a couple notches toward the middle .
edit: That´s disappointing in regards to on disc dlc. Time to prepare for Vanessa is not playable because John Doe didn't download the compatibility pack.
Wouldn't the simple answer be to make it so everybody has to download the mandatory compatibility pack, in the form of what would constitute a patch update?
R_thanatos
Member
Well as long as the game is made with that in mind from the start there are no problems
and some times you have the super street fighter 4 dlc fiasco where some costumes can't be seen by the other player if he didn't buy the dlc .. ( pointless )
Yes. What about download time?
It offers no real value to have it as a download other than psychological lube.
The problem with this is that Tecmo would have to pay fees to MS and Sony for those download packs. Basically, the bigger the download and the more people downloading it, the more they'd have to pay.
Yeah, what about download time? I got a 120GB to spare on my newest PS3 and a decent broadband connection, so what do I care about having to wait?
EDIT:
Ah, I see. Has there been anything said about what Sega stands to do with VF5? (Haven't kept up).
wow 28!! thats a lot. I don't expect DOA5 to have anywhere near that number
If I remember correctly, the intro demo for DOA4 had Kokoro(I think that was her name) wearing Kimono-style cloth, but you actually couldn't use that costume in the game, is that correct?
riceandbeans
Member
I don't get this. So you want on-disc DLC?
Doesn't MS not charge for bandwidth on XBL and Sony is the only one that does this, hence the time-limited demos?
I'd rather they go the SSFIV route and prep the game for DLC rather than lock things away. If I have to pay for shit already on the disc, then I'm going to buy the game when it's cheap and/or used and then buy all the shit that's already there.
I don't like the fact that certain content on the disc is being held ransom by an unlock key on my hard drive. Hayashi's seems like he wants do the consumer right, but at the end of the day, it feels like it's going to be Tecmo's call.
Ha, ha, ha... haha.
Alx
Member
Well sure, but it would give us boring fights... If you take that route, the best way to win a fight is to run away and call the cops, but that wouldn't be very exciting either.
Fighting games use exotic martial arts not because they're more efficient, but because they are flashy, aesthetic and/or impressive. Actually there is usually complaining against poking in those games.
QisTopTier
XisBannedTier
I will probably buy this just for how nice the art style is now compared to the old real doll look
The Faceless Master
Member
Master Thespian
Member
You brought real martial arts into the discussion. If you want to make it about what's exciting to watch and/or play, most people find DOA's tepid offensive flow at higher levels dreadful.Well sure, but it would give us boring fights... If you take that route, the best way to win a fight is to run away and call the cops, but that wouldn't be very exciting either.
Fighting games use exotic martial arts not because they're more efficient, but because they are flashy, aesthetic and/or impressive. Actually there is usually complaining against poking in those games.
Interesting..
Maybe someone else can check around and see if this is official or a fanart. The articles doesn't mention anything about her.
I hope that is Tina.
So the game either bombs on the ps3 or money that Temco could have put into content creation for both consoles is instead going into bandwidth fees?
I already see dlc as made while the team is already assembled anyway .
It feels good to be outsmarting your opponent and then lose 30-50% life to a lucky guess because that way the tides can turn at any time.
Wait. What?
Alx
Member
The "lucky guess" is the outsmarting part : counters are used against opponents that are too predictable in their attack patterns. If it's only based on luck, then you have too many chances to guess wrong and get hit.
I know it doesn't fit with the competitive approach out there, but it's how most people will play the game, and enjoy it because of that.
Maybe DOA is not meant to be played at a competitive level. I don't know and I don't care.
Actually I think that by looking too much into the mechanics of the game, you'll end up playing it differently than the designer meant to (which seems to be the case with Itagaki). Frame counting is for me like learning all words of a given length to play scrabble or crosswords. It will make you a better player, but that wasn't really the point of the game...
I know it doesn't fit with the competitive approach out there, but it's how most people will play the game, and enjoy it because of that.
Maybe DOA is not meant to be played at a competitive level. I don't know and I don't care.
Actually I think that by looking too much into the mechanics of the game, you'll end up playing it differently than the designer meant to (which seems to be the case with Itagaki). Frame counting is for me like learning all words of a given length to play scrabble or crosswords. It will make you a better player, but that wasn't really the point of the game...
lol! This is the EXACT problem with DoA4. The stun threshold and countering off of walls took away the ability of a person on offense to do damage. In DoA4, more attacks put you in critical state, which gives the opponent more guesses to counter. The offense doesn't have the opportunity to do as much damage with attacks because now there's no safe way to do so. You have to do more damage to get your opponent launched in the air to do a juggle that would do damage, but now the person on defense can counter more and do more damage to me.
DoA4 is the only game in the series that rewards defense more than offense. I think it's shitty game design to dictate how people should play your game, which is the case with Itagaki.
I'm glad he's gone and I'm glad DoA5 appears to be moving away from shitty guessing and moving toward rewarding actual strategy as opposed to getting lucky (which is what Itagaki's gambling game design emphasized). Not going to touch the rest of that post, since I just disagree with your mindset. It's completely opposite of what I think is rewarding in a fighting game (or any game for that matter). This isn't about frame counting. I don't see what that has to do with anything I've said.