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[Shouta]

Really? Between the handheld Marios, Metroids, Kid Icarus, Fire Emblems, Zeldas, Dragon Quests, SRWs... how many have you played?

I've played the first GBA Fire Emblem, most of the SRWs, all of the Dragon Quests, several of the Metroids, and a couple of Zeldas. Who do you think I am?

]Except maybe Metroid, you say. What about excepting Zelda, too? After all, plenty of the intelligentsia here believes Link's Awakening to be the best of the 2D Zeldae, and now even more people are calling Phantom Hourglass one of the best in the series. Kid Icarus for GB was pretty well received, no? Plenty of people would tell you NSMB is one of the best in that series.

I didn't exempt Zelda because while, the handheld versions are good, they aren't the absolute best. I exempted Metroid because the consoles have had the 3 Metroids on the NES/SNES and then the Primes (unless I'm forgetting something inbetween) and yeah, Prime...

Also, note that I'm refering to the game series in general, and not just 2D iterations.

Aww, now see, you had me going there for a while. Here I was thinking you were speaking reasonable points -- it's true that Tales has consistently been relatively high in production values so far as audio and visuals go and that that's always been a notable element of the series. But then you brough up DQ under your banner of "games or series where the experience is everything about it rather than just the gameplay" and I realized no, Shouta's just pulling my leg.

As Kintaro said, you're putting words in my mouth. You're assuming my stance on what occurred with DQ9 and here was my thoughts on DQ as a whole.

DQ is about gameplay. If you think I've thought otherwise, you're absolute fool.

However, there's always been chocolate that's been ready to add to DQ's peanut butter, it just hasn't been. Peanut butter is fantastic and you always come back to it for its wholesome goodness. When you get the peanut butter and the chocolate together though, in the words of Quagmire from Family guy "giggity giggity goo!" It's just so heavenly when you get both together. Going back to just peanut butter is kinda disappointing. ;(

]If you honestly believe the gameplay in 2D Tales has gotten so complex -- so fast, so frenetic, so hectic and crazed -- that it would be severely compromised on any handheld, then I fail to see how it would be any better on the PSP.

Uh yeah, it wouldn't be any better on the PSP. What would be better on the PSP is that I could get all the voice acting in and probably better looking visuals.

 

[Kintaro]

Even if a person thinks of Link to the Past as the series' best (which I do), it was brought to GBA, so the point would stand that it's entirely possible for a person's favorite in the series to be done on a portable. Honestly, any of the Zelda games other than Wind Waker and Twilight Princess could have been done on DS.
Or how about a better example: every Mario game except Sunshine is on GBA or DS. And if you factor in Mario Land and Mario Land 2, the number of portable exclusives beats out home console exclusives by one. The only people who can't technically say that their favorite Mario is a "portable game" are the ones who like Sunshine best.

:lol Semantics man I see. Not going to argue with you then.


*cues up Wikipedia*

Whoa. Freaking heck, man, that's awesome. Thanks for the heads-up. I'd totally buy them...
...if they were available in this country. Bad comparison.

Not on this forum. People argue many games that aren't brought outside of Japan. I could have said all of the GBA games and such not brought the US. If you don't have those, you aren't a TRUE FAN!

=P But I was arguing sementics as well. It's a stupid discussion. If someone doesn't care for a handheld version of a series they like, that doesn't make them any less of a fan of said series. Saying that are should net anyone who says it a slap in the mouth. Just like if someone only like the handheld versions, they might not care for the console version.

Saying junk like that to folks outside of the internet would get you a dirty look and a possible kick in the shins. :lol

 

[ethelred]

Who do you think I am?

Hey, it was a sincere question; don't take insult. I know you have neither a PSP nor a DS, and I don't recall you talking alot about GBA games, so I was genuinely unsure and figured I'd ask.


Anyway, really, we could go back and forth on this all day, so I'll just make this my last post and sum up my thoughts on the situation. (note that this isn't specifically directed at you, Shou, just my thoughts in general)

I do think this is a good thing -- for Namco & Tales Studio as developers (more money), and for us as gamers (more games). If they handle this right and treat the games seriously, that'll be more really good games and the portability will be nice even if certain other things are sacrified.

I do think that Tales Of is a less appropriate series to move here than something like, say, Dragon Quest or Shin Megami Tensei simply because of the nature of the series; that being said, it's happening, so people can either gripe, refuse to play good games, or just... play good games and enjoy them. I prefer the last approach.

The thing is... we've got six Tales Of games on the PS2. Even if you accept Namco's PR spin of "new home for the series," surely no one's dumb enough to think that'll be exclusive? That there'll never be any more high production home console Tales games? It's silly to look at this as an "this is all we'll ever get" thing instead of recognizing that they'll continue to make high quality console Tales games while just now also making a few high quality portable games. It's a win/win.

Maybe they'll take a few years off from the console ones (I'm guessing at most we'll see three more Tales games on DS including ToI), but so what? Is that SUCH a bad thing? Six of them on the PS2 is kinda a lot so it's not like the series is hurting for quantity here. So let them make a few of these, appreciate them for what they are, and by the time that's done the console market will have shaken itself out sufficiently that Tales Studio can go and make some high budget big production console games (assuming that these won't be development simultaneously as the handheld ones).

It all just seems like a lot of panic over nothing. People on GAF get so ****ing hung up on hypotheticals that they think they should be getting that they consistently fail to appreciate the quality games being delivered in reality. Let them make whatever games they're going to make. Play it. If it's a good game, it's a good game; enjoy it and stop obsessing over "what could have been" and affixing meaningless labels to them.

To Kintaro: No, obviously no one should have an obligation to play them. But if you like the series and you like the developers that make these games, I would think people would want to play the games. If not... your loss. You're the one who'll be giving up probably an enjoyable game and experience just because of certain hang-ups about how things should be instead.

 

[Deku]

Ok, aside from looking for reasons, real or fictitious, to hate a hypothetical game no one has played, what exactly are some of these posters so hung up about?

Because DS is the lead platform? It would be sad to 'hate' a franchise that was previously loved simply because it changed platforms. And it's not like the PS2/PSP isn't getting anything.

But I guess this is GAF.

 

[Grimmy]

Sorry - I'm not too familiar with the Tales games but was wondering what has been released in Japan on PSP but not in N. America?

I think these are all the Tales PSP games:
Tales of Eternia
Tales of Phantasia
Tales of Destiny 2
Tales of the World: Radiant Mythology
Tales of Rebirth (upcoming)

None of them have been released state-side except Radiant Mythology...I guess the chance of Rebirth making it is pretty much nil?

 

[kiryogi]

Ok, aside from looking for reasons, real or fictitious, to hate a hypothetical game no one has played, what exactly are some of these posters so hung up about?

Because DS is the lead platform? It would be sad to 'hate' a franchise that was previously loved simply because it changed platforms. And it's not like the PS2/PSP isn't getting anything.

But I guess this is GAF.

PS2's getting a rehash for fangirls. and PSP's getting a rehash for portability. I'd say its almost the short end of the stick there in terms of something new.

Grimmy: Scamtek claims that if RM sells well, there's a chance for the other ones. But how many thats not us hardcore rpg players/gamers will actually like the 2d ones.

 

[Deku]

PS2's getting a rehash for fangirls. and PSP's getting a rehash for portability. I'd say its almost the short end of the stick there in terms of something new.

Well someone has to hold the short end of the stick. Admittedly, Namco can't announce a main platform for the franchise if they have to spread their resources equally to every platform. But it's better than getting nothing.

 

[GamerSoul]

I think that Namco-Bandai believes that only the 3D ones have a better chance to sell in our market. So far we have gotten: ToS,(they skipped ToR), ToL, TotA, and ToW:RM.

 

[Jiggy]

...I can't really follow up on ethelred's post. Or at least not well, without sounding redundant. But hey, mediocre contribution away.

Not on this forum. People argue many games that aren't brought outside of Japan. I could have said all of the GBA games and such not brought the US. If you don't have those, you aren't a TRUE FAN!

Unlocalized GBA games can be imported. As far as I know, you can't possibly "import" something that's offered through a Japan-only cell phone service.
Of course, I suppose if you really wanted to press the issue, you could argue that one could argue that the person isn't a true fan unless they move to Japan to play those games.

=P But I was arguing sementics as well. It's a stupid discussion. If someone doesn't care for a handheld version of a series they like, that doesn't make them any less of a fan of said series.

There's a difference between not caring for a handheld entry in a series and suggesting that it's objectively worse because it's on a portable system. That was the point of my references to Link to the Past, etc. Great games, whether they're NES or Genesis or N64 classics or anything else, don't change much when they're ported to a handheld system. Yoshi's Island is Yoshi's Island whether it's being played on an SNES or a GBA--and even if it had never been released on SNES, it would have still been amazing in 2002. Likewise, if Tales of Innocence would have been wonderful on the PS1, then as far as I'm concerned it'll still be wonderful on DS whenever it comes out. (For that matter, my second most-anticipated game is a PS1 title being remade for PSP.) And if by chance it turns out to be trash now, it probably would have been trash then too.

This is why the likes of Final Fantasy Tactics and Valkyrie Profile can still be successful in mostly-untouched form on PSP, why Final Fantasy VI still holds up on GBA, and so on: because the games are either good or bad, which has nothing to do with their "potential" and everything to do with their actual. Every game ever made could have been better than it is, and the only difference from one game to the next is to what degree they could have been better. Some legendarily bad games need to be refined or remade in every way. Some legendarily good games are so good that the only way to improve them would be to add more optional content, but there's no limit to what you could ask in theory. I could ask that Chrono Trigger be endowed with 71 more end-game sidequests, or that Star Ocean 2 should have five more bonus dungeons and twenty selectable costumes per character, but what would the point be? I adore the games as they are, and can't judge them by what they coud have been if they had reached some theoretical and probably impossible maximum potential.

To be objectively worse than something else, that something else has to exist. Tales of Innocence on DS isn't worse than Tales of Innocence on (for example) PSP, because there's no such thing. I could say that the graphics and music would be better if the game had been developed for PSP, or PS2, or Wii, or whatever, but who could say that with any certainty? If the same budget was given, maybe they wouldn't. Maybe it would still look like a PS1 game. Valkyrie Profile did, and Final Fantasy Tactics will, and those seem to be fine games. Castlevania: Dracula X Chronicles doesn't look particularly PS2-ish to me, nor does Mega Man Powered Up. There are certainly PS2 games that look better, but that doesn't matter. They're probably fine games as they are.

I feel like I'm reiterating myself here, and probably could have ended it with one earlier line, which was that every game ever made could have been better than it is. Welcome to life, to "the human condition." Everything could be better than it is, but all you really have to work with is what's in front of you. If I judge by Utopia, life's pretty bad; if I judge by Earth, life's right on par. Anyone is free to shape their opinions either way, but generally speaking I'd rather be content with what's here.

 

[jarrod]

I didn't exempt Zelda because while, the handheld versions are good, they aren't the absolute best.

Spoken like a man who's only played a "couple of Zeldas".

 

[Oblivion]

I didn't exempt Zelda because while, the handheld versions are good, they aren't the absolute best.

I thought you didn't like Zelda at all?

 

[Hcoregamer00]

I think that Namco-Bandai believes that only the 3D ones have a better chance to sell in our market. So far we have gotten: ToS,(they skipped ToR), ToL, TotA, and ToW:RM.

The sad part is that they may be right.

2D is dead, and if it doesn't have pretty graphics and sparks it wont get bought outside of the the hardcore fans.

 

[Nuke]

So what can we expect from the Tales of Rebirth PSP port?

PS2 graphics to PSP sounds scary at first, but if I'm not mistaken, Tales of Rebirth used 2d sprites on 3d backgrounds correct? Or am I mistaking that with another Tales game.

How much of a downgrade do you guys expect? If it's 2d, I have high hopes.

Also, do you think 2 UMD discs is enough to house all the Voice Acting featured on the original PS2 ToR? I hope the original ToR wasnt a dual layer disc else the psp port will get butchered in that regard me thinks.

And yes, lets hope for a NA release please.

 

[Durante]

Also, do you think 2 UMD discs is enough to house all the Voice Acting featured on the original PS2 ToR? I hope the original ToR wasnt a dual layer disc else the psp port will get butchered in that regard me thinks.

Well, at 128kbit/s 1 UMD can store around 31 hours of voice acting, so I don't think there'll be much of a problem.

 

[GamerSoul]

The official site got an update!

http://namco-ch.net/taleschannel/index.html

Kickass ToI trailer inside its section.

nevermind

 

[Shouta]

Spoken like a man who's only played a "couple of Zeldas".

Hey, talking out of my ass is a skill I learned from you!

I thought you didn't like Zelda at all?

Doesn't mean I don't play them. I'll play pretty much anything. I even played Generation of Chaos, sweet monkeys those were bad.

 

[jarrod]

Hey, talking out of my ass is a skill I learned from you!

:lol

Then go play some games for a change, frankly they don't get much better than handheld Zeldae (but skip Minish Cap).

 

[Link1110]

You know something? I've been thinking about it, and Eternia may have been made by Team Symphonia. Consider the following:

1) It uses the term "Skits" for camp skits. Only other games that use that term are Symphonia and Abyss (Legendia uses it too, but neither team made that.) Team Destiny's games use "Screen Chat," "Face Chat," or something else similar.

2) Eternia has the "Internal science fiction" thing where the world has a sort of "science" to it that figures majorly into the plot. That's typical of Team Symphonia, ToS and ToA used that, too.

3) Inomata characters don't necessarily mean anything. Fujishima designed the ToP characters.

 

[sebthelobster]

:lol

Then go play some games for a change, frankly they don't get much better than handheld Zeldae (but skip Minish Cap).

Minish Cap is a good zelda . Although it is very by-the-book and having one of the most boring side-quest of all time, it is a game of great quality nonethless.

 

[Shouta]

:lol

Then go play some games for a change, frankly they don't get much better than handheld Zeldae (but skip Minish Cap).

I've played all the handheld Zelda up to the DS ones. I still prefer the console ones for the most part though.

 

[ivysaur12]

Hmmm... it sort of makes me worried that ToS2's logo isn't in english. Should that worry me about a possible localization?

Oh, and Innocence looks sick.

 

[Jiggy]

So what can we expect from the Tales of Rebirth PSP port?

PS2 graphics to PSP sounds scary at first, but if I'm not mistaken, Tales of Rebirth used 2d sprites on 3d backgrounds correct? Or am I mistaking that with another Tales game.

How much of a downgrade do you guys expect? If it's 2d, I have high hopes.

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=7115906&postcount=165
http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=7116956&postcount=231

Looks fantastic to me. I love prerendered backgrounds--my favorite style, really.

 

[Link1110]

So what can we expect from the Tales of Rebirth PSP port?

How much of a downgrade do you guys expect? If it's 2d, I have high hopes.

ToR was all 2d. The graphics are very doable on PSP. I don't expect the voice acting to be cut back, because Tales of Phantasia: Full Voice Edition was 1 UMD. I still haven't bought ToD2 for psp, I doubt it, but was anything cut back on that>

ToR Footage:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3ykAS1E_Mwg&mode=related&search=

Bonus ToR Footage, one of the coolest event battles in any RPG (Minor spoilers
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gfDDi4S07ug&mode=related&search=

 

[dark10x]

So what can we expect from the Tales of Rebirth PSP port?

PS2 graphics to PSP sounds scary at first, but if I'm not mistaken, Tales of Rebirth used 2d sprites on 3d backgrounds correct? Or am I mistaking that with another Tales game.

How much of a downgrade do you guys expect? If it's 2d, I have high hopes.

Also, do you think 2 UMD discs is enough to house all the Voice Acting featured on the original PS2 ToR? I hope the original ToR wasnt a dual layer disc else the psp port will get butchered in that regard me thinks.

And yes, lets hope for a NA release please.

The ToD2 port (from PS2) was flawless on PSP. I've heard that ToR has a bit more intensity at times, but I'd still imagine the port will be solid. Namco has done an excellent job with all of their Tales ports.

 

[Firestorm]

What are the chances of the Rebirth port being localized in at least Europe by Ubisoft? Like the Eternia one? If that happens... I might look at getting a PSP.

 

[ethelred]

What are the chances of the Rebirth port being localized in at least Europe by Ubisoft? Like the Eternia one? If that happens... I might look at getting a PSP.

Exceedingly slim.

Ubisoft did not, bear in mind, localize Tales of Eternia. Ubisoft took the North American localization that was done by Namco (back when they called it Tales of Destiny 2) and just shipped that out to Europe. No work required at all.

We can hope Hometek will do a localization for Rebirth (which is a great game), but I kinda doubt they will after they passed on ToD2 PSP.

 

[Oblivion]

Doesn't mean I don't play them. I'll play pretty much anything. I even played Generation of Chaos, sweet monkeys those were bad.

You don't like them but still keep playing them? Sorry, I'm just trying to clarify. This would mean that you at least find them somewhat enjoyable, don't you?

 

[true Gek]

Next gen tales get finally!

It's funny that Namco is developing a takes on PS2 and not on PS3 an Xbox360

 

[Shouta]

You don't like them but still keep playing them? Sorry, I'm just trying to clarify. This would mean that you at least find them somewhat enjoyable, don't you?

Don't confuse hate with "not like." I won't go out of my way to play games I don't like but I'll play them if I'm bored and need something to do. Games I hate, I won't even touch anymore after I either get too fed up or finish it. I have a streak for finishing games even if I end up hating them.

I don't like Zelda but it doesn't mean I won't play them. If I don't have a higher priority game to play, I might load it up. On the other hand, I hate most sports games so I won't play them unless a friend wants me to play with them. Easier way to think of "not like" is neutral towards them.

 

[GamerSoul]

Do this say anything interesting about the story?

http://www.inside-games.jp/news/222/22206.html

 

[Trucbidule]

A new scan on GoNint*ndo of Tales of Symphonia: Knight of Ratatosk.

 

[rakka]

A new scan on GoNint*ndo of Tales of Symphonia: Knight of Ratatosk.

Was posted here in a new thread waaay before GN...

 

[Myke Greywolf]

Tales of Symphonia without Kosuke Fujishima character design = instant fail.

 

[schuelma]

1up ToS spinoff article:


http://www.1up.com/do/newsStory?cId=3161485


"In a recent interview with producer Makoto Yoshidumi on Japanese publication Famitsu, he talks about the upcoming sequel. "The reason why we did not name this Tales of Symphonia 2 is because the game concept is quite different from the previous game. Now players will be able to have monsters as party members and can level up together with the main characters." Like Dragon Quest and other RPGs, players can have monsters join their party when meeting certain conditions after completing battles. Monsters will most likely be controlled by AI and simple commands might be included, but the producer is still keeping details under wraps. "



"The game will feature the Linear Motion Battle which has become trademark to the series. Wiimote controls are expected to be in the game although not much has been talked about at this point. "

Apologize if old, etc.

 

[Sagitario]

1up ToS spinoff article:


http://www.1up.com/do/newsStory?cId=3161485


"In a recent interview with producer Makoto Yoshidumi on Japanese publication Famitsu, he talks about the upcoming sequel. "The reason why we did not name this Tales of Symphonia 2 is because the game concept is quite different from the previous game. Now players will be able to have monsters as party members and can level up together with the main characters." Like Dragon Quest and other RPGs, players can have monsters join their party when meeting certain conditions after completing battles. Monsters will most likely be controlled by AI and simple commands might be included, but the producer is still keeping details under wraps. "



"The game will feature the Linear Motion Battle which has become trademark to the series. Wiimote controls are expected to be in the game although not much has been talked about at this point. "

Apologize if old, etc.

Meh! They shouldn't have used the Symphonia name for the spin-off... From a sales perspective, I get it... but people is going to be even more disappointed...

Shin Quest Tensei: Dragon Tales of Pokemonia

I wonder how they're going to implement the LMBS with the Wiimote... Waggle+Up, Waggle+Down? =\