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New Zealand Politician Calls Out Disney For Overweight Portrayal of Moana's Maui
- Thread starter Dalek
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SenorArdilla
Member
Fat Pacific Islander stereotype.
echoshifting
Banned
You know what, you are completely right. I can't believe I didn't catch that.
The term fat-shaming does appear in the article but not in the quoted bits (unfortunately it looks like the original Facebook post was taken down, so I can't check if it popped up there at all); it is effectively sloppy editorializing by the author of the article. Strangely, the second piece referenced here does not actually talk about Maui or Moana at all. Yet it is linked to as though it has to do with the topic.
So all this outrage over the use of the term "fat-shaming" is directed at the wrong people. The article itself is garbage designed to provoke exactly the kind of response we have seen in this thread.
Spoiled Milk
Banned
Is this man fat?
RockTurtle
Member
i thought the whole movie was going for an exaggerated or larger-than-life visual motif on their characters.
he looks like a strong man character, which makes even more sense given his deityhood
it lends itself to interpretation through this movie's specific art direction, and it's...perplexing.
he looks like a strong man character, which makes even more sense given his deityhood
it lends itself to interpretation through this movie's specific art direction, and it's...perplexing.
Hellwarden
Member
I've never heard of this stereotype.
I mean, I look at the male character and think big.
Not fat.
Brawly Likes to Brawl
Member
I've been noticing this kind of thing a lot lately, where article writers are taking advantage of the whole "outrage culture" discussion by over-exaggerating the complaints of random people about things. Too many instances of minor comments on twitter or facebook being portrayed as "movements" or "backlash".
Familienoberhauptvogel
Banned
It's usually helpful to raise concerns like that in the early production phase not when it has almost come out.
Actually, i think in the case of Lilo and Nani, it was because of Chris Sanders' style, dude draws em thick.
In any case, are these people nuts? You can argue he has a gut, but the guy doesn't look fats in the least, his body shape expresses nothing but raw power, body builders look chiseled and shit, but it's guys like what maui represent that are actually bodies of raw power, like those guys in "the strongest man of the world" competition. He aint fat, he's powerful!
SenorArdilla
Member
MHWilliams
Member
This is true and the thread title has been changed to reflect this.
Vegetable Lasagna
Member
I'm having trouble seeing the issue here. Some people of all ethnicities are large, and some aren't. Does this character happen to just be large, or did they make half of the jokes in the movie revolve around the character's weight? If the former... Sounds like more faux internet outrage.
Fourth Storm
Member
I don't think it's right for us to blow off the complaint as a product of outrage culture when many posters here don't even seem to be aware of the stereotype (or the cause of it). Who am I to speak for Polynesians? It's good to have other minority voices heard and not just the ones we are used to hearing.
Vegetable Lasagna
Member
I'm very aware of the stereotype. But unless the movie actually spends time fat shaming the character, with jokes that are in poor taste, this is the exact definition of outrage culture.
But yeah, Disney should be forced to redesign the character. We should no longer allow animated characters to be designed with different body types as to not offend anyone that might be self conscious or push stereotypes. Then people with larger body types can get offended that they aren't represented in media. Continue the cycle.
It's a weird mix of animated Fat Guy and animated Strong Guy. He's got a fat guy's feet, ankles, and stomach definition. But his upper torso and arms are how strong guys are usually drawn.
Calamari41
41 > 38
Thanks for this, very interesting.
When compared to the father, this design clearly to me seems to be going for "over the top strong" rather than "obese."
It honestly reminds me of the way they portrayed the genie in Aladdin, when they were trying to express his otherworldly strength. The difference being that one is in total human form and one is a "spirit."
Maui does have fat feet though.
Fourth Storm
Member
Disney should be trying its best not to push stereotypes. Your second paragraph is pure straw man. I never said that different body types shouldn't be represented. It's just a bit suspicious that we now finally have a more robust protagonist (or sidekick?) and it just so happens to fit this stereotype. I'm not saying Disney intended for this to be negative, but that doesn't matter. We should be looking at the specifics of this story and not just hand waving, like I see many doing.
Maybe it will end up being a positive portrayal that uplifts the people of this heritage. The exact portrayal of this character has yet to be seen. But we should let this conversation happen without the knee jerk of hostility.
echoshifting
Banned
I don't know why people are saying this. Just because they both have large body types does not mean they are the same. They look completely different to me. Maui is rounder and softer, he does not have Ralph's wide shoulders or heavily exaggerated hand size. Ralph's head shape is squarish while Maui's is squat and roundish, and he has no visible neck. Maui's facial features are more intelligent, almost mischievous, while Ralph's suggest brutishness.
Even their postures are completely different - Ralph hunches forward slightly as he moves, almost like a gorilla, while Maui seems to lean back a bit to emphasize his large chest.
LyleLanley
Banned
The best canvas.
This may be the only time I've actually appreciated this meme.
boiled goose
good with gravy
I don't think this is fat shaming.
It is though a stereotype. The first fat hero happens to be Polynesian
It is though a stereotype. The first fat hero happens to be Polynesian
UnemployedVillain
Member
Is this man fat?
You do realize people can be fat and strong, right? They're not mutually exclusive
BronsonLee
Member
excelsiorlef
Member
The best canvas.
That's just great.
DOWN
Banned
He doesn't look fat. Looks like an older wrestler or somethingThe more interesting thing to me is that they made the girl have a fuller figure than they usually allow the princesses to have. She is less slender and waif-like than for example Elsa.
I can kind of understand where she is coming from. Maui might not actually be fat fat but the dude is about as "big boned" as they come. It's far beyond strong man levels of functionally big and strong. The father isn't so great either. They both absolutely play into the stereotype, or reality honestly given the serious prevalence of obesity on many pacific islands, of Polynesians being larger by a significant margin.
It's especially evident if, and from what I can tell it is that, Maui has never been previously depicted or described as being large like that. That's not the image the real peoples who see him as a demi-god view him as. Imagine how people would react if Thor looked that like that in the next Avengers or better yet Hercules in his Disney animated film. But they wouldn't do that because popular perception of ancient Greeks goes by classical art which is all about crazy cut dudes with bulging muscles. Not realistic strong man types. People wouldn't accept that depiction, but they will this because they've seen really large Polynesians before and it fits their idea of them. Which is an image a lot of actual Polynesians probably wish wasn't the case.
Disney has artistic licence and all that, but it's pretty evident they are modeling these characters off modern day perceptions of PIs. That's a positive in some ways, it was really great watching that video of Auli'i Cravalho getting the part of Moana, but given these complaints it's also not perfect. Also for some reason reminds of Tito Makani Jr. from Nickelodeon's Rocket Power.
It's especially evident if, and from what I can tell it is that, Maui has never been previously depicted or described as being large like that. That's not the image the real peoples who see him as a demi-god view him as. Imagine how people would react if Thor looked that like that in the next Avengers or better yet Hercules in his Disney animated film. But they wouldn't do that because popular perception of ancient Greeks goes by classical art which is all about crazy cut dudes with bulging muscles. Not realistic strong man types. People wouldn't accept that depiction, but they will this because they've seen really large Polynesians before and it fits their idea of them. Which is an image a lot of actual Polynesians probably wish wasn't the case.
Disney has artistic licence and all that, but it's pretty evident they are modeling these characters off modern day perceptions of PIs. That's a positive in some ways, it was really great watching that video of Auli'i Cravalho getting the part of Moana, but given these complaints it's also not perfect. Also for some reason reminds of Tito Makani Jr. from Nickelodeon's Rocket Power.
Pinko Marx
Banned
😒😒😒😒😒The best canvas.
uncelestial
Member
This is not a fat person, the Labor MP who made the statement took it down from FB, and the People Magazine article calling this "fat shaming" was horrible. So... Not sure where this thread can go from here. What is there to say about a bad tabloid article about a retracted social media post?
LiquidSolid
Member
"It's not racism, it's fact!" The fuck...?
There's truth to all negative stereotypes, that doesn't mean it's okay to play into them. But I guess I must've missed the myth about Maui living in western civilization and becoming obese.
The answer for me comes from how you react when you see the character.
Example: When I saw the picture of Maui up-thread the kind of words that came to mind were "huge", "massive", "strong" and "powerful", rather than "fat", "obese", "pudgy" or whatever. The design for me evokes power and imposing stature rather than anything negative relating to weight.
If you told me that character is a mighty warrior, I'd be like "Yeah, I can see that for sure".
Example: When I saw the picture of Maui up-thread the kind of words that came to mind were "huge", "massive", "strong" and "powerful", rather than "fat", "obese", "pudgy" or whatever. The design for me evokes power and imposing stature rather than anything negative relating to weight.
If you told me that character is a mighty warrior, I'd be like "Yeah, I can see that for sure".
Shamrock7r
Member
Go to a gym
The best canvas.
Amazing.
Inferno313
Banned
Yep. If you ever google the guy, he does a lot of pin-up art using the exact same style he used for Lilo & Stitch. It's kind of surprising seeing characters that look almost identical to Nani in such sexualized images, haha.
The best canvas.
I feel like I'm missing the joke here
Well the movie certainly didn't show "tourists" in the best light.
Choppasmith
Member
Whoa! I can't believe I missed that at first. Is that real and unaltered? If not, that's a great edit job!
oh wow I didn't even get close enough to see the tattoos
I'm usually good on catching those too
It is criticism, a very normal thing. Criticism can be right, wrong and any shade inbetween. The closest we are getting to "outrage culture" are reactions like "They can not win", which sort of indicates that some can not handle criticism.
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